abletofly
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CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 5:45 am

It's only in danish though.
600 people looses their jobs. Very sad.
On tv, an economic expert said it had to come at one point.
I really liked the classic colourscheme with the cheatline, so I'll really miss their aircrafts.

http://www.finans.tv2.dk/nyheder/art...-beg%C3%A6res-konkurs.html?forside

///A
 
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AirPacific747
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 6:18 am

I know people flying for them and also people in the administration, so I know how much they have had to fight getting money from their Ukrainian owner.. I don't understand his timing doing this.. they had just announced a new business plan not so long ago that could have worked...

Also, if he was so keen on making them earn money, then why did he insist on using two daily 737-700 flights between CPH and KBP that were only about 30% full? (I know since I've flown this route many times.
 
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Dahlgardo
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 8:29 am

Sad day for Cimber, but this has been going the wrong way for a long time.
It's probably a good move not throw more good money after bad money.

Several things went wrong for Cimber.
They went head on with Norwegian, Easyjet on the leisure market, but did not have the cost structure to do it right.
Norwegian responded by going after Cimbers core business, which is the domestic routes in Denmark.

Their fleet was not ideal. Too many fuel inefficient CRJs, and too few B737 to sustain reasonably low unit costs.

Besides a lot of bad press, Cimber has also been haunted by too many cancellations, and I know quite a few people which choose not to book with Cimber for that reason.

Until 2009 Cimber was a family owned airlines. In the fall of 2009 the Nielsen family bailed out and cashed in on their inheritage by selling most of ther stock in the company but also offering new stock to bolst the company. The media quickly found out Cimber already then was an ailing airline and they had a hard time selling the stock. Cimber never managed to distance themselves from being an ailing airlines in the eyes of the public.

Will be interesting to see if Kolomoisky pulls the plug on his Scandinavian Regional Network project and let Swedish Skyways fall also. FlyBe Nordic seems to get a good grip on the Scandinavian Market with their strategy.

This is also a big blow to SAS which has been tied closely to Cimber.
FlyBe Nordic is tied to SAS main Scandinavian competitor, Finnair.
leave your nines at home and bring your skills to the battle
 
Someone83
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 8:32 am

This was a disaster waiting to happen. Cimber used to be a well run regional airline, untill the day they decided to buy the remains of the bankrupt Sterling. Since that day their destiny was doom, only delayed after a few business men decided to pur some money into that bottomless pit, keeping them afloat for a while
 
okobjorn
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 8:36 am

I think that Cimber will come back, based on the Nielsen family and their strong relationship with local business.
My guess is that they will do a Cimber Classic, i.e. take over some or all of the ATR's and be a strong but small regional player which acts primarily as a feeder to SAS. They probably should have done this a number of years ago...
 
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AirPacific747
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 8:49 am

Quoting Dahlgardo (Reply 2):
Besides a lot of bad press, Cimber has also been haunted by too many cancellations, and I know quite a few people which choose not to book with Cimber for that reason.

What you call a 'selvopfyldende profeti' ... Cimber were bound to go bankrupt with journalists scaring people from buying tickets with Cimber Sterling.. they definitely didn't help in the process, plus there really was no point in writing all these negative articles as Cimber could have staid afloat for as long as Kolomoisky wanted them to.. so why make it sound like Cimber was already dead?
 
IndianicWorld
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 9:00 am

Another example of consolidation at work.

Not a huge surprise, given the competitive pressures at play currently. Everyone is struggling in some way, and it will unfortunately have some casualties.

Sorry for all the staff and families who bare the brunt of this though. Its a hollow feeling to work hard and for this to be the end result.
 
Pelle
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 9:05 am

I just heard this now, very sad to see another airline crack. Especially one with a 60+ year heritage.

@Dahlgardo: Thanks for the brush-up.

Who do you think will take over on CimberSterling's now abandoned routes? Sas? "Cimer Classic"? Norwegian?
DHC6 CRJ700 ERJ190 737 733 735 738 752 763 772 77W 744 A319 A320 A321 A333 A346
 
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Dahlgardo
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 9:48 am

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 5):
What you call a 'selvopfyldende profeti' ... Cimber were bound to go bankrupt with journalists scaring people from buying tickets with Cimber Sterling

Well, they definitely had a point.
Had it not been for Kolomoisky, Cimber would have been dead and buried long time ago, and now we see that even the 300mill DKK from the new owner didn't help, but only delayed the demise of the airline. Cimber has been a dead dog since they bought the 737s, and I'm surprised Kolomoiskys Due Diligence was of such bad quality.

