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Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Thu Feb 02, 2012 11:31 pm

NZ will re-launch AKL - DPS as a seasonal route from June - August using a B763. Fares go on sale from February 23rd using its 'popular' seats to suit fares

http://www.stuff.co.nz/travel/intern...6361786/Air-NZ-restarts-Bali-route
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kiwiandrew

RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Thu Feb 02, 2012 11:45 pm

I know one person who will be excited about this... my retired flatmate loves Bali... goes a couple of times a year and he usually travels with hand luggage only so seats to suit will be fine for him.
 
aircanada014
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 12:58 am

well lets hope it does well and make it year round even if its only 3 or 5 weekly. i wish them luck  
 
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 1:14 am

It will be interesting to see if JQ try to compete with NZ on this route using their A332s.
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timb777
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 1:24 am

Sounds great, this seems to be a good fit for the 763. I hope the pricing is competitive with VA one stops etc.....
 
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aerorobnz
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 1:36 am

Quoting timb777 (Reply 4):
I hope the pricing is competitive with VA one stops etc.....

yep. would think that it will become a reservations option to fly AKL-NZ-DPS-VA-BNE/SYD-VA-AKL as well.
Flown to 120 Airports in 44 Countries on 73 Operators. Visited 55 Countries and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
koruman
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 2:09 am

See my post in the main Air NZ thread.

So S2S is now launching long-haul, and the network planners would rather use a 763 on AKL-DPS than LAX-MAN or SFO-LHR or LAX-PPT.

So much for having a connected network. So much for yield modelling. So much for commercial common sense.
 
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mariner
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 2:15 am

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 1):
I know one person who will be excited about this... my retired flatmate loves Bali... goes a couple of times a year and he usually travels with hand luggage only so seats to suit will be fine for him.

I'm another one who is really pleased to see it. It's a place that a lot of people want to go. I've always been astonished that Air NZ was not flying to such a resort, that is so (comparatively) close.

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kiwiandrew

RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 2:46 am

Although I am disappointed that it is not an exciting new destination ( I would rather have seen EZE or GRU with a 772) I do think it is a smart use of 767 capacity which would otherwise be underutilised during the New Zealand winter season to meet a currently unmet demand for direct flights to Bali. The risk in this route seems pretty minimal.
 
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 3:00 am

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 8):
The risk in this route seems pretty minimal.

As is the potential revenue for the company... The issue for me is not that NZ are flying to DPS, it's that the aircraft being used could be making more money on other existing/new routes.
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kiwiinoz
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 3:01 am

Quoting timb777 (Reply 4):
Sounds great, this seems to be a good fit for the 763. I hope the pricing is competitive with VA one stops etc.....

Its actually quite a hassle via the one-stop. I have met my parents in Bali a couple of times and it seems thay end up travelling about 12 hours.
 
kiwiandrew

RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 3:08 am

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 9):
The issue for me is not that NZ are flying to DPS, it's that the aircraft being used could be making more money on other existing/new routes.

Routes such as?

Bear in mind that the 767 is no longer suitable for most longhaul routes due to the J product. I am curious what these other opportunities are for an aircraft near the end of its service life with only a short haul J product.
 
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mariner
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 3:11 am

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 9):
As is the potential revenue for the company... The issue for me is not that NZ are flying to DPS, it's that the aircraft being used could be making more money on other existing/new routes.

I wonder where?

I think it is a place that should be on the route map because it is a place where many people want to go.

On a personal level, I'll take a holiday in Indonesia, especially Bali, over almost anywhere else in Asia or the Pacific Islands.

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aerorobnz
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 4:49 am

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 11):
Bear in mind that the 767 is no longer suitable for most longhaul routes due to the J product. I am curious what these other opportunities are for an aircraft near the end of its service life with only a short haul J product.
Quoting mariner (Reply 12):
I wonder where?

An extra service or two to HNL???

