SCL767
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LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 1:15 pm

According to several sources, the Barcelona Air Route Development Committee (BARDC),

Quote:
is actively working with LAN and TAM to build direct routes with Santiago de Chile and other selected South American cities. The merger should help the LATAM network planning process.
LAN and TAM merger should make more easy for Barcelona to have direct routes

Also, LAN's Commercial Director for Europe, Pablo Ayala, recently mentioned that LAN is evaluating opening a direct route between SCL and BCN after LAN completes its merger with TAM:

Quote:
Lan estudia abrir un vuelo entre Barcelona y Santiago de Chile con tres frecuencias semanales que se uniría a las conexiones que ya oferta en España desde Madrid a Santiago, Quito y Lima, con 650 plazas diarias, según ha señalado Pablo Ayala, director comercial de Europa de Lan, en una entrevista con Preferente.
Lan aumentará plazas a Chile cuando termine su fusión con Tam

Intercontinental flights to grow at El Prat without Spanair:

Quote:
Mientras, otras compañías internacionales de primera fila como la chilena LAN se encuentran plenamente decididos a abrir una ruta directa entre la capital de su país y Barcelona, a medida que su fusión con la brasileña TAM se vaya concretando, según ha podido saber preferente.com de altos responsables de la mayor aerolínea de Chile.
La chilena LAN será la próxima tras Air Europa y Emirates
 
UALWN
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 1:32 pm

That would be great! I travel from BCN to SCL about once a year, now transiting through MAD. And I love LA, and pick it up every time over IB (alright, that's not saying much).
AT7/111/146/Avro/CRJ/CR9/EMB/ERJ/E75/F50/100/L15/DC9/D10/M8X/717/727/737/747/757/767/777/787/AB6/310/32X/330/340/380
 
RJ_Delta
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 5:16 pm

All depends of the B787 Dreamliners arrival and capacity reorganization with TAM after the merge. It could be a good alternative to increase LAN presence in Europe addign two destination: BCN and FCO while its partner TAM continues serving LHR, CDG, MAD, FRA and MXP.

Recently LAN receives for its Colombian' subsidiary the permission to fly three times per week from BOG to MAD and BCN.

Best Regards,
 
Summa767
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 5:26 pm

Quoting RJ_Delta (Reply 2):
Recently LAN receives for its Colombian' subsidiary the permission to fly three times per week from BOG to MAD and BCN.

LAN did absolutely *not* receive permission to fly to BCN, nor was such a request made. Aires (Lan Colombia) received *7* weekly frequencies to fly to MAD.
I know where you got the story from -with the wrong information in the first place- and I see that it still keeps spreading like wildfire..
 
RJ_Delta
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 5:42 pm

Quoting Summa767 (Reply 3):
LAN did absolutely *not* receive permission to fly to BCN, nor was such a request made. Aires (Lan Colombia) received *7* weekly frequencies to fly to MAD.

Ok thanks for the update. Portafolio was one of the source thats indicates that LAN Colombia received permission of the Aerocivil to fly three times per week to BCN and MAD.

Saludos,
 
Summa767
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 5:44 pm

Quoting RJ_Delta (Reply 4):
Ok thanks for the update. Portafolio was one of the source thats indicates that LAN Colombia received permission of the Aerocivil to fly three times per week to BCN and MAD.

Indeed, totally wrong info by Portafolio that hardly ever get anything right.
 
SCL767
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 6:11 pm

Quoting RJ_Delta (Reply 2):
All depends of the B787 Dreamliners arrival and capacity reorganization with TAM after the merge.

Hopefully both B-787-8s will arrive by October in order to increase flexibility in the fleet. LA and/or LP could open a new route to Europe with the A-343s or LA could transfer one or two A-343s over to LP in order to increase capacity on the LIM-MAD route. Also, since LAN Cargo will have a fleet of 4 B777Fs by the end of the year and TAM already operates the B77Ws; the B77W could be a very interesting option for LAN in the future since it could replace the A-343s on the SCL-AKL-SYD route.



Quoting RJ_Delta (Reply 2):
Recently LAN receives for its Colombian' subsidiary the permission to fly three times per week from BOG to MAD and BCN.

