cloudyapple
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6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:52 am

Hot off the press.

http://downloads.cathaypacific.com/c...CX_Discloseable_Transaction_en.pdf

These are in addition to the previous purchase of 30, taking the total ordered to 36.
A310/A319/20/21/A332/3/A343/6/A388/B732/5/7/8/B742/S/4/B752/B763/B772/3/W/E145/J41/MD11/83/90
 
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PM
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:55 am

Etihad cancel 6, Cathay order 6. You win some, you lose some!

Good news for Cathay, Airbus and, er, RR...   
 
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PM
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:58 am

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...eal-for-six-more-a350-900s-367166/

"Cathay had previously said that it needs "new supper efficient aircraft" to replace its ageing fleet of Boeing 747-400s and Airbus A340s to meet its expansion plans."

There used to be a time when FLIGHT employed editors...  
 
mdavies06
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:05 am

According to the HKEX notice, they state that they expect these 6 to be delivered 2016-2017. Lets hope they actually will receive them during this time frame given the delay in the 350 program. Interestingly, CX also states that they will be used for flights from HKG to Europe. I am surprised that they can tell so far in advance that they will reploy them just to Europe and not other regions such as Middle East, Africa, North America etc. Is the A359 not suitable for any of their North American routes?
 
astuteman
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:11 am

Quoting PM (Reply 1):
Etihad cancel 6, Cathay order 6. You win some, you lose some!
Quoting mdavies06 (Reply 3):
According to the HKEX notice, they state that they expect these 6 to be delivered 2016-2017

Etihad's cancelled A350-1000 slots, anyone?     

Rgds
 
flood
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:17 am

Excellent news, congrats to both!

Quoting PM (Reply 2):
"new supper efficient aircraft"

Maybe they're adding more galleys 
 
AustrianZRH
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:30 am

Quoting PM (Reply 2):
"new supper efficient aircraft"

But only in C. Y will stay chicken or pasta...
WARNING! The post above should be taken with a grain of salt! Furthermore, it may be slightly biased towards A.
 
cloudyapple
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:43 am

Quoting cloudyapple (Thread starter):
taking the total ordered to 36.

Or 38 including 2 to be leased from ILFC if anybody remembers!
A310/A319/20/21/A332/3/A343/6/A388/B732/5/7/8/B742/S/4/B752/B763/B772/3/W/E145/J41/MD11/83/90
 
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EPA001
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:45 am

Quoting PM (Reply 1):
Etihad cancel 6, Cathay order 6. You win some, you lose some!

Good news for Cathay, Airbus and, er, RR...   

Indeed it is.  . And that for a program of which some think that the upper variant is a dog.  .

Quoting PM (Reply 2):
"new supper efficient aircraft"

They must taste good.  .

Quoting astuteman (Reply 4):
Etihad's cancelled A350-1000 slots, anyone?     

Very likely.   
 
col
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 9:36 am

Zeke actually said thank you for the slots on the Etihad canx thread, guess you knew what was coming.
 
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zeke
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 9:37 am

Quoting mdavies06 (Reply 3):
Interestingly, CX also states that they will be used for flights from HKG to Europe. I am surprised that they can tell so far in advance that they will reploy them just to Europe and not other regions such as Middle East, Africa, North America etc. Is the A359 not suitable for any of their North American routes?

The 359 will be the smallest long haul aircraft CX will have, historically this is how CX has started new pax routes. The business case and fleet planning has been done to expand to a number of new destinations, or even reopen destinations CX has operated to before, or current freighter destinations. Not all of the 359 destinations planned are in Europe.

Quoting cloudyapple (Reply 7):

Stil a ot of options left to convert...
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
 
CXB77L
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 9:39 am

Congrats to CX and Airbus on this order. A total of 38 A359s would be excellent for CX's future expansion into new markets, and as replacements for the A343.

Last I heard, CX was due to retire its last 744 around 2017-2018, so deliveries of these A359s between 2016 and 2017 sounds like it's perfectly timed for 744 replacements too. It would seem that CX are replacing its 744 fleet with smaller aircraft, although it has been reported that CX will make its VLA decision some time this year. I guess time will tell.
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titus95
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 10:33 am

If really CX replaces 744 with A359 , a smaller plane , in that case they will absolutly need a VLA , either A388/89 or 748I , or it will be for them a downgrade.