Random search in June/July to DPS across the whole month found
JQ from $830 (ie: seat only)
VA from $1430
MH from 1643

The same search for HNL found
NZ $1758
QF $1930
KE $2267


Effectively they could lower the average fare to HNL by $250 a seat and still bring in more than what DPS will... and have the chance to sell some of the J Class...(even if they discounted that as well for being an older product)
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xiaotung
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 4:56 am

If NZ wanted to fly to DPS they could have started anytime in the last few years. My question is why now!
 
ghifty
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 5:07 am

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 13):

An extra service or two to HNL???

Random search in June/July to DPS across the whole month found
JQ from $830 (ie: seat only)
VA from $1430
MH from 1643

The same search for HNL found
NZ $1758
QF $1930
KE $2267


Effectively they could lower the average fare to HNL by $250 a seat and still bring in more than what DPS will... and have the chance to sell some of the J Class...(even if they discounted that as well for being an older product)

Interesting. What could be the reason for this cost disparity? Perhaps landing fees, etc.?

In case anybody wonders, per gcmap, the distances for the routes are:

AKL-HNL: 4389mi
AKL-DPS: 4189mi

My theory is that ANZ intended to launch AKL-DPS with the 789 they have on order. Since, per Flight Global, they were supposed to arrive late 2013. Now, it appears, they will arrive sometime in 2014 (mid-late, I assume). 763's in NZ's fleet are just waiting to leave. I'm guessing that AKL-DPS is just a way for them to utilise a bird that is sitting around, doing nothing (what is their 763 fleet doing??).

[Edited 2012-02-02 21:08:19]
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byronicle6
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 5:08 am

Quoting xiaotung (Reply 14):
If NZ wanted to fly to DPS they could have started anytime in the last few years. My question is why now!

My guess is that because its a heavily reliant tourist market, and with the recession over the past few years which we are now emerging from, many people weren't in a financially stable position to travel for overseas holidays

Also what flight arrival/departure times are expected? Obviously one of the weekly flights will be Wednesday, and the other a Saturday or Sunday?
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mariner
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 5:09 am

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 13):
An extra service or two to HNL???

If that rings your bell, but it doesn't do anything for me. DPS is the first time in years Air NZ has flown anywhere I might want to go for my vacations.

HNL is a mature market and lower fares may indeed stimulate that market some, but eventually it is finite, all markets are.

DPS is new territory and may well stimulate other areas of the base market, people like me.

Or does Air NZ simply give away that section of the market that prefers Asia?

mariner

[Edited 2012-02-02 21:19:48]
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aerorobnz
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 5:35 am

Quoting byronicle6 (Reply 16):
Also what flight arrival/departure times are expected?

would think early AM or Late PM out of AKL...like most charter operators...And they will need domestic feed.. I'd say 0700-0800 or 2359 departure.

Quoting mariner (Reply 17):
If that rings your bell, but it doesn't do anything for me

It doesn't ring my bell, neither does DPS to be honest - it's somewhere that I would only pass through on a backpacking tour of South East Asia..

Unless they offer it as a direct KLM connection to AMS and beyond they aren't going to gain much onward feed either.
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kiwiandrew

RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 5:40 am

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 18):
It doesn't ring my bell, neither does DPS to be honest - it's somewhere that I would only pass through on a backpacking tour of South East Asia..

Not getting at you specifically, but it is interesting the prejudices people have about Bali ... there are actually some very upmarket areas and resorts ... it's not all about loud drunk backpackers vomiting their way around Kuta doing drugs and picking up STIs.
 
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mariner
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 5:46 am

Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 18):
It doesn't ring my bell, neither does DPS to be honest - it's somewhere that I would only pass through on a backpacking tour of South East Asia..

I don't stay on Bali, either.

I give myself a couple of nights somewhere glam - I've been going to the Oberoi since 1976 - and then either head off to Surabaya or get the short flight to Lombok, which is, for my money, pretty close to heaven.

I think it is crazy that no Australian (or obviously NZ) airline flies to Lombok, but I take what I can get.

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nethkt
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 6:01 am

Would love to see AIR NZ coming all the way to Phuket!
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PA515
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 7:11 am

Quoting xiaotung (Reply 14):
If NZ wanted to fly to DPS they could have started anytime in the last few years. My question is why now!

June, July and August coincides with use of the 77E on AKL-HNL which is the same distance.

