BACCALA
Topic Author
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Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 12:52 am

I know CO/UA combined flights are about 15 or so as of June 1st. Looks like the 747-400 wont be doing the summer route from SFO-LHR.

EWR 5 flights 4 757-200, 1 777-200
IAH 2 flights 777-200
SFO 2 flights 77-200
LAX 1 flight 777-200
ORD 3 flights all 767-300
IAD 3 flights all 767-300
DEN ?

What about AA, DL, and US?

[Edited 2012-02-27 17:12:51]
 
727LOVER
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 12:55 am

I would guess its AA by a mile.......maybe less with UA/CO merger. Interestingly, they paid TWA 445mil for 3 routes: LAX, JFK & BOS...IIRC
Love Trumps Hate
 
N62NA
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 1:04 am

Well, things get a bit fuzzy if you also count the BA flights since technically they are AA flights, although also technically they are not! Such interesting times we live in!
 
b377
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 1:15 am

Heres AA Eastbound Schedule effective June 14:

Carrier Acft FreqFlight Orig Time Time Dest

AA 763 D 90 ORD 9:10 22:45 LHR
AA 777 D 86 ORD 18:10 7:50 LHR
AA 777 D 46 ORD 19:25 9:05 LHR
AA 777 D 98 ORD 21:45 11:25 LHR

AA 777 D 50 DFW 16:50 7:50 LHR
AA 763 X3 26 DFW 17:15 8:30 LHR
AA 777 D 78 DFW 19:45 10:45 LHR
AA 777 D 80 DFW 21:25 12:25 LHR

AA 777 D 142 JFK 9:40 9:30 LHR
AA 777 D 100 JFK 18:10 6:20 LHR
AA 777 D 138 JFK 19:35 7:40 LHR
AA 777 D 104 JFK 21:00 9:00 LHR
AA 777 D 106 JFK 23:00 11:00 LHR

AA 777 D 56 MIA 18:35 8:10 LHR

AA 777 D 136 LAX 19:55 14:15 LHR

AA 757 D 156 BOS 9:00 20:40 LHR
AA 757 D 108 BOS 20:10 7:45 LHR
AA 757 D 124 BOS 22:25 10:05 LHR

AA 763 D 174 RDU 18:30 6:55 LHR
 
flymia
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 1:18 am

AA LHR:
BOS 2X daily 757s
DFW two daily 777s and I think they are adding a third soon
MIA two daily one 777 one 763 with a third 3x a week 763
ORD 3 daily 2x 763 1x 777
JFK 4 daily 777
RDU 1 daily 763
LAX 1 daily 777

So with that currently in February 15-16 flights a day. I may be missing some so please correct me. This is what their online timetable said for this week.

[Edited 2012-02-27 17:21:50]
"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
 
mhkansan
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 1:18 am

AA - no doubt.

On a random weekday in April (17APR):

10x JFK since the BA/IB codeshare is metal-neutral (AA has 3 of its own flights)
6x ORD (4 on AA metal)
4x DFW (3 on AA metal)
4x BOS (2 on AA metal)
4x LAX (One on AA metal)
4x MIA (One on AA metal)
1x RDU

That's 29 TATL flights, 15 of which are on AA to LHR alone, mostly 772 and a handful of 763s. I don't think the 752 goes to LHR anymore, either. Just MAN.

While AA only serves a small handful of destinations in Europe, it is still the largest carrier TATL, which I think is astonishing.
 
727LOVER
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 1:19 am

Looking at that, I'm amazed MIA only has one flight !
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flymia
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 1:22 am

Quoting mhkansan (Reply 5):
4x MIA (One on AA metal)
Quoting flymia (Reply 4):
MIA two daily one 777 one 763 with a third 3x a week 763
Quoting B377 (Reply 3):
AA 777 D 56 MIA 18:35 8:10 LHR
Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 6):
Looking at that, I'm amazed MIA only has one flight !

As you can see MIA has many seasonal changes. During the winter AA has MIA 2X Daily with a third flight 3 times a week. BA also has 2 daily flights from MIA year round and is going to be adding a 3rd daily.

[Edited 2012-02-27 17:23:38]
"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
 
b377
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 2:13 am

Continuing with the code share flights with BA

Quoting mhkansan (Reply 5):
That's 29 TATL flights, 15 of which are on AA to LHR alone, mostly 772 and a handful of 763s. I don't think the 752 goes to LHR anymore, either. Just MAN.


