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hummingbird
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A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 23, 2012 12:18 pm

Welcome Guys,

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x57/llamoore/Caribbean%20maps/GrandCayman_map.jpg

This thread will feature our neighboring airline, Cayman Airways.



Cayman Airways is the national flag carrier of the Cayman Islands. With it's head office in Grand Cayman, it operates mainly as an international and domestic scheduled passenger carrier, with cargo services available on all routes. Its operations are based at Owen Roberts International Airport in George Town, Grand Cayman.The airline also offers a limited charter service.

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x315/yardieindubai/PlanespottersNet_063465.jpg


Cayman Airways was established and started operations on August 7, 1968. It was formed following the Cayman Government's purchase of 51% of Cayman Brac Airways from LACSA (the Costa Rican flag carrier) and became wholly government owned in December 1977. A few months after it was formed, Cayman Airways flew its first international route to Kingston, Jamaica. The airline acquired its first jet aircraft in 1978 and began services to Houston. In 1982 the airline acquired a Boeing 727-200 aircraft to strengthen the airline's regional and international capability, also allowing for the introduction of first class service. These jets were eventually replaced with Boeing 737-300 series, and during the 1980s Cayman Airways offered scheduled or charter service to Atlanta, Baltimore, Boston, Chicago, Detroit, Minneapolis, Newark, New York, Philadelphia, & St. Louis. Today Cayman Airways employs a staff of 300+ with two national and eight international gateways.

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x315/yardieindubai/EYE_0318.jpg

As the national flag carrier for the Cayman Islands, Cayman Airways operates non-stop Boeing 737 jet service between Grand Cayman and the following major US cities: Miami and Tampa, Florida; Washington DC; New York, New York; and Chicago, Illinois.
Nonstop jet service is also provided between Grand Cayman and regional destinations, including: Kingston and Montego Bay, Jamaica; Havana, Cuba; and La Ceiba, Honduras.



The airline’s Cayman Airways Express service also operates Twin Otter aircrafts between Grand Cayman and the Sister Islands of Little Cayman and Cayman Brac.

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x315/yardieindubai/IMG_7594.jpg

Future routes:


Effective June 23, 2012 – September 2, 2012, Cayman Airways will operate weekly service from Dallas to Grand Cayman on Sunday and from Grand Cayman to Dallas on Saturday..

A twice-weekly direct flight service to Panama 
on 31 May thru Sep 3..
Operating Mon and Thur..



Current Routes:

Grand Cayman
Cayman Brac
Little Cayman
New York
Washington, D.C
Havana
Kingston
Montego Bay
La Ceiba

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x315/yardieindubai/thumb1_banner_4f4c94095c14f1330418697TPA-to-GCM_diving_template2.jpg

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x315/yardieindubai/thumb1_banner_4f4c94a49aae31330418852CHI-to-GCM_culinary_template.jpg

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x315/yardieindubai/thumb1_banner_4f4c945acf4e31330418778MIA-to-GCM_rum-point_template.jpg

Fleet
4 B737-400
2 Twin Otters
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x315/yardieindubai/Cayman_Airways_Boeing_737-300_OJEV.jpg


Other Updates:

CO will suspend EWR-MBJ in Sept..Service resumes in Nov.
CM looking to increase services to MBJ by year end..PTY-KIN will see an increase to 4 weekly from the existing two..
Sunwing Airlines will launch seasonal flights from BNA and CVG into MBJ..Also, more flights will be added from Canada..
TS and The GOJ has entered in an agreement, where will TS increase flights between Canada and Jamaica..
BW has dropped PHL-MBJ from its network..According to news reports, the JM sale is a burden on their finances.. Rumors are a further downsizing on their operations in Jamaica is on the horizon..
VS to add a 3rd weekly LGW-MBJ flight in Nov..
DE to operate a 2 weekly nonstop FRA-MBJ service for the winter..
AA to reduce its recently added 4 daily MIA-KIN service to 3 in June..
DL to re-launch daily JFK-MBJ service in Dec..
SY to operate a 4 weekly MSP-MBJ service in December..

More updates in old thread..

Entering KIN FIR..Jamaican Thread 43.. (by hummingbird Mar 20 2012 in Civil Aviation)

[Edited 2012-05-23 05:29:03]

[Edited 2012-05-23 05:31:15]
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hummingbird
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 23, 2012 12:22 pm

Quoting jm079 (Reply 200):

Are they planning on returning to KIN from JFK too?

IMHO..They could start services in winter, but to have success on this route, they will have to coordinate some strong promotions in the Tri-State and Kingston area...


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

AIR Jamaica's divest-ment team is crafting a response to the growing criticisms being levelled at the company and its owners, Caribbean Airlines (CAL).
Recent news out of Trinidad and Tobago, CAL's owner, claims that the company is heavily indebted and that its ownership of Air Jamaica is one of the major contributors.



