qf340500
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:40 pm

In the meantime two newly delivered planes with the new Premium Economy and new long-haul Economy product should have arrived in Hong Kong. A330-300 left Toulouse on 24th and B 777-300ER left Seattle on 25th. Both should be in Hong Kong already. Does anyone has pictures of the two new products? CX did a very good job keeping these innovative products a secret until the last moment. Excited to see the Premium economy product finally...
 
mogandoCI
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:59 pm

how do they sell the seats when the customer doesn't even know what they're buying ?
 
qf340500
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:14 pm

well, they have a very good verbal description on the homepage, and according to internal reports the uptake is quite good already... still WAITING for the first pics  
 
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zeke
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:27 pm

Busy weekend for CX, a new A320 for KA, a new A330, a new 77W, and a new 748F.

B-LAN the new A330 basically came back empty from TLS, do not expect pics from that, it landed in HKG at 2:49 local on Saturday, it should be in revenue service as early as Monday.

B-KPY the new 77W however should have some pics leaking out as there is a media contingent in the cold and wet Seattle for its departure today, that should also be in revenue service next week.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
 
qf340500
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:34 pm

Thanks, Zeke, i can't wait for the leaked pictures....
 
qf002
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:43 pm

Quoting zeke (Reply 3):
B-KPY the new 77W however should have some pics leaking out as there is a media contingent in the cold and wet Seattle for its departure today, that should also be in revenue service next week.

Lucky people! What time is the flight due in HKG?
 
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zeke
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 1:50 pm

Quoting qf002 (Reply 5):

Will know more when it departs, they also had a dinner last night at the museum oof flight with our COO.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
 
qf340500
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 2:01 pm

Zeke, thanks, for your input... but... why is there such a big fanfare about the Boeing 777-300ER delivery, but no celebration about the actual first plane delivered with PE, the A330-300, which must have arrived already.... obv we know Boeing also have the 747-8F to celebrate delivery but one thinks CX celebrate the Boeing deliveries more than Airbus' ??
 
qf002
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 2:12 pm

Quoting QF340500 (Reply 7):
one thinks CX celebrate the Boeing deliveries more than Airbus' ??

I think you're reading too far into it...

1. The A333 will struggle to carry 50+ pax nonstop TLS-HKG. The 77W can handle the same load on SEA-HKG without any issues.

2. SEA is far more local to the media that I imagine CX are targeting -- ie the North American and East Asian/Australian markets. Cheaper and easier to get people there...

Another question for Zeke -- are these aircraft fitted with the new Y seat as well?? Have any further details emerged yet on this product (it seems to have been rather overshadowed by the introduction of W)...
 
qf340500
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 2:18 pm

yeah, i heard that they also have the new long haul economy product on board, but how will it be???? Overshadowed is the right way of putting it... they are supposed to be 1 inch wider and have more recline... BUT no info/comments if it is still the "much loved" fixed shell... so lots of excitement this weekend for us  

oh, also the latest 777-300ER is the first one without First Class ... what do you guys say to that?
 
qf002
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 2:32 pm

Quoting QF340500 (Reply 9):
fixed shell.

I'm hoping that CX retains the fixed shell design in the W cabin, but reverts to a more traditional style product in Y. Articulating seat bases (ie the base cushion slides forward as the seat reclines) does half the job of the shell seats anyway (ie preserving knee space).

Quoting QF340500 (Reply 9):
what do you guys say to that?

I think it's a good move. Hopefully it will mean that we could see some 777's back in Australia at some point (doubtful, I know   )
 
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zeke
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 2:53 pm

Quoting qf002 (Reply 8):

Yes it will. The new PEY seat is a Cathay corporate green, (similar to B-KPF, the green "Asia World City" 77W) and the new economy seat is blue similar to the current Y seats. Both seats are made by Weber. I believe 6 new A330s are due this year in the 39J/28PEY/175Y configuration (known as the 33G configuration). I have photos of the seats and the seat maps, however I am not willing to post anything until released elsewhere.

This configuration will be on B-LAN to B-LAR and B-LAX.

The 77W will be operating as CX3337, expect departure around 1pm local, and arrival In HKG around 7:30 pm local if all goes to plan.

Quoting QF340500 (Reply 9):
oh, also the latest 777-300ER is the first one without First Class ...