Quoting byronicle6 (Reply 16):
Also what flight arrival/departure times are expected? Obviously one of the weekly flights will be Wednesday, and the other a Saturday or Sunday?

Probably the same as the AKL-HNL 763 flights so it won't conflict with the rest of the 763 schedule: AKL-HNL dep 1100 Tu Th Sa, HNL-AKL arr 0630 We Fr Su.

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gardermoen
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:02 am

A seasonal new service, hardly exciting stuff. This surely can become a year round service, can't see the problem in getting traffic all year round. Back in the 90s, both GA and NZ flew the route so it's ripe something came back.
There will also be some feed ex-Indonesia I would take.
I know GA were keen to resume AKL, has been mentioned a few times but nothing seems to come of it.
 
koruman
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:19 am

I currently have bookings for eight AKL-HNL business class returns this year, at NZ$5000 each.

I don't dispute that Bali is a Seats 2 Suit market, as it's a cheap and cheerful destination, but a long-haul flight.

I just want to know who they think will buy the 24 Business Class seats on every flight, and I want to know how much yield they will have to sacrifice to shift them.
 
kiwiandrew

RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:26 am

Quoting koruman (Reply 24):
I just want to know who they think will buy the 24 Business Class seats on every flight, and I want to know how much yield they will have to sacrifice to shift them.

If it helps, try not to think of them as business class, think of them as premium economy, since realistically that is what those seats are on any flight more than about 4 hours duration.
 
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MillwallSean
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:31 am

Quoting gardermoen (Reply 23):
A seasonal new service, hardly exciting stuff. This surely can become a year round service, can't see the problem in getting traffic all year round. Back in the 90s, both GA and NZ flew the route so it's ripe something came back.
There will also be some feed ex-Indonesia I would take.
I know GA were keen to resume AKL, has been mentioned a few times but nothing seems to come of it.

The feed ex indo from DPS will be small, very small. Thats why Garuda hasnt launched Auckland. The money isnt from DPS but thats the destination to where the NZ demand is, tricky one. This is 0therwise one of the few routes I think Lion Air could make a killing on. Cheapest tickets wins hands down here and no one would be able to undercut Lionair.

Nah, this is a flightcentre route. Extremely low yields and the typical beachresort. But that doesnt have to be bad. NZ made alot of money of Polynesia for a long time. A healthy dose of tourism and VFR ensured that.

But one thing is certain its not launched because of business demand between AKL-DPS nor will we see businessfares like the ones to Singapore.

I am happy NZ will fly it even if it just is a short term tour operator contract. And yes during the Northern summer months DPS seems a lot of free capacity at their hotels and I am sure the travelagents have gotten great bargains on hotelrooms.
The consolidators tend to have incredible deals during this period. In NZ where competition is low one or two chains can really leverage this.

What will this do to NZ as an overall airline. I guess very little. Flying charter tourists works but its razorthin margins if there is the slightest competition and in the case of DPS (cheap charlie holiday destination) I would guess many tourists would be prepared to take a stopover in Australia if they saved 200 dollars.
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ZKOJH
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:48 am

well what a funny route, lets hope they can pull this one off or they will look like Clowns . they will struggle to fill the 24 up front, and this will mostly be free upgrades so hope they got this covered. lets wait for the next press statement saying due to lack of pax' s and money we are not going to carry on this route then.
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mariner
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:05 am

Quoting koruman (Reply 24):
I just want to know who they think will buy the 24 Business Class seats on every flight, and I want to know how much yield they will have to sacrifice to shift them.

I'll almost certainly buy one of them.

I think it bizarre to imagine that there isn't any premium traffic to Bali just because the cheap Kuta crowd gets all the attention. Someone has to fill all the five star hotels.

Quoting MillwallSean (Reply 26):
Nah, this is a flightcentre route.


Cashed up Bogans? Great - they sure spend and enjoy their money.

The largest vacation packager in the US is presently shifting all of it's flight contracts to airlines that have some sort premium seating, even if only premium economy or the like, because the demand for it is there.

mariner

[Edited 2012-02-03 03:08:52]
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koruman
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:46 am

The luxury hotels on Bali are primarily filled by southeast Asians, who live within three hours by plane.