Cimber caused a lot of bad press and bad image by themselves a few years ago when they sabotaged Norwegians sales campaign i Denmark. I'm not agueing if Norwegians campaign was fair or not, but the reaction from the Cimber employees and the lack of response from the managers gave the impression of an airline that lacked winner mentality. They didn't believe in their own project.
leave your nines at home and bring your skills to the battle
 
Quokkas
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 9:53 am

This is sad news, particularly for those employees affected.

CimberSterling operated flights on behalf of SAS on some routes, for example some of the flights between CPH - HAM. Presumably anyone who had purchased a ticket with an SK code would not be losing any money. But what about the flights themselves. Will SK be able to introduce their own metal or will the flights be terminated?
“Not to laugh, not to cry, not to hate, but understand.” Spinoza
 
Thomas_Jaeger
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 9:54 am

DAT has announced CPH-SGD and CPH-RNN while Sun-Air apparently will take over BLL-OSL and BLL-ARN.
Swiss aviation news junkie living all over the place
 
harmonium
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 11:18 am

Sun Air will also take over AAL-OSL with two daily rotations starting Mon 7th May.
 
AIR MALTA
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 11:37 am

If you use google translate, you'll get this (weird how sterilng is replaced by easyJet):

Cimber Sterling bankrupt - all flights are provisionally canceled

The Board of easyJet has decided to ask the company bankrupt and has therefore been filed for bankruptcy with the court in Sønderborg on Thursday 3rd May 2012 at. 06.30.

The consequence is that all flights from that time are canceled. If you should have been off with easyJet today will unfortunately therefore be futile to go to the airport. We apologize sincerely.

Cimber Sterling is registered in the Travel Guarantee Fund. That means you could get the ticket refunded if you simultaneously with the purchase of the ticket has purchased a bankrupt insurance. You will be contacted directly by the fund. If you befiunder up abroad and have a bankruptcy insurance, you will also be transported home free. Read more at Rejsegarantifonden.dk

However, if you are abroad and have not purchased a bankrupt insurance, the journey is unfortunately lost, and you must, unfortunately, even pay for alternative transport home.

If travel is purchased through a travel agent is the agent responsible for ensuring the implementation journey. Contact organizer for more information concerning. refund.

Have you paid with international credit card, you can through your bank to object and thereby see if you can get your expenses covered. If however, you paid with credit VisaDankort equated paying with cash - and you no opportunity to object apart from doing your claims in the bankruptcy estate.

We must again regret deeply.

Sincerely
Cimber Sterling
Next flights : BRU-ZRH-CAI (LX)/ BRU-FCO-TLV (AZ)
 
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AirPacific747
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 11:39 am

Quoting Dahlgardo (Reply 8):
Well, they definitely had a point.
Had it not been for Kolomoisky, Cimber would have been dead and buried long time ago, and now we see that even the 300mill DKK from the new owner didn't help, but only delayed the demise of the airline. Cimber has been a dead dog since they bought the 737s, and I'm surprised Kolomoiskys Due Diligence was of such bad quality.

I don't understand why he bought them to start with.. seems like they finally had a good plan though by getting rid of the 737s and focusing on the domestic market just like in the good old days..

Now his entire investment has been wasted, but I guess he had just lost faith in the airline which is understandable.. from what I hear, AeroSvit is not doing too well either..
 
smbukas
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 11:52 am

I think, even being separate airlines, Cimber Sterling, Skyways (with ex City Airline integrated to Skyways) and Aerosvit had some strong operation cooperation.
As an example, one of the Cimber Sterling ATR72 were based in VNO and operated 3x daily rotations VNO-KBP-VNO under Aerosvit flight number.

As I remember, SAS dropped the route CPH-KBP when Cimber putted 2x daily 737 service. Should SAS come back to KBP now? Or CPH-KBP is Aerosvit route operated on Cimber Sterling metal?
 