Yes it will be, B-KPY to B-KQH will be known at the 77G configuration with a 40J/32W/268Y layout. J class will have 3 window rows, and 4 centre rows aft of door 2, this will rows 11 to 23, PEY is 4 rows of 8 behind that, 30 to 34, and Y is 39 to 72.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
 
qf340500
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 3:15 pm

Thanks Zeke... lots of input! Sounds like a great configuration. And KUDOS to your integrity to CX for not publishing pics before the official launch!
 
CX Flyboy
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Sat Feb 25, 2012 11:29 pm

Quoting zeke (Reply 11):
Yes it will be, B-KPY to B-KQH will be known at the 77G configuration with a 40J/32W/268Y layout. J class will have 3 window rows, and 4 centre rows aft of door 2, this will rows 11 to 23, PEY is 4 rows of 8 behind that, 30 to 34, and Y is 39 to 72.

Whats forwards of dors 2 then?

Quoting QF340500 (Reply 12):
Thanks Zeke... lots of input! Sounds like a great configuration. And KUDOS to your integrity to CX for not publishing pics before the official launch!

I think the potential wrath of the company about one of their employees leaking sensitive photos online and subsequent job security!!....not that I am questioning his integrity either. Just that a big company does not treat employees kindly if they go public on big things before they do it themselves.
 
ghifty
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:51 am

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 1):

how do they sell the seats when the customer doesn't even know what they're buying ?

How did Breaking Dawn sell tickets when some people didn't know what they'd see... and when most people knew they'd see absolute crap?
  

I'm sure people have enough confidence in CX that they'll know whatever CX has in store for them will, likely, please them. Kind of like Apple, I suppose.
 
Fly Delta Jets
 
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CCA
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:54 am

Quoting CX Flyboy (Reply 13):
Whats forwards of dors 2 then?

The remainder of J class.
P1 in A330, A340, A346, B742, B744, B748.
 
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zeke
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:41 am

Quoting CX Flyboy (Reply 13):
Whats forwards of dors 2 then?

Rows 11-19 of J class like the A330.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
 
JA8119
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 1:37 pm

Someone leaked the picture of the new cabin on a Hong Kong local forum.The Y+ seat looks just like a sightly enlarged Y seat.

http://www.discuss.com.hk/viewthread...tid=17863615&extra=page%3D1&page=3

[Edited 2012-02-26 06:00:19]
 
qf002
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:15 pm

Not sure I'm keen on this new styling in these bigger, denser cabins. The seats look quite dated from this first photo...

Looks to me like the seats (at least in W) are still fixed shell...
 
LondonCity
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:16 pm

Quoting JA8119 (Reply 17):
Someone leaked the picture of the new cabin on a Hong Kong local forum.The Y+ seat looks just like a sightly enlarged Y seat.

The new CX Y+ seats look nothing special. If CX had offered lots more comfort, like NZ's new Y+ for example, then the penalty would have been less space in the regular Y cabin. When NZ introduced its more comfortable Y+ on the B77W, the seating in Y class changed from 9-across to 10-across.
 
mogandoCI
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 3:27 pm

Quoting qf002 (Reply 18):

Not sure I'm keen on this new styling in these bigger, denser cabins. The seats look quite dated from this first photo...

Looks to me like the seats (at least in W) are still fixed shell...

those seats look like some uncreative guy just took the current "regional business" seat and shrunk the seat width and pitch.

38" pitch ... i was really hoping for 40+" to compensate for the fact that it's still 2-4-2 on the 77W

UA's "economy plus" looks attractive from a price/comfort perspective all of a sudden
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 3:42 pm

An official picture:



[Edited 2012-02-26 07:44:40]
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
qf002
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 3:48 pm

Quoting SInGAPORE_AIR (Reply 21):
An official picture:

Disappointing...
 
MarcoPoloWorld
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 4:37 pm

Taken together with the other enhancements that will be a part of their overall Y+ product, this looks great to me.

Remember, it is economy class plus - not business class minus - and is supposed to be something that can offer an affordable upgrade for any traveler willing to spend a bit extra on their travels.

I would consider buying a seat in their new cabin myself - and would definitely spend miles to upgrade to it.

Hope to see images of the new Y seat as well. Congratulations to CX!
 
loalq
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 6:56 pm

What is currently considered to be the benchmark of premium economy seats? I have flown BA and while it is miles away from their economy product, it is still not "stellar". AF hard shell seems to be quite good...I wonder if anyone with enough experience can share their views?
"...this is your captain speaking. We have a small problem. All four engines have stopped."
 