If they do not choose a VLA , either they have chosen the more frequencies way , either they are afraid of new entrants on the HKG market , of course Hong Kong Al with their A380s comes to mind.

Hope the 744 replacement with A359 is only the first step of a more ambitious plan.
 
mdavies06
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 10:34 am

Quoting zeke (Reply 10):
The 359 will be the smallest long haul aircraft CX will have, historically this is how CX has started new pax routes. The business case and fleet planning has been done to expand to a number of new destinations, or even reopen destinations CX has operated to before, or current freighter destinations. Not all of the 359 destinations planned are in Europe.

In this case lets hope they use them on MAN, ZRH, ARN then   perhaps LGW even...

Although realistically by 2016 I would have expected them to have launched probably at least 1 destination amongst those plus the likes of MAD and BER.

[Edited 2012-01-20 02:47:07]
 
Daysleeper
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 11:03 am

Great news, I have no idea why but I just have a gut feeling that the A350 project is going to one of the most successful projects ever attempted. I genuinely think Airbus has learnt from the problems with the A380 and will get it right this time.


Are we to assume that Airbus is still going to let customers easily change from one variant to another? With the A359's EIS only being a couple of years away this would be very difficult for Airbus to do.
 
kaitak
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 5:32 pm

You can certainly understand why CX is so anxious to see the third runway at HK completed; I don't know what the current completion date is, but I'm assuming it's later this decade. CX is certainly on the march! I think it's also fair to say that these won't be the last 350s to be ordered by CX; the -1000 would probably be a very good replacement for regional 773s.

Roll on the VLA order ...
 
LAXDESI
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 5:53 pm

Quoting kaitak (Reply 15):
I think it's also fair to say that these won't be the last 350s to be ordered by CX; the -1000 would probably be a very good replacement for regional 773s.

It could also be a good replacement for 77W on long haul routes.

A350-1000 in 9-abreast Y should have better operating numbers against 9-abreast B77W(or B777-9X) for most routes. CX is unlikely to go 10-abreast on 777.

EK on the other hand with its 10-abreast Y and 7-abreast J layout is likely to choose B777-9X over A350-1000.
 
astuteman
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:17 pm

Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 16):
EK on the other hand with its 10-abreast Y and 7-abreast J layout is likely to choose B777-9X over A350-1000.

????
EK has already "chosen" the A350-1000, hasn't it?   

FWIW I can actually see them operating the A350-1000 and B777-9X side-by-side, with the latter taking the space that might once have been for the 748i

Rgds
 
LAXDESI
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:30 pm

Quoting astuteman (Reply 17):
EK has already "chosen" the A350-1000, hasn't it?

FWIW I can actually see them operating the A350-1000 and B777-9X side-by-side, with the latter taking the space that might once have been for the 748i

What I should have said was that the bulk of replacement order for B77W would go to B777-9X. One can not rule out the possibilty that A350-1000 may be converted to A359.
 
mham001
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:50 pm

Quoting col (Reply 9):
Zeke actually said thank you for the slots on the Etihad canx thread, guess you knew what was coming.

He also said there were no slots available until 2018.
 
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:11 pm

Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 18):
What I should have said was that the bulk of replacement order for B77W would go to B777-9X. One can not rule out the possibilty that A350-1000 may be converted to A359.

I think the bulk of the 77W fleet will be replaced by the 35J because it will carry 90% of the passengers in EK's configuration at less cost. The 779X can then be used for the routes that regularly sell that extra 10% load factor or need that bit extra payload. Range is pretty even, and the 35J will extend range as it matures, as will the 77X but I would assume by not as much as it is already an older base design tweeked as much as possble. I'm still to make my mind up if that extra 30 seats is worth an extra type in the fleet, or just abuse an A380 whilst the route builds to a reasonable load factor on the A380. A 35J at 317 seats equales a 63%ish load factor on a 380, whilst a 354 seat 777 equales a 71%ish load factor on a 380. Is that 8% worth the extra type.

