GneissGuy
Topic Author
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SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Wed Feb 29, 2012 9:59 am

All LCCs will be shifted to the 3 existing terminals in the interim until the new LCCT is ready in 2 years time.

Details: http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stori...porelocalnews/view/1186047/1/.html
 
BD338
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Wed Feb 29, 2012 11:54 am

Wow, 6 years old and they are demolishing it and replacing. I guess kudos for being ahead of the demand but how did they get the original design so wrong that it has to be demolished rather than expanded?
 
qf340500
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Wed Feb 29, 2012 12:52 pm

Well done, tare it down after a few years, build it new and keep on doing that.... YEAH!

Guess someone has not had the future-looking ideas when the old terminal was build... a very rare mistake in Singapore, this being a planning-addicted society...

Hope they build proper connecting bridges to the other terminals into the new one. and apparently there is a huge lack of carpark space????

Good luck!
 
CXfirst
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Wed Feb 29, 2012 12:57 pm

Well, I don't think anyone at SIN 6+ years ago was expecting the growth of LCC's that the airport has seen. But good that they are rebuilding a more suitable terminal rather than adding to a terminal making it seem like a Heathrow terminal at the end. Better to build a new bigger and more prepared terminal.

-CXfirst
 
aGreatWayToFly
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Wed Feb 29, 2012 2:52 pm

The terminal was pretty bare bones in terms of construction design. It wouldn't surprise me if it was built to be temporary from the start.
 
gardermoen
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Wed Feb 29, 2012 9:44 pm

While they are at it, rename it "Terminal 4" instead of "Budget Terminal"
 
mcogator
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Wed Feb 29, 2012 9:46 pm

Isn't the current one just a big "warehouse" type facility with chairs? What was the original cost of the build?
“Traveling – it leaves you speechless, then turns you into a storyteller.” – Ibn Battuta
 
6thfreedom
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Thu Mar 01, 2012 12:33 am

Quoting mcogator (Reply 6):
What was the original cost of the build?

$45m (SG), with a further $10M expansion a few years ago.
 
rogercamel
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Thu Mar 01, 2012 12:58 am

Good news - the budget terminal at SIN is a very weak experience compared to the other 3. As others have said the Budget Terminal is little more than a water-tight shed with some seats and some shops, and has pretty poor transport links to the other terminals and city; no good way to reach the MRT, and it is not connected with the inter-terminal train system either.

My guess is that the budget terminal was a temporary terminal building to provide short term capacity prior to the opening of T3 in 2008, or simply to provide some interim capacity while they decided how best to deal with the airport expansion. The use of temporary transport buildings is commonplace for bus interchanges here whilst better provision is constructed, and it wouldn't surprise me if this approach had been extended to airpor terminals.

Incidentally, some LCCs are already operating out of the numbered terminals - Air Asia goes from T1.
 
infinit
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Thu Mar 01, 2012 3:17 am

Yes, I think the "Budget Terminal" was meant to be temporary- a trial if you will. It is in the former Airport Police Division HQ if memory serves me right.

Hopefully the folks at the Changi Airport Group would learn from the mistakes of this one and improve the user experience with the new one
 
nethkt
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Thu Mar 01, 2012 4:50 am

Singapore government is always the aviation industry leader.
Airlines, airport, aircraft leasing etc. they know how to do it all, great job!!

I'm sure the new budget terminal will be renamed for the sake of better name.
And it won't be that kind of warehouse/IKEA looking atmosphere.

Can't wait to see!!!
What a powerful tiny country!!
Let's just blame it on yields.
 
GneissGuy
Topic Author
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:37 am

-New terminal will be named Terminal 4
-Expected to be operational in 2017
-16 million capacity
-No aerobridges (so basically an expanded and improved version of the existing Budget Terminal)

Link: http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stori...porelocalnews/view/1186306/1/.html
 
Triple Seven
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:41 am

Truth be told, SIN is probably under competitive pressure to upgrade the Budget Terminal considering KUL is building a big and rather posh LCCT that should be operational Q1 2013.
 
