einsteinboricua
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CM And Widebodies?

Thu Mar 01, 2012 2:35 am

It's clear to see that CM is a very successful airline, with its fleet consisting solely of 737s. However, I certainly don't think a 737 has the legs to fly PTY to Europe.

Considering that PTY's only European destinations are AMS with KL and MAD with IB, what are the chances that CM might add a couple of widebodies for TATL flights (not now, but perhaps before the end of the decade)? Madrid, London, and Paris would seem like the likely choices, perhaps even Barcelona.
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jfk777
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RE: CM And Widebodies?

Thu Mar 01, 2012 2:38 am

Copa probably has a future in 787's, they are small enough for 200 passengers yet capable enough to fly 8000 miles putting almost everything within nonstop reach.
 
roseflyer
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RE: CM And Widebodies?

Thu Mar 01, 2012 2:50 am

Copa already pushes the 737 farther than any other airline in a typical configuration. PTY-EZE/MVD is a very long trip and I would assume that they'd benefit from a smaller widebody for those routes on top of routes to Europe or more extensive US routes.
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yellowtail
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RE: CM And Widebodies?

Thu Mar 01, 2012 2:56 am

The are many closer routes that could use some wide body capacity for CM so that that 738 capacity could be deployed elsewhere....SDQ, HAV, CCS come to mind
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Viscount724
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RE: CM And Widebodies?

Sat Mar 03, 2012 1:28 am

Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 2):
Copa already pushes the 737 farther than any other airline in a typical configuration.

Some other 737NG nonstops are almost as far. FJ's HNL-NAN 738 nonstop is also entirely over water with fewer potential diversion points.

PTY-MVD 2941 nm (73G)
PTY-EZE 2879 nm (738)
NBO-BKO 2802 nm (Kenya Airways 738)
HNL-NAN 2748 nm (Air Pacific 738)
 
AR385
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RE: CM And Widebodies?

Sat Mar 03, 2012 1:57 am

At this point, I don´t think CM is interested in a very small fleet of a very different airliner to serve a few European destinations. Maybe in a few years, but not now. Besides, that small subfleet would require a total revamp of the services CM provides today, not so much in Y, maybe, but definitely in C. As for widebodies for MVD or EZE, I think their model is based on frequency, not on capacity.

A good analogy would for Southwest to get a few widebodies to fly to LHR or CDG. It´s just not their business model and probably won´t happen soon.
 
bpat777
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RE: CM And Widebodies?

Sat Mar 03, 2012 2:17 am

I always felt CO/UA's 762's could be a good w/b for CM.
 
SJOtoLIR
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RE: CM And Widebodies?

Sat Mar 03, 2012 3:09 am

Quoting einsteinboricua (Thread starter):
It's clear to see that CM is a very successful airline, with its fleet consisting solely of 737s.


False.
Both Copa Airlines and Copa Airlines Colombia also utilize a vast fleet of Embraer 190s.




.

Quoting einsteinboricua (Thread starter):
Considering that PTY's only European destinations are AMS with KL and MAD with IB


DE FRA-SDQ-PTY 1x weekly with 763 can also be considered as a regular operation linking Europe and Panama City.
It would be temporary upgraded from 1x to 2x weekly from June 25th till October 22nd.




.

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 4):
PTY-MVD 2941 nm (73G)


Probably the longest commercial route for a 737 nowadays.




.

Quoting einsteinboricua (Thread starter):
what are the chances that CM might add a couple of widebodies for TATL flights (not now, but perhaps before the end of the decade)? Madrid, London, and Paris would seem like the likely choices, perhaps even Barcelona.


Copa studied in 2007 the chance to launch flights to Europe but the idea hasn't been materialized.
Related link available in Spanish language:

http://mensual.prensa.com/mensual/co...007/01/21/hoy/negocios/866405.html

CM has firmly ordered a huge fleet consisting in 32 brand new 737s to be gradually delivered between 2015 and 2018.
However, the long-haul equipments haven't been mentioned yet.

Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
 
kiwiandrew

RE: CM And Widebodies?

Sun Mar 04, 2012 3:40 am

I recall reading an interview with the CEO of CM last year ( pretty sure it was in Flight International magazine) where he said that they currently have no intention of investing in widebodies and would rather attempt to persuade some of their future *A partners to commence longhaul services to PTY ( which, presumably, they would codeshare on) . I will try to find a link.
 
JQflightie
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RE: CM And Widebodies?

Sun Mar 04, 2012 8:56 am

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 4):

add to the list:
DJ PER-HKT 2991mi
DJ SYD-DPS 2871mi
Next Trip: PER-DPS-KUL-BKK-HKT-CNX-BKK-SIN-PER
 
Pe@rson
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RE: CM And Widebodies?

Sun Mar 04, 2012 9:06 am

For those interested, here are CM's net profit (loss) and net margin between 2007 and 2011 in USD and millions:


Net profit (loss):

2011: 310.40m

2010: 212.10m

2009: 240.36m

2008: 118.66m

2007 160.41m

Net margin

2011: 16.96 %

2010: 15.03 %

2009: 19.18 %

2008: 9.2 %

2007: 15.61 %

Source: Air Transport Intelligence (ATI).

Needless to say, these are, for airlines, highly impressive results.
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SJOtoLIR
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RE: CM And Widebodies?

Sun Mar 04, 2012 9:37 pm

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 8):
they currently have no intention of investing in widebodies and would rather attempt to persuade some of their future *A partners to commence longhaul services to PTY


I agree.
We have previously commented into the Central American aviation thread about the possibility of LH FRA-PTY in the near future.

Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
 
nethkt
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RE: CM And Widebodies?

Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:48 am

LH FRA-PTY with high-density A340-300?
I'd say the 8 First class seats on 333 and lower density 343 are a waste on FRA-PTY?
Would love to see a STAR long-haul, trans-con. connection from PTY!
Let's just blame it on yields.
 
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RWA380
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RE: CM And Widebodies?

Mon Mar 05, 2012 12:22 pm

Quoting nethkt (Reply 12):
LH FRA-PTY with high-density A340-300?
I'd say the 8 First class seats on 333 and lower density 343 are a waste on FRA-PTY?
Would love to see a STAR long-haul, trans-con. connection from PTY!

I would think, a tag to PTY instead of a non-stop, or even a circle trip with another neighboring city they serve, or can, or else an en-route, not too far off the circle mapper for a stop. For any airline trying trans-atlantic to PTY, not just LH.
Next Flights: PDX-HNL-OGG-LIH-PDX On AS, WP & HA