User avatar
readytotaxi
Topic Author
Posts: 3321
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:09 am

Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:42 pm

Just reported here.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-nottinghamshire-17631534

Alarmed a few passengers and frightened the children no doubt but all is well.

Quote "You overheard the captain saying 'Mayday, mayday,' and he was saying it rapidly as we were going down. I thought my number was up."

A bit of drama for the interview?
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
 
ScottishDavie
Posts: 177
Joined: Fri Feb 25, 2011 10:48 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Fri Apr 06, 2012 10:56 pm

Complete non-story. Pressurisation problem occurs, crew do their jobs, everybody is safe, story ends apart from sensationalised media garbage. (Are they suggesting that flights out of Bergamot are particularly prone to pressurisation issues??) I'm no fan of FR but they did as well as any other carrier under the circumstances.
 
sandyb123
Posts: 749
Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2007 9:29 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 10:09 am

Quoting readytotaxi (Thread starter):
Quote "You overheard the captain saying 'Mayday, mayday,' and he was saying it rapidly as we were going down. I thought my number was up."

Absolutely! Isn't 'Pan Pan Pan' would be more suitable?

I love the fact the witness is Mr Farter. Maybe the pressurisation probles started at his rear end. LOL  

Sandyb123
Member of the mile high club
 
Speedbirdie
Posts: 873
Joined: Mon May 15, 2006 5:11 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 10:20 am

Why so much hype about this particular story? Every news website I come across I see this story..
Never give up..
 
richardw
Posts: 3137
Joined: Tue May 08, 2001 3:17 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 10:26 am

 
sandrozrh
Posts: 2420
Joined: Sun Feb 04, 2007 12:19 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 10:29 am

Quoting sandyb123 (Reply 2):
Absolutely! Isn't 'Pan Pan Pan' would be more suitable?

No, an emergency descent is a definite mayday.

But yes, a complete non-event indeed..
 
Btblue
Posts: 536
Joined: Thu Mar 18, 2004 4:57 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 10:55 am

Quoting readytotaxi (Thread starter):
A bit of drama for the interview?

if you want drama read this:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ure--passengers-reveal-terror.html

The captain "screamed Mayday! Mayday!"
146/2/3 737/2/3/4/5/7/8/9 A320 1/2/18/19/21 DC9/40/50 DC10/30 A300/6 A330/2/3 A340/3/6 A380 757/2/3 747/4 767/3/4 787 77
 
User avatar
readytotaxi
Topic Author
Posts: 3321
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:09 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 11:29 am

Quoting Speedbirdie (Reply 3):
Quoting btblue (Reply 6):

I guess it must have been a VERY slow news day.
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
 
Quokkas
Posts: 1327
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 5:51 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 11:54 am

Of course it was a slow news day: to our regular A.netters these things are par for the course. Hardly do they ever take a trip without sudden loss of cabin pressure and oxygen masks being deployed while simultaneously doing a go around and a water landing. But to Mr and Mrs Average Flyer this would indeed be alarming.

The real news is that FR didn't charge for the oxygen, or will a direct debit be made to the passengers' credit cards?   

Quoting sandyb123 (Reply 2):
I love the fact the witness is Mr Farter.

All the links state that his name is Frater but your version would be more amusing.  
“Not to laugh, not to cry, not to hate, but understand.” Spinoza
 
babybus
Posts: 2379
Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2003 5:07 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 11:56 am

This type of event isn't rare from what I see. The only difference being some happen on a slow news day.

A friend of mine was on an FR 737 from Rome a few years ago when the same thing happened to him. He said the whole experience was horrific and put him off flying for some time.
and with that..cabin crew, seats for landing please.
 
RussianJet
Posts: 5983
Joined: Sat Jul 21, 2007 4:15 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 12:20 pm

Quoting babybus (Reply 9):
This type of event isn't rare from what I see.

Come off it folks, seriously. Yes, it has been well hyped up in the media, but let's not pretend that this is particularly common. It clearly happens now and then, but emergency descents are hardly routine.

Quoting Quokkas (Reply 8):
The real news is that FR didn't charge for the oxygen,

No, the real news is that it was clearly handled well and nobody got seriously hurt. Still, got to get the cheap and predictable digs in somewhere I guess.

