Jonathanxxxx
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Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Sun Dec 25, 2011 1:14 am

Wow! Just saw this on Wikipedia. I didn't see it posted anywhere so I'm pretty sure it was recently announced. Apparently, Condor Airlines of Germany is to start service from Ft. Lauderdale Airport (FLL) to Munich Airport (MUC). According to Wikipedia it is set to start February 1, 2012. This is an addition to Condor's service from Frankfurt (FRA). It's nice to see more transatlantic service to FLL!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_La...93_Hollywood_International_Airport
 
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Semaex
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Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Sun Dec 25, 2011 1:30 am

The Condor booking system still shows DE flights MUC-FLL only via FRA, so no change there.
There is also no link or reference to the entry on Wikipedia, so I have a feeling that someone has taken something from the rumour mill and made it look like a fact on Wiki.

I would also be very surprised if it was going to happen for other reasons: First, the market Germany-Florida is strongest in winter, so why would they start the service when the winter is just about to end? I couldn't imagine this flight being year-round. Second, there is (AFAIK) no DE maintanance facility for 757/767 in MUC, and the planes (all except the A320 fleet) are fully integrated into the FRA timetable, leaving no room for other destinations. I could see this change when (rather: if) DE orders any new 787, but for now I think their growth on the transcon is very limited and ex FRA only.
// You know you're an aviation enthusiast when you look at your neighbour's cars and think about fleet commonality.
 
flyingalex
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Sun Dec 25, 2011 3:50 pm

Interesting - I'm not sure we will actually see this happen since DE has completely concentrated their .longhaul operations in FRA. If O/D traffic ex-MUC is strong enough, or if they have a specific operator chartering lots of seats on every flight, it may happen, but it would have to be a very strong business case indeed.

One option for them would be to run this flight as a W-pattern (i.e. FRA-FLL-MUC-FLL-FRA). It could be a lot cheaper than permanently basing an aircraft in MUC or having to reposition the aircraft (and crew!) before and after the trans-Atlantic turn.
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kann123air
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Sun Dec 25, 2011 4:33 pm

Well, under the airlines and destinations tab, FRA is the only listed airport that Condor serves. So I guess whoever put it up took it down very quickly!
Now more than ever, moving forward with the new American.
 
LAXdude1023
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Sun Dec 25, 2011 5:58 pm

Wikipedia is not a source.
It is what it is...
 
AA94
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Sun Dec 25, 2011 9:19 pm

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 4):
Wikipedia is not a source.

  

DE is currently working on making themselves known on FRA routes. They've started SEA-FRA, and will be starting BWI-FRA in the summer. I can't see them introducing MUC services when they are still growing TATL services to their hub.
If you can't take the heat, you best get out of the kitchen
 
cgnnrw
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Sun Dec 25, 2011 9:25 pm

Quoting AA94 (Reply 5):
They've started SEA-FRA, and will be starting BWI-FRA in the summer.

Wouldn't they be competing directly with their "mother" airline in SEA? Also, LH has a good operation going at IAD and PHL isn't that far up I-95 so I'm surprised they would go into BWI.
A330 man.
 
srqmuc
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Sun Dec 25, 2011 11:53 pm

Quoting cgnnrw (Reply 6):
Wouldn't they be competing directly with their "mother" airline in SEA? Also, LH has a good operation going at IAD and PHL isn't that far up I-95 so I'm surprised they would go into BWI.

Lufthansa sold their remaining Condor shares in 2009 (if you're reffering to LH as Condor's "mother airline").

However, I'd love to have more direct MUC-Florida flights! Someone needs to start TPA-MUC asap! Big grin

[Edited 2011-12-25 15:55:02]
 
MHG
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Mon Dec 26, 2011 10:28 am

Quoting cgnnrw (Reply 6):
Wouldn't they be competing directly with their "mother" airline in SEA?

Well, the child already left home ...