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huaiwei
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:18 am

Quoting BD338 (Reply 1):
Wow, 6 years old and they are demolishing it and replacing. I guess kudos for being ahead of the demand but how did they get the original design so wrong that it has to be demolished rather than expanded?

Six years is not a short time by Singapore's standards. That building, by the way, was built in a matter of months, so it is hardly a sophisticated building meant to last decades.

Quoting QF340500 (Reply 2):
Guess someone has not had the future-looking ideas when the old terminal was build... a very rare mistake in Singapore, this being a planning-addicted society...

Hope they build proper connecting bridges to the other terminals into the new one. and apparently there is a huge lack of carpark space????

This sounds like something coming out from TR, but anyway, many have already pointed out that the building was meant to be an interim experimentation in the first place. At the time when the idea was mooted and when construction commenced, it was the first dedicated LCC terminal in Asia, so it was considered a high-risk expenditure. Not all LCCs were willing to use it, and should Tiger fail as an airline (as it very well could in this cut-throat industry), the entire terminal almost becomes an empty shell as only one other airline was using it for some time (Cebu Pacific, IIRC?). It is a good thing that they had to rebuild to expand, rather than demolish it for being underused, the later of which would be a bigger sign of poor planning.

I do not see an issue with being a "planning-addicted society", btw. If you think there is a lack of carparking space, you can very well arrive earlier, park in T2, and take the free shuttle bus to the BT, all in a matter of 15 mins or so. But then again, I suppose you do not like to plan....?  
Quoting rogercamel (Reply 8):
The use of temporary transport buildings is commonplace for bus interchanges here whilst better provision is constructed, and it wouldn't surprise me if this approach had been extended to airpor terminals.

Indeed when the BT first opened, many commented it looked just like a temporary bus interchange!

Quoting rogercamel (Reply 8):
Incidentally, some LCCs are already operating out of the numbered terminals - Air Asia goes from T1.

AirAsia chose to fly from the main terminals to "improve the traveller's experience", as they put it. Jetstar uses T1 mainly because the QF group is also located there.

Quoting Triple Seven (Reply 12):
Truth be told, SIN is probably under competitive pressure to upgrade the Budget Terminal considering KUL is building a big and rather posh LCCT that should be operational Q1 2013.

The pressure comes from outside and wihin. In particular, Scoot is going to have problems finding parking space with their fleet of widebodies if nothing is done to the BT, which has space for only ten narrowbodies. It is the same problem which AirAsiaX experienced in KUL. It is obvious they need to upgrade quickly or else the Singapore-based carriers will loose out to the regional competition.

[Edited 2012-03-01 18:21:45]

[Edited 2012-03-01 18:24:27]
It's huaiwei...not huawei. I have nothing to do with the PRC! :)
 
aviasian
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Fri Mar 02, 2012 8:49 am

Truth be told, I have loved flying out of and back into the Budget Terminal. It is a no-nonsense, sensible, practical, visually pleasing what-I-call a shoebox facility. You cannot even get lost if you tried. The only facility missing is a cafe on its rooftop for those of us who love to watch planes and perhaps wave to arriving and departing friends (and strangers).

I am glad that the new terminal which will be built in its place will be called Terminal 4 (I have always disliked the name "Budget Terminal" ... for which someone was named a winner for suggesting that name!!). It is better to see a totally new facility that hopefully provides lots more room for future growth than for bits and pieces to be added to the existing facility like a wart here and a tumour there.

I absolutely love the idea that there will not be aerobridges ... I may be a minority in loving the concept of walking across the ramp from the terminal to the plane. Three cheers to all those airports that still allow for this ... including Pyongyang Sunan Airport!

Now I must rush to photograph the Budget Terminal before it is torn down ... for posterity of course. This must go down Singapore's aviation history as the airport terminal with the shortest lifespan. Thank goodness it was covered in a book recently published to mark Singapore's Aviation Centenary entitled: Where Lions Fly.

KC Sim
 
Pe@rson
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:12 am

Quoting nethkt (Reply 10):
And it won't be that kind of warehouse/IKEA looking atmosphere.
Quoting rogercamel (Reply 8):
others have said the Budget Terminal is little more than a water-tight shed with some seats and some shops
Quoting mcogator (Reply 6):
Isn't the current one just a big "warehouse" type facility with chairs? What was the original cost of the build?

