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Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 1:14 pm

http://www.aviacaobrasil.com.br/wp/n...0-no-pais?doing_wp_cron=1332076377

According to the above link QR will start GIG in early 2013 along with an undisclosed point in Brazil. I think we can now start speculating what it could be  
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AirIndia
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 1:24 pm

2014 FIFA world cup
2016 Olympics

Thats the trigger........
 
PlymSpotter
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 1:25 pm

Brasilia I should think.


Dan  
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kaitak
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 1:40 pm

Brasilia may well be the administrative capital - and as a result would produce significant J Class travel, but what are the biggest cities, after Sao Paolo and Rio? Salvador? Belem? Manaus? Fortaleza?

Good to see QR taking a lead and going beyond the obvious destinations. Can we assume, given its range, that the 788 would be the most obvious aircraft for such a route?
 
AF086
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 1:45 pm

Perhaps QR will shift EZE to one of these new cities. My bet on QR's ops to South America is:

DOH-GRU-EZE
DOH-GIG-SCL

DOH-BSB is even farther than DOH-GIG so unless the flight stops somewhere in between they would have to use the 77L for the route which I think is too much for DOH-BSB. Perhaps QR could try DOH-LAD-SSA with the 332 with 5th freedom rights, naturally.

[Edited 2012-03-18 06:55:24]
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 1:56 pm

Quoting kaitak (Reply 3):
Brasilia may well be the administrative capital - and as a result would produce significant J Class travel, but what are the biggest cities, after Sao Paolo and Rio? Salvador? Belem? Manaus? Fortaleza?

Sao Paulo, Rio, Salvador and Brasillia - the latter two are both a similar size.

Quoting AF086 (Reply 4):
DOH-BSB is even farther than DOH-GIG so unless the flight stops somewhere in between they would have to use the 77L for the route which I think is too much for DOH-BSB.

QR's 77L carries 259 whilst the 788 has 254. The 788 has more Y seats then the 77L, so on a likely premium heavy route like BSB I think the 77L would be the best choice.

Quoting AF086 (Reply 4):

Perhaps QR will shift EZE to one of these new cities. My bet on QR's ops to South America is:

Isn't EZE going non stop with a 77L in the long run?


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jfk777
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 2:06 pm

BSB has shown in the past to be a graveyard for international airlines. Oher then TAP no European airline flies to BSB. Europe has lots more traffic then the Middle East, why would Qatar be ab le to make BSB work ?
 
AF086
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 2:08 pm

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 5):
The 788 has more Y seats then the 77L, so on a likely premium heavy route like BSB I think the 77L would be the best choice.

I don't think BSB is that premium heavy when it comes to Asia/Australia. SSA as well but it has economical and cultural ties with Africa (specially Angola due to building contractors and other sectors) so I think a DOH-LAD-SSA route would be a fine idea. I don't know if Angola would grant 5th freedom rights, though.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 5):
Isn't EZE going non stop with a 77L in the long run?

Probably, yes. But I think they'll leave more time to mature the destination. I expect that the same will happen to SCL: starting as a tagon from GIG, than shifting to a tagon from EZE and then becoming nonstop.

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 6):
BSB has shown in the past to be a graveyard for international airlines.

Well, not really. AA, DL, CM, TA and PU are being pretty successful there. The only foreign airline that ceased operations there recently was LP.
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 2:20 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 6):
Europe has lots more traffic then the Middle East, why would Qatar be ab le to make BSB work ?

Connecting traffic, that would be a big factor.

Quoting AF086 (Reply 7):
I don't think BSB is that premium heavy when it comes to Asia/Australia.

I don't mean that the overall market is very large, but I do think that premium demand is likely to be much more important on such a route than Y. LIS, ATL and MIA hardly provide the best connections to the Middle East and Asia, so a service by QR would effectively have the monopoly on a huge number of routes.


Dan  

[Edited 2012-03-18 07:23:00]
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jfk777
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 2:28 pm

Quoting AF086 (Reply 7):
Quoting jfk777 (Reply 6):BSB has shown in the past to be a graveyard for international airlines.
Well, not really. AA, DL, CM, TA and PU are being pretty successful there. The only foreign airline that ceased operations there recently was LP.

And which European airline has made Brasilia Work ?

The USA seems to work from BSB but then that is a completely different type of passenegers. With the 9/11 visa procedures how many Brazilians are going to connect over the USA to Asia ? Very Few, which is one reason Air Canada is having such success in Latin America.
 
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 2:33 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 9):
And which European airline has made Brasilia Work ?

TAP seem to be doing a pretty good job of it...
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RodRB
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 2:42 pm

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 8):
Connecting traffic, that would be a big factor.

I think BSB is the only brazilian airport with flights to all states
 
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 3:04 pm

Quoting RodRB (Reply 11):
I think BSB is the only brazilian airport with flights to all states

I hadn't actually thought about it that way around, I was thinking connections from DOH. But maybe there are preferable connections from BSB too.


DAn  
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AF086
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 3:21 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 9):
And which European airline has made Brasilia Work ?