LH has no more a stake in DE for a couple of years already although DE still keeps its connection with miles&more ...

[Edited 2011-12-26 02:29:16]

[Edited 2011-12-26 02:30:18]
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airbazar
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Mon Dec 26, 2011 2:26 pm

Quoting AA94 (Reply 5):
DE is currently working on making themselves known on FRA routes. They've started SEA-FRA, and will be starting BWI-FRA in the summer. I can't see them introducing MUC services when they are still growing TATL services to their hub.

Condor has a hub? I thought they were a p2p charter and low fare carrier.
 
727LOVER
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Mon Dec 26, 2011 2:56 pm

Quoting srqmuc (Reply 7):

Your username routing would be even better!!!! 
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flyingalex
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Mon Dec 26, 2011 5:27 pm

Quoting airbazar (Reply 9):

Condor has a hub? I thought they were a p2p charter and low fare carrier.

Condor offers plenty of connections via partner airlines, the biggest of course being Lufthansa. LH provides a fair amount of feed to DE through FRA, they also have interline agreements with AS, CM and G3, among others.

If you can find a workable connection, they'll also be more than happy to sell you a through-ticket wholly on their own network (say PMI-FRA-HKT, for example).
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Semaex
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Mon Dec 26, 2011 6:58 pm

Quoting flyingalex (Reply 11):

Yep, LH and DE still enjoy a healthy "gentlemen's agreement", which is really the best solution to the situation they both had to deal with. Plus it also benefits the flying pax (an unusual side-effect whenever airline CEO's feel like playing God).

I think DE is also the only other airline which is allowed to use gates in FRA that are LH-exclusive (T1 -C/D), plus Lufthansa Pilot Training Network provides pilot-recruitment programs for DE.
// You know you're an aviation enthusiast when you look at your neighbour's cars and think about fleet commonality.
 
flyingalex
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Tue Dec 27, 2011 1:36 pm

Quoting Semaex (Reply 12):
I think DE is also the only other airline which is allowed to use gates in FRA that are LH-exclusive (T1 -C/D)

Which gates are those? UA/CO and US park at the C gates all the time, so does SQ, and probably a few others. I've even seen Air Moldova at C1 (LH is their handling agent at FRA).

In my experience, they stick the Condor flights whereever there is room, and that can be anywhere in Terminal 1. C or B gates are preferred though, because they are closer to Condor's check-in counters at the back end of Departure Hall C.
Public service announcement: "It's" = "it is". To indicate posession, write "its." Looks wrong, but it's correct grammar
 
srqmuc
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Tue Dec 27, 2011 3:13 pm

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 10):
Your username routing would be even better!!!!

Indeed! Unfortunately my wishes weren't fulfilled yet and that's why I'd also be ok with TPA! I don't want to demand too much, you know 
 
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Semaex
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RE: Rumor: Condor (DE) To Start FLL-MUC

Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:14 pm

Quoting flyingalex (Reply 13):
Which gates are those? UA/CO and US park at the C gates all the time, so does SQ, and probably a few others. I've even seen Air Moldova at C1 (LH is their handling agent at FRA).

Gates are C17-C22 (or even further, not sure). From gates C13 onwards it's all LH exclusive (first gates to see the A380). However in summer months the gates further toward T2-D (therefore "C/D") are used by DE as well. Bus gates only, but nontheless year-round usually LH exclusive.
You are right though, the old part of T1-C (C2-C12) is mainly used by QR, US, VN, LY, 9U, even Hamburg Airways. In fact I have yet to see a LH plane along those gates (not surprising, last time I looked they were the definition of ugly)

Quoting srqmuc (Reply 14):
Indeed! Unfortunately my wishes weren't fulfilled yet and that's why I'd also be ok with TPA! I don't want to demand too much, you know

Woooow how much I'd love to see a DE 767 come in overhead Lk Okeechobee 
// You know you're an aviation enthusiast when you look at your neighbour's cars and think about fleet commonality.