aztrainer
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83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Sun Dec 04, 2011 2:22 pm

I searched and did not see this topic discussed, but here is another TSA oops.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...gents-jfk-airport-article-1.986198

I am wondering when common sense will win out over the lunacy that takes place, I do not think that TSA should be singled out for her cutting her shin and "bleeding like a pig" because that is a side effect of blood thinners.

When are people going to say enough is enough and demand a revision of TSA policies and a return to normal thought and treating people with respect and common decency.
 
BC77008
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83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Sun Dec 04, 2011 2:26 pm

The story I read in another publication last night stated that the TSA denies having stripped searched this woman. Personally I think she is making the whole thing up.
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Revelation
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83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Sun Dec 04, 2011 2:47 pm

Quoting aztrainer (Thread starter):
here is another TSA oops.

C'mon now, get with the program! The terrorists have run out of younger people willing to sacrifice the balance of their life, so they've been recruiting those whose balance isn't so good. They've moved on from underwear bombers to Depends bombers. They've cleverly found a way to create exploding adult diapers and have used harmless looking little old ladies to deliver the diapers of death on to the aircraft.

Quote:

Bruce Zimmerman, 53, said he can’t understand why the agents targeted his mom.

“She looks like a sweet, little old lady,” he said.

C'mon, Bruce, the TSA is two steps ahead of you and your mom's devious plans!
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tdscanuck
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83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Sun Dec 04, 2011 5:09 pm

Quoting aztrainer (Thread starter):
I am wondering when common sense will win out over the lunacy that takes place

Although I'm not a fan of the TSA, they do one thing very right...randomness. It's essentially impossible to find a pattern in how they search. This is a good thing for security. Patterns can be exploited.

Tom.
 
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STT757
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83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Sun Dec 04, 2011 5:14 pm

Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 4):
Although I'm not a fan of the TSA, they do one thing very right...randomness. It's essentially impossible to find a pattern in how they search. This is a good thing for security. Patterns can be exploited.

Exactly, if you don't search certain people, as innocent as they may look, that gives drug smugglers or terrorists an advantage.

It's a good thing the media is not in charge of law enforcement.

[Edited 2011-12-04 09:14:38]
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Sun Dec 04, 2011 8:52 pm

Quoting STT757 (Reply 4):
Exactly, if you don't search certain people, as innocent as they may look, that gives drug smugglers or terrorists an advantage.

Agreed. While it's unfortunate that an elderly woman may have been searched, if TSA only searches "younger" passengers, how is that tactic effective? Employing such a strategy would make it way too easy for terrorists to plot an attack.
 
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Sun Dec 04, 2011 9:37 pm

How did we even survive before 9/11..
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bennett123
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Sun Dec 04, 2011 10:35 pm

What your saying is that the randomness is a cunning ploy rather than stupiditity.

Based on previous threads on this subject, (many from the US) I find that argument a bit thin.
 
Maverick623
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Sun Dec 04, 2011 11:37 pm

Quoting bennett123 (Reply 7):
What your saying is that the randomness is a cunning ploy rather than stupiditity.

Based on previous threads on this subject, (many from the US) I find that argument a bit thin.

  

Just because something works out, doesn't mean it was intended to.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 4):
Exactly, if you don't search certain people, as innocent as they may look, that gives drug smugglers or terrorists an advantage.

Exactly. It's not unheard of for CBP to find drugs and weapons on "little old ladies", either with or without their knowledge.
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gigneil
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Sun Dec 04, 2011 11:44 pm

In fact, on southwards flights, its super common.

Sorry, little old ladies.

NS
 
tdscanuck
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:11 am

Quoting bennett123 (Reply 7):

What your saying is that the randomness is a cunning ploy rather than stupiditity.

Not exactly...I'm saying being random is good for security. Whether they actually mean to be random is a different question.

Quoting bennett123 (Reply 7):
Based on previous threads on this subject, (many from the US) I find that argument a bit thin.

That's possible but something TSA would probably never disclose either way. Whether it's true or not, having your foe think you're a bunch of bumbling incompetents can only help you.

Tom.
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:43 am

Quoting BC77008 (Reply 1):
The story I read in another publication last night stated that the TSA denies having stripped searched this woman. Personally I think she is making the whole thing up.

The TSA has it all on tape, and this Grandmother knows it, so whay would she make it up?

Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 3):
Although I'm not a fan of the TSA, they do one thing very right...randomness.
Quoting STT757 (Reply 4):
Exactly, if you don't search certain people, as innocent as they may look, that gives drug smugglers or terrorists an advantage.

If it were truely 'random' it would b e more acceptable (not completely acceptable). The searches are done so the TSA can show the public 'look at us we search 10% of everyone flying'. The searches are not 'random' as the PC crowd won't let them racial profile. No 83 year old Grandmother has ever hyjacked an airplane in the US. But young arab males under age 40 have. Other young men and women from other groups have too, but we cannot strip search these people, that would be racial profiling (which actually works, just ask LY).

The TSA continues to fail its own internal security checks to see if anyt weapons get through them and onto planes. In some cities the TSA has failed 50% of its own tests, meaning in those cities half of the unauthorized weapons got through them.

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 8):
Exactly. It's not unheard of for CBP to find drugs and weapons on "little old ladies", either with or without their knowledge.

Correct, but those people just got off an airplane, they have already been on one.
 
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:53 am

Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 3):
Although I'm not a fan of the TSA, they do one thing very right...randomness. It's essentially impossible to find a pattern in how they search. This is a good thing for security. Patterns can be exploited.

  

If little old ladies never got search you would just let them be mules. The thoroughly searched terrorist looking people can pick up their goodies from grandma.
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Maverick623
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:07 am

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 11):
that would be racial profiling (which actually works, just ask LY).

        

It amazes me the sheer amount of times that gets debunked on this very forum, and yet people still claim that Israel both a) practices it and b) that it works, when it's quite the opposite.
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fxramper
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:11 am

If you don't like getting cavity searched take the bus.

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 13):
people still claim that Israel both a) practices it

Uh, they do.
 
Kaiarahi
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:14 am

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 13):
It amazes me the sheer amount of times that gets debunked on this very forum, and yet people still claim that Israel both a) practices it and b) that it works, when it's quite the opposite.

How so?
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Grid
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:23 am

The randomness also helps act as cover for when a TSA agent goes half-cocked: Sorry, but we have to be random ...
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TheCommodore
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:35 am

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 13):
It amazes me the sheer amount of times that gets debunked on this very forum, and yet people still claim that Israel both a) practices it and b) that it works, when it's quite the opposite.

You might like to read these articles.

It clearly mentions that at El Al, they use racial profiling on passengers !

http://www.israelsituation.com/2009/12/in-defence-of-racial-profiling/

http://www.theweek.co.uk/politics/17...urity-rest-world-needs-learn-el-al
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:47 am

Quoting TheCommodore (Reply 17):


It clearly mentions that at El Al, they use racial profiling on passengers !

No, it editorializes. Even after they're done praising the wonders of racial profiling, you get gems like this:

From the first link:

Quote:
he added that profiling based on race and religion was counter-productive and should be avoided
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TheCommodore
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 3:01 am

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 18):
No, it editorializes. Even after they're done praising the wonders of racial profiling, you get gems like this:

From the first link:

And no where do they (El Al) refute the fact either.

As the articles say, with many examples cited, they use racial profiling.

"In London, Philip Baum, editor of Aviation Security International and managing director of Green Light Limited, an airline security company, argued that the current approach was indeed outdated."

Read more: http://www.theweek.co.uk/politics/17...ld-needs-learn-el-al#ixzz1fcq0leoh

Which indicates to me they use it, or at the very least have use it.... no ?
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tdscanuck
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 3:41 am

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 11):
The searches are not 'random' as the PC crowd won't let them racial profile.

I don't follow you here...if you're profiling then, by definition, it's not random. If they're being forced to not racially profile then that increases, not decreases, the randomness.

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 11):
No 83 year old Grandmother has ever hyjacked an airplane in the US. But young arab males under age 40 have.

First of all, the number of US hijackings is so low that I doubt you can get any statistical validity off it. However, even if you do go with that theory, take a look at the hijacking history of US aircraft:
1961: Cuban
1968: Cuban
1970: American
1971: American (2)
1972: American (6)
1976: Croation
1978: American (2)
1985: Lebanese
1986: Pakistani
1994: American
2001: Arab (4)

So, yes, there's a trend there...and it's not Arabs.

