SWALUV
Topic Author
Posts: 148
Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:43 pm

Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Tue Apr 24, 2012 7:56 pm

Hi Everyone,

As I was looking at other post in the forums, I had a questions. With the small fleet size, I was wondering...

What is the future of Piedmont?
Will Piedmont be merged with PSA? ( Because they're both owned by US)
Will Piedmont take Colgans old Q400?
Will US sell Piedmont?
Will Piedmont be dismantled?

Thanks in Advance!
 
Dash8Driver16
Posts: 109
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Tue Apr 24, 2012 8:30 pm

I Think that the future of PDT is to be a ground handling company for USAirways. The actual airline portion of it is so small that i am not sure if there really is a future for it. The fleet is only getting older and there seems to be nothing happening to replace it. I doubt that anyone would be interested in buying PDT due to the incredibly senior pilot group and elderly fleet. The merger with PSA is a very real possibility we will have to see what happens with that.

The dismantling of the airline i think could happen but as i stated above i think the PDT entity will live on as the ground handling provider for Airways.
 
KarlB737
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:01 am

I want Piedmont mainline back no if ands or buts. I miss their well honed operation and reliable style.
 
silentbob
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:29 am

Quoting Dash8Driver16 (Reply 1):
I doubt that anyone would be interested in buying PDT due to the incredibly senior pilot group and elderly fleet. The merger with PSA is a very real possibility we will have to see what happens with that.

If PSA has trouble recruiting pilots over the next year or two, a merger is a distinct possibility.
 
nycdave
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Wed Apr 25, 2012 12:38 am

Wasn't part of the reason US kept the Piedmont name flying was to keep the name from being taken and used by a competitor? Lord knows that reason is pretty much past -- would most of the flying public put ANY connection to "Piedmont"?
 
Mainliner
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:32 am

Absolutely no chance PDT will get Colgan's -400's, or ANY -400's any time soon. US's scope clause prevents any turboprops CERTIFICATED with more than 69 seats. So even if US were to get -400's and outfit them with 68 seats, Piedmont still couldn't fly them because the -400 is certificated for 76 seats.

But RAH RJ's flying PHL-IAH is perfectly fine.

  
Every flight counts.
 
RogerThat
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:41 am

Quoting nycdave (Reply 4):
Wasn't part of the reason US kept the Piedmont name flying was to keep the name from being taken and used by a competitor? Lord knows that reason is pretty much past -- would most of the flying public put ANY connection to "Piedmont"?

Surely every resident of the Carolinas knows Piedmont as their home state air line.

Quoting KarlB737 (Reply 2):
I want Piedmont mainline back no if ands or buts. I miss their well honed operation and reliable style.

Absolutely!
 
safetyDemo
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Wed Apr 25, 2012 1:50 am

I commute weekly on Piedmont. Last week, the FA (who has been with them over 10 years) was telling me that they are down to about 30 aircraft and shrinking. As the leases are expiring she said that they aren't renewing them. How quickly are aircraft leaving the fleet and how much longer do their leases run? I'd take a Dash 8 any day over a CRJ!
Please direct your attention to the flight attendants in the cabin...
 
Mainliner
Posts: 359
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Wed Apr 25, 2012 2:17 am

It's not like the planes are going to disappear at once. The oldest three -100's will reach the end of their usable lives next year, but several months apart. After that, I believe it's a while longer before the rest begin to time out.

Eleven -100's were returned to the lessor a few years ago when their leases came up for renewal. It was simply a case of bad timing; in 2008 US was looking to cut costs, but was unable to reduce the number of 50-seat RJ's due to contractual obligations with Air Wisconsin, and existing lease obligations with PSA. Eleven DHC-8-100's seemed to be a quick expense to dispose of. Very short-sighted, in my opinion.
Every flight counts.
 
boberito6589
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Wed Apr 25, 2012 3:05 am

Quoting safetydemo (Reply 7):
I commute weekly on Piedmont. Last week, the FA (who has been with them over 10 years) was telling me that they are down to about 30 aircraft and shrinking

Piedmont has a fleet of 33 -100s and 11 -300s for a total of 44

Quoting Mainliner (Reply 8):
It's not like the planes are going to disappear at once. The oldest three -100's will reach the end of their usable lives next year, but several months apart. After that, I believe it's a while longer before the rest begin to time out

This is exactly right, 3 time out next year and it isn't really an option to extend the lease. Piedmont says its doing everything it can to find more 100s/300s to lease but there really aren't very many aircraft up for sale let alone to be leased.
 
HPRamper
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Wed Apr 25, 2012 4:14 am

Quoting nycdave (Reply 4):
Lord knows that reason is pretty much past -- would most of the flying public put ANY connection to "Piedmont"?
Quoting RogerThat (Reply 6):
Surely every resident of the Carolinas knows Piedmont as their home state air line.