The BOS - LHR and JFK - MAN flights are 757's, Then you need to add in all the other AA/BA codeshares, IAD, BWI, ATL, IAH, PHX, LAS, SAN, SFO, SEA, and even YVR, YYC, YYZ, YUL. I know several of the locations have multiple flights, so the total now pushes 50. There's also AA/BA from MCO and TPA to LGW.
 
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GSPFlyer
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 2:32 am

From my calculations, UA has ~200 more daily seats to LHR than AA.....BUT....I did make some assumptions that could alter the actual count, as noted below. I looked at todays schedule on the LHR website. I was going to add BA numbers for comparison, but this took me long enough.


CO/UA:

EWR..........1X 777, 4X 757.............................952 Seats
IAD.............3X 777..........................................807 Seats
IAH.............2X 777..........................................552 Seats
ORD ...........3X 763..........................................549 Seats
LAX............2X 777..........................................538 Seats
SFO ..........1X 747...........................................374 Seats

3,772 Daily Seats
*Assuming IAH, EWR use ex. CO aircraft, UA 777’s are in new config. Let me know if you know the actual configurations they use.



AA:

JFK.............4X 777............................................988 Seats
ORD ...........1X 777, 2X 763...............................697 Seats
MIA.............1X 777, 1X 763, 3X Weekly 763.....568 (Average) Seats
DFW............2X 777............................................494 Seats
BOS........... 2X 757............................................364 Seats
LAX ............1X 777............................................247 Seats
RDU ............1X 763............................................225 Seats

3,583 Daily Seats
*Added the total weekly seats to MIA, averaged number of daily seats


DL:
JFK................3X 764..........................................738 Seats
ATL................1X 764..........................................246 Seats
DTW..............1X 764..........................................246 Seats
MSP ..............1X 764..........................................246 Seats
BOS ...............1X 764.........................................246 Seats
MIA................1X 764..........................................246 Seats

1,968 Daily Seats
*MIA is ending soon.


US
PHL.................1X A330........................................258 Seats

258 Daily Seats

Let me know if I made any mistakes or left anything out.
 
SESGDL
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 2:37 am

Quoting mhkansan (Reply 5):

While AA only serves a small handful of destinations in Europe, it is still the largest carrier TATL, which I think is astonishing.

AA is actually the 3rd largest US airline by TATL traffic, hardly astonishing. AA is, however, the largest US airline to LHR.

Jeremy
 
ordbosewr
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 2:51 am

Quoting GSPflyer (Reply 9):
From my calculations, UA has ~200 more daily seats to LHR than AA.....BUT....I did make some assumptions that could alter the actual count, as noted below.

Great work GSPflyer.
I am sure that many will say it is not accurate for many reasons.

It shows that AA is not the slam-dunk leader that all think... case and point....

Quoting SESGDL (Reply 10):
AA is actually the 3rd largest US airline by TATL traffic, hardly astonishing. AA is, however, the largest US airline to LHR.

Can we get your facts that dispute GSPflyer's work.

We can't include any of the BA code-shares, even if they are metal-neutral or not. Metal neutrality means nothing to the traveling public. Alliance membership will drive traffic.
 
point2point
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 2:58 am

Quoting BACCALA (Thread starter):
DEN ?


DEN is nada here now.... nothing.... and UA claims a hub here eh? UA used to have a seasonal flight, but they then just took away the plane and decided it could make better $$$$$ playing elsewhere, even though supposedly the flight itself did well.


  



[Edited 2012-02-27 19:41:02]
 
N62NA
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:01 am

Quoting ORDBOSEWR (Reply 11):
We can't include any of the BA code-shares, even if they are metal-neutral or not. Metal neutrality means nothing to the traveling public.

Well, the way things have been so perverted in this industry over the past decade or two, I think that it actually is fair to include the BA flights, since passengers booking "AA flight 6501" are booking an American Airlines flight even though it's flown on and by BA. To disagree with this would mean you acknowledge that all those regionals flying around pretending to be part of the larger legacy that they are all painted up to look like are just that - other airlines pretending to be UA, CO, DL or US.
 