There are few Australians who stay in such hotels, but for WA and QLD residents Bali is closer than Hawaii, and can be served by 737s. The Australians I see who go to Bali are a mixture of the lowest yielding travellers who can't afford to go to Hawaii or Tahiti plus that cultural-cringe demographic which thinks that any old foreign culture is in some way richer and more exotic than their own. MillwallSean will recognize them from "Viz" as "The Modern Parents".

I know of the top of my head 7 Australians who have stayed at the St Regis on Kauai in Hawaii. I've never met one who has stayed at the Bali one.

The post saying "consider Business Class to be Premium Economy" is silly really. The seat pitch is 60 inches, that's an awful lot of wasted real estate. And of course those 24 seats did sell on LAX-PPT, as Business Class. And would be likely to sell for around $6000 on LAX-MAN or BNE-HKG.

The race to the bottom continues.....
 
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BNE
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 12:30 pm

I for one am glad that Air NZ are trying a new route. The time frame is good to test out the market to work out whether they should come back next year. I am sure a lot of the seats will be filled by passengers who want seats to suit but I am sure that there will be enough semi retired older folk who would enjoy a new destination to try out. Obviously there was a market in the past for AKL-DPS and with a bit of marketing from the airline and the flight centres and the like it will do well.
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mariner
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 5:47 pm

Quoting koruman (Reply 29):
The luxury hotels on Bali are primarily filled by southeast Asians, who live within three hours by plane.

Not when I've been there. The Oberoi is a longtime stomping ground of mine, since 1976, and I disagree with you.

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NZ6
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 7:57 pm

Quoting koruman (Reply 6):
See my post in the main Air NZ thread.

So S2S is now launching long-haul, and the network planners would rather use a 763 on AKL-DPS than LAX-MAN or SFO-LHR or LAX-PPT.

So much for having a connected network. So much for yield modelling. So much for commercial common sense.

I wish Koruman could agree NZ and him don't see eye to eye with things yet they have run an airline through the worst 3-5 years of it's history and still made profit. Koruman, although I often enjoy readying your opinion you point has remained the same now for some years, it's a little dry now and we all know what you would prefer  
Quoting ZKOJH (Reply 27):
well what a funny route, lets hope they can pull this one off or they will look like Clowns . they will struggle to fill the 24 up front, and this will mostly be free upgrades so hope they got this covered. lets wait for the next press statement saying due to lack of pax' s and money we are not going to carry on this route then.

Good on them for giving it a go I say, it is as risk but with the 772 going to HNL it does free up at 763, you could ground it and play safe or send them to SYD/MEL which NZ management has been beaten up on these forums for before but they are trying something new. Will 24 J seats sell?

Quoting koruman (Reply 29):
There are few Australians who stay in such hotels, but for WA and QLD residents Bali is closer than Hawaii, and can be served by 737s. The Australians I see who go to Bali are a mixture of the lowest yielding travellers who can't afford to go to Hawaii or Tahiti plus that cultural-cringe demographic which thinks that any old foreign culture is in some way richer and more exotic than their own. MillwallSean will recognize them from "Viz" as "The Modern Parents".

Sorry but this is wrong, there is a J market there, low cost J but it's still there. 5 star hotels who don't completely replicate who buys business class is made up of heaps of Aussies and Kiwis etc. NZ wont full 24 each time I think they know that, they will sell them mostly at discounted rates and to FQTV rewards (upgrades are different). They will fill half the cabin at least on each service, I don't think you can do much more about it. You can't refit the cabin, you can't not fly there because of this, what you could also do it sell it as works deluxe.
 
The Coachman
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 9:00 pm

Quoting koruman (Reply 6):
So S2S is now launching long-haul, and the network planners would rather use a 763 on AKL-DPS than LAX-MAN or SFO-LHR or LAX-PPT.

LOL

If they launched a 763 on SFO-LHR, they wouldn't fill the 24 J seats either because BA and UA would have them for breakfast.

LAX-MAN - you'd think that BA would have already tried that one; MAN-JFK didn't even work on 763 equipment.

LAX-PPT - tourist numbers to Tahiti have dropped significantly from the US recently.