Also, how likely is it that anyone actually heard the flightdeck saying anything? I don't recall hearing any words through that door, ever, even when repeatedly sat in the first row. No doubt he would have been slightly more animated than normal, but I still seriously doubt that anyone could have heard what was actually being communicated.
✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
 
Daysleeper
Posts: 565
Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2009 3:33 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 1:05 pm

Quoting ScottishDavie (Reply 1):
Complete non-story. Pressurisation problem occurs, crew do their jobs, everybody is safe, story ends apart from sensationalised media garbage
Quoting Speedbirdie (Reply 3):
Quoting babybus (Reply 9):
This type of event isn't rare from what I see. The only difference being some happen on a slow news day.

Just out of curiosity how many emergency descents have you guys experienced?

As the poster above stated this is hardly an everyday occurrence and I have absolutely no doubt it would be terrifying for the passengers, especially if you can also hear the captain declaring a mayday. In fact, despite being a regular flyer and understanding that we were in an emergency decent i think I’d have been just as scared as everyone else.
 
Mir
Posts: 19107
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:55 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 1:59 pm

Quoting sandyb123 (Reply 2):
Absolutely! Isn't 'Pan Pan Pan' would be more suitable?

It's called an emergency descent for a reason.

Quoting Quokkas (Reply 8):
The real news is that FR didn't charge for the oxygen, or will a direct debit be made to the passengers' credit cards?

There will be an "oxygen mask restowage fee" and an "airborne roller coaster experience" fee charged, I'm sure.

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 10):
Also, how likely is it that anyone actually heard the flightdeck saying anything? I don't recall hearing any words through that door, ever, even when repeatedly sat in the first row. No doubt he would have been slightly more animated than normal, but I still seriously doubt that anyone could have heard what was actually being communicated.

Sometimes the pilots mean to say something to ATC, and they say it to the cabin. Rather unfortunate that it happened during an emergency, but it's certainly not unheard of.

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
ScottishDavie
Posts: 177
Joined: Fri Feb 25, 2011 10:48 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:12 pm

Quoting Daysleeper (Reply 11):
Just out of curiosity how many emergency descents have you guys experienced?

In my case one, on a BAC 1-11 many years ago and, yes, it scared me absolutely sh*tless at the time. I could never bring myself to fly on a 1-11 again and I became seriously twitchy about flying generally. I got over it eventually but it required a lot of determination on my own part and a great deal of patient support from my wife before I regained my confidence which probably took the best part of ten years.

Autobiographical details apart, I don't feel any need to justify my original post but in case there is any doubt about it I was in no way seeking to belittle the fear which the passengers undoubtedly experienced. My simple point is that a pressurisation failure correctly handled by the crew, while frightening for those involved, does not justify the sort of sensationalist media coverage which this incident has received.
 
penguins
Posts: 417
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2010 9:52 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:21 pm

"Plunged", really. It was an emergency descent not a free fall. The plane was obviously controllable and it landed safely. Still, though a scary moment for passengers. I have never flown on Ryanair, but could skimpy maintenance be the cause of this?
 
Daysleeper
Posts: 565
Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2009 3:33 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:56 pm

Quoting ScottishDavie (Reply 13):
Autobiographical details apart, I don't feel any need to justify my original post but in case there is any doubt about it I was in no way seeking to belittle the fear which the passengers undoubtedly experienced. My simple point is that a pressurisation failure correctly handled by the crew, while frightening for those involved, does not justify the sort of sensationalist media coverage which this incident has received.

It doesn’t perhaps warrant being on the front page of a national newspaper, but it is almost certainly news. I agree that the media often exaggerate aviation story’s to the point of being ridiculous, however the constant downplaying of events on here is becoming equally as ridiculous.

Pressurisation problems have in the past resulted in the loss of an aircraft, and rapid descents have been responsible for injuring passengers, sometimes quite seriously.

Quoting penguins (Reply 14):
"Plunged", really. It was an emergency descent not a free fall. The plane was obviously controllable and it landed safely. Still, though a scary moment for passengers. I have never flown on Ryanair, but could skimpy maintenance be the cause of this?

Plungedv

To descend steeply; fall precipitously:
To become suddenly lower; decrease dramatically:


Sounds like an accurate description of an emergency descent to me.
 
