abrown532
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New Fence At St Maarten

Sun May 20, 2012 10:04 pm

Couldn't help but notice that in this recent picture there appears to be a second fence behind the existing fence. Would do much to stop the jet blast but I guess they had to do something.....

http://www.airliners.net/photo/JetBl...d=419053a8fd1258fe39a5a981bbbff361
 
B6JFKH81
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Sun May 20, 2012 10:11 pm

Just my opinion on this, maybe someone from SXM can correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think the fence has anything to do with jet blast. Blast fences are quite different looking. I have a feeling this is an attempt to bring the perimeter fence as close to the road as possible to reduce the amount of fence surfers.
"If you do not learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it"
 
toneale
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Sun May 20, 2012 10:14 pm

I was there last month. The new fence is up against the road rails and is intended to reduce fence surfing. It has had the intended effect.
 
aztrainer
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Sun May 20, 2012 10:47 pm

I guess the video of the girl getting blasted got the second fence put up. Litigious society kills the idea of personal responsibility.
 
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jfklganyc
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Sun May 20, 2012 10:57 pm

"I guess the video of the girl getting blasted got the second fence put up. Litigious society kills the idea of personal responsibility."

I think it was there before that
 
DeltaRules
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Sun May 20, 2012 11:39 pm

Just checked. The second fence was there the day of the "incident" video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8leu8Iaqis

[Edited 2012-05-20 16:40:18]
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Eagleboy
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Sun May 20, 2012 11:49 pm

I do like that shot of the JetBlue A320...
 
burnsie28
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 12:44 am

There was a secondary fence like that when I was at SXM in May 2011.
 
ghifty
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 7:58 am

I feel like the secondary fence contributed to her accident. If she was surfing off of the "original" fence, her feet would have found more grip in the sand..
Fly Delta Jets
 
flyingturtle
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 9:23 am

Given that topic, the fence at St Maarten – is it true that Air France has once damaged the fence?

I remember reading "Air Fence" in the connection with SXM...

David
Keeping calm is terrorism against those who want to live in fear.
 
bueb0g
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 10:04 am

Quoting abrown532 (Thread starter):
Couldn't help but notice that in this recent picture there appears to be a second fence behind the existing fence. Would do much to stop the jet blast but I guess they had to do something.....

That's not a new fence.

Quoting flyingturtle (Reply 9):

Given that topic, the fence at St Maarten – is it true that Air France has once damaged the fence?

I remember reading "Air Fence" in the connection with SXM...

Yes, I believe that is true... And this is just the story I heard when I was on the island, but the aircraft took off the top half of the fence, and when they rebuilt the fence they did it half as tall so it wouldn't happen again - which is why the fence directly behind the runway is half the height of the rest of the perimeter fence. If that's the case, then many thanks to those AF pilots - it's great being able to took over the fence!
Roger roger, what's our vector, victor?
 
alphaomega
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 1:26 pm

I saw this same thing in the picture and wondered when they added the fence - I know it wasn't there last fall! Thanks for the update.
 
tp1040
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 1:43 pm

Looks more like airport intruder defense. Double barbed wire.
 
richierich
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 2:15 pm

Quoting bueb0g (Reply 10):
That's not a new fence.

Correct,
I held on to the "new" fence back in 2010, although I don't recall it being green. The inside fence has barbed wire on it in order to stop people from entering airport property but there is no reason to think a chain link fence or two is going to stop jetblast.

The day they put up a blast fence at that airport is the day I find a new Caribbean island to go to!!!!!!
None shall pass!!!!
 
JAAlbert
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 2:20 pm

Quoting aztrainer (Reply 3):
Litigious society kills the idea of personal responsibility.

Please! What laws in St. Maarten encourage personal injury litigation?
 
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enilria
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 2:23 pm

Quoting JAAlbert (Reply 14):
What laws in St. Maarten

You coulda stopped there. :p
 
bueb0g
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 3:12 pm

Quoting alphaomega (Reply 11):

I saw this same thing in the picture and wondered when they added the fence - I know it wasn't there last fall! Thanks for the update.

It was.
Roger roger, what's our vector, victor?
 