Just TP because they are the only one who actually tried. TP started LIS-BSB flying 4x weekly, they're currently serving the city 6x weekly.

JJ doesn't serve BSB-Europe: they're too GRU-centric.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 8):
Connecting traffic, that would be a big factor.

That's a big factor for BSB. They're well connected to the rest of the country offering good connections.

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 9):
which is one reason Air Canada is having such success in Latin America.

And yet AC's presence in Brazil is abysmal: only a daily flight to GRU. There is market for at least a GIG-YYZ service and Brazil-Canada enjoy an openskies environment so frequencies are not an issue.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 8):
LIS, ATL and MIA hardly provide the best connections to the Middle East and Asia, so a service by QR would effectively have the monopoly on a huge number of routes.

You have a point there.
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AwysBSB
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 3:48 pm

If this thread is telling a straight rumor, QR would be following a strategy that is being yielding for airlines like TP, CM, PU, TA, AA.

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 8):
LIS, ATL and MIA hardly provide the best connections to the Middle East and Asia, so a service by QR would effectively have the monopoly on a huge number of routes.


Ace thought!
As AF does not come to BSB to provide connections to the Middle East and Asia, QR is welcome!

Quoting AF086 (Reply 13):
That's a big factor for BSB. They're well connected to the rest of the country offering good connections.


I would go farther.
Besides domestic connections, BSB is starting to offer good international connections.
If QR and TA match schedules in a code-share agreement, LIM and BOG would become two new connection options out of BSB.
 
kl911
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 4:52 pm

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 8):
LIS, ATL and MIA hardly provide the best connections to the Middle East and Asia, so a service by QR would effectively have the monopoly on a huge number of routes.

PEK - LIS - BSB is actually shorter than PEK - DOH - BSB
 
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 4:53 pm

Quoting kl911 (Reply 15):
PEK - LIS - BSB is actually shorter than PEK - DOH - BSB

But nobody serves PEK-LIS...
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 5:09 pm

Quoting SRQKEF (Reply 16):
Quoting kl911 (Reply 15):
PEK - LIS - BSB is actually shorter than PEK - DOH - BSB

But nobody serves PEK-LIS...

Exactly, it's not about potential great circle distances, it's about the services, frequencies and available routings.


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something
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 5:40 pm

It should be MAO. It might not generate a whole lot of passenger traffic, but cargo should be extra strong. That would also make it the ideal tag-on destination from either GIG or GRU, but it'd obviously be much more exciting to see the 77L on DOH-MAO-LIM.
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RodRB
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 6:04 pm

Quoting something (Reply 18):
DOH-MAO-LIM.

DOH-BSB-LIM could also work
 
LPSHobby
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:26 pm

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 5):
Quoting kaitak (Reply 3):
Brasilia may well be the administrative capital - and as a result would produce significant J Class travel, but what are the biggest cities, after Sao Paolo and Rio? Salvador? Belem? Manaus? Fortaleza?

Sao Paulo, Rio, Salvador and Brasillia - the latter two are both a similar size.

no, the third city in Brazil is Belo Horizonte. The population of Belo Horizonte and Salvador is similar but Belo Horizonte is the capital of Minas Gerais state, Minas Gerais is the 3rd richer state of Brazil and Belo Horizonte is the 3rd richer city in Brazil.
 
Rafabozzolla
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:46 pm

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 5):
Sao Paulo, Rio, Salvador and Brasillia - the latter two are both a similar size.

As far as city proper they are similar, but Belo Horizonte metro is larger.


Rank Metropolitan Area State Population
1 São Paulo São Paulo 19,889,559
2 Rio de Janeiro Rio de Janeiro 11,902,701
3 Belo Horizonte Minas Gerais 5,397,438
4 Porto Alegre Rio Grande do Sul 4,063,886
5 Salvador Bahia 3,866,004
6 Recife Pernambuco 3,768,902
7 Fortaleza Ceará 3,602,319
8 Brasília Distrito Federal 3,451,549

Data from IBGE, through Wikipedia.
 
CNForever
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 8:23 pm

Besides the size of its Metro Area, Belo Horizonte is the third city in Brazil regarding the international traffic.
BH has a huge metals and mining activity which nowadays has strong links with China and Japan.
BH is the third industrial center in Brazil and it generates a lot of business traffic and cargo.

The weak point is its location so close to Rio and SP which means that its traffic is easily disposed by other airports.
 
RAGAZZO777
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 8:34 pm

Other than GIG (which is for sure), I'd put my money on Brasília or Belo Horizonte. Also, when QR starts GIG they will likely tag SCL on the new flight.

Quoting something (Reply 18):
It should be MAO. It might not generate a whole lot of passenger traffic, but cargo should be extra strong. That would also make it the ideal tag-on destination from either GIG or GRU, but it'd obviously be much more exciting to see the 77L on DOH-MAO-LIM.
Quoting something (Reply 18):
DOH-BSB-LIM could also work

A gulf carrier in Lima is a matter of when, not if. That said, there's only room for one, methinks. So if QR comes first, they would surely have the edge over a possible EK operation.
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CNForever
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 8:39 pm

If they come to CNF and BSB and link these two cities with EZE, it would be for sure a winner flight.
 