Read more: http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/busin...-s-response_11525101#ixzz1vh91I9wH

[Edited 2012-05-23 05:24:42]
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A388
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 23, 2012 1:03 pm

Since when has the Jamaican thread turned into a Caribbean Aviation thread. We have a separate thread for that  

In any case, I admire the approach of Cayman Airways to stimulate tourism (stimulate new routes so other airlines can take over the route as soon as it has become popular)

A388
 
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817Dreamliiner
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 23, 2012 1:18 pm

You for got to mention they had the 732 as well, caught one back in 2008 when I was on may way to FLL:

Please let me know... If you know this is the end of the world, Let me know... If you know the truth...
 
airjamaica
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 23, 2012 2:33 pm

Quoting hummingbird (Reply 195):
....MBJ will be daily eff, Dec 15...
Quoting jm079 (Reply 200):
Delta will be going daily - JFK to MBJ effective the fall of 2012.

It was announced on the weekend.

Is this a year round increase or is it just for the busy winter period ?

Quoting jm079 (Reply 200):
Are they planning on returning to KIN from JFK too?
Quoting hummingbird (Reply 1):
IMHO..They could start services in winter, but to have success on this route, they will have to coordinate some strong promotions in the Tri-State and Kingston area...

This is yet to be seen. But should they decide to, it will only mean an even more competitive KIN market.

Quoting 817Dreamliiner (Reply 3):
caught one back in 2008 when I was on may way to FLL:

Great photos. That was shortly after Norman Manley International Airport completed part of its major revamp.

Quoting A388 (Reply 2):
Since when has the Jamaican thread turned into a Caribbean Aviation thread. We have a separate thread for that

In the past we have featured many different carriers ( WS, 7I, RD, B6, BW, etc. ) that serve Jamaica, as the theme template for the thread. Don't remember KX being one of them ( maybe I just can't recall ) but it does make for an interesting theme none the less. I like the tail of their current livery.
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 23, 2012 2:39 pm

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 4):
Don't remember KX being one of them ( maybe I just can't recall ) but it does make for an interesting theme none the less. I like the tail of their current livery.

That is true, I would love to see their Twin Otters. I like their livery too.

A388
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 23, 2012 2:49 pm

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 4):
Great photos. That was shortly after Norman Manley International Airport completed part of its major revamp.

Correct, was quite impressed when I saw the improvements that year. Though I do miss the viewing deck, even now, it was always the place I looked forward to going whenever I was in KIN.

[Edited 2012-05-23 07:54:06]

[Edited 2012-05-23 08:03:57]
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 23, 2012 3:04 pm

DOT Stats, Sept 2011..

FLL-KIN
13244-9168 69%

KIN-FLL
13244-8257 62%

FLL-MBJ
4620-2791 60%

MBJ-FLL
4466-2591 58%

JFK-KIN
10679-6683 63%

KIN-JFK
10936-7277 67%

JFK-MBJ
4620-3100 68%

MBJ-JFK
4620-3748 81%

PHL-MBJ
4466-1960 44%

MBJ-PHL
4620-2115 46%

MCO-KIN
77O-550 72%

KIN-MCO
770-528 69%

AA

DFW-MBJ
1920-1496 78%

MBJ-DFW
1920-1636 85%

MIA-KIN
14240-11212 79%

KIN-MIA
14240-10649 75%

MIA-MBJ
11314-9567 85%

MBJ-MIA
11314-9668 85%

DL

ATL-MBJ
9484-8813 93%

MBJ-ATL
9484-8682 92%

US

CLT-MBJ
9288-8281 89%

MBJ-CLT
9288-8537 92%

PHL-MBJ
1703-1386 82%

MBJ-PHL
17031629 96%

CO

EWR-MBJ
640-613 96%

MBJ-EWR
640-607 95%

IAH-MBJ
640-559

MBJ-IAH
640-556 87%

FL

ATL-MBJ
3699-3274 86%

MBJ-ATL
3699-3209 87%

BWI-MBJ
3014-2343 78%

MBJ-BWI
3014-2448 81%

MCO-MBJ
2192-1264 58%

MBJ-MCO
2192-1576 72%

B6

JFK-KIN
4500-3848 86%

KIN-JFK
4500-3980 88%

JFK-MBJ
4800-4211 88%

MBJ-JFK
4800-4110 86%

MCO-MBJ
4500-3095 69%

MBJ-MCO
4500-3438 76%

SY (BW)

FLL-MBJ
4698-2699 57%

MBJ-FLL
4536-2307 51%

PHL-MBJ
4698-1953 41%

MBJ-PHL
4860-2274 47%

NA (BW)

JFK-KIN
1235-937 76%

KIN-JFK
1434-1364 95%

NK

FLL-KIN
1451-1178 81%

KIN-FLL
1451-1192 82%

FLL-MBJ
2238-1336 60%

MBJ-FLL
2060-1405 68%

U5

ORD-MBJ
672-358 53%

MBJ-ORD
672-371 55%

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 4):

Is this a year round increase or is it just for the busy winter period ?