A couple of questions-

What is the average EK load actor for cargo carried in the belly of 77W's?
How much volume and payload (after pax and bags) extra does the 77w carry over the 35J and 380?
 
CXB77L
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 4:15 am

Quoting ncfc99 (Reply 20):
I think the bulk of the 77W fleet will be replaced by the 35J

So that's why EK recently ordered 50 more 77Ws, and have been on record as one of the strongest proponents of the 777X?

I think at EK, the bulk of the 77W fleet will be replaced by new build 77Ws, and/or 777-9X. EK's A35Js are likely to be used as replacement for the 772A/772ER/773s on short/medium haul missions, which is what they initially ordered the aircraft for, until Airbus changed it - hence this spiel from Clark saying that they should have been consulted first prior to the changes.
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astuteman
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 8:35 am

Quoting CXB77L (Reply 21):
So that's why EK recently ordered 50 more 77Ws

EK made it quite clear when they placed this order that they did so because they could no longer get their A350-1000's in the 2015-2017 time period, and as an insurance against further slippages to availablility of the A350-1000.

Nothing more. Nothing less

FWIW despite having made comments about the A350-1000 changes, they in no way linked those comments to the decision to order 50 more 773ER's, instead quite explicitly quoting the above reason, and the above reason alone.

Rgds
 
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Ncfc99
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 9:04 am

Quoting astuteman (Reply 22):
Quoting CXB77L (Reply 21):
So that's why EK recently ordered 50 more 77Ws

EK made it quite clear when they placed this order that they did so because they could no longer get their A350-1000's in the 2015-2017 time period, and as an insurance against further slippages to availablility of the A350-1000.

Nothing more. Nothing less

FWIW despite having made comments about the A350-1000 changes, they in no way linked those comments to the decision to order 50 more 773ER's, instead quite explicitly quoting the above reason, and the above reason alone.

Arn't EK also retiring early 77W's as some of these new one aircraft come into the fleet, or will they operate all of them at once?

At it maximum fleet size around 2020, I'm guessing there will be over 100 77W's in the EK fleet (after delivery of this last order of 50), thats the fleet I think will mostly be replaced with 35J, not the currant fleet as it stands now. That is plenty of frames to split between 35J and 777X, wthout even thinking about growth. As I said above, is the extra few percent of capacity worth an extra fleet type. I'm yet to be convinced it is, but if Boeing pull another rabbit out of its hat as it did with the 77W, then yes I can see it, if not I'm scepticle that it is worth it. However, an EK fleet of just 359 & 35J, then a jump up to 388 (&389's) would surely be a challange for Airbus to supply all those frames in a reasonable time frame for EK, so that gives a 77X fleet a better than average chance of an order IMHO.

Quoting CXB77L (Reply 21):
and have been on record as one of the strongest proponents of the 777X?

They talked about the 748 quite a bit too, but that went nowhere.
 
flythere
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 10:29 am

Quoting cloudyapple (Thread starter):

These are in addition to the previous purchase of 30, taking the total ordered to 36.

Should be 38 total firmed order when consider also the 2 through leasing company.
Still many options left to come.

Quoting PM (Reply 1):
Etihad cancel 6, Cathay order 6. You win some, you lose some!

CX takes 6 more at present because EY freed up the production slots.  
Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 16):
CX is unlikely to go 10-abreast on 777.

The best answer is NEVER. CX will NEVER go 10-abreast.
 
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Stitch
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 2:48 pm

Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 16):
CX is unlikely to go 10-abreast on 777.

On their 777's they cannot, but they could on the 777X if Boeing does increase the inside cabin diameter a bit.

zeke has noted that CX wants the same Economy seat across their widebody fleet for a consistent passenger experience. According to SeatGuru, that seat is 17.5" in width.

CX chose the A350 in part because it can fit a 17.5" seat at 9-abreast where the 787 cannot. The 777 cannot do 17.5" at 10-abreast, but if Boeing can free up 3" of interior space, then it could.

