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YNGguins
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Allegiant Off Taxiway At YNG (Lake Effect Snow)

Tue Jan 03, 2012 12:50 am

http://www.wkbn.com/content/news/loc..._source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Lake Effect snow blasting Northeast Ohio and when the flight landed, this is what the radar looked like. Heavy snow squall at the time:
http://i.imgur.com/HTJh8.jpg

Hearing everyone is OK! Thank God!
I am PROUD to live in the greatest country on earth: The United States of America!
 
tb727
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RE: Allegiant Off Taxiway At YNG (Lake Effect Snow)

Tue Jan 03, 2012 2:32 am

They landed at 2253Z, looks like pretty typical NE Ohio heavy snow squalls. It can get slippery pretty quick.

KYNG 022318Z 30008KT 1/4SM +SN BR BKN003 OVC011 M04/M06 A2992 RMK AO2 SNINCR 1/2 P0004
KYNG 022256Z 27007G15KT 1/4SM +SN BR BKN005 OVC012 M04/M06 A2991 RMK AO2 P0000
KYNG 022251Z 27010G15KT 1/2SM SN BR BKN010 OVC016 M04/M06 A2991 RMK AO2 SLP142 P0000 T10391061
KYNG 022229Z 26008KT 1/2SM SN BR SCT005 BKN011 OVC017 M04/M06 A2990 RMK AO2 P0000
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RJNUT
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RE: Allegiant Off Taxiway At YNG (Lake Effect Snow)

Tue Jan 03, 2012 2:37 am

ah yes, i remember in Cleveland Heights being blasted, as a kid , by those "thunder" squalls and my grandmother calling to say in Bay Village, the sun was shining! We thought she was just kidding!
 
tb727
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RE: Allegiant Off Taxiway At YNG (Lake Effect Snow)

Tue Jan 03, 2012 2:42 am

Quoting RJNUT (Reply 2):
ah yes, i remember in Cleveland Heights being blasted, as a kid , by those "thunder" squalls and my grandmother calling to say in Bay Village, the sun was shining! We thought she was just kidding!

Yeah, I grew up on the West Side. Jealous of all those East Side school closings all winter 
Too lazy to work, too scared to steal!
 
as739x
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RE: Allegiant Off Taxiway At YNG (Lake Effect Snow)

Tue Jan 03, 2012 5:46 am

Did it go off at Hotel or H1?
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
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YNGguins
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RE: Allegiant Off Taxiway At YNG (Lake Effect Snow)

Tue Jan 03, 2012 1:43 pm

The turn from RW 32 onto the taxiway at the extreme north end of YNG near King Graves Road.

Updated stories:
http://www.wfmj.com/story/16431980/a...own-warren-regional-airport-runway
http://www.vindy.com/news/2012/jan/0...eather-causes-problems-at-airport/

In other news, the flight was sold out. What a surprise!

[Edited 2012-01-03 05:45:05]
I am PROUD to live in the greatest country on earth: The United States of America!
 
727forever
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RE: Allegiant Off Taxiway At YNG (Lake Effect Snow)

Tue Jan 03, 2012 6:01 pm

I love how the airport is quick to place blame on the pilot for waking too wide of a turn. It's a little early for such statements and stinks of an airport manager shifting some blame early. I'm wondering what the condition of the taxiway was at turnoff. When turning an MD-80 on slick surfaces you will have great grip until you don't. Once you loose grip those little tires aren't getting it back until you the inertia bleeds off or you straighten out the tiller and get good pavement again. If the wheel is still turned and you get good pavement again it will still keep sliding. Add in some winds blowing that big tail and long fuselage around and she can be a hand full. It's amazing to me that more big airplanes don't end up off the pavement in the winter, especially when you often time can't see the outline of the pavement in heavy snow and are really just following previous tracks and guessing when there aren't any.

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jeb94
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RE: Allegiant Off Taxiway At YNG (Lake Effect Snow)

Tue Jan 03, 2012 8:07 pm

MD80's can slide the nose even on dry pavement, especially when making sharp turns. When making sharp turns the wheel opposite the turn (left when making a right turn etc...) will actually lift off the ground when the aircraft is light. You can change a nose tire this way at the gate with no jack. So if he was making a sharp turn he only had one of those skinny little tires with weight on it.
I've taxied a DC-9-30 in snow. I had the tiller turned right to help keep it in the center of the taxiway. With everything else going on and the death grip I had on it I forgot to turn it while making a left turn. I just used left brakes and the plane swung around just fine to the left. The nose was sliding the whole time. I released the tiller and kinda laughed nervously when I realized what had happened. MD-80s are harder to get to swing like that because of the long nose and the nose wheels have even less grip.
 
hiflyer
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RE: Allegiant Off Taxiway At YNG (Lake Effect Snow)

Tue Jan 03, 2012 9:51 pm

md80's had the nickname of skid80's at some carriers.....
 
2H4
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RE: Allegiant Off Taxiway At YNG (Lake Effect Snow)

Tue Jan 03, 2012 10:30 pm

Quoting 727forever (Reply 6):

I once read an article about a 72 pilot who nearly slid off the runway while exiting onto a taxiway. At the time, he felt as though his speed was very conservative, but it was apparently not conservative enough. After that close call, he created a new personal SOP for slippery runways - before steering the nosewheel even one degree to vacate the runway, he ensures he's so slow that power must be added to make the turn.

I'm sure ATC would prefer a hasty exit from the runway, but the author of the article was convinced this is the way to do it.
Intentionally Left Blank
 
727forever
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RE: Allegiant Off Taxiway At YNG (Lake Effect Snow)

Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:21 pm

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 9):
I once read an article about a 72 pilot who nearly slid off the runway while exiting onto a taxiway. At the time, he felt as though his speed was very conservative, but it was apparently not conservative enough. After that close call, he created a new personal SOP for slippery runways - before steering the nosewheel even one degree to vacate the runway, he ensures he's so slow that power must be added to make the turn.



That author wasn't Len Morgan was it? That is a great technique but even it isn't full proof. In some airplanes the anti-skid deactivates when the wheel speed goes below 10 knots. If this happens the back end can swing around. I had this happen to me one morning landing at ORD as a quick but heavy snow squall was moving through. There was maybe a half inch of snow on the runways which hadn't been treated yet. I landed on what is now 28 and made the 90* turn at F. I slowed way down as in the above technique and the anti-skid deactivated. As I was making the turn with slight brake pressure the wind caught the tail and started swinging me around as the brakes locked up. As the nose was swinging through the 90* point I released the brakes and goosed the power which straightened her out and away we went. Lesson learned.

Quoting jeb94 (Reply 7):
MD80's can slide the nose even on dry pavement, especially when making sharp turns.



True, but you would have to be empty or taxiing way too fast. With a full load of people an cargo there is a lot of weight on that nose.

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