User avatar
readytotaxi
Topic Author
Posts: 3321
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:09 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 6:46 pm

So, the summery is :

Slow news day in the office
A UK aircraft has a cabin pressure problem.
Aircraft descends under control and lands at an airport other than one on my boarding card.
Passengers are delayed and then flown on.

Result, "I thought my number was up"

Ahhhhhhh!  
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
 
Dogbreath
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2008 8:49 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 7:56 pm

Quoting Daysleeper (Reply 11):
especially if you can also hear the captain declaring a mayday

For anyone that flies a multi crew commercial aircraft, knows that during a Decompression/Emergency Descent the roles of PF/PM revert immediately to Captain as PF and FO as PM. The PF (ie. Captain) doesn't transmit to ATC (that's the job of the PM), as the Captains' busy handling the aircraft in the descent.

Sure, the Captain makes the initial PA to the cabin to announce to the cabin crew that an emergency descent is 'about' to be carried out, but that's it as far as it goes for the Captain to be dealing with communication of any kind till levelling off.

I smell a rat on this story. I don't see how the passenger (Farter) could have heard the Captain making a Mayday call to ATC. Doesn't add up to me. Do I trust the media for truthful and accurate reporting? - ABSOLUTELY NO WAY

Will have to wait for the IAA report to be published on this one - to get the "FACTS".

As has been written above, a non-story here folks.
Truth, Honour, Loyalty
 
MD11Engineer
Posts: 13916
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2003 5:25 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 8:28 pm

Quoting dogbreath (Reply 17):
I smell a rat on this story. I don't see how the passenger (Farter) could have heard the Captain making a Mayday call to ATC. Doesn't add up to me. Do I trust the media for truthful and accurate reporting? - ABSOLUTELY NO WAY

Whoever made the mayday call could have had made a PA to the passengers just before the incident and forgotten to switch the audio select panel microphone switch to the relevant VHF radio.
Happened to about everybody using modern aircraft audio / radio systems at least once, e.g. I was doing some tests in the cockpit and wanted to talk to a mechanic using a headset outside the aircraft, but accidentally "talked" to ATC.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
anstar
Posts: 2870
Joined: Sun Nov 23, 2003 3:49 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 9:20 pm

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 10):
It clearly happens now and then, but emergency descents are hardly routine.

Exactly- how many did we have in the EU last year?

Quoting penguins (Reply 14):
Still, though a scary moment for passengers. I have never flown on Ryanair, but could skimpy maintenance be the cause of this?

I doubt it - the European safety regulators would be on them in a shot if they were unsafe.
 
Daysleeper
Posts: 565
Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2009 3:33 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 9:25 pm

Quoting dogbreath (Reply 17):

I smell a rat on this story. I don't see how the passenger (Farter) could have heard the Captain making a Mayday call to ATC. Doesn't add up to me. Do I trust the media for truthful and accurate reporting? - ABSOLUTELY NO WAY

As someone has already suggested the Mayday was perhaps voiced over the PA in error by who-ever was handling the communication.

I also don’t think it matters if it were the FO or Captain which did it, yes I’m sure that the flight crew followed procedure and it may well have been the FO that made the transmission. However, how would a passenger know the difference if it were indeed an accidental PA? They wouldn’t, also if asked about what they heard then most likely would assume that the captain would be the one declaring the mayday.

There is no conspiracy here, an aircraft lost cabin pressure and made an emergency decent which scared the hell out of the passengers… Not major news, but news all the same.

[Edited 2012-04-07 14:27:20]
 
User avatar
longhauler
Posts: 4981
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:00 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sat Apr 07, 2012 9:34 pm

Quoting ScottishDavie (Reply 13):
In my case one, on a BAC 1-11 many years ago and, yes, it scared me absolutely sh*tless at the time. I could never bring myself to fly on a 1-11 again and I became seriously twitchy about flying generally.

That would have been very interesting. I am not sure you are aware, but a lot of BAC 1-11s were built without emergency passenger oxygen. This is not an oversight, but more than the aircraft was capable of descending to a safer lower altitude VERY quickly.

Most Tridents as well!

