United Airline
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VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 4:53 am

When will VS take delivery of the A380? I suppose they will put them on routes like LHR-JFK, LHR-NRT? What about LHR-HKG-SYD? I suppose this is also on the cards?

VS went double daily for LHR-HKG for sometime. Will they resume the second daily flight anytime soon?
 
richcandy
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 5:10 am

Hi

I would guess that LGW-MCO has to be near the top of the list. (Long haul leisure destination were a range of departure times is not such an issue and they currently operate a number of departures per day)

LHR-NRT & LHR-HKG-SYD flights are currently operated by 340's if capacity was an issue would VS not upgrade them to a 744?

LHR-JFK is also possible

Alex
 
United Airline
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 6:19 am

Quoting richcandy (Reply 1):
LHR-NRT & LHR-HKG-SYD flights are currently operated by 340's if capacity was an issue would VS not upgrade them to a 744?

VS once put the B 747-400 on the HKG-LHR route back in 2001/2002. They really should upgrade it to a B 747-400 or even an A380
 
qf002
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 7:03 am

I'd have thought a second daily flight to HKG would be the better option, once the 787's arrive probably.

No way can VS fill an A380 on the HKG-SYD leg, nor would they want to given the poor utilisation that having a plane sat in SYD all day creates.
 
scouseflyer
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 7:05 am

I believe that VS are currently scheduled to receive their first one "some time in 2015" after deferring twice but IIRC there was a report that along with IT VS are the only airline who don't have well defined schedule for their A380s meaning that they may never get them but we'll see.

I would expect to see the A380s move round on their busiest holiday routes to MCO would be hgih on that list.
 
ZK-NBT
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 7:10 am

Quoting scouseflyer (Reply 4):
I would expect to see the A380s move round on their busiest holiday routes to MCO would be hgih on that list.

I would have thought they would be Premium configured and used from LHR exclusivly myself not that I know to much about VS.

LHR-LAX
LHR-JFK
LHR-JNB
 
MAH4546
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 7:13 am

Quoting richcandy (Reply 1):
I would guess that LGW-MCO has to be near the top of the list. (Long haul leisure destination were a range of departure times is not such an issue and they currently operate a number of departures per day)

It's not. The plan is to have the A380s in a very premium layout and based at Heathrow.
a.
 
sevenheavy
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 7:52 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 6):
It's not. The plan is to have the A380s in a very premium layout and based at Heathrow

Indeed. MCO MIGHT be a candidate further down the line, but initially look for NYC, LAX, SFO, possibly MIA and JNB.

Pretty much the existing LHR B744 routes.

MCO capacity is possibly better served by varying frequency due to the highly seasonal demand patterns. A couple of A380s would be perfect for about 12 weeks of the year, but VS currently vary their schedule, so that anything from 2 to 5 daily flights operate to MCO.
So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
 
scouseflyer
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 8:33 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 6):

It's not. The plan is to have the A380s in a very premium layout and based at Heathrow.

Ooops so my speculation was the exact opposite of the actual plan, please ignore me! 
 
qf002
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 8:42 am

Given that the LGW 744's are currently being updated, I wouldn't expect to see them replaced with anything this decade.
 
Pe@rson
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 8:46 am

Quoting United Airline (Reply 2):
VS once put the B 747-400 on the HKG-LHR route back in 2001/2002. They really should upgrade it to a B 747-400 or even an A380

Why? Because you'd like to see one?!

If VS thought they should and could (e.g. from the ability to swap), I'm sure they would.

[Edited 2012-05-14 01:59:06]
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
sevenheavy
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 8:54 am

Quoting United Airline (Reply 2):
VS once put the B 747-400 on the HKG-LHR route back in 2001/2002. They really should upgrade it to a B 747-400 or even an A380

This was only for a while post 9/11 when Transatlantic traffic fell through the floor. It did ok at the time but it would be a nightmare with the SYD tag on, as you would either lose almost the entire LHR B744 fleet, or have two different types operating the service.
So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
 
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qfvhoqa
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 8:57 am

I still doubt they need such a large plane. Not many of their routes need year round service of an A380.

JFK, LAX, JNB seem likely candidates. NRT, PVG & HKG less so. HKG is more likely to receive service if VS drops the SYD leg and leaves it to VA.
 
migair54
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 12:50 pm

I think first destination will be JFK, because with one aircraft they can offer daily rotation, but not to LAX and JNB... and after I think they will go to JNB, because AF and LH already does, and I guess BA will do sooner than later, so they need to reach that level as well to avoid losing more premium customers.