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AirPacific747
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 11:57 am

Quoting smbukas (Reply 14):
Should SAS come back to KBP now? Or CPH-KBP is Aerosvit route operated on Cimber Sterling metal?

CPH-KBP is now operated by the rest of the AeroSvit group.. I've flown with both AeroSvit and Dniproavia on this route and next time will be with Windrose Embraer aircraft.. so unless SAS wants to get into a fight with AeroSvit, then I guess they should stay away.. it is already not the most profitable route I would imagine..
 
smbukas
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 12:06 pm

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 15):
CPH-KBP is now operated by the rest of the AeroSvit group..

Just checked the schedules in GDS and yes - "Aerosvit" is owner of the flight KBP-CPH. So, poor loads on the route is financial problem for Aersvit, not Cimber Sterling even it was their aircrafts operated the route earlier.
 
Checo77
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 03, 2012 6:54 pm

Oh too bad! Another airline gone! And they flew to PRG from CPH and BLL! The only way to gay from PRG to BLL, this route is now over   Very sad! I know people who were supposed to fly them on the CPH-PRG route, now they are not sure what is going to happen...

RIP Cimber Sterling!!

Adam
Czech Boeing lover living in Lima
 
prebennorholm
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Fri May 04, 2012 2:36 am

Yes, sad to see Cimber fold. But no surprise.

I think that they tried to save money the wrong way.

When much of the traffic (all Danish domestic plus some more) is in reality a substitute for a 3-4 hours car or train ride, then punctuality means a lot. Much of it, and all those who don't just search the lowest fares, are business people with tightly scheduled meetings or connecting passengers.

One time last year I was on Cimber KRP-CPH for connecting to an international trip with another carrier. Arriving at KRP I was told that there would be a delay. It looked like I could almost make my connection if my international plane was just a little late, so I tried. Luckily Cimber wasn't as much "delayed" as first told, so I made my connection from CPH terminal 1 to 3 with sweat and tears - no blood.

Later, when back home again, I discovered that the plane wasn't actually "delayed". Instead the day before they had had an engine problem on one plane which now needed substantial repair. And they had NO SPARE PLANE to cover the situation. Therefore they had reshuffled their whole schedule countrywide since they were short of one plane. Mostly identical things kept happening over and over again. That's the most efficient way to throw away your best customers, those who chose to fly to save time rather than money.

Basically the same thing happened over and over again, whether it was initiated by mech or weather related problems. The result was the same: Whole company wide screw up of the whole schedule for days. Hundreds of businessmen late for meeting, so they took their car next time, Hundreds of connecting pax missing their connection. Many could just throw away their international ticket since they were not official "transfer pax" as they had bought their international ticket separately at EasyJet, Air Berlin or whatever. Others were on a combined Cimber - Star Alliance ticket, so they would be carried on the next available SK, LH or whatever flight to their destination. That's better than throwing the ticket away, but not much if you have an important meeting and arrive to destination the day after the meeting ended.

With their market segment they need to offer a product which is better than own car and train. In reality they lately offered an inferior product since people couldn't trust their schedule.

If only Cimber Air founder, Mr. Ingolf Nielsen, had lived today, then it wouldn't have happened. He understood That ultra short range air traffic has to survive on punctuality and reliability. He did that better than anybody else in the good old days. Today he must be rotating in his grave, knowing how his baby was mistreated after he left the scene.
Always keep your number of landings equal to your number of take-offs
 
Kevin777
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Fri May 04, 2012 10:28 pm

Quoting Dahlgardo (Reply 8):
Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 5):
What you call a 'selvopfyldende profeti' ... Cimber were bound to go bankrupt with journalists scaring people from buying tickets with Cimber Sterling

Well, they definitely had a point.

They did indeed. Of course there is always a danger that bad press causing customer not to book in itself can make an airline bankrupt, even if there was nothing to it in the first place - but QI had it coming all along, and no one to blame but them selves.

Personally, I didn't buy tickets for July 2012 FLR-CPH with QI around a month ago. (And I see now that the decision was correct). Why? Well: 1) Those who could have been leaving the airline for the past 1-2 years, including a former colleague of mine - they new this couldn't last. 2) From another source: The boss of the media agency that served QI had warned his own employees not to buy QI tickets (!!), because of financial "problems". 3) A contact of mine at a financial services provider said that they had stopped all cooperation with QI because of problems with their cash flow.