One thing of note - I believe 17.5" can be fitted at 11-abreast on the main deck in the A380-800, so I wonder should CX choose the A380, they would choose 3+5+3 versus the 3+4+3 of current operators with 18-19" seats. I don't fly CX, but if I did, I'd be voting for the 747-8 since it can only do 10-abreast at 17.5".

  
 
kaitak
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 3:07 pm

Quoting Stitch (Reply 25):
One thing of note - I believe 17.5" can be fitted at 11-abreast on the main deck in the A380-800, so I wonder should CX choose the A380, they would choose 3+5+3 versus the 3+4+3 of current operators with 18-19" seats. I don't fly CX, but if I did, I'd be voting for the 747-8 since it can only do 10-abreast at 17.5".

Has anyone actually gone to 11 abreast on the A380? I'd heard it talked about, but I wasn't sure if anyone had actually gone down that road!
 
Daysleeper
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 3:19 pm

Quoting CXB77L (Reply 21):
I think at EK, the bulk of the 77W fleet will be replaced by new build 77Ws, and/or 777-9X. EK's A35Js are likely to be used as replacement for the 772A/772ER/773s on short/medium haul missions, which is what they initially ordered the aircraft for, until Airbus changed it - hence this spiel from Clark saying that they should have been consulted first prior to the changes.

I’m intrigued as to why you think they would replace existing 77Ws with new build ones when the A35J will be able to operate the same routes but at a substantially reduced costs. As we discussed in detail in another thread the very slight payload advantage the 77W’s has at missions less than 6000nm is unusable due to space constraints. And the 20-30 extra Y passengers with 10 abreast seating isn’t going to come anywhere close to offsetting the 20% fuel burn advantage of the A350.

If Boeing increase the capacity of the 77W with the 77X then I can see them operating it on the few routes where neither the A35J or the A380 fit. But for all intents and purposes as Airbus stated in their press release and Boeing confirmed with the 77X, the 77W will be made obsolete by the A35J.
 
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Stitch
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 3:24 pm

Quoting kaitak (Reply 26):
Has anyone actually gone to 11 abreast on the A380? I'd heard it talked about, but I wasn't sure if anyone had actually gone down that road!

To my knowledge, no.
 
rushed
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 4:29 pm

I can't remember where or when I read it (or may be imagining this) but weren't CX looking at increasing frequency on key business routes? How does this mesh with a VLA?
travel blogging enthusiast :)
 
LAXDESI
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 6:29 pm

Quoting Daysleeper (Reply 27):
If Boeing increase the capacity of the 77W with the 77X then I can see them operating it on the few routes where neither the A35J or the A380 fit. But for all intents and purposes as Airbus stated in their press release and Boeing confirmed with the 77X, the 77W will be made obsolete by the A35J.

I too believe that A350-1000 in current iteration has a good future. I have a thread in tech. forum where I compared the A350-1000 to B777-9X as laid out in a Flightglobal article. Details in the link below:
A350-10 Versus B777-9X Economic Analysis (by LAXDESI Sep 20 2011 in Tech Ops)

Here's a quote from OP of the above thread with B777-9X in 10-abreast Y:
Under the assumption of a 6,300 nm (HKG-LAX) mission at MTOW:
B777-9X burns about 4,500 gallons more at a current cost of $13,500.
A350-10 has the potential to carry about 7,000 lbs. additional cargo, and earn about $5,000 at 50% load factor.
B777-9X has the potential to earn about $19,000 in additional 38 Y seat revenues at 70% load factor.

Overall, it is a wash between the two for a 6,300nm mission with SQ or CX like F and J configuration with 10 abreast Y.

However, an operator like EK with 7-abreast in J will come out ahead with 777-9X.

Furthermore, an operator with SQ or CX like F and J configuration with 9 abreast Y will come out ahead with A350-10.

It seems to me that the selection between the two critically depends on the expected cabin layout of the airline.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 25):
On their 777's they cannot, but they could on the 777X if Boeing does increase the inside cabin diameter a bit.

If CX were to go 10-abreast Y on 777-9X, then 777-9X may be more attractive if it is cheaper to acquire and no more expensive to maintain than A350-1000. Data on CFRP maintenance from B787/A359 will help in comparing the two.

If CX were to stay 9-abreast on 777-9X, it would lose out to A350-1000 on operating economics.
 