I have only seen two pressurization problems in my career, once in a B737-200 and once in a B767-300. In both cases we were able to descend to below 10,000' before the emergency mask deployment was triggered.
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
sandrozrh
Posts: 2420
Joined: Sun Feb 04, 2007 12:19 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sun Apr 08, 2012 1:10 am

Quoting dogbreath (Reply 17):
For anyone that flies a multi crew commercial aircraft, knows that during a Decompression/Emergency Descent the roles of PF/PM revert immediately to Captain as PF and FO as PM

???

Certainly not at my airline    And not according general Airbus SOP as far as I know. What's the point of that anyway?
 
Mir
Posts: 19107
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:55 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sun Apr 08, 2012 4:56 am

Quoting dogbreath (Reply 17):
For anyone that flies a multi crew commercial aircraft, knows that during a Decompression/Emergency Descent the roles of PF/PM revert immediately to Captain as PF and FO as PM.

I wouldn't make a blanket statement about that. We don't do it that way where I fly. A rapid decompression is a pretty involved event already - is it really the best idea to make it even more involved by adding a transfer of controls into the mix (at a time when communication might not be optimal due to oxygen masks being donned, etc.)?

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
larspl
Posts: 351
Joined: Fri Apr 05, 2002 4:06 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sun Apr 08, 2012 10:15 am

Quoting dogbreath (Reply 17):
For anyone that flies a multi crew commercial aircraft, knows that during a Decompression/Emergency Descent the roles of PF/PM revert immediately to Captain as PF and FO as PM. The PF (ie. Captain) doesn't transmit to ATC (that's the job of the PM), as the Captains' busy handling the aircraft in the descent.

Sure, the Captain makes the initial PA to the cabin to announce to the cabin crew that an emergency descent is 'about' to be carried out, but that's it as far as it goes for the Captain to be dealing with communication of any kind till levelling off.


According to your profile you say you are a pilot.
I don't see any reason not to trust you. But.

As said before a transfer of control in an emergency descent is not general sop. The two airlines I fly don't.
It is an emergency descent; it is also NOT an SOP to announce such an event to the cabin. That is where we have cabin crew for. Aviate navigate communicate. Communication to the cabin comes last. Period.
Just for clarification, how do you think an emergency descent is handled? Let's follow your thinking.
capt: "o dear co pilot; do you see the cabin pressure dropping?"
co pilot: "uhrg, yes sir i think you are right"
capt: "my controls"
co pilot: "your controls"
capt: "ow, no, your controls again, better speak to the passengers first"
aircraft: "ding ding ding ding ding ding" (think red lights flashing)
capt: "ladies and gentlemen, may i have your attention please, this is your captain speaking. In a few seconds we will commence a live saving procedure called an emergency descent. You may have felt an irritating feeling in your ears for the last couple of minutes, while we here in the front were discussing our options, but this feeling is completely normal. As soon as you have all returned to your seats and fastened your seat belts we'll start the procedure".
co pilot" "sir, i start to feel dizzy, I really think it is a b o u t t i m e"

All joking a side.
In emergencies as a captain it would be something to over think to NOT take control and let the co pilot fly.
It frees you up as the pilot in command to manage the situation and monitor the other pilot.
Also; if you are flying in a flight deck with a steep authority gradient, the co pilot is less likely to speak up in an emergency if the captain is flying. So by letting the least experienced and less senior pilot in the flight deck be the pilot flying, you make sure the most senior guy and pilot in command is really in command.
He might be the co pilot, he is although less experienced, trained and proficient to be a pilot flying in emergencies.
Please read for instance the Avianca crash at New York for an example of a situation where the captain should have had the co pilot do the flying. (yes, way more to it than just that..)
facebook.com/ddaclassicairlines
 
User avatar
longhauler
Posts: 4981
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:00 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sun Apr 08, 2012 2:51 pm

At the three airlines at which I flew ... Wardair, merging into Canadi>n, merging into Air Canada, that was and is SOP at all three!

In the event of any pressurization problem, the Captain assumes control and the drill starts. If an emergency descent is required the Captain already has control. I have done this countless times, at least twice a year in the simulator, and have never seen any confusion. Each crew-member knows exactly what to do, as he is performing the same function every time, regardless who was flying at the start.

That is not to say the First Officer does not know what to do to perform an emergency descent. Often in these simulator scenarios, one the crew-members becomes incapacitated, (not that far a stretch), and the other performs all functions in safely getting the aircraft to a safe altitude.