Evidently you are unfamilar with what budget and budget terminal means: simplisticity, removing any superfluous elements, and minimal cost.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
IndianicWorld
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Fri Mar 02, 2012 10:55 am

Seems that a few airports that developed minimalist LCC terminals have gone about creating the 'next big thing' only a few years later. It makes sense in one way to have a quick and relatively cheap option set up, but as KUL found out things can get very overcrowded fast. Short term thinking can have downsides.

SIN, KUL (In progress) and MEL come to mind with plans to rid themselves of 'tin sheds' and replace them with more traditional airport terminal concepts.

SIN seems to have a fair aount of available capacity currently though in its existing T1, T2 and T3 which comes in handy in this transition period.
 
Cysafan
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:55 am

By building the new T4 , I am pretty sure the low-cost travel prices will be higher as from what I have heard from my friends at Changi Airport that it will be something like what the other three terminals are boosting.(High quality facilities) I am pretty sure T4 will be build in mind to handle the current Jetstar A330s , the future Scoot B777s as well as maybe the low-cost Japanese carrier , Skymarks 's future A380 as well so that Changi Airport will have the opportunity to move out all of the low-cost carriers from T1 and T2 ( Jetstar , Air Asia , Indonesia Air Asia , Lion Air , Tiger Airways , Jetstar Airways , Jetstar Asia , Thai Air Asia , Cebu Pacific , Scoot) in order to give Changi Airport some good image of their management by separating legacies and low-cost carriers. Of course , there 's an advantage of moving the low-cost carriers out of the current T1 and T2 so that Changi Airport will be able to free up slots for more legacy carriers to fly to Singapore and we might have more unique airlines at the airport in the future.
 
IndianicWorld
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Sat Mar 03, 2012 5:12 am

^^ Wasn't the point though for these LCC terminals to be basic and therefore offer lower fees?

The ore these terminals become like traditional facilities, where will the fee advantage offered by airports to these carriers be able to be applied without further fuss from competing carriers?
 
rogercamel
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Sat Mar 03, 2012 9:09 am

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 18):
^^ Wasn't the point though for these LCC terminals to be basic and therefore offer lower fees?

Ok - but at SIN the concept is somewhat diluted because some LCCs are in the main terminals. Given the option, I'd rather fly from the main airport - not least because it is better by public transport.
My guess is that the new T4 at SIN will be a middle ground between the existing basics only Budget Terminal, and the main terminals.
 
Pe@rson
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Sat Mar 03, 2012 9:15 am

Quoting rogercamel (Reply 19):
some LCCs are in the main terminals.

I have often wondered why AK/FD/QZ didn't use SIN's Budget Terminal when they're clearly so cost-conscious. Perhaps that terminal didn't have sufficient capacity or infrastructure (e.g., stands) for its scale of operation?
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
Cysafan
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Sat Mar 03, 2012 9:53 am

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 20):
I have often wondered why AK/FD/QZ didn't use SIN's Budget Terminal when they're clearly so cost-conscious. Perhaps that terminal didn't have sufficient capacity or infrastructure (e.g., stands) for its scale of operation?

It is because the current terminal is too crap for most airlines to dock at. The facility is just a single floor terminal with very few shops and seating areas which is not even enough to handle the crowd when it is loaded. So these three airlines from the Tune group decided to give the passengers more comfort , so they choose to dock at T1 instead which is much better. with adequate seating and facilities.
 
Pe@rson
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Sat Mar 03, 2012 9:59 am

Quoting Cysafan (Reply 21):
It is because the current terminal is too crap for most airlines to dock at. The facility is just a single floor terminal with very few shops and seating areas which is not even enough to handle the crowd when it is loaded. So these three airlines from the Tune group decided to give the passengers more comfort , so they choose to dock at T1 instead which is much better. with adequate seating and facilities.