SESGDL
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:22 am

Quoting ORDBOSEWR (Reply 11):

Can we get your facts that dispute GSPflyer's work.

I wasn't disputing GSPflyer's work, which only focused on LHR for today. During the summer, however, and for the full year, AA is larger than UA/CO. AA will have considerably more flights and seats than at present this summer, when demand is lower. This is independent of metal neutrality with JVs/ATI.

Jeremy
 
EricR
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:43 am

Quoting point2point (Reply 12):
DEN is nada here now.... nothing.... and UA claims a hub here eh? UA just took away the plane and decided it could make better $$$$$ elsewhere, even though supposedly the flight itself did well.

IIRC, competition with the BA flight was a primary factor why UA discontinued the route (combined with limited feed on the LHR end). Due to UA's numerous hubs at the time, most passengers could be easily re-routed via SFO, IAD, ORD, LAX.
 
bristolflyer
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:43 am

Quoting point2point (Reply 12):
DEN is nada here now.... nothing.... and UA claims a hub here eh? UA just took away the plane and decided it could make better $$$$$ elsewhere, even though supposedly the flight itself did well.


When did they stop the Denver flight? I booked DEN-LHR today for a summer trip, looked for UA/Continental flights but nothing. Speedbird it is.
Fortune favours the brave
 
point2point
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:47 am

Quoting bristolflyer (Reply 16):
When did they stop the Denver flight? I booked DEN-LHR today for a summer trip, looked for UA/Continental flights but nothing. Speedbird it is.

I'm not sure if it was last summer that was the last season for it, or the one before.....?? but nonetheless, my friend, if you want to go DEN-LHR nonstop, the only option now is BA.......

At least BA hasn't had any problems here for the last 10-12 years or so.... so see there UA!

 
 
b377
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:54 am

Quoting GSPflyer (Reply 9):
LAX............2X 777..........................................538 Seats

UA only operates 1X777 in the LAX-LHR market at the present time. In fact I do no remember them flying more than 1 for quite some time.
 
b377
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:59 am

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 6):
Looking at that, I'm amazed MIA only has one flight !

Due to the AA/BA JV, AA elected to drop the second frequency this summer in favor of BA operating three. This is why the JV is starting to really work. You can see in some of the previous postings about BA loads increasing dramatically at SAN, PHX and LAS.
 
point2point
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 4:03 am

Quoting EricR (Reply 15):
IIRC, competition with the BA flight was a primary factor why UA discontinued the route (combined with limited feed on the LHR end). Due to UA's numerous hubs at the time, most passengers could be easily re-routed via SFO, IAD, ORD, LAX.

I wouldn't change planes in SFO or LAX to go from Denver to London, but that's me...... ORD or IAD maybe.....

Nonetheless, kind of sad (? for lack of a better word) that UA can't compete with BA at one of its primary hubs if that's the reason.

 
 
mogandoCI
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 4:04 am

Quoting mhkansan (Reply 5):
10x JFK since the BA/IB codeshare is metal-neutral (AA has 3 of its own flights)
6x ORD (4 on AA metal)
4x DFW (3 on AA metal)
4x BOS (2 on AA metal)
4x LAX (One on AA metal)
4x MIA (One on AA metal)
1x RDU

rule of thumb : if you can't use systemwide upgrade coupon, you can't count it for your own airline

"metal neutral" is just fancy feel-good accounting
 
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GSPFlyer
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 4:16 am

Quoting B377 (Reply 19):
UA only operates 1X777 in the LAX-LHR market at the present time. In fact I do no remember them flying more than 1 for quite some time.

Good Catch. Under LHR's timetable, it includes one stop flights, I accidentally counted one of these. This means only 269 seats to LAX daily. 3,503 seats total for CO/UA, so AA is larger by ~80 seats.

I would still like to hear from someone who knows what configurations UA uses to LHR, so I can get a more accurate calculation. As far as I can tell, DL and AA only operate one configuration of their aircraft they fly to LHR. LHR lists US as EQV (Equipment Varies), but all of the flights I could find are A332's, which they operate in a single configuration. Maybe an occasional A333 or 767 sub?
 
whorsefield
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 5:03 pm

Quoting BACCALA (Thread starter):
IAD 3 flights all 767-300

IAD is infact 4 daily in the summer, 2x 763 and 2x 772, 3x 763 would be quite a downgauge!
 
