SailorOrion
Topic Author
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BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 9:31 am

According to the AP, the opening date of the "new" Berlin airport will slip by several weeks, apparently due to problems with the fire protection equipment. How embarrassing ...

SailorOrion

[Edited 2012-05-08 04:06:59 by SA7700]
 
vfw614
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 9:32 am

At this point, this is just a rumour published by Germany's largest tabloid. There will be an official press conference at 1 pm.
 
NoUFO
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 9:33 am

No, it is not just a tabloid. It is AP as the OP has stated, and FAZ reports it too.
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Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 9:42 am

Yes, it's official. Several weeks delayedbecause of unfinished fire protection installations in the terminal building.

That's a mere disaster. Now, just at the amount of re-organization/rescheduling of the overnight move from TXL to BER (staff, ground vehicles etc.) that needs to be done now...

And the costs... Tax money it will be, I guess. What about the airlines? How is this organized? How much will AB/LH lose just because there won't be a working hub airport by 3 June? What about pax who are already booked on connecting flights? TXL just cannot handle connections!!!

What a catastrophe.

edit: and what's more, there is just no definite new opening date, it's just "several weeks later". Incredible.

edit: There will be a press conference this afternoon, at 13:00 local time. Also, the Tagesspiegel newspaper reported about the problems with the fire protection earlier.:

BER To Open With Provisorial "Tent Terminal" (by Tobias2702 Apr 21 2012 in Civil Aviation)?threadid=5444926&searchid=5447600&s=tent+terminal#ID5447600

[Edited 2012-05-08 02:49:08]

[Edited 2012-05-08 02:54:23]
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
vfw614
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 9:47 am

Until a few minutes ago, they were all reporting based on a "breaking news" published by BILD at 11 am.

However, in the meantime, there has been independent confirmation from within government sources.
 
Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 9:51 am

The problems seems to be that the smoke venting system in the terminal building isn't working properly, which is why the operating allowance is deied because of the obvious safety concerns.

Here, this gives you an impression on what needs to be reorganized on the passenger side alone...
http://preview.berlin-airport.de/en/...xf/important-information/index.php

As someone who was born in Berlin and spent so much time there, I can only say that I'm ashamed of the city. This will affect travellers/companies worldwide!

[Edited 2012-05-08 02:56:41]
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
vfw614
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 9:56 am

No, from what I can gather from the most recent press articles, the airport was unable to submit proper documentation so that the terminal could not be cleared for operations.

http://www.tagesspiegel.de/berlin/sc...d-platzeck-stinksauer/6604068.html
 
Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:00 am

Quoting vfw614 (Reply 6):
the airport was unable to submit proper documentation so that the terminal could not be cleared for operations.

But that's unthinkable. If all systems worked as they should, submitting the proper papers cannot be a matter of weeks (as stated above, the problems were known at least since mid-April).

As I read the article, the problems with the venting system are so huge that the airport wasn't able to schedule the needed acceptance test. "Some parts of work properly, but there is a failure with the system as a whole".

[Edited 2012-05-08 03:02:55]
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
TheSonntag
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:01 am

On a positive note, it shows that the government is independant and working. Since we already had several people killed in a DUS fire in 1996, better to do it right.
 
vfw614
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:03 am

Quoting Tobias2702 (Reply 7):
But that's unthinkable. If all systems worked as they should, submitting the proper papers cannot be a matter of weeks (as stated above, the problems were known at least since mid-April).

Apparently it was. I am just telling you what the Tagesspiegel write, a very respected broad-sheet.
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:07 am

I just happened to see the information of the new airport opening delay via der spiegel.

http://www.spiegel.de/reise/aktuell/...g-im-juni-verschoben-a-831989.html

Article in German. I had to use the reverso online translation.

I hope all those who had booked your travel can get refunds/reschedulings.

 
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:08 am

Quoting vfw614 (Reply 9):
pparently it was. I am just telling you what the Tagesspiegel write, a very respected broad-sheet.

Sorry, maybe I got you wrong here. I read your post as if the airport had forgotten to submit the necessary papers. As I read the (indeed respectable newspaper) article, the airport just wasn't able to apply for the acceptance test because the whole installation is f***ed up.