I don't really accept that: having flown through there 2 or 3 times, it isn't that different from KUL's LCCT (other than scale and the consequent lower amount of facilities). And given AK's cost-consciousness, I cannot imagine it would happily pay more - assuming the cost differential is decent - for 'better' facilities given its target audience. However, unless we have someone from SIN or AK itself, we won't know precisely why.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
IndianicWorld
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Sat Mar 03, 2012 10:46 am

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 22):
I don't really accept that: having flown through there 2 or 3 times, it isn't that different from KUL's LCCT

Exactly. Both are 'tin sheds', with one larger than the other (KUL bigger than SIN's).

Overall, both werelikely short sighted in their approach, and developed for speed over any real strategic plan. The investment is therefore written off quite quickly as it turns out and more work is now required to rectify those limitations.
 
Akiestar
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Sat Mar 03, 2012 10:54 am

Quoting Cysafan (Reply 21):
It is because the current terminal is too crap for most airlines to dock at. The facility is just a single floor terminal with very few shops and seating areas which is not even enough to handle the crowd when it is loaded. So these three airlines from the Tune group decided to give the passengers more comfort , so they choose to dock at T1 instead which is much better. with adequate seating and facilities.

For some airlines, it's not all about comfort. This is in the case of 2P and 5J.

As far as I know, 2P docks at Terminal 2 to better-compete with 5J: PR can say that 2P is better because they dock at main terminals which are more convenient for passengers to use than low-cost terminals which, as in the case of SIN, are harder to reach. All while competing with 5J price-wise. I'm not sure how well the strategy has worked, but I'm inclined to believe that it has worked to an extent.
 
aviasian
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:32 pm

Yes, one could unkindly call the Budget Terminal a tin shed (and I call it a shoebox, no better) ... but it is one airy, brightly-lit, comfortable, welcoming tin shed. Sure, it does not have butterfly gardens, swimming pool, fine dining restaurants, huge screens for live soccer telecast, airline lounges etc ... but it is not uncomfortable and it is certainly not depressing.

It is as the name and concept suggest ... basic, practical and not one where anyone is likely to stay more than one or two hours - given that very little hubbing (if at all) takes place here.

When I am booked to fly on an LCC, I immediately understand that "basic" and "practical" are the operative words that will be a part of the entire travel equation. I simply fail to understand how many still want the lower cost of budget travel and expect all the thrills and frills of Changi Airport's Terminals 1, 2 and 3 - no less.

There are quite a few terminals around the world serving full service carriers which are far more depressing than Changi Airport's Budget Terminal (just for the heck of making a point, I name just one - CDG Terminal One).

There needs to be a mindset shift here ... and as long as the new Terminal 4 turns out to be an improvement over the Budget Terminal (but is designed with far more growth), I would be pleased.

KC Sim
 
LJ
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Sat Mar 03, 2012 4:43 pm

Quoting Cysafan (Reply 17):
I am pretty sure T4 will be build in mind to handle the current Jetstar A330s , the future Scoot B777s as well as maybe the low-cost Japanese carrier , Skymarks 's future A380

Why would Skymark send their low density A380 (with only J or Y+ seats) to a budget terminal????
 
sallecc
Posts: 52
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RE: SIN To Tear Down And Rebuild Budget Terminal

Thu Mar 08, 2012 4:51 am

I didn't mind using Budget terminal... it was what it name says, and low-fares were what mattered most.
Connection to other terminals (and subway to city) was frequent with nice & clean buses, and polite & helpful drivers, passing beautiful trees and gardens (well it's Singapore, I can go on and on...  

Only one thing was annoying - when they cramp all check-in passengers into ONE single lane for ALL check-in counters together... You can imagine how nervous people get if their flight departs soon... Then, just before check-in closes, they call those passengers to leave big lane and join newly formed dedicated lane for that particular flight... messy.

4-5 years is really long time... Tiger Airways & others moving to T1/T2 terminals will automatically charge higher fees for their flights? How will Tiger compete with JetStar in that case? (in 50% cases I had cheaper ticket on JetStar to KUL & HKG - even before when they had higher charges in T2 compared to Tiger in Budget terminal)

Cheers,
sallecc HKG

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