Not since the late 1980s, meaning basically only people at least in their mid-40s really have any real memory of Piedmont being anything but a regional partner of USAir and later, US Airways.
 
Dash8Driver16
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Wed Apr 25, 2012 4:52 pm

The whole reason PDT is called PDT and PSA is called PSA is because airways wanted to keep those names off of the market for a startup to come in and scoop up. The fleet count is right with 33-100 and 11-300. 906, 907, 908 are all timing out within the next 12 months and the -300 leases are done in 2015 although there has been a rumor floating around of them returning a 300 early. the question is what are they going to do to replace these aircraft. PDT had over 12K block hours this month and the ops spare that we do have is usually flying since all the of planes break pretty consistently.
 
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JBo
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Wed Apr 25, 2012 5:24 pm

Let's not forget that US also retained a regional named Allegheny to keep that name in use as well, but I believe they integrated it into either PSA or PDT several years ago.

I could see the two airline operations being consolidated to reduce overhead, especially if the AA merger comes to fruition. There is no real practical reason for the two airlines to exist separately, it's not as though they are scoped out of each other like RAH's separate airlines.
I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
 
SWALUV
Topic Author
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Wed Apr 25, 2012 6:40 pm

What if AA is purchased and American Eagle still isn't spun off? This means that US/AA will have 3 fully owned regional carriers. Will we see AE being merged into another operation or will we see Piedmont, (possibly) PSA, and AE merge together for the sake of management?

I meant AE to be American Eagle :P
 
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JBo
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Wed Apr 25, 2012 6:57 pm

Quoting SWALUV (Reply 13):
What if AA is purchased and American Eagle still isn't spun off? This means that US/AA will have 3 fully owned regional carriers. Will we see AE being merged into another operation or will we see Piedmont, (possibly) PSA, and AE merge together for the sake of management?

I meant AE to be American Eagle :P

Let's not forget that American Eagle is actually both Eagle and Executive, though my understanding is the Executive ops are being wound down (or something to that effect, I could be wrong).
I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
 
Dash8Driver16
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Thu Apr 26, 2012 2:01 am

Yes Allegheny was merged into PDT.
 
sflaflight
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Thu Apr 26, 2012 4:25 pm

But couldnt those props be used in a merged MIA base to handle Bahamian traffic that are loosing ATR ala Executive or are those planes not capable due to cargo problems or age?
 
N6168E
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:02 am

Quoting Dash8Driver16 (Reply 11):
The whole reason PDT is called PDT and PSA is called PSA is because airways wanted to keep those names off of the market for a startup to come in and scoop up.

The name changes happened after Robert E Peach, Jr., son of Mohawk's long time president, founded a commuter with the same name. This was a rag-tag outfit and caused much confusion to the flying public in Central New York where both Mohawk's were based, so US changed the names of their wholly owned carriers in order to protect their trademarks.

I didn't find much on the second Mohawk, but here is a link to a New York Times article about their bankruptcy.
http://www.nytimes.com/1992/03/28/bu...mohawk-airlines-is-irs-target.html
 
DashTrash
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:44 am

There is no future for Piedmont flight ops. Breaks my heart as I still have several good friends there.

The company has been dragging out negotiations with the pilots and FAs since the contracts became amendable in '09. With the pilots, the company has offered the current post 9/11 concessionary contract with no improvements and hasn't been talking outside of that. Federal mediation was granted in short order, and has been ongoing. The union hasn't been on top of things from my standpoint as they should have called a strike vote last year. A strike is exactly where this is headed. The pilot group cannot agree to the substandard post 9/11 concessionary work rules. The reserve rules are archaic, scheduling rules deplorable, crew meals crap, et al. The only thing in the contract worth the ink it's written with is the vacation language.

I'm getting all the current condition second hand, but I firmly believe it. Things were starting to go downhill when I was there.

BTW.... Since the merger, profit sharing checks have been distributed. This year management decided to keep the money since "it's not in the contract". The company is run by soulless bastards who are going to use the ensuing pilot strike as the excuse for ceasing flight ops. I'm sure there marching orders are coming straight out of the desert. Sad they'd rather destroy it than try to sell it off.
 
Dash8Driver16
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RE: Future Of Piedmont Airlines?

Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:36 pm

Yes the Profit sharing disaster might push PDT over the edge from what I have heard. I have friends who work there as well and they are saying the union is doing a strike preparedness meeting at all bases. Right now they are just waiting for one more meeting with the NMB to find out if they are going to be released or not. Unfortunately this is what it has come to. I wish them all well.