Tom.
 
bennett123
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:44 am

"That's possible but something TSA would probably never disclose either way. Whether it's true or not, having your foe think you're a bunch of bumbling incompetents can only help you".

Looking incompetant can only help you. Actually being incompetant, I am not so sure.
 
ghifty
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 8:44 am

I saw this on the local news.

First, I have to say that the way they treated her was improper. She had a, what, bruise on her leg from her walker and called for help, but was instead whisked away to security (per local news). That's wrong.

However, there's nothing wrong with the strip search itself. The TSA has every right to so, regardless of Age, Gender, etc.

The "innocent" old lady thing doesn't really stand ground. Sure, she's old.. but that doesn't mean she's not a terrorist. The probability is very low, but still there. And she could be sneaking illegal substances inside of her walker, knowingly or unknowingly. Now, I'm not saying she is a terrorist, or that she is smuggling drugs... I'm merely saying that she could be. And that's the TSA's job.. to prevent "could be."

Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 20):
First of all, the number of US hijackings is so low that I doubt you can get any statistical validity off it. However, even if you do go with that theory, take a look at the hijacking history of US aircraft:
1961: Cuban
1968: Cuban
1970: American
1971: American (2)
1972: American (6)
1976: Croation
1978: American (2)
1985: Lebanese
1986: Pakistani
1994: American
2001: Arab (4)

So, yes, there's a trend there...and it's not Arabs.

Tom.

I need to save this post for future reference..
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PanHAM
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 9:34 am

Quoting fxramper (Reply 14):
If you don't like getting cavity searched take the bus.

Human dignity should prevent passengers from "cavity" searches. That may be the rule for convicts but not people just wanting to travel from A to B.

But while we are at it, if that ever happens to me in the US, I will most certainly fart in the face of the searcher, of course, i will apologize immediately. No one can prove that it was intentionally.

What will happen?
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standby87
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 11:14 am

Quoting ghifty (Reply 22):
Sure, she's old.. but that doesn't mean she's not a terrorist. The probability is very low, but still there.

There's a probability that the ceiling will collapse on your head right now. The probability is very low, but still there.

There is no such thing as 100% security in life.
Strip-searching an 83 year old women doesn't help reach 100% security.

I don't want passengers with guns, bombs or knives on my aircraft or the aircaft I send my wife and children on.
But I would feel happier if someone has looked through the pax list in advance and checked the names isof. taking the clothes off a wheelchair passenger in what should be the most peaceful, stress-free stage of her life...
 
tdscanuck
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 1:48 pm

Quoting standby87 (Reply 24):
But I would feel happier if someone has looked through the pax list in advance and checked the names isof. taking the clothes off a wheelchair passenger in what should be the most peaceful, stress-free stage of her life...

Terrorists are many things but stupid isn't generally one of them (at least not the ones who fly airliners in to buildings). How hard do you think it is to find an 83-year old willing to die for their cause? If TSA announces they're no longer searching anyone 80+, guess what the profile of your next aviation terrorist is?

Tom.
 
eldanno
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 1:52 pm

Everyone's entitled these days, aren't they? I'm sure if the papers reported every last complaint, the TSA is "violating" every demographic out there. Being 83 doesn't give one any less likelihood of being disgruntled and shoving a bomb up their rump than me at 32. And, being firm and fit makes it much less likely that I have been forced into doing something that I otherwise wouldn't. You know the whole "if you want your family to live" deal... Sure, it's extreme thinking, but I could list several reasons why Granny is a more likely suspect.

While I may question the overall effectiveness of the TSA, they are getting the random thing correct. And it's necessary.
 
AviRaider
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:39 pm

I saw this on the news and the old woman claims she was made to take her underwear off. But a TSA response said that they do not do strip searches. I'm inclined to believe the TSA on this one.
 
BC77008
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 3:17 pm

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 11):
The TSA has it all on tape, and this Grandmother knows it, so whay would she make it up?

She believes she had an unpleasant experience, in which she missed her flight and couldn't fly out until over 2 hours later. She exaggerates what really happened and her experience for publicity and to "shame" the TSA.
"He waited his whole damn life to take that flight. And as the plane crashed down he thought 'Well isn't this nice...'"
 
nelsonde
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 3:49 pm

TSA:
1) Doesn't strip search.
2) Doesn't tape private screenings.
3) Doesn't profile.
4) Doesn't make old ladies take off their underwear.
5) Won't let someone through without making sure a metal detector alarm, body image anomaly, or suspicious x-ray image is cleared as a non-threat.

