ZKOJH
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Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:47 am

I Wonder what they have up there shorts! he-he

Virgin Atlantic is preparing to bid for the 12 pairs of Heathrow slots that will be freed up following British Airways' takeover of bmi as Richard Branson sets his sights on launching his first UK domestic flights, reported The Daily Telegraph.

The airline is calling on the European Commission to ensure the 12 slots are auctioned as one complete package to provide the "most effective" competition to BA owner International Airlines Group (IAG).

http://www.cargonewsasia.com/secured/article.aspx?id=15&article=28149
Vietnam time..
 
CHRISBA777ER
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:19 pm

A340s LHR-MAN and GLA.

Sign me up!  
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
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Vasu
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:20 pm

Surely they'd be getting some smaller aircraft?!
 
richcandy
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:23 pm

They might want the 12 pairs of slots at LHR, but I can't see them being used for UK domestic services.
 
tonystan
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:24 pm

Just another publicity stunt if you ask me.

Those 12 slots will not go to one operator and there is nothing that states they must all be used on domestic routes. BA are simply asked to provide for other non-aligned carriers feed from domestic routes.
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jumpjets
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:35 pm

Quoting richcandy (Reply 3):
They might want the 12 pairs of slots at LHR, but I can't see them being used for UK domestic services.

My reading of the EU announcement is that the routes for which the 12 slots have to be used are clearly specified and that includes 7 daily flights [in total] to EDI and ABZ and five flights to specified international destinations. It is only after three years the carrier then has to right to user the slots for other destinations.

If VS wish to take on the slots they will have to take on the obligation to fly to EDI or ABZ for at least three years.
 
LHRFlyer
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:42 pm

I can't take credit for this, but it did make me laugh:

"4 Engines 4 Scotland"?
 
RyanairGuru
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:54 pm

Quoting ZKOJH (Thread starter):
The airline is calling on the European Commission to ensure the 12 slots are auctioned as one complete package to provide the "most effective" competition to BA owner International Airlines Group (IAG).

For me this is the most interesting stipulation, and this isn't the first time I've read it...

Virgin/Branson want the 12 slots to be one offering whereas at the moment there are two separate groups. Their request to have them "assigned as one complete package" will be denied (although they may be entitled to the two separate packages independently of each other) and this provides them with a convenient get out of jail free card... They can say 'we tried' but big bad IAG (in collusion with the European authorities) prevented the champion of consumer rights from entering the market....

*YAWN*
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
virgincrew
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 2:23 pm

If VS got them, they would have to be used as per the guidelines:

"The EC has split the 14 slots into three separate groups: seven pairs that have to be used between Heathrow and Scotland; the two Transaero slots; and five further daily slots with various destination restrictions."

If VS could make this work, it would be great.

would be nice to see this:

Hello Beautiful !!!
 
virgincrew
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 2:25 pm

Hello Beautiful !!!
 
Gingersnap
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 2:26 pm

I saw an article yesterday that stated EI was also interested in acquiring these slots.
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Revelation
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 3:14 pm

Quoting ZKOJH (Thread starter):
Virgin Atlantic is preparing to bid for the 12 pairs of Heathrow slots that will be freed up following British Airways' takeover of bmi as Richard Branson sets his sights on launching his first UK domestic flights, reported The Daily Telegraph.

VS is making a press release.

Wake me up when they actually do something.

Branson should be known as "The Beard That Cried Wolf"...
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PezySPU
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 6:38 pm

Quoting jumpjets (Reply 5):
My reading of the EU announcement is that the routes for which the 12 slots have to be used are clearly specified and that includes 7 daily flights [in total] to EDI and ABZ and five flights to specified international destinations.

The scheme goes like this:

- 7 daily slot pairs for services to EDI and/or ABZ
- 5 daily slot pairs for services to EDI, ABZ, or Nice, Cairo, Moscow or Ryadh
- 2 daily slot pairs will be leased to UN for services to Moscow

So VS could get up to 12 daily slot pairs for EDI and/or ABZ.
 
sxb
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 6:47 pm

Quoting Chrisba777er (Reply 1):
A340s LHR-MAN and GLA.

Don't they have a few A380 on order?  
SXB
 
planejamie
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 7:24 pm

VS don't have a hope in hell's chance at operating these flights - even if they did there wouldn't be enough feed to Long Haul to sustain them anyway! Plus, they'd be competing with their own train services from Edinburgh to London (granted VS don't "operate" the trains but it's part of the Virgin brand. If they wanted a decent feed I'm sure they could codeshare on the trains like AF do with the SNCF)

The real likelyhood is this new Scottish airline that's going to be formed out of bmi Regional will actually operate ERJs from EDI & ABZ to LHR and that would provide a feed for VS

Alternatively, Richard Branson could accept VS can't survive on O&D travellers to/from London (I'm sure it can) and he has to codeshare on BA to/from the regions - now that's when we see something interesting happen!