Maybe we should return to discussing my original questions about howe Air Berlin, Lufthansa, other airlines, airport employees, public transport systems (bus/railroad lines were to be ceased/opened) etc. will re-organize that mess.
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
cedarjet
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:08 am

Air Events have a special "last flight out of TXL" on June 2, glad I didn't book pricey (yet non-changeable) BA LHR-TXL and SXF-LHR flights yet. Hope it works out - but TXL is such a unique, friendly, historic airport, any reprieve, even a couple of weeks, is A Good Thing.
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:16 am

Rumors according to Tagesspiegel are that the press conference at 13:00 won't give a new opeing date. That means, the opening of BER is postponed indefinitely. "Hopes are to open the new airport after the summer, but still in 2012".

This is such a disaster. Airlines/Airport Employers etc. just need a date for the planning. Huge losses feared especially for AB/LH. Heck, pax are already booked on BER connections, which won't be possible given the current TXL layout.

LH planned to increase its presence in Berlin, stationing several a/c in BER. At TXL, there just won't be any space. This non-opeing is unprecedented in an "otherwise properly run" country, I suppose?
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
vfw614
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:19 am

The airport must open in 2012. As far as I know, TXL will be without a licence from Jan 1. 2013 and this cannot be changed easily. My guess is that they will open with effect winter schedule.
 
Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:24 am

What I am hearing is that it will be impossible for airlines to operate according to schedule from 3 June if BER is not open.

I'm still trying to get an overview about the multitude of catastrophic problems this non-opening creates. For example, without BER operational, maintenance schedules have to be redone because there won't be any aircraft around at the hangars...

AB opened its BER hangar yesterday: http://www.airberlin.com/en-DE/site/pressnews_dr.php?ID=3858&LANG=eng

[Edited 2012-05-08 03:31:16]
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
PanHAM
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:33 am

Quoting TheSonntag (Reply 8):
On a positive note, it shows that the government is independant and working. Since we already had several people killed in a DUS fire in 1996, better to do it right.

The governmen is not independent. The laws they have put in place mandate such things. The reason is that the terminal building, the fire protection system etc. will , at the present stage, not be certified by TUEV. Without that certification the airport cannot open. Whoever would override that would be personally liable if something happens. Haven't we good laws in his country?

Now, why doesn't surprise me this breaking news? I would have won another bet.

And the Berlin Mayor said, just about 2 weeks, ago, of course it will open on time. After all, we have decided that it will open.

See above......and welcome again to Posemuckel.
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fn1001
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:40 am

Quoting Tobias2702 (Reply 13):
This non-opeing is unprecedented in an "otherwise properly run" country, I suppose?

This is no more the Federal Republic of Germany, as it was 25 years ago, it is new Germany, including the former GDR and a bunch of manpower from the eastern part of Europe. Unfortunately the quality and reliability of the products and services has declined dramatically in the last decades.

Long time ago, the label "Made in Germany", was something more valuable than today ISO9001 or other labels. Today they build a new runway in FRA and use it only for departures (in contradiction to the german phrase, which describes the mentality quite good: "keine halben Sahen machen" - don't do things by halves).
Mai bine să-ţi fie rău decît să-ţi pară rău.
 
aloges
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:46 am

Quoting aloges:
It's about airports in Berlin. Logic does not apply.  

BER To Open With Provisorial "Tent Terminal" (by Tobias2702 Apr 21 2012 in Civil Aviation)

I'm trying hard to suppress quite a lot of hysterical laughter... that is one clusterfuck accomplished, I suppose.   

It is of course a shame that thousands of passengers will have to change their travel plans, but on the huge cake of utterly bonkers aviation policy Made in Berlin (and Brandenburg), this is the icing... anyway, they can always turn the unused terminal into a Tropical Island in case it never does get certified.  

Quoting FN1001 (Reply 17):
Today they build a new runway in FRA and use it only for departures

Ummm... sorry, but that runway was built in the early 80s.

[Edited 2012-05-08 03:50:55]
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
PanHAM
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:49 am

Quoting FN1001 (Reply 17):
FRA and use it only for departures (in contradiction to the german phrase, which describes the mentality quite good: "keine halben Sahen machen" - don't do things by halves).

basically you are right, but we had half a runway for starting saircarft., so we needed the other half for landings here. Makes one now.

The problem is not the industry, which powers hout high quality goods. The prolem are the politicdians who have no clue what they are doing but cave in to each pressure group made up of people who do not know at all what they are doing and what the consequences can be.

BER is a mis-conception from the beginning, that mis-conception includs the closure of the other 2 airports. I hope they can keep TXL open until the new one is ready, because it might be law that TXL has to close June 3trd.