If someone chooses to bypass the body imaging, they will get a standard pat-down. If the TSO cannot clear the person through the pat-down process, they will be taken to a private screening so the passenger can be cleared. If that involves moving clothing, privacy drapes are available. I'm sorry this woman feels that she was abused, I'm glad the TSA resolved the anomaly and didn't let her proceed just because she was a "little old lady."
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longhauler
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 4:56 pm

While I tend to question the word of this 83 year old, one has to remember ...

The 83 year old does not have to be a terrorist, she just has to carry the tools necessary so that the terrorists can "do their job". Once inside the secure area, she can pass the items in question to the terrorists.

That is why seemingly incapable people, like the elderly, physically challenged or the very young, can and do pose a terror threat.
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Grid
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:06 pm

Quoting eldanno (Reply 26):
Sure, it's extreme thinking, but I could list several reasons why Granny is a more likely suspect.

Yeah, sure, anyone could list a bunch of reasons why anyone is a suspect.

Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 20):
First of all, the number of US hijackings is so low that I doubt you can get any statistical validity off it. However, even if you do go with that theory, take a look at the hijacking history of US aircraft:
1961: Cuban
1968: Cuban
1970: American
1971: American (2)
1972: American (6)
1976: Croation
1978: American (2)
1985: Lebanese
1986: Pakistani
1994: American
2001: Arab (4)

So, yes, there's a trend there...and it's not Arabs.

Actually, there is a trend there ... look at five of the last seven hijackings - all done by people from the Middle East, while hijackings done by Americans has actually trended downward.
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tdscanuck
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 5:12 am

Quoting Grid (Reply 31):
Actually, there is a trend there ... look at five of the last seven hijackings - all done by people from the Middle Eas

Pakistan isn't in the Middle East and the Lebanese are a highly mixed population...calling them "Arabs" (the original claim of appropriate racial profiling) isn't accurate either.

Tom.
 
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jfklganyc
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:52 pm

Another older lady travelling thru JFK to Florida came forward this morning...


As someone that deals with the TSA on a daily basis, please do not give them more credit then they are due.

They are a top heavy operation in which the lowest paid and, more importantly, least empowered people deal with you, the travelling public.

There is no room for them to make decisions or have discretion. Listen/watch agents the next time you go through a checkpoint . . . they repeat statements and follow procedure with a learning level best described as rote.

That is the way this big government agency functions: they don't want their agents to have discretion or power to reason, they want their agents to follow a memorized procedure and statement over and over again to be standard. It works because they have so many employess BUT it often results in stupid and media attention-grabbing incidents:

The "don't touch my junk" guy

The 7 year old having his shirt taken off last year

The senior in the wheelchair that had to have her diaper taken off

This old lady who was "strip searched"

I have personally witnessed juice being taken from a baby at the AA Checkpoint Concourse D at LGA.


Just following procedure sir/man. Unfortunately in a free society with cameras on every phone, it just doesn't cut it anymore.


On another note, for those of you that think the TSA is doing this for our protection AND it is good that they don't profile . . . don't sleep too comfortably at night.

In test after test, the TSA screeners can not find their way out of an open cardboard box. They are a reactionary agency that is always one step behind the bad guys: shoes, liquids, underwear

Our best defense, and the reason none of the above attacks were successful, is you, the paying passenger being vigilant and taking action when necessary.
 
PanHAM
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 2:00 pm

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 33):
That is the way this big government agency functions: they don't want their agents to have discretion or power to reason, they want their agents to follow a memorized procedure and statement over and over again to be standard. It works because they have so many employess BUT it often results in stupid and media attention-grabbing incidents:

Then you should tell your government to change the function of their agencies. Every customs officer, every tax man, every policeman and even every screener at airport check point is encouraged to use common sense.

Common sense seems to be totally lacking with TSA . People have brains and they should be encouraged to use these assets.

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 33):
Just following procedure sir/man. Unfortunately in a free society with cameras on every phone, it just doesn't cut it anymore.

A society where everything goes "by the book" is not a free society. The US has given up to be free 10 years ago.

.
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tdscanuck
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 2:08 pm

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 33):
On another note, for those of you that think the TSA is doing this for our protection AND it is good that they don't profile . . . don't sleep too comfortably at night.