I seem to recall a post on here a few days/weeks back about BA/VS 25 years or so on and I seem to recall Richard saying that he doesn't want VS to become big like BA, and that he doesn't want everything handed to him on a plate - well nothing like a bit of contradiction if he wants those slots!
 
Gingersnap
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 7:54 pm

Quoting planejamie (Reply 14):
I seem to recall a post on here a few days/weeks back about BA/VS 25 years or so on and I seem to recall Richard saying that he doesn't want VS to become big like BA, and that he doesn't want everything handed to him on a plate - well nothing like a bit of contradiction if he wants those slots!

Well to be fair, they are prepared to bid for them as oppose to just having them handed to them on a silver platter.
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ZKOJH
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:20 pm

If they got this it would surely be E-Jets? anything else would be too big but then some nice VS 787's would look cool, and would they not follow the trend of the Virgin Group - Virgin America/Australia/ Samoa / so we we get ''Virgin England''??!!
Vietnam time..
 
steve6666
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Fri Apr 13, 2012 12:01 am

Quoting planejamie (Reply 14):
Alternatively, Richard Branson could accept VS can't survive on O&D travellers to/from London (I'm sure it can) and he has to codeshare on BA to/from the regions - now that's when we see something interesting happen!

What would the commercial rationale for BA be? Why would they want to bring pax from around the UK - probably at a loss - and feed them on to a competitor's (sorry, strike that, bitter rival's) profitable long haul flights?

Separately, I am not convinced that this makes financial sense. Last time I remember hearing Virgin's financial results they were marginally profitable on a turnover of £3-£4bn (and I seem to remember then only because of a foreign exchange gain). It seems to me a pretty big bet that a UK operation is going to break even - if bmi couldn't, what makes Virgin think they can - and without a big investment from somewhere to underwrite possible losses, this strikes me as betting the company.
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T8KE0FF
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:54 am

I don't see this happening really. As already pointed out, Virgin would be competing with their own company Virgin Trains who already offer services to Scotland. But I'd love to be proved wrong.

Quoting ZKOJH (Reply 16):
so we we get ''Virgin England''??!!

What, on a airline that'd be likely to fly exclusively to Scotland to start off with at least? :P
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nicktt
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:03 am

Surely it wouldn't be worth starting domestic operations with only 12 slots in the first place?
 
mikey72
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:46 am

Quoting Revelation (Reply 11):
Branson should be known as "The Beard That Cried Wolf"...

  
Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand.
 
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OA260
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:50 am

Quoting Revelation (Reply 11):
Branson should be known as "The Beard That Cried Wolf"...

      Too funny. I have switched off about VS and their disputes . I used to respect SRB but these days he is just bitter. Shame .
 
sevenheavy
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:39 am

Quoting steve6666 (Reply 17):
What would the commercial rationale for BA be? Why would they want to bring pax from around the UK - probably at a loss - and feed them on to a competitor's (sorry, strike that, bitter rival's) profitable long haul flights?

Who knows but they've done it for years. BA and VS have a sizeable through check in agreement. Don't forget that in many cases VS are the originating carrier. Its not just BA feeding VS from the U.K. and Europe, there is also VS feeding BA from the U.S, far east etc.

It clearly works. Thru check in agreements come and go and this one has been around for a while. Even on a relatively quiet day like today the numbers of passengers thru checked and transferring from BA-VS and vice versa number well into the many hundreds.
So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
 
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eurowings
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RE: Virgin Eyes Bmi Slots For Launch Of UK Flights

Fri Apr 13, 2012 11:23 am

If Virgin was serious (and I am by no means certain that they are) about launching a limited domestic network to feed long haul from LHR, I think it would be wise to start negotiating with Flybe.

BE would probably be prepared to operate from Scotland to LHR with full Virgin branding, and BA's stakeholding in their firm means nothing to them (they will do business with anyone e.g feeding AF at CDG, operating for SN out of BRU).

People forget that VS used to operate LGW-MST with a Vickers Viscount (owned by British Air Ferries), to feed long haul flights. However, it also offered a flat fare of £19 each way, a forgotten glimpse into the history of low cost air travel in Europe, predating deregulation by a fair few years!


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Quoting planejamie (Reply 14):
Plus, they'd be competing with their own train services from Edinburgh to London (granted VS don't "operate" the trains but it's part of the Virgin brand. If they wanted a decent feed I'm sure they could codeshare on the trains like AF do with the SNCF)

They wouldn't actually, the only services Virgin Trains operate to Scotland are once hourly from London to Glasgow, and every two hours from Glasgow/Edinburgh to Birmingham.

The other services like Edinburgh/Aberdeen/Inverness to London are operated by another rail company (East Coast).

[Edited 2012-04-13 04:42:30]
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