LAN Colombia should receive at least 2 new B-767-316ERs by Q4 to launch the BOG-MAD route.

Saludos
 
RJ_Delta
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 6:23 pm

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 6):
the B77W could be a very interesting option for LAN in the future since it could replace the A-343s on the SCL-AKL-SYD route

Yes specially when the B777 family received ETOPS 330 min. However at this moment LAN only consider the B787-9 as a replacement for the A343's fleet.

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 6):
LAN Colombia should receive at least 2 new B-767-316ERs by Q4 to launch the BOG-MAD route.

Yes, maybe in a near future. This year will receive nine B767-300ER to increase the fleet up to 38 aircraft including the retirement of two B763s (one has been retired: CC-CEB).

Regards,
 
SCL767
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 6:41 pm

Quoting RJ_Delta (Reply 7):

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 6):
LAN Colombia should receive at least 2 new B-767-316ERs by Q4 to launch the BOG-MAD route.

Yes, maybe in a near future. This year will receive nine B767-300ER to increase the fleet up to 38 aircraft including the retirement of two B763s (one has been retired: CC-CEB).

CC-CEB, (9Y-LGW) is still at Mexicana's MRO and Caribbean Airlines has yet to take delivery of it. With the other B763 being delivered to Caribbean Airlines as well, LAN should start to be receiving the new B-767-316ERs very soon since LAN is increasing frequencies on several routes from both SCL and LIM starting in July.
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 7:12 pm

Wouldn't it be more important for LAN to link SCL with LHR before BCN, considering the former is the more important OW/IAG hub currently lacking a nonstop flight to Chile?
confidence is silent. insecurities are loud.
 
SCL767
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 8:14 pm

Should LAN Airlines launch both SCL-BCN and SCL-FCO, LAN would link SCL with 4 destinations in Europe:
BCN, FCO, FRA, and MAD:


Thus, LATAM would serve 7 destinations in Europe including, BCN, CDG, FCO, FRA, LHR, MAD, and MXP:
 
LIPZ
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 8:25 pm

When do the 787s join LAN's fleet?
 
SCL767
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 8:31 pm

Quoting LIPZ (Reply 11):
When do the 787s join LAN's fleet?

The first B-787-8 should arrive in August and the second B-787-8 should arrive in October.
 
RJ_Delta
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Tue May 15, 2012 8:39 pm

Quoting LIPZ (Reply 11):
When do the 787s join LAN's fleet?

The first two Dreamliners will join into the fleet between August and October 2012.

Best Regards,
 
dumbell2424
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Wed May 16, 2012 12:56 am

Quoting SCL767 (Thread starter):
Quote:
Lan estudia abrir un vuelo entre Barcelona y Santiago de Chile con tres frecuencias semanales que se uniría a las conexiones que ya oferta en España desde Madrid a Santiago, Quito y Lima, con 650 plazas diarias, según ha señalado Pablo Ayala, director comercial de Europa de Lan, en una entrevista con Preferente.
Lan aumentará plazas a Chile cuando termine su fusión con Tam


Rough translation that I tried, for anyone who needs it:

LAN is studying to open a flight between Barcelona and Santiago, Chile with three weekly frequencies that would join the connections that they already offer in Spain from Madrid to Santiago, Quito, and Lima, with 650 seats daily, as noted by Paul Ayala, LAN's commercial director of Europe, in an interview with Preferente.

Quoting SCL767 (Thread starter):
Quote:
Mientras, otras compañías internacionales de primera fila como la chilena LAN se encuentran plenamente decididos a abrir una ruta directa entre la capital de su país y Barcelona, a medida que su fusión con la brasileña TAM se vaya concretando, según ha podido saber preferente.com de altos responsables de la mayor aerolínea de Chile.
La chilena LAN será la próxima tras Air Europa y Emirates

On the other hand, other leading international companies such as Chile's LAN are fully determined to open a direct route between the capital of their country and Barcelona, as it's merger with Brazil's TAM looks like a go, as senior management of Chile's largest airline has told preferente.com.
 
SCL767
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Wed May 16, 2012 2:39 am

Quoting dumbell2424 (Reply 14):
LAN is studying to open a flight between Barcelona and Santiago, Chile with three weekly frequencies that would join the connections that they already offer in Spain from Madrid to Santiago, Quito, and Lima, with 650 seats daily, as noted by Paul Ayala, LAN's commercial director of Europe, in an interview with Preferente.