If that happens Germany would be laughing stock all over the world and I would alugh MFAO
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padster
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 10:52 am

http://www.n24.de/news/newsitem_7906945.html now suggests that it could be as long as September to sort out the problem with the ventilation...

sounds like a major problem for all the airlines who were launching new routes from BER ... can TXL cope ?
 
Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:00 am

Quoting padster (Reply 20):
sounds like a major problem for all the airlines who were launching new routes from BER ... can TXL cope ?

As I stated above, TXL alone is not able to hold the BER-scheduled upright:

**not enough facilities for connecting pax (AB connecions might be possible, but LH/Star connecting passengers will face near-impossible conditions). Same for AB-oneworld connections.

**not enough runway capacities to cater for the increased flight numbers of LH/AB

**TXL curfew is 23:00-06:00, BER is 00:00-05:00

**Not enough ramp space at TXL for the aircraft AB/LH plan to station at BER

Quoting vfw614 (Reply 14):
As far as I know, TXL will be without a licence from Jan 1. 2013 and this cannot be changed easily.

You are right.

[Edited 2012-05-08 04:10:06]

[Edited 2012-05-08 04:15:09]
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
aloges
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:04 am

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 19):
If that happens Germany would be laughing stock all over the world and I would alugh MFAO

You aren't already?

Quoting padster (Reply 20):
can TXL cope ?

short answer: not at all

long answer: Its capacity is 12 million passengers per year. It served 16.919.820 in 2011. Fortunately, I haven't had the misfortune of flying through there for years, but the last time it happened, TXL was a mess of long and confusing walks, pedestrian tunnels and terminals that would at best be called shacks elsewhere (Terminal C). Finally, there isn't even any sort of rail link to the place. BER was originally supposed to open late last year, which explains the neglect... well, together with Berlin's debt and the anti-airport policies of the governing parties it does.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:18 am

Berlin Mayor at press conference: So far, no definite new opening date will be given, negotiations with airport holding needed here (new opening planned for "after the summer vacacions"). Decision to be done during the next days.

Governors of Berlin and Brandenburg "furious" that the situation was not recognized/admitted earlier. This will be investigated, of course. Both claim, that there will be no flight disruptions.
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
something
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:20 am

German's are a peculiar people. They can move the temples of Abu Simbel, but they can't build Hamburg's Elbphilharmonie nor open a tiny airport it seems.

This is indescribably embarrassing, but if we're being honest to ourselves, comes to the surprise of the fewest.
..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
 
PanHAM
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:22 am

Quoting aloges (Reply 22):
You aren't already?

I am indeed. When this clown Wowi replied to the reporter about 2 weeks ago (while visiting BER) that of course they will open because they have a resolution that it opens, I had mxy doubts.

I wonder what the press conferenjce will bring, unfortunately I am traveölling and cannpot hear or live stream it.
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Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:25 am

Quoting something (Reply 24):
a tiny airport it seems.

27 Million pax/year and hub of a oneworld member airline is not exaclty what I would call tiny.

But anyway, are there any statements from LH/AB yet? The press conference had only politicians and construction planners.
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
aloges
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:26 am

Quoting something (Reply 24):
They can move the temples of Abu Simbel, but they can't build Hamburg's Elbphilharmonie nor open a tiny airport it seems.

It's usually when political prestige (or that of engineers) takes precedence over safety margins and economic/ecologic sense that people mess up like this. In that respect, we aren't any different from any other people.

But we still build all the nice cars that you island dwellers buy.   
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
AIR MALTA
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:28 am

It is amazing how nobody has learned from the LHR T5 fiasco. If you intend to open an airport to replace 2 others, better do it in stages and not all at once.
Next flights : BRU-ZRH-CAI (LX)/ BRU-FCO-TLV (AZ)
 
smbukas
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:28 am

It is really a huge mess.

Now it is a turn for AB and LH to decide what to do with announced huge numbers of new routes/frequencies and what to do with a passengers who already booked flights.
 
aloges
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:29 am

Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:30 am

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 25):
I am indeed. When this clown Wowi replied to the reporter about 2 weeks ago (while visiting BER) that of course they will open because they have a resolution that it opens, I had mxy doubts.

I wonder what the press conferenjce will bring, unfortunately I am traveölling and cannpot hear or live stream it.