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TheRedBaron
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 4:17 pm

Quoting bueb0g (Reply 10):
Yes, I believe that is true... And this is just the story I heard when I was on the island, but the aircraft took off the top half of the fence, and when they rebuilt the fence they did it half as tall so it wouldn't happen again - which is why the fence directly behind the runway is half the height of the rest of the perimeter fence. If that's the case, then many thanks to those AF pilots - it's great being able to took over the fence!

Those AF pilots are quite fearless chaps!!!

And yes the fence was there when that lady tried and Failed to hang to it during the take off... but hey! if authorities do not defend us from our own stupidity, who will do it??? /rant off
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AddictedMAN
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 5:28 pm

This is a photo of me at SXM in May 2009. Admittedly it was 3 years ago, but I think it shows very clearly what the fence was previously like. The new fence appears to be right where that low metal barrier is.

 
jeffreyklm
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 5:32 pm

That second fence was there in May 2010 when I was there.... Nothing new.
A mile of road or railway leads to nowhere, a mile of runway leads to everywhere.
 
Foxtrot789
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 5:35 pm

Quoting TheRedBaron (Reply 17):
but hey! if authorities do not defend us from our own stupidity, who will do it??? /rant off

I don't know... Darwin?
 
richierich
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 6:21 pm

Quoting addictedMAN (Reply 18):
This is a photo of me at SXM in May 2009. Admittedly it was 3 years ago, but I think it shows very clearly what the fence was previously like. The new fence appears to be right where that low metal barrier is.

OK, I took this photo Summer 2010 - the fence was apparently added sometime between March and August two years ago.

None shall pass!!!!
 
bueb0g
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 8:16 pm

Quoting addictedMAN (Reply 18):

This is a photo of me at SXM in May 2009. Admittedly it was 3 years ago, but I think it shows very clearly what the fence was previously like. The new fence appears to be right where that low metal barrier is.

You're not pointing the camera at where the fence is. The double fence only exists RIGHT behind the runway, on the extended centreline. Where your picture is taken from it's a single fence still.


Quoting richierich (Reply 21):
OK, I took this photo Summer 2010 - the fence was apparently added sometime between March and August two years ago.

No, the double fence is and has always been right behind the runway, i.e where your picture shows. The rest of the fence is a single fence.
Roger roger, what's our vector, victor?
 
b6a322
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Mon May 21, 2012 8:55 pm

So folks, to be clear:

The fence was added between March and August of 2010.

The fence was not originally green. The fence is now green.

Therefore, it is safe to say the fence has since been refurbished, with what looks to be the addition of some barbed wire.

Mystery = solved.
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Continental
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Tue May 22, 2012 1:52 am

Quoting bueb0g (Reply 10):
Yes, I believe that is true... And this is just the story I heard when I was on the island, but the aircraft took off the top half of the fence, and when they rebuilt the fence they did it half as tall so it wouldn't happen again - which is why the fence directly behind the runway is half the height of the rest of the perimeter fence. If that's the case, then many thanks to those AF pilots - it's great being able to took over the fence!

I always wondered if this was true. If so, that's insane. The hardly seems safe to have people around if an aircraft can clip the fence. Perhaps they should close the beach directly in front of the approach path.
 
WA707atMSP
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Tue May 22, 2012 2:28 am

Quoting Continental (Reply 24):
Perhaps they should close the beach directly in front of the approach path.

Noooooooo!

When I visited SXM in 2005, there was some talk that they would extend the runway into the lagoon on the east side of the airport, and put in a displaced threshhold so aircraft would be crossing Maho Beach at a higher altitude, and would not be taxiing all the way to the edge of the road before taking off. Thankfully, this hasn't happened yet.

As others have said, if they were to do this, this would destroy what makes SXM so special - it would make SXM just a place to change planes enroute to SAB or SBH.......
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kl838
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Tue May 22, 2012 3:49 am

Quoting WA707atMSP (Reply 25):
When I visited SXM in 2005, there was some talk that they would extend the runway into the lagoon on the east side of the airport, and put in a displaced threshhold so aircraft would be crossing Maho Beach at a higher altitude, and would not be taxiing all the way to the edge of the road before taking off. Thankfully, this hasn't happened yet.