It looks like a daily year round service...
I looked up the schedule up to Feb 2013 and it shows BW and DL @ daily and B6 at 12weekly..
The sky is the limit, but never stop grasping until you get the glory cloud..
 
airjamaica
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 23, 2012 4:53 pm

Quoting 817Dreamliiner (Reply 6):
Correct, was quite impressed when I saw the improvements that year. Though I do miss the viewing deck, ever now, it was always the place I looked forward to going whenever I was in KIN.

Myself was very impressed with the transformation back then as well. I did a Trip Report on my KIN-MBJ-MCO trip in November of that year which highlighted the '' new '' NMIA. Pity there is no observation decks at both KIN and MBJ anymore. Was the place '' to be '' for taking in all the action.

Quoting hummingbird (Reply 7):


BW

PHL-MBJ
4466-1960 44%

MBJ-PHL
4620-2115 46%


SY ( BW )

PHL-MBJ
4698-1953 41%

MBJ-PHL
4860-2274 47%


US

PHL-MBJ
1703-1386 82%

MBJ-PHL
17031629 96%

Need I say any more ?

Quoting hummingbird (Reply 7):
It looks like a daily year round service...
I looked up the schedule up to Feb 2013 and it shows BW and DL @ daily and B6 at 12weekly..

Interesting. The heat is on in MBJ on the JFK-MBJ sector. Lets see if DL will restart JFK-KIN as well. They will use the B738s on JFK-MBJ.
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LimaMike
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Thu May 24, 2012 4:16 am

http://jamaica-gleaner.com/latest/article.php?id=37398
Under the facilitation of the Jamaica Defense Force two Canadian Air Force F18s conducted some acrobatic demonstrations in KIN today. Its quite comical the level of consternation expressed by some observers!

Lucky for me though, after the demonstrations I was able to view the aircraft up-close on the ramp and take a few pics!

Cleared for takeoff!
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Thu May 24, 2012 11:50 am

Quoting LimaMike (Reply 9):
Under the facilitation of the Jamaica Defense Force two Canadian Air Force F18s conducted some acrobatic demonstrations in KIN today. Its quite comical the level of consternation expressed by some observers!

Heard them when they were criss-crossing over the city. The comments made by some of the observers were indeed humorous...Like these comments.................


'' Are we under attack? Is another Tivoli incursion? A God a come? A wha dat? ''


Lol.....Here are some more details of the event...


'' They were warming up their aircraft, including a jet, for the military air display which was part of the Labour Day festivities held yesterday. ''


http://jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/20120524/lead/lead2.html


A memorable aviation day for those in Kingston.

Quoting LimaMike (Reply 9):
Lucky for me though, after the demonstrations I was able to view the aircraft up-close on the ramp and take a few pics!

Great photos of the fighter jets. It is times like these I really miss working out there.
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Thu May 24, 2012 1:55 pm

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 8):
Need I say any more ?

I agree, talk about excess capacity........

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 8):
Interesting. The heat is on in MBJ on the JFK-MBJ sector. Lets see if DL will restart JFK-KIN as well. They will use the B738s on JFK-MBJ.

It will be a B737-800.....I hope this time, DL will enjoy longevity with this new frequency...

BTW...
Changes on the FLL-KIN route for the summer..

NK who previously announced daily services will now operate 4 a week eff June..Flights will operate on Thur, Sun, Tues and Wed..

B6 will remain at twice daily..

Quoting LimaMike (Reply 9):
Lucky for me though, after the demonstrations I was able to view the aircraft up-close on the ramp and take a few pics!

Cool pics..Would like to get close to fighter jet one day..



In addition to reviewing their Jamaica operations, BW has taken the decision to reduce their new London route to twice weekly...

Quote:
CAL's acting Chief Executive Officer, Robert Corbie said the airline is looking at booking trends for the London route, and based on the frequency it will determine the number of times for the week it will fly.
http://rjrnewsonline.com/business/cal-offer-two-weekly-flights-london

I am shocked as based on other posts I have seen, the impression painted was of high bookings for the summer..

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

VS's new 3rd weekly service will operate on Fri to compliment the existing Wed and Sun flights..


Virgin Atlantic has announced that it will add an extra weekly flight to Montego Bay from Gatwick Airport starting November 3.

The Friday flight will complement Virgin's services on Wednesdays and Sundays.

http://rjrnewsonline.com/business/vi...d-extra-flight-montego-bay-gatwick
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airjamaica
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Thu May 24, 2012 10:48 pm

Quoting hummingbird (Reply 11):
In addition to reviewing their Jamaica operations, BW has taken the decision to reduce their new London route to twice weekly...
Quoting hummingbird (Reply 11):
I am shocked as based on other posts I have seen, the impression painted was of high bookings for the summer..

I distinctly recall reading where one poster stated that flights were heavily booked up until December. Apparently this is not the case, based on what the aforementioned article states.

Quoting hummingbird (Reply 11):
B6 will remain at twice daily..