LAN operates three daily flights to Europe:
LAN Airlines operates SCL-MAD-FRA daily (A-343-313X)
LAN Ecuador operates GYE-MAD daily (B-767-316ER)
LAN Perú operates LIM-MAD daily (B-767-316ER)
(LAN Colombia plans on launching a daily non-stop service between BOG and MAD in the near-term)

Quoting dumbell2424 (Reply 14):
On the other hand, other leading international companies such as Chile's LAN are fully determined to open a direct route between the capital of their country and Barcelona, as it's merger with Brazil's TAM looks like a go, as senior management of Chile's largest airline has told preferente.com.

The Barcelona Air Route Development Committee (BARDC), has held negotiations with various international carriers, including LAN, in order to launch intercontinental flights into BCN. EK will soon launch DXB-BCN. BCN would also like to increase its connectivity with South American cities. Currently, AR operates EZE-BCN, AV operates BOG-BCN, IB operates BCN-GRU, and SQ operates SIN-BCN-GRU. LAN Colombia wanted to operate a BOG-BCN service, but was not awarded any frequencies by Colombia's Aerocivil. International traffic at SCL is growing at a rapid pace and LAN would like to increase its competitiveness in the market by opening new international routes; especially after LAN concludes its combination with TAM.
 
SJOtoLIR
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Wed May 16, 2012 3:09 am

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 9):
Wouldn't it be more important for LAN to link SCL with LHR before BCN, considering the former is the more important OW/IAG hub currently lacking a nonstop flight to Chile?

LA SCL-MAD-FRA 7x weekly and IB MAD-SCL 7x weekly are concentrating the demand of passengers in Madrid exclusively.
The opening of BCN would diversify the traffic to Spain as it actually happens in Sao Paulo, Buenos Aires and Bogota, regarding the South American landscape.




.

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 15):
AR operates EZE-BCN, AV operates BOG-BCN, IB operates BCN-GRU, and SQ operates SIN-BCN-GRU. LAN Colombia wanted to operate a BOG-BCN service, but was not awarded any frequencies by Colombia's Aerocivil

These South American cities are already experiencing the dual service in Spain of deploying flights to both Madrid and Barcelona. Santiago de Chile may be forming part soon of this selected group.
I also expect a full code-share cooperation with IB on the intended LA SCL-BCN.




.

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 10):
Should LAN Airlines launch both SCL-BCN and SCL-FCO

Are you necessarily thinking on the 787 for such routes?



Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
 
SCL767
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Wed May 16, 2012 3:44 am

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 16):
LA SCL-MAD-FRA 7x weekly and IB MAD-SCL 7x weekly are concentrating the demand of passengers in Madrid exclusively.

That is a complete generalization. Many passengers do connect onto these services from domestic destinations in Chile and destinations such as BUE, COR and MDZ. Plus passengers also transit via MAD to other destinations. LAN offers a daily direct service between SCL and FRA. LAN also offers passengers traveling between LIM and FRA a daily connection via MAD on its own metal.

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 16):
These South American cities are already experiencing the dual service in Spain of deploying flights to both Madrid and Barcelona. Santiago de Chile may be forming part soon of this selected group.

Those destinations are not as far from Europe as Santiago's location. For example, the longest route in the AF/KL network is the CDG-SCL route.

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 16):
Are you necessarily thinking on the 787 for such routes?

It depends on the routing that LAN chooses to operate. Certain routes may operate via certain points in Brazil in-cooperation with TAM. Also, LAN could deploy the A-343 on the SCL-BCN route. However, the B-787-8 is obviously the best choice and the most economical one. The B-787s will enable LAN to launch new routes between its primary hubs at SCL and LIM and Europe without having to stop at MAD.
 
PHX787
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Wed May 16, 2012 4:23 am

I think it will be a good route, especially during football season! Just wait till LA gets the 787
Follow me on twitter: www.twitter.com/phx787
 
RCS763AV
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Wed May 16, 2012 10:54 am

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 15):
. LAN Colombia wanted to operate a BOG-BCN service, but was not awarded any frequencies by Colombia's Aerocivil.