HKG I think they will add a second daily, it´s much better for pax and also for cargo uplift, a very good business in HKG for almost any airline.

MCO, problem is that using such a expensive plane for holiday makers willing to pay the cheapers fares is not a good idea... unless you configure with lot of economy seat like Air Austral plans to do. So I don´t think that happening soon.
 
mercure1
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 3:40 pm

It seems this question come up last month. Long discussion in this thread.

VS & The A380 (by mikey72 Apr 14 2012 in Civil Aviation)
 
skipness1E
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 3:43 pm

Surely they are intended for LHR-EDI when SRB tackles the big bad BA monopoly?
Seriously, they don't show much sign of taking delivery so speculation now would be pretty pointless as they're at least three years away, if they ever take them at all.
 
Gingersnap
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 4:47 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 6):
It's not. The plan is to have the A380s in a very premium layout and based at Heathrow.

Which says to me VS are only using the A380 as some kind of "bragging rights". Shame they're many years late for that party.

They could easily consolidate the two MCO flights out of LGW into a single A380, especially if loads begin to drop off on the low season. The issue is they don't want to be seen as using their most "prestigious" aircraft on the bucket & spade leisure routes. The LHR centric attitude doesn't always work and I fear it may be the same situation here.

But still I suspect the 380 will find it's way to LGW fairly soon.
Flown on: A306 A319/20/21 A332 B732/3/4/5/7/8 B742/4 B752 B762/3 B772/W C152 E195 F70/100 MD-82 Q400
 
sevenheavy
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 5:23 pm

Quoting gingersnap (Reply 16):

Please name me an A380 operator that isn't using the aircraft on "premium routes" .

LH ? SQ ? QF ? Etc.

Do you know any that are operating, or planning to operate on leisure routes?

VS will do the same as everyone else.....deploy them where they will make the most money. Nothing to do with bragging rights  
So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
 
migair54
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 6:22 pm

Quoting sevenheavy (Reply 17):
Please name me an A380 operator that isn't using the aircraft on "premium routes" .

LH ? SQ ? QF ? Etc.

Do you know any that are operating, or planning to operate on leisure routes?

Not now, but there wil be... as I said... Air Austral, Skymark... and EK will configure some of them with big economy configuration.
 
airbazar
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 6:43 pm

Quoting sevenheavy (Reply 17):
Do you know any that are operating, or planning to operate on leisure routes?

Yes but it depends on what you call a "leisure route". NYC is the biggest tourist destination in the US. Are all routes to JFK leisure routes? Some routes are more leisure to some airlines than to others. I think it's fair to say that Air Austral and Skymark will operate their A380's on leisure routes although their business model may not necessarily be all leisure. Also other airlines have denser Y cabins in their A380's which in some way indicate that leisure customers are a big part of their business as well. AF and TG for example have nearly 450 Y seats compared to KE with only 300 Y seats. We may not think of JFK as a leisure route but I guarantee you that AF would not be flying an A380 with 450 Y seats into JFK if leisure customers wasn't a big part of that route for them.
 
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readytotaxi
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 6:44 pm

I thought Virgin were now using the A330-300 on the LGW-MAN-MCO routes, config W59 Y255, or not all the time?
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
 
lhcvg
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 6:49 pm

Quoting migair54 (Reply 18):
Air Austral, Skymark... and EK will configure some of them with big economy configuration.

Wasn't the EK the one who supposedly claimed a few years back that the 380 would allow them to offer $200 transatlantic fares?
 
sevenheavy
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 8:49 pm

Quoting migair54 (Reply 18):
Not now, but there wil be... as I said... Air Austral, Skymark... and EK will configure some of them with big economy configuration.
Quoting airbazar (Reply 19):
Yes but it depends on what you call a "leisure route". NYC is the biggest tourist destination in the US. Are all routes to JFK leisure routes?

Granted, I've said all along that IF VS gets A380's, I wouldn't be surprised to see them on MCO routes eventually. I appreciate that alm ost all flights have some component of leisure flights - VS's NYC/SFO/LAX routes are full of leisure travellers.

The difference is that these routes also have enough business demand to warrant fairly low density, high premium configurations. VS do have these kind of routes, and they are where the A380s will be deployed to first. Apart from anythign else, the big corporate clients will not be happy if VS send an A380 to MCO every day whilst they are stuck on a 20 year old B744!