I agree it's almost 100% security theater but the constant argument for profiling baffles me.

If you set up any kind of profiling, all you do is guarantee that the next terrorist is from a demographic that's not in your profile, *decreasing* your chance of catching them in either a profiled-random or targeted search. A profile of "everyone who's pissed at the US *plus* everyone who's crazy *plus* everyone who's gullible enough to be convinced to mule for one of the first two groups" isn't very useful.

Tom.
 
COEWR787
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 2:34 pm

Quoting Grid (Reply 31):
Actually, there is a trend there ... look at five of the last seven hijackings - all done by people from the Middle East, while hijackings done by Americans has actually trended downward.

The one clearly visible fact is that the period 2002 - 2011 is the first 10 year period in which no American plane has been hijacked since the whole hijacking phenomenon started. So the TSA maybe doing something right? Just wondering.

And since when is Pakistan in the Middle East. It is in South Asia and used to be a part of India until 1947.

Also racially aren't both Arabs and Israelis Semitic? So any profiling that Israelis do would have to be something other than purely racial, and would include a large dollop of religious, birthplace etc. aspect possibly.
 
PanHAM
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:04 pm

Quoting COEWR787 (Reply 36):
It is in South Asia and used to be a part of India until 1947.

It is the Indian sub continent, to be precise.

Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 35):

If you set up any kind of profiling, all you do is guarantee that the next terrorist is from a demographic that's not in your profile, *decreasing* your chance of catching them in either a profiled-random or targeted search. A p

There is üprofiling, every passenger buying a ticket for a flight to the USA has to submit details to the carrier and the carriers passes these details on to the US authorities. Some of these details would never be processed by most European countries as these fall under data protection laws. The EU had to bow to the US requests. Unfortunately, that did not prevent the shoe bomber or the underpants guy to board US bound aircraft at LHR and AMS and the only reason they did not succeed was the sheer amateurish stupidity of those guys. Or was it the fact that their race precluded them from detection? If so, what good is it for the 99,9999% of "normal" passengers to submit critical data?

What good is it to send data of air cargo and ocean shipments before vessels depart when freight never has been used for terror attacks and would be extremely difficult to do so even if tried?

Quoting COEWR787 (Reply 36):
The one clearly visible fact is that the period 2002 - 2011 is the first 10 year period in which no American plane has been hijacked since the whole hijacking phenomenon started. So the TSA maybe doing something right? Just wondering.

That's the "millions of flies can't be wrong" argument and the general public eats that sh*t. I have nothin against Gerge Walker Bush, but he made a himself a butt of jokes when he landed on the carrier and pronounced "mission accomplished".

No, the fraction that can proudly say that their mission is accomplsihed are the terrrists. It is a huge success to watch millions of people harrassed every day at airports in this world at costs gpoing into the billions. It is difficult to top that and that's the main reason nothing has happened since.
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DogsOfWar
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:38 pm

Quoting BC77008 (Reply 1):

and you're very naive! TSA is the problem with air travel within the US today.
 
daviation
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RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:48 pm

Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 20):
1961: Cuban
1968: Cuban
1970: American
1971: American (2)
1972: American (6)
1976: Croation
1978: American (2)
1985: Lebanese
1986: Pakistani
1994: American
2001: Arab (4)

What does this show? Only the successful hijackings. Over the last several years, the CIA, FBI, NYC Police, Scotland Yard have uncovered and foiled numerous plots to blow up airliners, buildings, landmarks. And all of these terrorist cells have consisted of members of radical Islam, Arabs, Pakistanis. They were only successful in 2001. They will certainly continue trying to be successful.
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MaverickM11
Posts: 15252
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:57 pm

This thread is worthless without pics

...I keed, I keed...
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
DogsOfWar
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2011 3:50 pm

RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 4:02 pm

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 40):

This thread is worthless without pics

...I keed, I keed...

you're sick! you need help! 83 year old granny panties? yuck!
 
Grid
Posts: 253
Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 4:26 am

RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 5:50 pm

Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 32):
Quoting Grid (Reply 31):
Actually, there is a trend there ... look at five of the last seven hijackings - all done by people from the Middle Eas

Pakistan isn't in the Middle East and the Lebanese are a highly mixed population...calling them "Arabs" (the original claim of appropriate racial profiling) isn't accurate either.