Daysleeper
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 6:44 pm

Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 30):
B777-9X burns about 4,500 gallons more at a current cost of $13,500.
A350-10 has the potential to carry about 7,000 lbs. additional cargo, and earn about $5,000 at 50% load factor.
B777-9X has the potential to earn about $19,000 in additional 38 Y seat revenues at 70% load factor

From previous discussions we have established that both these planes will reach there limits in terms of physical capacity before weight, so I’d doubt the A35J would ever be able to use such a small advantage.

I’m also confused as to how you get a $19K advantage from just 38 Y seats unless you haven’t deducted operating costs and have just assumed a $500 ticket price ?
 
LAXDESI
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 7:05 pm

Quoting Daysleeper (Reply 31):
From previous discussions we have established that both these planes will reach there limits in terms of physical capacity before weight, so I’d doubt the A35J would ever be able to use such a small advantage.

Volume constraints may indeed make it difficult for A350-1000 to realize its cargo advantage, and therefore make the B777-9X marginally more attractive.

Quoting Daysleeper (Reply 31):
I’m also confused as to how you get a $19K advantage from just 38 Y seats unless you haven’t deducted operating costs and have just assumed a $500 ticket price ?

I am assuming an average RT ticket price of about $1,400, and $700 then would be the share allocated to this leg in my analysis($19,000 = $700 X 38 X 70%)
 
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frigatebird
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 8:02 pm

Quoting Stitch (Reply 28):
Quoting kaitak (Reply 26):Has anyone actually gone to 11 abreast on the A380? I'd heard it talked about, but I wasn't sure if anyone had actually gone down that road!To my knowledge, no.

Not even EK, while they have their 777's 10 abreast in Y. And if they haven't I wonder if there are maybe some certification issues or other formalities that prevents an airline from using 11 abreast seating? Is 10 abreast perhaps the maximum with 2 aisles?

But apart from any possible certification issues with 11 abreast, CX will certainly not go that way. Pretty sure they will have a large bunch of A35J's in their fleet also, with already so many A359's on order. Some may even be converted to -1000s. Initially to replace 773's, and later, with further improvements, to replace 77W's.
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astuteman
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 8:36 pm

Quoting kaitak (Reply 26):
Has anyone actually gone to 11 abreast on the A380? I'd heard it talked about, but I wasn't sure if anyone had actually gone down that road!

I'm pretty sure I read a comment from Airbus that said the deck wasn't strong enough to accommodate 11-abreast, and to be honest, I'm not sure why anyone would need to.
I think you'll find even Air Austral's 840 seat layout is 10-abreast on maindeck.

Rgds
 
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Stitch
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sat Jan 21, 2012 9:15 pm

Quoting frigatebird (Reply 33):
But apart from any possible certification issues with 11 abreast, CX will certainly not go that way.

I'm sure the passengers would appreciate the extra width if CX went with a wider seat at 10-abreast, but they theoretically could do 11-abreast and still maintain a common passenger experience (if the plane could take it).

They could also stick with 17.5" in 3+4+3 and have extra wide aisles, which would help loading, unloading and passenger transit during cart services.

[Edited 2012-01-21 13:16:27]
 
cloudyapple
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sun Jan 22, 2012 3:13 am

Quoting astuteman (Reply 34):
I think you'll find even Air Austral's 840 seat layout is 10-abreast on maindeck.

That's with a lot of Y seats upstairs and downstairs. When you have a F/J only upper deck then there should be a lot of leftover head counts. Is there a limit on the number of passengers on each deck? A pair of Type A exits has a 110 passenger limit. Are there regulations about where the passengers must be seated in relation to the doors?
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zeke
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sun Jan 22, 2012 9:20 am

Quoting mham001 (Reply 19):
He also said there were no slots available until 2018.

I do not believe I actually said those words, I said they were next to impossible to get slots. Slots do become available from time to time.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 25):
According to SeatGuru, that seat is 17.5" in width.

Seatguru is incorrect, the seats are wider than that in the A330/A340/A350.
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scbriml
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sun Jan 22, 2012 10:54 am

Quoting cloudyapple (Reply 36):
Are there regulations about where the passengers must be seated in relation to the doors?