As others have said, if they were to do this, this would destroy what makes SXM so special - it would make SXM just a place to change planes enroute to SAB or SBH.......

The runway was extended and the threshold was also put in place and it was completed a year or so ago. (not exactly sure when) I live next to the runway at the east end and the planes no longer turn right in front of my house but more towards the end.

The double fence was there for years, but it seems like they have refurbished it and replaced the fence, and therefore extending it to the barrier.

As for the Air France clipping the fence, it is absolutely true, as my father is friends with the former maintenance manager at TNCM and every time they clipped the fence he would come to my father to buy the supplies for the fence. This is of course when Air France flew the gorgeous 747 and despite the stop in Santo Domingo, I still remember loving it each time I flew as a child.
 
flyingturtle
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Tue May 22, 2012 6:01 am

Quoting kl838 (Reply 26):
every time they clipped the fence

WOW!

I'm proud of repeat offenders. The aircrew(s) in question are current with the aviation obstacles at the airport in question, and should be commended for their precise flying.

[Edited 2012-05-21 23:07:13]
Keeping calm is terrorism against those who want to live in fear.
 
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817Dreamliiner
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Tue May 22, 2012 6:25 am

Quoting Continental (Reply 24):
Quoting kl838 (Reply 26):
Quoting flyingturtle (Reply 27):

This AF story reminds me of these photos of a KLM 744:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Trent R Sellers
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Chris Starnes


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © JAR Photography



They were a real eye opener when I first saw them.
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richierich
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Tue May 22, 2012 1:31 pm

Quoting kl838 (Reply 26):
As for the Air France clipping the fence, it is absolutely true, as my father is friends with the former maintenance manager at TNCM and every time they clipped

So you're saying that only AF has clipped the fence? Judging by the photos above, it would be amazing if KLM hadn't nicked it once or twice too!

Quoting bueb0g (Reply 22):
No, the double fence is and has always been right behind the runway, i.e where your picture shows. The rest of the fence is a single fence.

OK - I could not find a photo of the "rest of the fence" but you could be right. Either way, just a few feet between the fences is not going to make a difference and take away from the 'fun factor' of the beach. Hopefully there will be no more reports (or videos) of people running away from the jet blast and falling down...
None shall pass!!!!
 
kl838
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Tue May 22, 2012 7:10 pm

Quoting richierich (Reply 29):
So you're saying that only AF has clipped the fence? Judging by the photos above, it would be amazing if KLM hadn't nicked it once or twice too!

As far as I know, KLM hasn't ever clipped the fence, it was only Air France and I guess most probably because they took off from runway 28 (formerly 27), while majority of the time KLM always used to take off from runway 10 (formerly 9).

It is also possible it is because Air France operated the 747-200, while KLM operated 747-300 and 400 majority of the time. KLM also used to fly the MD-11 nonstop from St. Maarten to Amsterdam for a while in addition to the triangle service to CUR or AUA.

When I had the chance to spend 1 week with the ATC for job training week in high school, I was told that the KLM pilots have more guts than the Air France pilots as they would try to land in any weather, while quite the opposite for Air France who would divert during any small storm.

[Edited 2012-05-22 12:14:11]
 
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817Dreamliiner
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Wed May 23, 2012 1:22 pm

Quoting kl838 (Reply 30):
As far as I know, KLM hasn't ever clipped the fence, it was only Air France

Well judging from the photo I posted, they came pretty close.
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ha763
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RE: New Fence At St Maarten

Thu May 24, 2012 1:42 am

Quoting richierich (Reply 21):
OK, I took this photo Summer 2010 - the fence was apparently added sometime between March and August two years ago.
Quoting B6A322 (Reply 23):
So folks, to be clear:

The fence was added between March and August of 2010.

Actually, it looks like it was installed in 2007:

May 26, 2007

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Sam Pollitt



July 29, 2007

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Christian Eggers



You can see the 2 guys on the guard rail leaning on the new fence in the July 29 picture.

This picture from February 27, 2007 does not show the second fence.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Robert J Cijntje

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