It's already over, nothing really new. No new opeing date so far. According to radio correspondent, Mr Schwarz, the BER airport manager, was -- as of last week-- honestly very optimistic and confident that the opening date would hold. Today, he "looks shocked, taken aback, a picture of misery". Maybe, indeed it was hoped to get the problems fixed up in time.
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
aloges
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:34 am

Quoting AIR MALTA (Reply 28):
If you intend to open an airport to replace 2 others

BER will replace 3 other airports when it finally gets round to opening: THF, TXL and SXF. In its final days, scheduled traffic at THF was a small operation, but it did have considerable GA traffic.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
vfw614
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:34 am

Quoting Tobias2702 (Reply 31):
It's already over,

It is not. I am still watching it...
 
Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:37 am

Also, the non-opening of BER / non-closure of TXL means an ATC problem as the regulations concerning the then-valid flight paths are worthless now.
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
CXfirst
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:49 am

Sad news, I looked into booking tickets in June to BER to see the new airport (and a short trip to the city), glad I didn't. Now, I'll wait to a more final date.

Although I did have a little chuckle. Seeing how people here (and other forums) have mentioned that the German's will not make a mistake like the British at LHR T5. How that backfired.

-CXfirst
 
deltamartin
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:49 am

Very weird situation. Let's see what happens to my scheduled (short) connection at BER on June 17th with AB, I guess we'll have to go via TXL instead.

[Edited 2012-05-08 04:50:20]
 
N14AZ
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 11:57 am

Quoting Tobias2702 (Reply 3):
And the costs... Tax money it will be, I guess.
Quoting Tobias2702 (Reply 23):
This will be investigated, of course.

Pheew, I don't want to be in the shoes of the Consulting Engineer or in the shoes of the Contractor for the ventilation system. For sure there is a financial damage and they will make these two parties reliable. Aaah, and just for the record: the Client is never ever wrong. If something goes wrong it's the mistake of the designer or the contractors or both of them. As they say "When the sh... hits the fan"....   
 
NoUFO
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 12:01 pm

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 25):
When this clown Wowi replied to the reporter about 2 weeks ago (while visiting BER) that of course they will open because they have a resolution that it opens, I had mxy doubts.

To be honest, the major can only echo what those responsible have told him.

Quoting something (Reply 24):
They can move the temples of Abu Simbel, but they can't build Hamburg's Elbphilharmonie nor open a tiny airport it seems.

Well yes, how's your terminal 5 working by now?   
I support the right to arm bears
 
LOWS
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 12:25 pm

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 37):
As they say "When the sh... hits the fan"....   

When it hits the non-functioning ventilation system...

:D
  
 
Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 12:32 pm

According to Tagesspiegel, BER airport has now confirmed that there were also problems with the test runs. So, it seems like the smoke venting system is not the only headache for the airport managers.

"On last Thursday, a test run had to be aborted three times because of massive problems: door openers and other switches did not work properly, the baggage delivery system broke down and several check-in counters crashed.

Lufthansa seems to try to reschedule everything to TXL. IMO this will be impossible -- if I recall correctly, LH will operate 7 more a/c out of BER than currently out of TXL, and as I stated before:

There is just no free ramp space available at TXL.

Therefore, LH might even be hit harder than AB. AB planned to move its business from TXL to BER, with a slight increase in routes/frequencies. LH, on the other hand, planned to massively grow overnight in Berlin. For them, the SXF-business of Germanwings is to be merged with the TXL mainline business. This won't work now.

[Edited 2012-05-08 05:50:11]
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 12:45 pm

First official press relase of AB (so far, German only):

They won't be able to operate as scheduled, because the waves of arriving/departing aircraft were designed according to the new facilities of BER airport. The next days will clarify how AB will cope with the situation.

http://www.airberlin.com/site/pressnews_dr.php?ID=3860&LANG=deu
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
Logos
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 1:00 pm

Now saying that the 3rd of August is the new proposed opening date. Quite a disaster for this already much-delayed project. Maybe I can sneak one more flight into Tegel after all.

http://www.bz-berlin.de/service/flug...erst-im-august-article1450936.html

(Article in German - sorry for those who don't speak it).

Cheers,
Dave in Orlando
Too many types flown to list
 
Tobias2702
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 1:05 pm

Quoting Logos (Reply 42):
Now saying that the 3rd of August is the new proposed opening date.

As I read the source, it only states that the new opening date will be AFTER 3 August, which is when the school holidays end, and which corresponds to what was said during the press conference.