AAIL86
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 5:07 pm

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 22):
rule of thumb : if you can't use systemwide upgrade coupon, you can't count it for your own airline

"metal neutral" is just fancy feel-good accounting

But can't you find something for each each of the major alliances to pick at? For example, I could say why fly an alliance whose main European partner doesn't offer fully lie flat J seats(LH, as opposed to BA and AF, who do)? What AA and BA are doing is smart enough- they know BA's product is generally better then AA's and until such time as AA catches up, they are offering a variety of flights and pushing lower-yielding traffic to AA flights.


Quoting point2point (Reply 21):
I wouldn't change planes in SFO or LAX to go from Denver to London, but that's me...... ORD or IAD maybe...

I wouldn't either, but if it saved $500 or more plenty of people would consider it.
The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason - Benjamim Franklin
 
point2point
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Tue Feb 28, 2012 5:21 pm

Quoting AAIL86 (Reply 25):
I wouldn't either, but if it saved $500 or more plenty of people would consider it.

I suppose that is a point to consider...... all other things being equal.......

 
 
atct
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Wed Feb 29, 2012 12:04 am

Okay im picking a random tuesday eastbound to do some checking

June 12th, 2012 Schedules

American Airlines:
BOS AAL156 - Boeing 757-200
BOS AAL108 - Boeing 757-200
BOS AAL124 - Boeing 757-200
DFW AAL50 - Boeing 777-200
DFW AAL78 - Boeing 777-200
DFW AAL80 - Boeing 767-300
JFK AAL142 - Boeing 777-200
JFK AAL100 - Boeing 777-200
JFK AAL138 - Boeing 777-200
JFK AAL104 - Boeing 777-200
LAX AAL136 - Boeing 777-200
MIA AAL56 - Boeing 777-200
ORD AAL90 - Boeing 767-300
ORD AAL86 - Boeing 777-200
ORD AAL46 - Boeing 777-200
ORD AAL98 - Boeing 777-200
RDU AAL174 - Boeing 767-300

17 Flights

United Airlines

EWR UAL18 Boeing 757-200
EWR UAL110 Boeing 757-200
EWR UAL28 Boeing 777-200
EWR UAL8 Boeing 757-200
EWR UAL114 Boeing 757-200
IAD UAL922 Boeing 767-300
IAD UAL918 Boeing 767-300
IAD UAL948 Boeing 767-300
IAD UAL924 Boeing 777-200
IAH UAL34 Boeing 777-200
IAH UAL4 Boeing 777-200
LAX UAL934 Boeing 777-200
ORD UAL958 Boeing 767-300
ORD UAL928 Boeing 767-300
ORD UAL938 Boeing 767-300
SFO UAL954 Boeing 777-200
SFO UAL930 Boeing 777-200

17 Flights

ATCT
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mogandoCI
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Wed Feb 29, 2012 1:23 am

Quoting AAIL86 (Reply 24):
But can't you find something for each each of the major alliances to pick at? For example, I could say why fly an alliance whose main European partner doesn't offer fully lie flat J seats(LH, as opposed to BA and AF, who do)? What AA and BA are doing is smart enough- they know BA's product is generally better then AA's and until such time as AA catches up, they are offering a variety of flights and pushing lower-yielding traffic to AA flights.

Can you use your AA eVIP's on BA ?

Point being we're counting own metal flights, not double counting all the JV/JSA/ATI/metal-neutral ones.

According to your logic, AA has like 5 or 6 daily flights to Australia too.
 
cofannyc
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Wed Feb 29, 2012 3:44 am

Quoting GSPflyer (Reply 22):

I don't know the exact seat counts since I rolled it up by carrier, but used their filed schedules (essentially using a tool that uses OAG data) and came up with this for 01Mar12:

AA - 3722 seats
UA - 3444 seats
DL - 1968 seats
US - 258 seats

For comparison's sake:

BA - 10,230 seats
VS - 3,576 seats
NZ - 332 seats
KU - 280 seats
 
BCEaglesCO757
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RE: Largest US Carrier To LHR?

Wed Feb 29, 2012 3:54 am

So it's AA 1st, UA/CO 2nd, and everybody else after that pretty much.