If they wanted it so much, they should have asked for it, but alas, and as was mentioned before, they didn't. LAN only requested 10 weekly frequencies to MAD, and was awarded seven.

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 15):
BCN would also like to increase its connectivity with South American cities.

I'm sure in the near future improved connections will be available. AM will surely re-launch the route to MEX on the 787s if IB doesn't go for it first, and as well as the new LAN flights, I could see flights to GIG and CCS also working. AV will probably add a new weekly frequency to BOG-BCN this year too (for 5 weekly flights).
 
Summa767
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Wed May 16, 2012 12:27 pm

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 15):
LAN Colombia wanted to operate a BOG-BCN service, but was not awarded any frequencies by Colombia's Aerocivil

What rubbish!!
LAN did **NOT** even ask for frequencies for BCN, so how could Aerocivil even consider them!
Where did you get this?

There are 6 new frequencies to Spain available from tomorrow that LAN can apply for. I expect that they will do so. Whether it will be for BCN, we will have to see. I also expect them to ask to LHR, for which 7 frequencies will be also available from tomorrow. Another 7 are also available for FRA. Aerocivil next public audience will be on 16th June -exactly a month away-
where applications for these and other frequencies will be heard.
 
RJ_Delta
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Wed May 16, 2012 2:22 pm

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 16):
Are you necessarily thinking on the 787 for such routes?

Today SFO is well served from LIM but for BCN its necesary the B787 specially if the route starts in SCL.

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 17):
LAN could deploy the A-343 on the SCL-BCN route.

Remember that LAN will retire its A343 soon starting with the CC-CQG the next year.
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Wed May 16, 2012 4:22 pm

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 16):
LA SCL-MAD-FRA 7x weekly and IB MAD-SCL 7x weekly are concentrating the demand of passengers in Madrid exclusively.
The opening of BCN would diversify the traffic to Spain as it actually happens in Sao Paulo, Buenos Aires and Bogota, regarding the South American landscape.

....That doesn't answer my question.

Even with a business case for BCN, the fact remains that SCL is one of the few major important Latin American markets without a nonstop connection to London.
confidence is silent. insecurities are loud.
 
SJOtoLIR
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Wed May 16, 2012 4:37 pm

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 17):
Many passengers do connect onto these services from domestic destinations in Chile and destinations such as BUE, COR and MDZ. Plus passengers also transit via MAD to other destinations. LAN offers a daily direct service between SCL and FRA. LAN also offers passengers traveling between LIM and FRA a daily connection via MAD on its own metal


I would elaborate my point a bit more: the launch of the possible LA SCL-BCN might be sustained on the protectionism of the healthy current O&D traffic into SCL-MAD supplied by both IB MAD-SCL 7x weekly and LA SCL-MAD-FRA 7x weekly.
For example, in the case of Sao Paulo the existence of IB GRU-BCN 3x weekly would liberalize the component of the (Sao Paulo - Barcelona) traffic who traveled before on (IB GRU-MAD plus IB MAD-BCN) and vice-versa.
Thus, IB MAD-GRU would be loaded with O&D and connecting passengers through MAD.
My point consists if that model could also be applied to Santiago de Chile.

Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
 
SJOtoLIR
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Wed May 16, 2012 6:30 pm

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 22):
That doesn't answer my question.

Even with a business case for BCN, the fact remains that SCL is one of the few major important Latin American markets without a nonstop connection to London.


My concern in the long-term is that TAM already flies the GRU-LHR and GIG-LHR sectors and there's a decent connectivity between SCL and (GRU-GIG), taking into the account the services offered by LATAM in the future. The long SCL-LON segment requires a suitable plane like the 787.
It would be interesting to analyze accurate figures demonstrating that the current market into (SCL-LON) is larger than (SCL-BCN).

Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Wed May 16, 2012 7:07 pm

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 24):
My concern in the long-term is that TAM already flies the GRU-LHR and GIG-LHR sectors and there's a decent connectivity between SCL and (GRU-GIG), taking into the account the services offered by LATAM in the future. The long SCL-LON segment requires a suitable plane like the 787.
It would be interesting to analyze accurate figures demonstrating that the current market into (SCL-LON) is larger than (SCL-BCN).