UK - MCO is at the extreme end of the leisure market. Business travel is a tiny fraction of the market. There is definately an increasing demand for Premium Economy in particular, and to a lessor extent, Upper class but its nothing like JFK, JNB or LAX.

Put in context, an A380 flying for VS to MCO would likely have around 600 economy seats! A possible config would be something like J18 W 84 Y588. Thats higher density by a considerable margin than anything we'we seen so far.

I have never said the A380 won't go to MCO, but it won't go there first....
So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 9:37 pm

I bet they don't take any A380s.
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
antonovman
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 9:58 pm

Quoting SInGAPORE_AIR (Reply 23):
I bet they don't take any A380s.

I agree with you SlnGAPORE
I think they will make up some tale blaming the whole fiasco of not getting A380's because of some trumped up "dirty trick" which British Airways had played on them. Then they will go back to being the "poor little virgin that BA keeps kicking"
 
skipness1E
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 10:30 pm

The Beach Fleet has 14 Upper Class seats in a B744. The remainder is Y and Y+.
Extrapolate that level of J class to an A380 and fill the rest of the seats as Y and you get something you can only make money on during school holidays. There are 15 aircraft in this fleet, 13 B744s and 2 A333s, the only route suitable for the A388 is LGW-MCO. For everything else, the B744 is almost uncomfortably big, however they get by with double drops on LGW-ANU/BGI/UVF out of season and the A333 has gone onto MAN-MCO.

The A388 is not suitable for this market, it's just too big.
 
Gingersnap
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Mon May 14, 2012 11:16 pm

Quoting sevenheavy (Reply 17):
Please name me an A380 operator that isn't using the aircraft on "premium routes" .

I understand that and I take it on board.

However Orlando had around 633,000 pax out of LGW in 2011, whichever way you look at it is a lot of pax.

There is huge competition on routes out of LHR to JFK, LAX, ORD etc and I honestly don't believe VS could even potentially fill a 380 on those routes.
The last two flights I took with VS had terrible loads. 120 out, 89 back to BOS. This is one example sure and doesn't represent the entire spectrum.

It is just my uneducated guess that VS would be better off running the A380 on the MCO route, as I feel they would have a much better chance of filling the thing. Of course during low seasons you could switch the 380 back onto LHR routes, but then I understand we run into the problems of configuration. I'm sure VS know what they're going to do with it when they receive it, and I suspect they will be at LHR for the long term anyway.

[Edited 2012-05-14 16:17:29]
Flown on: A306 A319/20/21 A332 B732/3/4/5/7/8 B742/4 B752 B762/3 B772/W C152 E195 F70/100 MD-82 Q400
 
skipness1E
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Tue May 15, 2012 12:19 am

Quoting gingersnap (Reply 26):
I'm sure VS know what they're going to do with it when they receive it,

Count to ten and think about that for a moment.
Still sure?

I think a Virgin A388 has awesome potential, a true world beating potential to become the best airline on point to point out of LHR. I think a proper Upper Class product could be genuinely innovative and make BA raise its game again, my worry is that Virgin's best days may be behind them if they keep prevaricating. BA are going to have a fleet of A388s running out of LHR with a good product before Virgin get started, and it's not as if BA are a launch customer this time round.
 
JHCRJ700
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Tue May 15, 2012 12:55 am

Quoting richcandy (Reply 1):
I would guess that LGW-MCO has to be near the top of the list.

Didn't they get the A330's for this route?
RUSH
 
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readytotaxi
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Tue May 15, 2012 1:36 am

Just a thought, if VS were to use the A380 to MCO how about a LGW start, additional pick-up at MAN and then on to MCO, sure the leisure market would not mind that extra short hop and it would double the catchment area by 2.  
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
 
United Airline
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Tue May 15, 2012 3:36 am

Wonder if VS will put first class on the A380
 
qf002
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RE: VS's Potential A380 Routes?

Tue May 15, 2012 5:01 am

Quoting readytotaxi (Reply 20):
I thought Virgin were now using the A330-300 on the LGW-MAN-MCO routes, config W59 Y255, or not all the time?

These will have the new UCS fitted soon. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see them transferred to LHR once the LGW 744 refurbishments are done.

Quoting United Airline (Reply 30):
Wonder if VS will put first class on the A380

No way.

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