I believe the only regulation is that for new types, pax must be able to evacuate both forwards and backwards from their seat location.

Interestingly, the 748i has been grandfathered in and doesn't have to meet that requirement - pax in front of door 1 on both decks can only evacuate towards the rear of the plane.
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Stitch
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sun Jan 22, 2012 1:00 pm

Quoting zeke (Reply 37):
Seatguru is incorrect, the seats are wider than that in the A330/A340/A350.

As I don't fly OneWorld, I have not had the chance to break out the measuring tape as I have done for the reports I have given to SeatGuru for Star Alliance airlines. If you happen to know, that would be great. Otherwise, I'm going to hazard a guess of 45cm / 17.7" based on the A330, A340 and A350 ACAP, which would offer a 48cm / 19" aisle on the A330/A340 and an 47cm / 18.35" aisle on the A350.
 
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sun Jan 22, 2012 3:47 pm

Quoting scbriml (Reply 38):
I believe the only regulation is that for new types, pax must be able to evacuate both forwards and backwards from their seat location.

That wouldn't work for the A380 either, as the foremost cabin of the upper deck has no forward door. Unless, of course, descending a flight of stairs is admissible for evac purposes.

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WARNING! The post above should be taken with a grain of salt! Furthermore, it may be slightly biased towards A.
 
AirbusA370
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sun Jan 22, 2012 4:35 pm

Quoting AustrianZRH (Reply 40):
Unless, of course, descending a flight of stairs is admissible for evac purposes.

Yes, of course it is
 
cmf
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sun Jan 22, 2012 6:57 pm

Quoting scbriml (Reply 38):
I believe the only regulation is that for new types, pax must be able to evacuate both forwards and backwards from their seat location.

There are also regulations about maximum distance between emergency exits.
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zeke
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sun Jan 22, 2012 9:25 pm

Quoting Stitch (Reply 39):
Otherwise, I'm going to hazard a guess

Your guess is not correct, from memory the ACAP has a double armrest in the middle.

Most airlines do not publish seat widths. The main reason being is that in any cabin there are many variations on seats on Y due to changes within the fuselage, bulkheads, doors, changes in direction, fuselage tapering etc. While the seats may look similar, they may have many different seat types.
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Stitch
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Sun Jan 22, 2012 10:06 pm

Quoting zeke (Reply 43):
... from memory the ACAP has a double armrest in the middle.

The A330 and A340 ACAPs measures seat width in the outer seat of the center section (the "G" seat in CX's confguration). The A350 ACAP measures from the center of the armrest to the center of the armrest for the "B" seat (middle seat of the outer set of three), which makes sense, as Airbus PR materials say seat cushion width is 17.5" so the extra .2" would be (part of) the armrests.Neither shows what looks like a double-armrest. Anyway, this is a side discussion to the main one, so we can put it to bed.  Smile

[Edited 2012-01-22 14:37:52]
 
CXB77L
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:41 am

Quoting astuteman (Reply 22):
Quoting ncfc99 (Reply 23):
Quoting Daysleeper (Reply 27):

I don't wish to drag the thread any further off topic, so I've posted a message in response to those points here:

Boeing 777-8X And -9X Now In The Pipe Line Part 2 (by wilco737 Jan 18 2012 in Civil Aviation)

Quoting flythere (Reply 24):
CX takes 6 more at present because EY freed up the production slots.

EY announces its cancellation last Wednesday, and CX orders 6 on Friday. I wonder if there are some behind the scenes negotiation between EY, CX and Airbus, to have CX take some of EY's production slots.
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Stitch
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RE: 6 More A359 For Cathay Pacific

Mon Jan 23, 2012 1:05 pm

Quoting CXB77L (Reply 45):
EY announces its cancellation last Wednesday, and CX orders 6 on Friday. I wonder if there are some behind the scenes negotiation between EY, CX and Airbus, to have CX take some of EY's production slots.

I imagine EY informed Airbus before Wednesday - likely well before - that they were going to reduce their order and this allowed Airbus to shop the slots, with CX being the one to say "yes".

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