If AF can sustain dedicated long-haul services each between CDG and GIG, GRU and SCL, then surely either LATAM or BA can do the same with providing a nonstop LHR-SCL, rather than force the hassle of connecting in GIG or GRU to transit between the two cities. Especially given that they are both OW hubs.

I'd even suggest that a LIMLHR flight is overdue as well.
confidence is silent. insecurities are loud.
 
SJOtoLIR
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Wed May 16, 2012 8:04 pm

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 25):
If AF can sustain dedicated long-haul services each between CDG and GIG, GRU and SCL, then surely either LATAM or BA can do the same with providing a nonstop LHR-SCL, rather than force the hassle of connecting in GIG or GRU to transit between the two cities. Especially given that they are both OW hubs.


In my view, only an existing and decent (O&D) SCL-LHR market can justify dedicated flights from Santiago de Chile to London and back. Same with the discussed LA SCL-BCN.
MAD is also a base for OneWorld grouping and IB MAD-SCL 7x weekly plus LA SCL-MAD-FRA 7x weekly would feed connections to the rest of Europe and beyond through MAD.
Furthermore, I doubt if the current amount of passengers into LHR-GIG, LHR-GRU and LHR-EZE match the dimension of the LHR-SCL sector.

Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
 
Rafabozzolla
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Thu May 17, 2012 2:32 am

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 25):
If AF can sustain dedicated long-haul services each between CDG and GIG, GRU and SCL, then surely either LATAM or BA can do the same with providing a nonstop LHR-SCL, rather than force the hassle of connecting in GIG or GRU to transit between the two cities. Especially given that they are both OW hubs.

MAD is the MIA of Europe. Shorter flying times, strong cultural ties to Latin America and good connectivity to the rest of the continent it serves. You cannot compare O&D to Latin America from LHR and MAD. Paris is a somewhat distant second. Think ATL. Latin America tends to look more into Latin Paris than Anglo-Saxon London.

Brazil-London works well because it is such a much more diverse economy than all the rest of Latin America and it is, understandably, much less MAD focused than Hispanic America.
 
LIPZ
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Fri May 18, 2012 12:08 pm

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 15):
(LAN Colombia plans on launching a daily non-stop service between BOG and MAD in the near-term)

Do you know how will be the long-haul fleet for each division once the 787s join the fleet?

I mean how many and which widebodies for each of

# LAN Argentina
# LAN Chile
# LAN Colombia
# LAN Ecuador
# LAN Peru

thanks
 
RJ_Delta
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Fri May 18, 2012 1:06 pm

Quoting LIPZ (Reply 28):
I mean how many and which widebodies for each of

# LAN Argentina
# LAN Chile
# LAN Colombia
# LAN Ecuador
# LAN Peru

Excepting LAN Argentina's aircraft all B767-300ER rotate within all LAN's subsidiaries in different routes within Latin America destination. However the current widebodies distribution are:

LAN Argentina: 3 B767-300ER (2 active one in maintenance at SCL with LV-registration)
LAN Chile: 5 A340-300, 14 B767-300ER
LAN Peru: 10 B767-300ER
LAN Ecuador: 4 B767-300ER (all with Chilean registration CC-)
LAN Colombia: no widebodies

Best Regards,
 
SCL767
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Fri May 18, 2012 4:40 pm

Quoting LIPZ (Reply 28):
Do you know how will be the long-haul fleet for each division once the 787s join the fleet?

The B-787s will eventually be deployed to each affiliate in a similar method as the B-767-300ERs. LAN Airlines S.A. and LAN Perú S.A. will both operate a size-able fleet of B-787s. This year, LAN will incorporate 9 new B-767-316ERs and 2 B-787-8s into the fleet.

LAN's newest B-767-316ER (CC-BDD) At KPAE:
http://paineairport.com/kpae5022.htm
 
LIPZ
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Mon May 21, 2012 9:04 am

@Thanks all!


I have also just found the following today's interview with CEO of Santiago Airport.
Looks like LAN would launch London, Rome and other points (Barcelona.....) in Europe.