Seem they plan to rotate 2 A320s on at least some days for the FLL-KIN route during the summer, and from my observation their summer loads are shaping up quite nicely.
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ghifty
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Fri May 25, 2012 3:20 am

Just on observation: their livery looks mighty similar to British Airways' old "world tails" livery!
Fly Delta Jets
 
A388
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Fri May 25, 2012 12:37 pm

Quoting hummingbird (Reply 11):
Quoting LimaMike (Reply 9):
Lucky for me though, after the demonstrations I was able to view the aircraft up-close on the ramp and take a few pics!


Cool pics..Would like to get close to fighter jet one day..

Same here my friend, I would also love to be that close to a fighter jet one day. Nice photos LimaMike   

A388
 
guyanam
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Fri May 25, 2012 5:11 pm

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 12):

The poster quoted "inside sources" I suspect they confused expressions of interest with bookings.
LGW is a prestige route and will be a disaster. Anorther Nicholas fiasco. The man thought he could be another Butch...starting routes helter skelter and then getting the govt to bail them out when they lost money.

[Edited 2012-05-25 10:12:59]
 
N312RM
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Fri May 25, 2012 5:29 pm

Hummingbird,

Thank you for featuring KX in this new thread. A fitting tribute, considering that the airline has served the Jamaica market for all of its existence (44+ years) including its predecessor Cayman Brac Airways (CBA) with its lone DC3. KX is certainly near the top of the list of airlines serving the KIN market on an uninterrupted basis, perhaps exceeded only by BW. I flew on CBA to and from KIN when I attended school in my youth. Quite often, the route was KIN-MBJ-CYB-GCM and took many hours to accomplish.

Permit me to share a few omissions from your otherwise accurate history of KX and add a few more details.

The first jet aircraft operated was the venerable BAC 1-11. Two were purchased (VR-CAL and VR-CAB) and operated until 1982 when they were disposed of and replaced by 2 B727-200 (N271AF and N272AF) on lease purchase. In 1988, they were sold to AS and replaced by 3 new B737-400's (VR-CAL, VR-CAB and VR-CAA) fresh from Boeing on lease. Unfortunaltely, KX was unable to afford the high lease payments (reportedly in excess of $300k per month each) and with the economic downturn was forced and restructure and return them to the lessor. These were replaced by 3 B737-200's (VP-CAL, VP-CYB and VP-CKX) that were purchased outright. VP-CYB was a combi, and was used to carry cargo overnight MIA-GCM. Passengers hated the aircraft as the overhead bin space was very limited.

In 2003, the airline began replacing the 200's with the B737-300 and they have all been retired to the desert. The fleet now comprises 4 B737-300's and 2 DHC6-300.

A nice collection of photos. That's my brother standing on the left in the photo of VP-CKY following her delivery flight. I was Chairman of KX at the time.

Occasionaly, the Twin Otters can be seen in KIN on medevac flights, so you might just catch one there some day.
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Fri May 25, 2012 11:48 pm

Quoting hummingbird (Reply 11):
BTW...
Changes on the FLL-KIN route for the summer..

NK who previously announced daily services will now operate 4 a week eff June..Flights will operate on Thur, Sun, Tues and Wed..

B6 will remain at twice daily..

Apparently B6 is offering a "friends and family" 50pc discount on FLL-KIN for all travel completed by September 30th and booked by June 1st with the promo code "Jamrock". The fact they are having to offer this combined with NK's cutback surely indicated bookings are not as solid for B6 this summer as some have indicated in the previous thread.

JMBWEEBOY
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Sat May 26, 2012 1:10 am

Quoting jmbweeboy (Reply 17):
Apparently B6 is offering a "friends and family" 50pc discount on FLL-KIN for all travel completed by September 30th and booked by June 1st with the promo code "Jamrock". The fact they are having to offer this combined with NK's cutback surely indicated bookings are not as solid for B6 this summer as some have indicated in the previous thread.

By the way, Jamrock is case sensitive, meaning with Caps.

JMBWEEBOY
 
airjamaica
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Sat May 26, 2012 12:23 pm

Quoting ghifty (Reply 13):
Just on observation: their livery looks mighty similar to British Airways' old "world tails" livery!

In a way, yes it does remind me of the BA old '' world tails '' livery. But the difference here is that most if not all ( not certain if any of their aircraft still have the older livery ) of KX's tails have the same design, unlike the old BA '' world tails '' where several designs were used.


BTW I wasn't even aware that they operated the DC-8 in the past as well.

Quoting guyanam (Reply 15):

Have my doubts about that one as well.

Quoting N312RM (Reply 16):
KX is certainly near the top of the list of airlines serving the KIN market on an uninterrupted basis

   Got used to seeing their B737s at KIN growing up.


Apparently a '' disoriented '' passenger had to be restrained after AA flight 320 landed in MIA from MBJ yesterday.........................


'' MIAMI, USA (AP) A 24-year-old Canadian man is in federal custody for rushing toward the front of an American Airlines flight from Jamaica after the plane landed in Miami.
The FBI says Ryan Snider faces federal charges including interference with a flight crew. ''


http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/news/...rained-on-flight-to-Miami-arrested


Headlines of this nature seem to be making the news quite frequently nowadays.

