doulasc
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A Few Questions About Pan Am

Sat Dec 24, 2011 11:16 pm

I noticed when I read timetables in the 1970s Pan Am had flight 551/552 was SJU-MIA-TPA-MEX and vice versa. I am aware Pan Am was not allowed to carry passengers from MIA-TPA and I also noticed in their timetables no flight was listed from TPA-SJU,there was not a change of flight numbers either, this flight was a Boeing 707-321B. Was Pan Am not allowed to sell tickets to a passenger that wanted to go from TPA-SJU?
I know Pan Am for years tried to get domestic routes and were unsucessful and I was wondering if Pan Am ever applied for rights to fly to Canada like Toronto and Montreal and got turned down.
 
747400sp
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RE: A Few Questions About Pan Am

Sun Dec 25, 2011 12:11 am

That's a good question. I can not tell you the answer, but I would think they would be running into EA territory on this route, and that was a no, no, before deregulation.
 
liftsifter
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RE: A Few Questions About Pan Am

Sun Dec 25, 2011 12:35 am

Why didn't the US allow for inter-US flights? Seems like Pan Am was a good airline, where did it all go wrong? I too have lots of questions on the big PA.
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maxpower1954
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RE: A Few Questions About Pan Am

Sun Dec 25, 2011 12:52 am

Pan Am flew New York to San Juan for many years, competing with Eastern on this route. And they ran SJU-BAL-PHL too, and you could ride all the way to PHL, but no local traffic was carried between BAL to PHL. I imagine it was the same SJU-MIA-TPA.
 
BoeingGuy
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RE: A Few Questions About Pan Am

Sun Dec 25, 2011 12:55 am

Quoting liftsifter (Reply 2):
Why didn't the US allow for inter-US flights?

PA couldn't carry local traffic with the 48 states. They could carry traffic to Alaska, Hawaii and Puerto Rico, etc. It was just part of their regulatory authority back when airline routes were regulated.
 
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zippyjet
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RE: A Few Questions About Pan Am

Sun Dec 25, 2011 7:24 am

Quoting 747400sp (Reply 1):

That's a good question. I can not tell you the answer, but I would think they would be running into EA territory on this route, and that was a no, no, before deregulation.

I remember in the late 60's and even till at least 1980 Eastern flew from Ottowa/Hull or Montreal to BWI (previously BAL)
then on to MIA. Equipment was usually a 727 but during busy travel periods, upgraded to L1011's and even A 300's.
Also Air Canada had direct service from Montreal and Toronto to MIA using DC-8's and later L1011's. And, Eastern had at least one daily flight from BWI to BDA! And many times these were L1011's for a quick 90 minute to 2 Hour flight!
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skyhawk
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RE: A Few Questions About Pan Am

Sun Dec 25, 2011 1:58 pm

They were allowed to pick up connecting passengers within the 48 but not people that were just going from say BWI-PHL as mentioned. In that way they were able to pick up people in JFK going to IAH but those people had come into JFK on them. Does that make sense?
 
Thrust
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RE: A Few Questions About Pan Am

Sun Dec 25, 2011 5:15 pm

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 4):

That would ultimately prove to be their undoing IMO. One of the reasons I think TWA survived longer than Pan Am was that it had a domestic route system to fall back on when its extensive international network collapsed. Pan Am essentially lost their entire transpacific system to United and much of their Atlantic system to Delta. They didn't have much left when they went down.
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SKY1
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RE: A Few Questions About Pan Am

Sun Dec 25, 2011 5:33 pm

Quoting Thrust (Reply 7):
Pan Am essentially lost their entire transpacific system to United and much of their Atlantic system to Delta

Do you know if the Delta's existing routes to/from Madrid were inherited from Pan Am or TWA for the JFK-MAD leg? Pan Am was for a not very long period in the late 1980's serving MAD-MIA but I don't think it has to do with the Delta expansion over the Atlantic in the late 80's or early 1990's. I'm not sure about it, anyway ...that's why I'm asking.

ATL-MAD was a totally new route, but MIA-MAD was on the US side initially flown by Air Florida, then Pan Am and finally American Airlines.
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