Quote:
Hub carrier LAN’s development plans calls for the launch of flights to London, Rome and other European cities from Santiago, and its ambitions to expand its route network has led it to place an order for 32 B787s with delivery dates between this autumn and 2014.

full interview
http://www.airport-world.com/publica...rticles/item/1553-always-improving

[Edited 2012-05-21 02:13:39]
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Mon May 21, 2012 8:47 pm

Quoting Rafabozzolla (Reply 27):
MAD is the MIA of Europe. Shorter flying times, strong cultural ties to Latin America and good connectivity to the rest of the continent it serves. You cannot compare O&D to Latin America from LHR and MAD. Paris is a somewhat distant second. Think ATL. Latin America tends to look more into Latin Paris than Anglo-Saxon London.

Brazil-London works well because it is such a much more diverse economy than all the rest of Latin America and it is, understandably, much less MAD focused than Hispanic America.

Okay, I don't buy the logic of MAD being the focal point of Latin America-Europe traffic just purely due to cultural ties. If it were all about Madrid, then why would LH serve BOG, CCS, EZE, GIG, and GRU nonstop from FRA/MUC? Or KL to LIM, EZE, GRU, GIG, GYE and UIO from AMS? AZ to CCS, GIG, GRU and EZE? etc...

You can argue that there are "ancestral ties" between Italy, Germany etc. and Latin America, but that is not what drives the yields behind nonstop flights. There is business demand, and I still feel like nonstop London-South America flights remain a huge hole.

And comparing LHR to ATL? London is one of the most populous, important business centres in the world. Perhaps IAG seems satisfied routing it all through MAD on IB metal.
confidence is silent. insecurities are loud.
 
Talaier
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Mon May 21, 2012 9:23 pm

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 32):
Okay, I don't buy the logic of MAD being the focal point of Latin America-Europe traffic just purely due to cultural ties. If it were all about Madrid, then why would LH serve BOG, CCS, EZE, GIG, and GRU nonstop from FRA/MUC? Or KL to LIM, EZE, GRU, GIG, GYE and UIO from AMS? AZ to CCS, GIG, GRU and EZE? etc...

You can argue that there are "ancestral ties" between Italy, Germany etc. and Latin America, but that is not what drives the yields behind nonstop flights. There is business demand, and I still feel like nonstop London-South America flights remain a huge hole.

It's not only about cultural ties. Spain is the first or second biggest FDI originator after the USA in most Latin American countries. And even on those where it has been displaced by China and other EMs (such as Brazil) on a per capita basis the ratio is still disproportionately big. Big Spanish companies shuttle employees between Madrid and Sao Paulo, Buenos Aires or Chile (to name a few) on a weekly basis. I know a few of those people in my most immediate circle, and I'm pretty sure it's not an exception.

London can sustain direct flights to quite a few places in LatAm, but the mix of yield from MAD is much better. Flights to LatAm leave packed from row 1 right to the last seat. LHR will get its direct flights, but my bet is that it will come from LatAm companies and not from BA. We will see a LHR-SCL flight, I'm sure. Just as BCN and FRA will probably get one too.
 
SJOtoLIR
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RE: LAN Airlines Interested In Serving Barcelona

Thu May 24, 2012 12:57 am

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 32):
the logic of MAD being the focal point of Latin America-Europe traffic just purely due to cultural ties. If it were all about Madrid, then why would LH serve BOG, CCS, EZE, GIG, and GRU nonstop from FRA/MUC? Or KL to LIM, EZE, GRU, GIG, GYE and UIO from AMS? AZ to CCS, GIG, GRU and EZE?

Speaking generally about the [Latin American-Europe] component, it's a matter about where's located the big chunk of the that grouping which is precisely focused into the [MAD-Latin American] sector.
For example, Sao Paulo gets non-stop fights to MAD and other European stations due to the dimension and diversity of the traffic: BCN, CDG, LHR, LIS, OPO, IST, FRA, MUC, MXP, FCO, AMS, ZRH and so on...
On the contrary, the tiny [Guatemala-Europe] traffic is only allowing the triangular IB [MAD-GUA-SAL-MAD] 3x weekly.
Disregarding some Brazilian airports, is there any Latin American station sustaining scheduled flights to Europe where the service to Madrid is absent?


Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"

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