[Edited 2012-05-26 05:58:29]
greenheart
 
beeweel15
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Sat May 26, 2012 11:31 pm

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 4):
Quoting A388 (Reply 2):
Since when has the Jamaican thread turned into a Caribbean Aviation thread. We have a separate thread for that

In the past we have featured many different carriers ( WS, 7I, RD, B6, BW, etc. ) that serve Jamaica, as the theme template for the thread. Don't remember KX being one of them ( maybe I just can't recall ) but it does make for an interesting theme none the less. I like the tail of their current livery.

While they serve Jamaica it copies the Caribbean Aviation thread which represents the whole Caribbean not just Jamaica.
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Sat May 26, 2012 11:55 pm

Quoting beeweel15 (Reply 20):
While they serve Jamaica it copies the Caribbean Aviation thread which represents the whole Caribbean not just Jamaica.

If that is your perception, then so be it. I don't view it as such. As outlined in the opening comments :


'' This thread will feature our neighboring airline, Cayman Airways. ''


It is not the first time we have featured one of the many carriers flying into Jamaica as a theme. And it definately wont be the last.
greenheart
 
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hummingbird
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Sun May 27, 2012 12:22 am

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 12):
Seem they plan to rotate 2 A320s on at least some days for the FLL-KIN route during the summer, and from my observation their summer loads are shaping up quite nicely.

Definitely is improving for the summer..

Quoting N312RM (Reply 16):
Hummingbird,

Thank you for featuring KX in this new thread. A fitting tribute, considering that the airline has served the Jamaica market for all of its existence (44+ years) including its predecessor Cayman Brac Airways (CBA) with its lone DC3. KX is certainly near the top of the list of airlines serving the KIN market on an uninterrupted basis, perhaps exceeded only by BW.

You are welcome..KX does deserve this tribute..

Quoting jmbweeboy (Reply 17):
Apparently B6 is offering a "friends and family" 50pc discount on FLL-KIN for all travel completed by September 30th and booked by June 1st with the promo code "Jamrock". The fact they are having to offer this combined with NK's cutback surely indicated bookings are not as solid for B6 this summer as some have indicated in the previous thread.
JMBWEEBOY

Not really, Its a tactic to force BW to reduce service into FLL....BW recently increased flights to 3 a day into FLL from KIN..With a recent announcement, the airline is facing financial operational risk, the move is to dilute the route with the cheap fares to sink yields..

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 19):
'' MIAMI, USA (AP) A 24-year-old Canadian man is in federal custody for rushing toward the front of an American Airlines flight from Jamaica after the plane landed in Miami.
The FBI says Ryan Snider faces federal charges including interference with a flight crew. ''

A sad incident, but am happy the suspect was not Jamaican..When news first broke, the suspect was identified as a Jamaican, who tried to hijack the aircraft....

Quoting beeweel15 (Reply 20):
While they serve Jamaica it copies the Caribbean Aviation thread which represents the whole Caribbean not just Jamaica.

You guys need to quit..Am not going to waste my time having petty squabbles over nonsensical issues..Since it's inception, the thread has and will continue to feature airlines that serve Jamaica...
Why are you having a problem with KX, when it the past we featured BW and Insel Air??

As mentioned by N312RM, we featured KX because;

Quoting N312RM (Reply 16):
A fitting tribute, considering that the airline has served the Jamaica market for all of its existence (44+ years) including its predecessor Cayman Brac Airways (CBA) with its lone DC3. KX is certainly near the top of the list of airlines serving the KIN market on an uninterrupted basis,
The sky is the limit, but never stop grasping until you get the glory cloud..
 
LimaMike
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Sun May 27, 2012 4:04 am

Quoting hummingbird (Reply 22):
You guys need to quit..Am not going to waste my time having petty squabbles over nonsensical issues..Since it's inception, the thread has and will continue to feature airlines that serve Jamaica...

Bravo! Granted I was hoping you guys would simply IGNORE certain comments and just move on with life. If you do not respond to or make reference to some of the impish comments made then they will simply die a natural death.
Cleared for takeoff!
 
airjamaica
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Sun May 27, 2012 4:39 am

Quoting hummingbird (Reply 22):
When news first broke, the suspect was identified as a Jamaican, who tried to hijack the aircraft....

Lol. Wasn't aware of that. There was one report that stated the passenger in question walked up towards the front of the aircraft prior to the landing. Media madness. One of the other passengers who assisted in subduing him was a trained security officer from Bermuda.

Quoting N312RM (Reply 16):
A fitting tribute, considering that the airline has served the Jamaica market for all of its existence (44 years) including its predecessor Cayman Brac Airways (CBA) with its lone DC3.

Quite a milestone indeed.
greenheart
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Sun May 27, 2012 1:44 pm

Quoting hummingbird (Reply 22):
You guys need to quit..Am not going to waste my time having petty squabbles over nonsensical issues..Since it's inception, the thread has and will continue to feature airlines that serve Jamaica...
Why are you having a problem with KX, when it the past we featured BW and Insel Air??