No method is safer than the other, as each airline must adhere to its governing body's Air Regulations.
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
User avatar
shamrock604
Posts: 2091
Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2007 11:27 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sun Apr 08, 2012 6:23 pm

Quoting readytotaxi (Reply 16):

Em....not quite. It was an Irish aircraft.
 
Dogbreath
Posts: 172
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2008 8:49 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sun Apr 08, 2012 6:33 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 23):
I wouldn't make a blanket statement about that.

I'll take it on the chin. Fair statement! I've been in 3 airlines and it was SOP in all three.

Quoting longhauler (Reply 25):
At the three airlines at which I flew ... Wardair, merging into Canadi>n, merging into Air Canada, that was and is SOP at all three!

Seems like it happens in Canada too!

Anyway as I said, let's wait for the IAA report for the facts.
Truth, Honour, Loyalty
 
Tristarsteve
Posts: 3365
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 11:04 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Sun Apr 08, 2012 6:54 pm

Quoting Mir (Reply 12):
There will be an "oxygen mask restowage fee" and an "airborne roller coaster experience" fee charged, I'm sure.

There is no evidence that the oxygen maskd deployed.
If the reason for the pressurisation problem is lack of air, like an engine bleed or a pack has failed, then an emergency descent will get the aircraft down before the cabin altitude rises.

Our A320 MEL has a statement in 36-11, dispatch with one bleed system inop.
In case of depressurisation above 37000 ft, oxygen masks MAY drop during the descent.

And as a previous poster said, two of the three types of Trident had no pax oxygen system.

Quoting penguins (Reply 14):
but could skimpy maintenance be the cause of this?

Not up here. It was Minus 3 last night. I am still wearing winter clothes. I leave the skimpy stuff to Page 3!   
 
Mir
Posts: 19107
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:55 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Mon Apr 09, 2012 4:01 am

Quoting Tristarsteve (Reply 28):
There is no evidence that the oxygen maskd deployed.
If the reason for the pressurisation problem is lack of air, like an engine bleed or a pack has failed, then an emergency descent will get the aircraft down before the cabin altitude rises.

I had hoped that the second part of my post would have indicated the tongue-in-cheek nature.  

Then again, it is Ryanair, so I suppose it's more believable.

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
Quokkas
Posts: 1327
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2012 5:51 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Mon Apr 09, 2012 4:26 am

Quoting Tristarsteve (Reply 28):
There is no evidence that the oxygen maskd deployed.

OK, it is the Sun's coverage, so I can't vouch for the veracity but

Quote:

In a statement, Ryanair said: "Flight FR1703 (Milan to East Midlands) diverted to Frankfurt Hahn after the captain identified a pressurisation warning, deployed the oxygen masks, and descended to 10,000ft as recommended.
“Not to laugh, not to cry, not to hate, but understand.” Spinoza
 
Tristarsteve
Posts: 3365
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 11:04 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Mon Apr 09, 2012 11:36 am

Quoting Quokkas (Reply 30):
it is the Sun's coverage, so I can't vouch for the veracity but

The pilots would not deploy the oxygen masks. They would deploy automatically if the cabin altitude rose above about 14000ft, and the pilots job is to descend fast enough so it doesn't happen.
Emergency descents, and oxygen masks are not very common.
I work in line maintenance. In fourty years I have personally never seen oxygen masks deployed en mass. I remember one incident on a Gulf Air Tristar when the pilot accidentally deployed the masks. Lots of red faces there, especially in engineering when we found we didn't own a spare ship set of oxygen generators, and they could not be delivered on a pax aircraft!
But depressurisation and emergency descent, never.
 
MD11Engineer
Posts: 13916
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2003 5:25 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Mon Apr 09, 2012 6:20 pm

Quoting Tristarsteve (Reply 31):

The pilots would not deploy the oxygen masks. They would deploy automatically if the cabin altitude rose above about 14000ft, and the pilots job is to descend fast enough so it doesn't happen.

On the 737NG at 10,000 ft cabin altitude the pilots will get a cabin altitude warning (horn and light). If the cabin altitude increases further, at 14,000 ft the pax oxygen masks will be deployed automatically. There exists a manual override switch, which allows the pilots to deploy the oxygen masks at any time.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
yeelep
Posts: 727
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2011 7:53 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:02 pm

The QRH states: If the cabin altitude exceeds or is expected to exceed 14,000ft, PASSENGER OXYGEN switch ON.