LPSHobby
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 9:10 pm

but I think it will be BSB, with the continuing to other South America country
 
PlymSpotter
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 10:00 pm

Quoting LPSHobby (Reply 20):
no, the third city in Brazil is Belo Horizonte. The population of Belo Horizonte and Salvador is similar but Belo Horizonte is the capital of Minas Gerais state, Minas Gerais is the 3rd richer state of Brazil and Belo Horizonte is the 3rd richer city in Brazil.
Quoting Rafabozzolla (Reply 21):
As far as city proper they are similar, but Belo Horizonte metro is larger.


Rank Metropolitan Area State Population
1 São Paulo São Paulo 19,889,559
2 Rio de Janeiro Rio de Janeiro 11,902,701
3 Belo Horizonte Minas Gerais 5,397,438
4 Porto Alegre Rio Grande do Sul 4,063,886
5 Salvador Bahia 3,866,004
6 Recife Pernambuco 3,768,902
7 Fortaleza Ceará 3,602,319
8 Brasília Distrito Federal 3,451,549

Data from IBGE, through Wikipedia.

Interesting, I checked English Wikipedia and checked the source of the information, which was also IBGE listing 2010 municipal data. It would appear there are several different rankings depending on which data is used.


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something
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 10:14 pm

Many cities are bigger than Manaus, but then again I am not sure they could support a non-stop flight to DOH on a regular basis; especially if not even Buenos Aires with a metro region of 15 million can. Which leads me to believe that it's going to be a tag-on flight, which in terms of passenger comfort is more or less on par with a connection through GRU on GOL.

Therefore, a tag on would make most sense to a very cargo heavy destination. MAO undoubtedly is, and it also boasts the highest foreign direct investment out of most/all Brazilian cities. Manaus is also one of the fastest growing cities/regions in Brazil.

It's a long shot, and it sounds unpopular. But I see LH at BSB/CNF long before any of the Gulf carriers will tap into those markets. LH could carry passengers to all of Europe and Northern Africa and it'd be shorter (or insignificantly longer) to all of Asia including India - they'd have a much broader passenger base and yet, these destinations are nowhere on LH's radar. I say LH and not AF-KL or BA because from my experience, frequent fliers at CNF and BSB rely on JJ and their international network and are (at least for now) Star Alliance card holders.

In conclusion, DOH-GIG-MAO and DOH-GRU-EZE would be nice; DOH-GIG-SCL, DOH-MAO-LIM, DOH-GRU-EZE would be nicer but just as unrealistic.
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LPSHobby
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Sun Mar 18, 2012 10:48 pm

Quoting something (Reply 27):
It's a long shot, and it sounds unpopular. But I see LH at BSB/CNF long before any of the Gulf carriers will tap into those markets. LH could carry passengers to all of Europe and Northern Africa and it'd be shorter (or insignificantly longer) to all of Asia including India - they'd have a much broader passenger base and yet, these destinations are nowhere on LH's radar. I say LH and not AF-KL or BA because from my experience, frequent fliers at CNF and BSB rely on JJ and their international network and are (at least for now) Star Alliance card holders.

I think the most logical would be AF first in CNF/BSB, as Paris is the most visted city in Europe by brazilian tourists, and we would have too business travellers and I think AF could provide many connections to many places through CDG for the passengers coming with these 2 places. TAM could do this too.
 
nomorerjs
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:39 am

Given EK's resistance to ORD, I think QR will announce ORD (a la EY for IAD then EK announces) and see what happends. QR has the UA feed, EY is established, and EK, well their loss.
 
AF086
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Mon Mar 19, 2012 2:28 am

Quoting something (Reply 27):
In conclusion, DOH-GIG-MAO and DOH-GRU-EZE would be nice; DOH-GIG-SCL, DOH-MAO-LIM, DOH-GRU-EZE would be nicer but just as unrealistic.

As for GIG, the DOH-GIG-SCL routing is being rumoured for quite some time. Since GIG, apparently, is a given I see that routing possible. The other brazilian city is the mystery: CNF, SSA and BSB seem strong candidates, in my view.

I don't see QR (or any other airline) flying intra-Brazil tag-ons since there are no 5th freedom rights. Domestic tag-ons operated by non-brazilian airlines nearly disappeared these past few years. These days only UA (IAD-GRU-GIG), LA (SCL-GRU-GIG) and AA (MIA-SSA-REC-MIA) fly them.

As for MAO, perhaps QR could fly an all-cargo service there.
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PPVRA
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RE: Qatar Airways To Soon Start 2 New Points In Brazil

Mon Mar 19, 2012 4:18 am

If this is related to the World Cup, having a stop somewhere in the northeast to distribute traffic makes sense. IMO, if it's not a tag on service but a new service, it will go to SSA, REC or FOR, in that order.
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