Come on, why cant we all just get along and stop bashing each other? If their comments bother you simply ignore them like what LimaMike said:

Quoting LimaMike (Reply 23):
Bravo! Granted I was hoping you guys would simply IGNORE certain comments and just move on with life. If you do not respond to or make reference to some of the impish comments made then they will simply die a natural death.
Please let me know... If you know this is the end of the world, Let me know... If you know the truth...
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Sun May 27, 2012 3:14 pm

Quoting hummingbird (Reply 22):
Not really, Its a tactic to force BW to reduce service into FLL....BW recently increased flights to 3 a day into FLL from KIN..With a recent announcement, the airline is facing financial operational risk, the move is to dilute the route with the cheap fares to sink yields..

With the current cost of fuel, B6 is too smart an airline to engage in "loss pricing" with its fares to potentially drive a competiiror, particularly BW out of the market. They know BW will always be there but now Spirit, well that is another story. With their current reduction to 4 frequencies weekly, this is a repeat peformance of NK in the FLL-POS market where they reduced frequencies and then ultimately "left town." If there is a blood bath this summer with FLL-KIN, Spirit is likely the victim.

JMBWEEBOY
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Sun May 27, 2012 9:08 pm

Just to make it clear, I replied to this Caribbean Aviation thread start because the thread started with a picture of the island itself. I don't remember seeing geographical charts of the U.S., U.K. or any of those big countries when those airlines were taken. That island photo and only that island photo mislead me and my apologies for this. As soon as AirJamaica explained it, I realized I was wrong but again I just want to clarify my initial reply.

A388
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Mon May 28, 2012 12:51 am

DOT Stats Oct 20111

BW

FLL-KIN
13860-10022 72%

KIN-FLL
14014-8168 58%

FLL-MBJ
4928-3433 70%

MBJ-FLL
4774-3041 64%

JFK-KIN
9394-6559 70%

KIN-JFK
9548-6565 69%

JFK-MBJ
4928-3358 68%

MBJ-JFK
4774-3561 75%

KIN-MCO
1232-999 81%

MCO-KIN
1232-961 78%

PHL-MBJ
4620-2255 49%

MBJ-PHL
4620-2120 46%

B6

JFK-KIN
4650-3782 81%

KIN-JFK
4650-3903 84%

JFK-MBJ
4650-4221 91%

MBJ-JFK
4650-4168 90%

MCO-MBJ
4550-3127 69%

MBJ-MCO
4550-3166 70%

CO

EWR-MBJ
800-755 94%

MBJ-EWR
813-709 87%

IAH-MBJ
813-710 87%

MBJ-IAH
800-713 89%

DL

ATL-MBJ
10181-9468 93%

MBJ-ATL
10181-9359 92%

US

CLT-MBJ
10183-9364 92%

MBJ-CLT
10183-8875 87%

PHL-MBJ
3528-2848 81%

MBJ-PHL
3528-2966 84%

AA

DFW-MBJ
2400-1864 78%

MBJ-DFW
2400-1990 83%

MIA-KIN
14868-10715 72%

KIN-MIA
14708-10357 70%

MIA-MBJ
11692-10034 86%

MBJ-MIA
11690-9660 83%

NK

FLL-KIN
1160-858 74%

KIN-FLL
1160-808 70%

FLL-MBJ
1470-939 64%

MBJ-FLL
1470-1042 71%

SY

FLL-MBJ
5022-3426 68%

MBJ-FLL
5022-3043 61%

PHL-MBJ
4860-2537 52%

MBJ-PHL
4860-2420 50%

U5

ORD-MBJ
840-771 92%

MBJ-ORD
840-701 83%

FL
ATL-MBJ
4110-3581 87%

MBJ-ATL
4110-3385 82%

BWI-MBJ
3836-3226 84%

MBJ-BWI
3836-3256 85%

MCO-MBJ
1918-1139 60%

MBJ-MCO
1918-1145 60%

Quoting jmbweeboy (Reply 26):
With the current cost of fuel, B6 is too smart an airline to engage in "loss pricing" with its fares to potentially drive a competiiror, particularly BW out of the market. They know BW will always be there but now Spirit, well that is another story. With their current reduction to 4 frequencies weekly, this is a repeat peformance of NK in the FLL-POS market where they reduced frequencies and then ultimately "left town." If there is a blood bath this summer with FLL-KIN, Spirit is likely the victim.

Believe me when I say, there is a lot more I cannot say, but mark my word, B6 is determined to win over the FLL-KIN market...
The sky is the limit, but never stop grasping until you get the glory cloud..
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Mon May 28, 2012 2:19 am

Quoting jmbweeboy (Reply 26):
If there is a blood bath this summer with FLL-KIN, Spirit is likely the victim.
Quoting hummingbird (Reply 28):
Believe me when I say, there is a lot more I cannot say, but mark my word, B6 is determined to win over the FLL-KIN market...

I think NK will try their best to hang on to FLL-KIN as much as they possibly can. They are known for adjusting their Jamaican frequencies from time to time over the years. But it will be interesting to see how that sector play out with all three carriers. At the same time I think that B6 has a distinct advantage on the route where flexibility of equipment type is concerned. E190s double daily, with the A320s/E190s mixture during the peak periods.