Just because you hold 8 J class tickets AKL-HNL this year doesn't mean that there are other people like you sufficient to fly the route.

I have to wonder why so many of your posts seem to merely repeat your own personal preferences and attribute them as being reflective of the wider market. Has it been considered that you indeed may not be reflective of the market in general?
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kiwiandrew

RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:10 pm

Quoting The Coachman (Reply 33):
I have to wonder why so many of your posts seem to merely repeat your own personal preferences and attribute them as being reflective of the wider market. Has it been considered that you indeed may not be reflective of the market in general?

I have often wondered that as well. It is a bit like me saying that NZ should obviously fly to BRU because I go there from time to time.
 
28L28L
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:28 pm

The article mentions NZ ending DPS in the 1990s.
Does anyone know what specific year that was?
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aerorobnz
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:58 pm

Quoting 28L28L (Reply 35):
The article mentions NZ ending DPS in the 1990s.
Does anyone know what specific year that was?

the year in the back of my mind is 1995. I don't know why, but I'm pretty sure it was not the later 90s
Flown to 120 Airports in 44 Countries on 73 Operators. Visited 55 Countries and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
SKY1
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Sat Feb 04, 2012 12:00 am

Quoting gardermoen (Reply 23):
Back in the 90s, both GA and NZ flew the route so it's ripe something came back.

In the 1990's GA served even MAD, it means nothing. Today's aviation is far different that in the 90's ...If there's some business that it has dramatically changed and it has nothing to do with 15 years back is the civil aviation business.

Now, NZ realizes that they have the ideal plane (767-300) to fly a medium haul, new destination (DPS) Good for them! But for sure it has nothing to do with the fact that in some moment in the 1990's they already served Bali.

Quoting koruman (Reply 29):
The Australians I see who go to Bali are a mixture of the lowest yielding travellers who can't afford to go to Hawaii or Tahiti plus that cultural-cringe demographic which thinks that any old foreign culture is in some way richer and more exotic than their own

hahaha ....so according you, the australians going to Bali is because they are 'pauper' & and with kinda identity crisis about their own culture, right?

Quoting koruman (Reply 29):
I know of the top of my head 7 Australians who have stayed at the St Regis on Kauai in Hawaii. I've never met one who has stayed at the Bali one.

Dunno if this one is the most classicist statement that I ever read in a.net, but for sure is among the most classicist and unfortunate remarks. Really a bad taste!
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alangirvan
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Sat Feb 04, 2012 12:09 am

Not sure of the year it ended, but if I remember it was a time when AirNZ was going to several Asian points, as part of trips to SIN. The DPS flights operated AKL-DPS-SIN twice weekly. Other flights were AKL-SIN-BKK and AKL-SIN-KUL, and also there were flights CHC-SYD-BKK and AKL-SYD-BKK. All these were 762 flights.

Perhaps this flight to DPS is a pity that they got rid of Freedom, because that would be ideal for leisure flights. Even just one 767 in an all tourist configuration (the Qantas Australian Airlines planes were 271 seats). If Jetstar is a good enough brand to use for carrying tourists from Japan to Australia, Freedom would be fine to carry those tourists to NZ.

It will be interesting to see how Seats to Suit are marketed. When I look at travel adverts in magazines, some of the retailers will base their lead in prices on the Seat only level, and others will use the Works fare as their base price.


And for people outside Auckland, I hope there will be reasonable connecting fares for people to use the flights. It is annoying when flights out of AKL are scheduled so early that people have to stay the night in AKL to catch an early morning departure. (An 1100 departure is too early for people from DUD to catch). If we travel through CHC, there is a same plane service CHC-MEL-DPS on Virgin, but that is quite a long ride in a Virgin 737 with tight seats. Hopefully when Virgin have more A332s some of those will go to DPS.
 
kiwiandrew

RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Sat Feb 04, 2012 12:29 am

Quoting alangirvan (Reply 38):
also there were flights CHC-SYD-BKK and AKL-SYD-BKK. All these were 762 flights.