So its possible the crew deployed the o2 masks.
 
MD11Engineer
Posts: 13916
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2003 5:25 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Mon Apr 09, 2012 9:38 pm

Quoting yeelep (Reply 33):
The QRH states: If the cabin altitude exceeds or is expected to exceed 14,000ft, PASSENGER OXYGEN switch ON.

So its possible the crew deployed the o2 masks.

The only purpose of this procedure is that the crew makes sure that the pax oxygen masks deploy should the automatic have failed.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
BoeingGuy
Posts: 3944
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:01 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:12 pm

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 34):
Quoting yeelep (Reply 33):
The QRH states: If the cabin altitude exceeds or is expected to exceed 14,000ft, PASSENGER OXYGEN switch ON.

So its possible the crew deployed the o2 masks.

The only purpose of this procedure is that the crew makes sure that the pax oxygen masks deploy should the automatic have failed.

The Boeing QRH has several steps like this to backup the automation, in addition to backing up the automatic rubber jungle deployment after a decompression. The Dual Engine Failure procedure calls for pushing the RAT switch, even though the RAT should already have deployed automatically. It also calls for starting the APU, even though it should have already started automatically on the 777 and 787. There's no room for even the tiniest probability of the automation failing in situations like these.

So I think we are hearing that different airlines may have different SOPs for who flies the emergency descent. Nothing shocking here. Different airlines have differing SOPs for a lot of stuff, like which pilot pushes the TOGA switch for takeoff when the F/O is the PF.
 
Mir
Posts: 19107
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:55 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Mon Apr 09, 2012 11:21 pm

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 34):
The only purpose of this procedure is that the crew makes sure that the pax oxygen masks deploy should the automatic have failed.

QRH-wise, yes, but there's no reason the pilots couldn't decide to drop the masks themselves, even if the plane were flying along normally and the pressurization were holding up fine.

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
BoeingGuy
Posts: 3944
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:01 pm

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Tue Apr 10, 2012 12:14 am

Quoting Mir (Reply 36):
QRH-wise, yes, but there's no reason the pilots couldn't decide to drop the masks themselves, even if the plane were flying along normally and the pressurization were holding up fine.

I'm going to assume that most operations would have a policy against this, unless the crew really had a valid reason to suspect imminent danger to the passengers. Oxygen only last for a finite number of minutes. Then what if you did decompress later at 40,000 feet and your oxygen was used up.

Contrary to what some crews have done in the recent past, it is a big no-no to deploy the oxygen masks during a smoke/fire/fumes event. First of all, the pax oxygen is mixed with air from the cabin so your not isolating the passengers from the smoke anyway. Secondly, you be introducing more highly flammable oxygen into a potential fire situation. Very very bad idea. I've seen reports of crews taking it upon themselves to do it anyway, but is very much against industry guidance.
 
Mir
Posts: 19107
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:55 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Tue Apr 10, 2012 3:42 am

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 37):
I'm going to assume that most operations would have a policy against this, unless the crew really had a valid reason to suspect imminent danger to the passengers.

Of course there are a number of reasons not to do it, but it is physically possible should the crew wish to.

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
Eagleboy
Posts: 1700
Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2009 2:29 am

RE: Ryanair Emergency Descent, Wednesday

Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:44 am

Quoting Daysleeper (Reply 20):
As someone has already suggested the Mayday was perhaps voiced over the PA in error by who-ever was handling the communication.......................There is no conspiracy here, an aircraft lost cabin pressure and made an emergency decent which scared the hell out of the passengers… Not major news, but news all the same.

I completely agree with the media overreaction to this event, obviously handled correctly by the crew.

Howvever I would love to hear what exactly the pax were told be the flightcrew after landing. A full and proper explanation of the incident would have nipped such "my number was up" stories in the bud. (Within the last week I have had a serious diversion, no worries among the pax as it was not an obvious emergency in the cabin and the Capt explained it calmly and clearly as we were diverting) Perhaps Mr. Frater (farter) did not listen to this and/or decided he wanted his 15 mins?