By the way, a week ago or so, a few days before the bankruptcy was official, QI had problems paying their employees their April salary, which was delayed by a day until they had money from Kiev (this was in an article on Takeoff.nu).

Sad to see QI go - especially now that they had announced that they were going back to to their former core business, that had served them well for many years. But too late.

Kevin777
"I was waiting for you at DFW, but you must have been in LUV" CPH-HAM-CPH CR9
 
copenhagenboy
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Sat May 05, 2012 12:04 am

Tomorrow Cimber will start to fly the routes they had contract with SAS to operate, with 4 jets CRJ200,
 
reifel
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Sat May 05, 2012 10:10 am

Quoting Quokkas (Reply 9):
CimberSterling operated flights on behalf of SAS on some routes, for example some of the flights between CPH - HAM. Presumably anyone who had purchased a ticket with an SK code would not be losing any money. But what about the flights themselves. Will SK be able to introduce their own metal or will the flights be terminated?

Yesterday we had guests booked on CPH-HAM (I work for a tour operator). The flight is sold by SK but operated by QI on wetlease basis. The seats are not sold by QI directly IIRC. Therefore SK just put an own aircraft and flew the route themselves yesterday... The guest was not even knowing he was suppose to fly a QI operated flight in first place...
 
LH506
Posts: 246
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Sat May 05, 2012 10:18 am

What will happen to CPH-HAJ? Will it be flown by SK? What aircraft will they use?
NOT FLOWN: 707 736/9 77L 788 300B2 300B4 345 359 RJ70/146-100 F27 ATR72 CRJ1/4/10 E120/135/40 Q1/2/3 M87
 
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Dahlgardo
Posts: 169
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RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Sat May 05, 2012 6:31 pm

Quoting LH506 (Reply 22):
What will happen to CPH-HAJ? Will it be flown by SK? What aircraft will they use?

As mentioned above, 4 Cimber CRJs have already been put back into service to continue operations for SAS on a wet-lease basis. This is a temporary agreement between SAS and the administers of the Cimber bankrupcy estate which will initially last for a couple of weeks. After that SAS will look for a more permanent solution.
leave your nines at home and bring your skills to the battle
 
md80forum
Posts: 147
Joined: Fri May 28, 1999 4:12 am

RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Sun May 06, 2012 3:46 pm

Unconfirmed info says Flybe Nordic would take up CPH to Aalborg, Billund, Karup, Sønderborg and Bornholm. They already do Stockholm BMA on ATR equipment. Flybe Nordic is a joint venture owned by Flybe and Finnair.

http://11oceans.net/?p=2835
 
CPHFF
Posts: 149
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2011 11:03 am

RE: CimberSterling Bankrupt!

Thu May 10, 2012 3:37 pm

Well, fares for CPH-Prague just jumped up 2-fold. Rountrip fares with CSA are now over €400, which is expensive in Y. I flew with them 5 weeks ago, and payed € 200 with very few restrictions. Supply and demand I guess. I hope Nowegian will increase the frequency on this route so the prices can come down again. Prague is no longer bookable on SK's website either, not even through a Star Alliance partner.

I had the displeasure of flying Cimber's ATR's CPH-HAM and CPH-LCY and it was terrible. The cabin crew was as bad as the aircraft them selves. No food or snacks available for purchase, even though it was the 1st flights our of CPH in the morning. "I have Coffee, take it or leave it" was the answer us breakfast hungry passengers got.

Quoting AirPacific747 (Reply 13):
don't understand why he bought them to start with.. seems like they finally had a good plan though by getting rid of the 737s and focusing on the domestic market just like in the good old days..

Now his entire investment has been wasted, but I guess he had just lost faith in the airline which is understandable.. from what I hear, AeroSvit is not doing too well either..

I couldn't agree more. I have a colleague who was working for Sterling when they whent belly-up. They were all shocked that Cimber treid to make a money-losing operation profitable. It was too far gone to even "cherry pick" (she says).
:D Never underestimate the power of ignorance

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