Are you sure? I thought the BKK flights on NZ were a mix of via SIN or via BNE. I don't remember via SYD.
 
jamesnz
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Sat Feb 04, 2012 2:04 am

Quoting 28L28L (Reply 35):
The article mentions NZ ending DPS in the 1990s.
Does anyone know what specific year that was?
Cheers
Quoting aerorobnz (Reply 36):
the year in the back of my mind is 1995. I don't know why, but I'm pretty sure it was not the later 90s

I flew AKL-DPS with my family in 1997 on one of their 747-200's. I'm pretty sure that was the last year they flew it, because the following year we had to fly to Sydney and continue on with Ansett.

I don't know how often that aircraft was put on the route, but surely the 767 is going to be easier to fill at the front than that.
 
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Sat Feb 04, 2012 4:50 am

Would an A321, B739ER or B752 be more suited to the route with all Y service?
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kiwiandrew

RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Sat Feb 04, 2012 4:59 am

Quoting 777ER (Reply 41):
Would an A321, B739ER or B752 be more suited to the route with all Y service?

Since none of those are in NZ's fleet, or ever likely to be in NZ's fleet it seems an odd question. But I would imagine that out of the 3 the 757 is the only one which could possibly perform such a mission. However, I am sure that part of the rationale behind the route is to utilise existing equipment which would otherwise be idle. Introducing a new type to operate what has been announced as a 3 month service would seem highly illogical.
 
zkncj
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Sat Feb 04, 2012 5:23 am

Quoting 777ER (Reply 41):
Would an A321, B739ER or B752 be more suited to the route with all Y service?

The A321 has less range than a A320, it would need a fuel stop in CNS
 
gardermoen
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Sat Feb 04, 2012 5:35 am

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 39):
Are you sure? I thought the BKK flights on NZ were a mix of via SIN or via BNE. I don't remember via SYD.

Yes, there was one season circa mid/late 90s when they had a CHC/AKL-SYD-BKK weekly service. I remember it well from my timetable collection back then.
 
nz2
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Sat Feb 04, 2012 7:20 am

Quoting mariner (Reply 28):
I'll almost certainly buy one of them.

At $3000 each way???
 
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mariner
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Sat Feb 04, 2012 7:23 am

Quoting nz2 (Reply 45):
At $3000 each way???

I flew to Perth last winter and that was the Qantas fare for Business Class.

mariner
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nz2
Posts: 167
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Sat Feb 04, 2012 7:27 am

Quoting mariner (Reply 46):
I flew to Perth last winter and that was the Qantas fare for Business Class.

mariner

Book sales must be good then
 
anstar
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Sat Feb 04, 2012 8:10 am

SYD-RAR is a leisure route and that seems to be doing o seasonally. Can't see why DPS wouldnt work too.
 
NZ6
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RE: Air NZ Announces Its Newest Destination: Bali

Sat Feb 04, 2012 8:27 pm

Quoting The Coachman (Reply 33):
If they launched a 763 on SFO-LHR, they wouldn't fill the 24 J seats either because BA and UA would have them for breakfast.

LAX-MAN - you'd think that BA would have already tried that one; MAN-JFK didn't even work on 763 equipment.

LAX-PPT - tourist numbers to Tahiti have dropped significantly from the US recently.

Just because you hold 8 J class tickets AKL-HNL this year doesn't mean that there are other people like you sufficient to fly the route.

I have to wonder why so many of your posts seem to merely repeat your own personal preferences and attribute them as being reflective of the wider market. Has it been considered that you indeed may not be reflective of the market in general?

Nice

The other point to note is even though focusing on your "core market" may seem boring, an Airline of NZ's size should not expose itself to the wider world wide aviation problems as they don't have the money or population to adapt quickly enough if they are hit by an under-preforming route or strong competition.

Lets look at Koruman's ideal fleet of more 772 and 77L flying routes such as LAX/SFO to MAN/LON and PER/LON, that would require several billion dollars worth of aircraft investment.

What if the US and European markets stay flat for another couple of years or if demand falls from these markets of if they create a price war with the other bigger airlines - QF, TG, SQ, EK or UA, AA, DL, BA, VS, AF, LH for example will crush NZ with low cost fares on these routes - then what does NZ do with it's new equipment?