Quoting hummingbird (Reply 28):



DOT Stats Oct 20111


BW

JFK-KIN
9394-6559 70%

KIN-JFK
9548-6565 69%


PHL-MBJ
4620-2255 49%

MBJ-PHL
4620-2120 46%


B6

JFK-KIN
4650-3782 81%

KIN-JFK
4650-3903 84%

JFK-MBJ
4650-4221 91%

MBJ-JFK
4650-4168 90%


US

PHL-MBJ
3528-2848 81%

MBJ-PHL
3528-2966 84%


SY

PHL-MBJ
4860-2537 52%

MBJ-PHL
4860-2420 50%

Very interesting stats. B6 extremely impressive on JFK-KIN as usual. The PHL-MBJ route speaks for itself.
greenheart
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Mon May 28, 2012 5:50 pm

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 19):

All aircraft are now wearing the new livery. The tail is an oversized image of Cayman's Coat of Arms.

Yes, KX did operate a single DC8-53 in the early 1980's for about 2 years to supplement the B727's on the longer charter routes. It was an ex-UAL machine.You can find a few photos on this site.

Other aircraft they have operated over the years include:

DC9-15 - Wet leased from Air Florida for about 6 months, pending arrival of the BAC1-11 in 1977
HS 748 - Used on inter-island service and MIA-CYB
BN Trislander - Inter-island service
DC6 - Cargo service GCM-MIA and GCM-KIN
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Tue May 29, 2012 6:10 pm

l

Quoting jmbweeboy (Reply 26):

Why are you so sure that BW will always be there?

KIN has turned out to be a financial disaster which is not sustainable. Jca will not put $ into BW as it defeats the goal of ridding them of JM, the othert money pit. T&T cannot indefinitely pour $ to support the KIN base. Not politically feasible.

Also with tiny market share, 2x/week, NK isnt a source for passengers for B6. BW is and so they will be targetted. If FLL doesnt work for BW and if YYZ is problematic due to incursions by Westjet and expansion by AC, its hard to justify the KIN base. Aside from NAS its now cut to the bone.

CAL is stuck with LGW and to offset those losses they will have to become lean and mean elsewhere.
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Tue May 29, 2012 10:50 pm

Quoting guyanam (Reply 31):
Why are you so sure that BW will always be there?

Nothing other than gut feeling from watching airlines enter and leave markets for the past 46 years!

In South Florida where I live, B6 is not considered the "2nd coming" like they migtht be currently in Jamaica. Bottom line, the diaspora here will ultimately stick with CAL, however much they mourn the loss of the old JM.

JmBweeboiy
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 1:25 am

Quoting jmbweeboy (Reply 26):
Bottom line, the diaspora here will ultimately stick with CAL, however much they mourn the loss of the old JM.

Not too certain about the '' stick '' part. It goes way beyond people simply missing or mourning JM. Mr. Lalor doesn't feel that way based on what he said not too long ago. There are those in the diaspora who are price sensitive, and will happily choose B6 if their fares are more competitive ( which often times it is, even with the fee for the second checked luggage ). When B6 inaugurated JFK-KIN, their loads were not super spectacular like their previous JFK-MBJ start up. However that has now changed, and it is quite clear Jamaicans at home and abroad have embraced B6's services. I am sure the carrier is quite cognisant of that, and no doubt they will try to replicate the same sucess on their FLL-KIN route. At the end of the day the KIN market is very competitive and is getting even more so, with the entry of WS etc. Time will tell though.
greenheart
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 8:56 am

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 33):
Mr. Lalor doesn't feel that way based on what he said not too long ago.

Speaking about Mr. Lalor, he is of the opinion that JM's debt is not to be blamed for BW's current financial dilemma........


'' The divestment team that organised the Jamaican Governments sale in 2010 rejected recent reports that the airline was an albatross around the neck of its Trinidadian rescuer. ''


'' CAL did not get any assets or liabilities of Air Jamaica when it started operating the national airline in May 2010, said the head of the divestment team, Dennis Lalor. Nor were Air Jamaica operations merged with CALs even when it began operating under the Caribbean Airlines brand a year later. ''


'' The Government of Jamaica assumed all liabilities of Air J, providing CAL a clean slate as it relates to Air Js operations - Lalor said, adding that this was done to ensure that CAL would have no disadvantages when it got the Air Jamaica brand.

'' In addition, the Government of Jamaica provided CAL with cash of over US$17 million, which represented tickets prepaid for by customers not yet flown. ''


http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/busin...r-Jamaica-is-NOT-to-blame_11549239


This should clear the air a bit better for those who thought otherwise.
greenheart
 
baje427
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 12:03 pm

How are you able to access these statistics?

Quoting hummingbird (Reply 22):
 
A388
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 12:35 pm

Quoting baje427 (Reply 35):
How are you able to access these statistics?