[Edited 2012-05-08 06:08:38]
PA, AF, UK, BA, AB, DL, LH, FR, BD, A3, EZY, DY //// A319/320/346, B733/735/73G/738/744/763, AT4, 146, CR2, DH4
 
Logos
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 1:11 pm

Quoting Tobias2702 (Reply 43):
As I read the source, it only states that the new opening date will be AFTER 3 August, which is when the school holidays end, and which corresponds to what was said during the press conference.

You're right - serves me right for going with just the headline from the B-Z and a cursory reading of the the first couple of paragraphs.

Cheers,
Dave in Orlando
Too many types flown to list
 
Burkhard
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 1:26 pm

Quoting FN1001 (Reply 17):
Today they build a new runway in FRA and use it only for departures (in contradiction to the german phrase, which describes the mentality quite good: "keine halben Sahen machen" - don't do things by halves).

The new runway is used for landings only, not for departures, and since there is one runway for departures only, fully busy, this makes sense.

But this said, to be honest I didn't expect anything else but chaos. Berlin is a black hole for money earned in the rest of Germany. Now another round of this daily farce of a so called city...
 
something
Posts: 1239
Joined: Fri May 13, 2011 5:29 pm

RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 1:30 pm

Quoting aloges (Reply 27):
But we still build all the nice cars that you island dwellers buy.

Actually, I drive a Japanese car for its reliability more than anything else.

Quoting NoUFO (Reply 38):
Quoting something (Reply 24):
They can move the temples of Abu Simbel, but they can't build Hamburg's Elbphilharmonie nor open a tiny airport it seems.

Well yes, how's your terminal 5 working by now?

Not the point. German engineering enjoys the best reputation throughout the world and it's held to different standards. When you're at the top, people will scrutinize your every move. Kanye West has a few songs on the matter.

Such a dilettantish mess up tarnishes an immaculate record and does greater damage than just the financial losses to the airport and airlines, in the same sense that Airbus' A380 issues have cost them a great deal of credibility - with the caveat that the competition isn't any better. But Germany isn't Italy.. yet.
..sick of it. -K. Pilkington.
 
captaincrackers
Posts: 91
Joined: Fri May 21, 2010 12:46 pm

RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 1:49 pm

Quoting Burkhard (Reply 45):
But this said, to be honest I didn't expect anything else but chaos. Berlin is a black hole for money earned in the rest of Germany. Now another round of this daily farce of a so called city...

To be fair, Germany's recent history has been dotted with a variety of farcical episodes that don't involve Berlin. Corruption, incompetence, failure, you name it. Perhaps we as a community could broaden our horizons to consider that Berlin has seen plenty of successes over the past 20 years and its involvement in any given matter does not automatically lead to that matter's complete and utter demise at the expense of the ever-high-and-mighty rest of Germany.
 
r2rho
Posts: 2439
Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 10:13 pm

RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 2:00 pm

Somehow I am not surprised...  
Quoting Tobias2702 (Reply 3):
What about the airlines? How is this organized? How much will AB/LH lose just because there won't be a working hub airport by 3 June? What about pax who are already booked on connecting flights? TXL just cannot handle connections!!!

The question is, how many of the new ops had AB / LH really scheduled to start from day 1 of the airport opening? Or had they planned a gradual move (shift existing ops first, then grow). If it is a significant amount then they were too optimistic... while it is not their fault, the risk of a delay in the opening was well known...

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 19):
I hope they can keep TXL open until the new one is ready, because it might be law that TXL has to close June 3trd. If that happens Germany would be laughing stock all over the world and I would alugh MFAO

Such a situation should hopefully be impossible, but applying the "logic" of the Berlin airport "strategy", I would not be surprised if it did happen.
 
Burkhard
Posts: 1916
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RE: BER Opening Postponed

Tue May 08, 2012 2:03 pm

You may have a very nice wide broad view of the things from so far away, but from inside Germany, if you ever have to do with any institution based in Berlin, starting with Deutsche Rentenversicherung which loose all of your documents every three years and then require you to send them again and again, the experience will be different.

Berlin still is full of little dictators who do not understand their work as service, but as "Obrigkeit", which can never fail, no matter how wrong they are - that explains to me that it is typical that such a mess is not acknowledged and worked on in time. Most institutions I had contact with in Berlin still feel like they are in Kaiserzeit, if they have an office in Bonn better contact that office. When I see how much money still is going to Berlin, how the infrastructure in Western Germany is falling apart with no money left for maintenance here while luxury temples are build there, you might see my point.