Tom.

Right, I know. The claim was that there wasn't a trend; there is. I did not refer to Pakistan - only five (Arab and Lebanese, which is mixed group - could be ethnicity and nationality etc.). I'm just pointing out there is trend.
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bennett123
Posts: 7440
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 9:22 pm

The worst terrorist attack in the US pre 2001 was Oklahoma City.

Timothy McVeigh was American, white and probably ex Military.

So stop all WASP ex soldiers.  

The point with profiling is that it is a scaple, not a blunt instrument.

I am sure that there are warning signs, passengers with no luggage, paying cash for a single ticket for example.

IMO, that would be far more suspect than a turban.

Also, AFAIK the role of the TSA is purely Anti Terrorist, they are noyt Police, Customs or DEA.

If they spot something, then they will act, but these things are not there principal role.

The whole security effort needs to get a lot smarter.
 
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zippyjet
Posts: 5089
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2001 3:32 pm

RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 10:42 pm

It's all security theatre. Hope this 83 yr young lady is OK and the folks TSA that were ordered to do the deed didn't suffer from a case of TMI.
I'm Zippyjet & I approve of this message!
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Tue Dec 06, 2011 10:54 pm

Quoting nelsonde (Reply 29):
TSA:
1) Doesn't strip search.
2) Doesn't tape private screenings.
3) Doesn't profile.
4) Doesn't make old ladies take off their underwear.
5) Won't let someone through without making sure a metal detector alarm, body image anomaly, or suspicious x-ray image is cleared as a non-threat.

I giggled a lot at this.

I concur that screening all people is necessary, but they CLEARLY do ALL those things and there is MUCH evidence to support it.

NS
 
steeler83
Posts: 7391
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 2:06 pm

RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Wed Dec 07, 2011 3:04 am

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 11):
If it were truely 'random' it would b e more acceptable (not completely acceptable). The searches are done so the TSA can show the public 'look at us we search 10% of everyone flying'. The searches are not 'random' as the PC crowd won't let them racial profile. No 83 year old Grandmother has ever hyjacked an airplane in the US. But young arab males under age 40 have. Other young men and women from other groups have too, but we cannot strip search these people, that would be racial profiling (which actually works, just ask LY).

The TSA continues to fail its own internal security checks to see if anyt weapons get through them and onto planes. In some cities the TSA has failed 50% of its own tests, meaning in those cities half of the unauthorized weapons got through them.

THANK YOU!

Christ! We really need to watch out for those people with the colostomy bags and urine bags. Yeah, THEY are the REAL threat to our national security!

  

You know something else? My wife has to carry corn starch with her when she travels. Coming back from SEA, they held us up for over 20 minutes to search and keep searching her bag. Then, they went into her corn starch container (MARKED Argo corn starch) and did some analytical bs on it. She even had a traveler's letter from her doctor, but they didn't care...

We missed our flight to MSP by 2 minutes!!!

Now I have an insulin pump. God help them if they stop me or suspect me because of my pump; I sure as hell won't...!

A very wise person once said, "if you sacrafice freedom for security, you will have neither..."

Ben Franklin said those very words...

Quoting something (Reply 6):
How did we even survive before 9/11..

I can only hope this is sarcasm...
Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
 
tdscanuck
Posts: 8572
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 7:25 am

RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Wed Dec 07, 2011 3:37 am

Quoting steeler83 (Reply 46):
You know something else? My wife has to carry corn starch with her when she travels. Coming back from SEA, they held us up for over 20 minutes to search and keep searching her bag. Then, they went into her corn starch container (MARKED Argo corn starch) and did some analytical bs on it. She even had a traveler's letter from her doctor, but they didn't care...

You tried to carry an un-perscibed white powder through TSA and are surprised they wanted to check what it really was?

Tom.
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Wed Dec 07, 2011 4:14 am

Yeah, to be fair, I would think that was an obvious trafficking attempt if it were me.

NS
 
Grid
Posts: 253
Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 4:26 am

RE: 83 Year Old Stripped Searched At JFK

Wed Dec 07, 2011 4:26 am

Quoting gigneil (Reply 48):

Yeah, to be fair, I would think that was an obvious trafficking attempt if it were me.

NS

It should not take 20 minutes though. I was carrying Black Powder and told them what it was ... TSA tested it and I was on my way in fewer than five minutes.
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