KL808
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 10:23 pm

It seems to me that only the first row have the full foot support?

Yikes! so the best seat is on the first row while the other rows dont have the full foot support.

Can anyone confirm?
AMS-LAX-MNL
 
lhr380
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Sun Feb 26, 2012 10:27 pm

Quoting KL808 (Reply 25):

If you look at the last picture you see the footrest under the seat in front. Bulkhead row does not have that so its a little different.
(The views on this site are my own and no one elses)
 
Motorhussy
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 12:25 am

Wonder how the Y+ fares are going to compare against NZ's product on AKL-HKG… both are great airlines and this is the class I fly for leisure. Actually, this is the class my work puts me in too now (when available).

I'm sure it will be immensely popular and will succeed in adding value from the Y customer base rather than eroding the J base.

Regards
MH
come visit the south pacific
 
nzrich
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:40 am

Quoting loalq (Reply 24):

What is currently considered to be the benchmark of premium economy seats?

Well for the moment my bet is on NZ !! AF looks good too .
"Pride of the pacific"
 
qf002
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:28 am

Quoting loalq (Reply 24):
I wonder if anyone with enough experience can share their views?

I have flown QF W, and thought it was great. The legroom is a bit more than CX is offering (40-42" from memory). This product is pretty similar to others, it just doesn't seem to be particularly special or different in any way (like most of the other products out there are -- this is just an off the shelf style product).

Quoting motorhussy (Reply 27):
I'm sure it will be immensely popular and will succeed in adding value from the Y customer base rather than eroding the J base.

I question how volatile CX's core J base is though, considering the strength and size of HKG in terms of financial markets, trade etc. I don't think that they're an airline at risk of losing J customers to a W product. Leisure travellers might trade up (the whole purpose of the product), but I honestly doubt that they would be able to track a trend of J class pax trading down, aside from corporate budget cuts, which would see pax flying in Y instead anyway...
 
blink182
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:01 am

There's a great article just posted on Australian Business Traveller about the products rollout. Included was a line about how product will appear on "all new Boeing 737s" in addition to the 330s, 777s, and 747s. Apparently CX is trying to get this product out to the masses quickly. The first four weeks, before the product gets implemented en masse, complimentary upgrades will be given to Oneworld and Marco Polo Club members in Y.

Is CX ordering 737s as well?

Edit: shortly after I made this original post, AusBT posted on twitter a favorable review of the product with plenty of pics.

[Edited 2012-02-26 20:12:06]
Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...
 
qf340500
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:08 am

ha ha ha, that must have been a typo... CX and 737  

Bu i am so looking forward to experience the new PE product... The seat for me looks fine, like other have said, its Premium ECONOMY and not a business class seat... Looks a bit like QF from the very few pics we have seen so far... lets see for the official statement (should come today ???)
 
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NZ107
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 4:15 am

They look comfortable, that's for sure. Can't wait to try it out for myself!

Quoting motorhussy (Reply 27):
Wonder how the Y+ fares are going to compare against NZ's product on AKL-HKG… both are great airlines and this is the class I fly for leisure. Actually, this is the class my work puts me in too now (when available).

So far, no dates have been announced for when this is going to be introduced into either the A343 or 744 fleet so it might still be a while before AKL gets aircraft which have it. All that is stated on the website is that it'll be 'introduced progressively' to the A343.

Quoting blink182 (Reply 30):
The first four weeks, before the product gets implemented en masse, complimentary upgrades will be given to Oneworld and Marco Polo Club members in Y.

Damn! Flew too early!

Quoting blink182 (Reply 30):

Is CX ordering 737s as well?

Someone screwed up somewhere..

Quoting KL808 (Reply 25):
It seems to me that only the first row have the full foot support?

Hard to tell. There might be footrests fixed to the seat in front.
It's all about the destination AND the journey.
 
qf340500
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:41 am

Looking at the report from Australian Businesstraveller this product looks much more appealing than on the three small pics above. Sure, the front row seats seems to be a different thing, with the business class like footrest, but all the other features are really nice. Can't wait to try it out! The only small thing i don't like is the colour, well, maybe its a bit nicer to the eye in real light etc, but this green doesn't seem to be that great. I would have preferred a different colour palette, which does not remind me of the old (or current) regional business class seat, which i always find odd.

