macc
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AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Mon Apr 30, 2012 7:58 am

Just wondered that AB group has no coverage of the Belgian or Dutch market. Is there any reason they stay out of these 2 countries? One would think that both BRU and AMS would be interesting destinations for business and leisure travellers.
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rlwynn
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Mon Apr 30, 2012 8:09 am

Cityhopper has AMS covered and Germans really have nothing to do with Belgium. So no BRU.
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macc
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Mon Apr 30, 2012 8:19 am

Quoting rlwynn (Reply 1):
Cityhopper has AMS covered and Germans really have nothing to do with Belgium. So no BRU.

BRU as the center of EU, with that big travelling workforce should still offer some interesting potential. And you forget connecting pax from other countries.
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LOWS
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:14 am

Quoting macc (Thread starter):
Just wondered that AB group has no coverage of the Belgian or Dutch market. Is there any reason they stay out of these 2 countries? One would think that both BRU and AMS would be interesting destinations for business and leisure travellers.

Because they still want to act like an LCC?

Quoting rlwynn (Reply 1):
Cityhopper has AMS covered and Germans really have nothing to do with Belgium. So no BRU.

Cityhopper also offers MUC-AMS-MUC for 80€, but LH still flies it.

And nothing to do with BRU? Really? You're joking, right?

[Edited 2012-04-30 04:21:55]
 
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vhtje
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:25 am

Actually I agree with this. I was in AMS a couple of weeks ago for the weekend, and had a business meeting in Berlin early the following week. In investigating my options for getting to Berlin, I was very surprised to find AB don't serve AMS. It was a pity, as I would have extended my stay in AMS and tried AB if they had.

In the end I returned to LHR and flew to Berlin from there a day later.

Quoting macc (Reply 2):
BRU as the center of EU, with that big travelling workforce

I agree. I would have thought the EU would generate a lot of business between Berlin and Brussels. Perhaps AB is still too leisure/LCC market-oriented?
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captaincrackers
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Mon Apr 30, 2012 2:04 pm

Quoting vhtje (Reply 4):
I would have thought the EU would generate a lot of business between Berlin and Brussels. Perhaps AB is still too leisure/LCC market-oriented?

U2 and SN fly SXF-BRU and TXL-BRU respectively; KL, HV, and U2 all fly AMS to TXL or SXF. That's plenty of competition to go up against, and there is probably more money to be made elsewhere. But the rumour mill keeps churning out BER-AMS. I guess we'll have to wait and see.
 
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Mon Apr 30, 2012 3:28 pm

Quoting rlwynn (Reply 1):

Cityhopper has AMS covered and Germans really have nothing to do with Belgium. So no BRU.

U'r kidding right?

Germany is the the Biggest Export market of Belgium and 2nd biggest import market after the netherlands.

Belgium is the 7th biggest export market of Germany and 6th biggest import market...

http://www.economywatch.com/world_economy/belgium/export-import.html

http://topforeignstocks.com/2010/08/...trading-partners-and-export-goods/

Reason I guess is that the Belgian market is already very well served by existing airlines and that there is not much connecting traffic AB can grab in Belgium...
 
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vhtje
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Mon Apr 30, 2012 4:33 pm

Quoting CaptainCrackers (Reply 5):
U2 and SN fly SXF-BRU and TXL-BRU respectively; KL, HV, and U2 all fly AMS to TXL or SXF.

The problem with U2 (and I suppose also HV but I would have to check to know for sure) is that being leisure-oriented, they do not offer much frequency on their routes and their scheduling can be poorly timed for business travellers. For example, on Wednesday 15th May, U2 is only showing two flights a day between SXF and BRU. Admittedly the timings are good, but with only two flights from which to choose I can't see they would carry much business traffic.
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AIR MALTA
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Mon Apr 30, 2012 5:17 pm

There is a huge *A monopoly on the Belgian->Swiss, Austrian and German markets... Prices are high and I think Niki could do well on the VIE-BRU route and AB can start its BRU-BER.
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aviationfreak
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Mon Apr 30, 2012 6:45 pm

AB did fly from AMS not to long ago. They flew to PMI and RMI. They offered connections at PMI to other Spanish destinations. They stopped ops from AMS when they had to restructure.
A reason they don't want a large ops at AMS could be that AMS is one of the most expensive airports in Europe. However U2 seems not to be bothered by that.

[Edited 2012-04-30 11:55:00]

[Edited 2012-04-30 11:55:53]
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MillwallSean
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Mon Apr 30, 2012 9:41 pm

Its not just BRU and AMS thats missing from AB European network.
Try going virtually to any neighbouring country. Warsaw, Prague fairly important capitals are completely missing from the routenetwork. AB is great going south in Europe, going south to holiday destinations. But if you want to go south to capitals for example MAD there is no flight unless you connect.
AB isnt a good airline for business customers or an airline serving the government employees. They cater to tourist and VFR markets.

To France there is now service to Paris twice daily and to Nice but not to any of the other larger cities. Same with LHR no service. they have two daily flights to LGW. MAN isnt served and neither is any other mainland English destination.

No flights to places such as the Baltics, Romania and Bulgaria even though they might be smaller markets.
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airbuseric
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Mon Apr 30, 2012 10:53 pm

AB did operate twice daily AMS-TXL flights, used B738, B73G and F100's. Flew the route many times, often is was packed.
Still, they stopped operating after a while, remaining with 2 daily conveniently timed AMS-PMI flights, which became 1 daily in the inconvenient afternoon.
Then also a AMS-RMI was set up in summer only, only on Saturdays. Mostly sold to tour operators. This route stopped also now, and afaik Windjet took over this service.

Such a shame actually, I like AB a lot and would like to see them back.

Quoting CaptainCrackers (Reply 5):
KL, HV, and U2 all fly AMS to TXL or SXF.

KLM does AMS-TXL
HV does EIN-TXL
U2 does AMS-SXF
4U does MST-SXF
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aviationfreak
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Tue May 01, 2012 3:06 pm

AB should have jumped in the gap that was left behind by MP but was quickly filled by HV and OR and to some extend KLM

KLM took over the long haul destinations from MP but is now stopping does routes one by one. An opportunity for AB maybe?
More likely OR is going to take advantage of that.

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LJ
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Tue May 01, 2012 6:25 pm

Quoting vinniewinnie (Reply 6):
Reason I guess is that the Belgian market is already very well served by existing airlines and that there is not much connecting traffic AB can grab in Belgium...

Moreover, why fly when you can use your own car or train? Most destinations in Germany are reachable by car within 6 hours or by train. Moreover, it's sometimes easier to use DUS if you live in eastern parts of The Netherlands and Belgium
 
Delta777Jet
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Wed May 02, 2012 12:01 pm

AB is indeed more a holiday carrier than a business carrier. They urgently need to connect European capitals with BER if they want to turn profitable.

EasyJet might doesnt have a lot of flights between AMSBRU-SXF(BER) i.e. SN but they are Always packed (Load Factor 90%+) with mostly Business Travellers!

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cgnnrw
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RE: AB Group: Why Not BRU Or AMS

Wed May 02, 2012 6:16 pm

But doesn't AB benefit from DUS' location? Not all Dutch live in / around AMS and for many Dutch residents DUS is more convenient than AMS. Check out the parking garages at the airport and you'll discover a lot of Dutch tags. DUS may not be as conveneint for Belgians though.
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