Having said that i really like the seat, seems spacious, and nice with the double armrest in the middle, smaller cabin, etc... And no, i don't really need a touchscreen for the IFE. Over all i think its a well thought through product.
 
qf002
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:27 am

Just had a chance to read over the AusBT review -- their reporter certainly gave it a positive spin, but I'm not convinced just yet... I guess it really comes down to the entire package, but CX seems to be trying to find somewhere between the offerings at NZ, VS, VA, QF etc and what BA has.

It will probably be a solid product overall, but nothing special to lure me to CX rather than W on another airline on the same route.

[Edited 2012-02-26 22:33:50]
 
qf340500
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:42 am

qf002, you might be right by saying that they try to be in between others. For me personally it means that i will even more concider flying CX via HongKong to europe next time, so lets see if they are cheaper than QF to FRA, once they put it on the FRA route. How do you like the color????
 
EBGflyer
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 8:33 am

Doesn't come near Turkish Airlines' Comfort Class. It's probably the best premium economy around.
Future flights: CPH-BKK-MNL; MNL-GUM-TKK-PNI-KSA-KWA-MAJ-HNL-LAX
 
qf340500
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 8:38 am

Really??? TKs PE didnt really look appealing to me on the tripreports i have seen... but hevent tried it yet...
 
lhr380
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 9:42 am

More pictures now on the Cx Facebook page
(The views on this site are my own and no one elses)
 
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NZ107
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 9:48 am

Quoting lhr380 (Reply 38):

Looks good. Everyone has an armrest on both sides in Y+ too.


And I like how they've reverted Y to more normal seats. The current seats are so uncomfortable.. And this seat better be an improvement in terms of sitting comfort.
It's all about the destination AND the journey.
 
CXB77L
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 10:06 am

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 32):
So far, no dates have been announced for when this is going to be introduced into either the A343 or 744 fleet so it might still be a while before AKL gets aircraft which have it. All that is stated on the website is that it'll be 'introduced progressively' to the A343.

The A343s might get them next year, if they're to get them at all:

http://www.cathaypacific.com/cpa/en_...0eac975310VgnVCM62000007d21c39____

Quote:
By end of this year, Cathay Pacific will have 48 aircraft installed with the new product comprised of 23 Boeing 777-300ERs, 17 A330-300s and eight Boeing 747-400s. By the end of 2013, 87 aircraft in the airline’s long-haul fleet will feature Premium Economy.
Quoting NZ107 (Reply 39):
And I like how they've reverted Y to more normal seats. The current seats are so uncomfortable.. And this seat better be an improvement in terms of sitting comfort.

I disagree about the current Y seats. I quite like the idea of not having anyone recline into my space, so the space I have available is dependent on whether I choose to recline or not, rather than whether the person in front of me chooses to recline. Personally, I think this is a step backwards. The non-reclining seats were great in principle, although I would agree that the execution could've been a bit better. Instead, they've gone back to the traditional reclining seats. Shame.  
Boeing 777 fanboy
 
qf002
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 10:06 am

Quoting QF340500 (Reply 35):
How do you like the color????

Not at all keen on the styling. Everything looks very dated -- a step back from the clean and modern look of their old Y seat, and the (IMO very) stylish looks of F and new J...
 
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NZ107
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 10:22 am

Quoting CXB77L (Reply 40):
I disagree about the current Y seats. I quite like the idea of not having anyone recline into my space, so the space I have available is dependent on whether I choose to recline or not, rather than whether the person in front of me chooses to recline. Personally, I think this is a step backwards. The non-reclining seats were great in principle, although I would agree that the execution could've been a bit better. Instead, they've gone back to the traditional reclining seats. Shame.

Yeah, I've followed your stance on these seats for a while. Last week, I flew LAX-HKG-SYD in Y (24 hrs of flying); albeit with an 11 hr stopover in HKG. The (lack of) cushioning of the seat made the journey extremely uncomfortable. You could not recline because that'd just compound the soreness in your legs and bottom. At least that problem seems to be solved. IMO the step backwards was in the level of comfort of the seat itself when they moved to the shell seats from the old Y. And the fact that they took so long to release a new seat despite the many calls for change (and the 744s/343s aren't getting the new seats either) is going to continue to drive away many passengers after one experience on them.

Don't forget you always have a choice of a bulkhead seat whereas the level of comfort of the seat itself can only change when the seat changes.

Possibly luckily for you, it might take a while for the planes configured in the new Y seat to reach PER seeing that this seat is destined for 'select A333s and 77Ws' - and I'm pretty certain SYD will be first in line for it. They haven't even managed to fit the rest of the A333s with the new J seats so I wonder if they'd refit those before coming back to the newer ones which have the new J. But for me, I might just be flying to SYD to catch a flight to HKG just for the new seats - no matter how much I hate the A333.
It's all about the destination AND the journey.
 
RpKs
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 11:03 am

AusBT has just published a review of the new premium economy if anyone is interested...some more photos as well

Review: here

Roll-out info: here
 
coolfish1103
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 12:22 pm

No wonder they released the pictures so late, the seats are pretty bad.

The new seats are definitely not worth the extra price you need to pay. They are nowhere near Air New Zealand and Turkish Airline's PE and are sub par even compare to neighbor EVA's Elite. On top of that, they are trying to charge 50% more than Economy...?

Even if you get the first row, you are pretty much getting what everyone else gets in other PE cabins, with tighter width in comparison to most PE seats other carriers offer. I am not too sure about getting a pillow or headset from Business Class worth anything...? Yes I know it's better than CX Economy, 18" -> 19.5" and better pitches... but when the person slide down in front of you, it's the same as Economy, you cannot use your laptop at all.

Furthermore, the need to use bathroom with the Economy passengers are absolutely unacceptable. You have to walk through four rows of Economy to use the bathroom that's shared... so you will be in lines with Economy passengers... what a exclusive private cabin this is...

Also, there's only 1 dedicated FA for this cabin (max 28 passengers). I am not too sure how often the other Business/Economy FA will be available, but am pretty sure the responses on requests from the FA won't come in a timely fashion.
 
qf002
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:07 pm

I've just reread the article by AusBT, and particularly the part about the touchscreens (I personally don't see it as an issue at all, the screen is too far ahead to comfortably touch anyway...) -- QF has the same 10.6" Panasonic screens in their International Y/W/Domestic J cabins, and they are touchscreens. They have been around since 2008 on the A380's, and have been on 744's since last year... I'm doubting that CX had these seats locked in over 4 years ago... Hmmm...

[Edited 2012-02-27 05:09:06]
 
dlphoenix
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:41 pm

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 20):
38" pitch ... i was really hoping for 40 " to compensate for the fact that it's still 2-4-2 on the 77W

UA's "economy plus" looks attractive from a price/comfort perspective all of a sudden

CX is applying the same concept as BA, AF and BR. I flew EVA Y+ several times (same concept, 6 Y rows, 8 seats wide in the same fllow space that would have been used for 7 Y rows 9 seats wides -> 48Y seats replace 63 Y seats - 25% less seats). This will not give you a bed, but you have a seat where your knees don't bump into the seat in front of you and you can use your laptop without bumping elbows with your neighbor.

Quoting coolfish1103 (Reply 44):
No wonder they released the pictures so late, the seats are pretty bad.

The new seats are definitely not worth the extra price you need to pay. They are nowhere near Air New Zealand and Turkish Airline's PE and are sub par even compare to neighbor EVA's Elite. On top of that, they are trying to charge 50% more than Economy...?

Well, you get 25% more real estate and the airline is adding this class to make more money.
This is something I can afford and with my limited budget I would rather they spend on extending my real estate and nothing else.

I hope they make tons of money from this product so other airlines will start offering it too.

DLP
 
Cipango
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:45 pm

Very very dated looking for premium economy.

A shame for CX. They never seem to be able to impress anyone with their new seat designs.
Let's fly! Unless it's on a CRJ 200, then I'll stay down here.
 
cloudyapple
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Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:05 pm

They should have used the corporate green as an accent colour and not on the whole seat. Looks like business class from the 70s from afar! So does the fabric on the new economy seat. Very retro to be polite!
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CX Flyboy
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Pics Of CX Premium Economy.

Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:15 pm

Quoting cipango (Reply 47):
A shame for CX. They never seem to be able to impress anyone with their new seat designs.

Apart from all those people who continually contribute to CX's relatively high load factors and yields that is...who obviously ar the people that count.

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