If you are referring to the airline load factors hummingbird posts, that comes from the U.S. DoT or BTS if I'm not mistaken. This data is available to the public but it can only be generated up to about six months from the current date.

Hummingbird can explain this in more detail I think.

A388
 
caribbean484
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 1:00 pm

Quoting baje427 (Reply 29):
How are you able to access these statistics?

The stats come from the the USDOT's office Research and Innovative Technology Admin (RITA) and its sub-office BTS which post all data related to public transportation, land sea and air, where I use stats for airport planning and future expansion. The stats are compiled on a quarterly basis, however International stats are posted 2 quarters thereafter. The new stats come out every 3rd week of the month, November 2011 stats are available.
Here is the site for aviation:
http://www.transtats.bts.gov/Tables....riers&DB_Short_Name=Air%20Carriers
All ah we is one family
 
baje427
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 1:13 pm

Thanks for the link but exactly where can you have the breakdown by carrier as listed above the site is a bit confusing.

Quoting caribbean484 (Reply 31):
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 1:19 pm

Quoting baje427 (Reply 32):
Thanks for the link but exactly where can you have the breakdown by carrier as listed above the site is a bit confusing.

Lol I know, It takes a bit to get used to, however its by destination, first go to
T-100 International Segment (All Carriers) at the bottom you will see download tab click and the page will be this
http://www.transtats.bts.gov/DL_Sele...D=261&DB_Short_Name=Air%20Carriers

to make life easier choose, seat, passengers, carrier(in the carrier section), origin, destination.
In the top section filler geography select the country, and month your looking for.
All ah we is one family
 
baje427
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 3:42 pm

Thanks

Quoting caribbean484 (Reply 33):
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 3:59 pm

Excellent site caribbean 484 and very useful, thanks for sharing.
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 5:38 pm

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 28):

JMs debts arent the cause of CALs problems, however losses on the KIN base since the acquisition of these routes is at the heart of CALs problems. Simply put, if CAL cant make these routes work QUICKLY they will have to shut down the base.
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 5:46 pm

Quoting guyanam (Reply 42):
JMs debts arent the cause of CALs problems, however losses on the KIN base since the acquisition of these routes is at the heart of CALs problems. Simply put, if CAL cant make these routes work QUICKLY they will have to shut down the base.

If the KIN base will be shut down, it will mean that the flights to/from SXM will also terminate seeing that the routing also continues to KIN? I think SXM wasn't in danger of being axed?

A388
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 7:11 pm

Quoting A388 (Reply 37):

SXM is served out of the POS base. KIN to POS flights are clearly needed and will continue, even if capacity is reduced from the current 11x.

Whats in doubt is Jca to North Am if the flights lose money. BW doesnt have time to "make it work". With the LON route likely to be a cash drain they definitely have to reduce losses elsewhere. They got into the deal with LAn for 2 767s and I am not sure that they can back out now. So they will have at least one severely under used 767 8 months of the year when JFK/YYZ cant absorb these planes. Also its tough for them to push back BA with that carrier's 6X vs BWs 2X on what is a heavy business route. Historically POS LON is really a one carrier route and this low frequency guarantees that BA stays.

BW didnt think thru its LON route even though many analysts warned tham of the pit falls. Now that they will not do BGI LON, after much fanfare in BGI, that reduces their credibility if and when they do, given BWs marginal position in that island (its a KIN/POS/GEO carrier).


B6 is making sure their life will become even more difficult. A good % of the VFR market is as integrated to FL NY travel as they are to travel to KIN/MBJ from both points and B6 is a much loved carrier on this route. One gets the impression thatB6 is very sensitive to the Jamaican traveler as they seem to use Jcan cultural symbols in their marketing more so than BW does. B6, seeing blood, will set out to reduce yields on the KIN routes knowing that this will force BW to be the secondary carrier on the route (and maybe exit MBJ). Can BW make $ being a secondary carrier to Jca, given overheads associated with that operation will be a question that will need to be answered.
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 7:29 pm

Quoting guyanam (Reply 44):
SXM is served out of the POS base

Don't know if you know it that those flights continue to KIN which is why the route is doing well what I've understood...

A388
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 8:35 pm

Quoting guyanam (Reply 36):
JMs debts arent the cause of CALs problems, however losses on the KIN base since the acquisition of these routes is at the heart of CALs problems. Simply put, if CAL cant make these routes work QUICKLY they will have to shut down the base.

All this was predicted from day one, and will not be a surprise to many if it does happen.

Quoting A388 (Reply 37):
If the KIN base will be shut down, it will mean that the flights to/from SXM will also terminate seeing that the routing also continues to KIN? I think SXM wasn't in danger of being axed?
Quoting guyanam (Reply 38):
SXM is served out of the POS base. KIN to POS flights are clearly needed and will continue, even if capacity is reduced from the current 11x.

From what I understand, the KIN to EC operations historically has performed very well for them, so it is highly unlikely that they would discontinue those services all together if they eventually decide to close shop in KIN.

Quoting A388 (Reply 39):
Don't know if you know it that those flights continue to KIN which is why the route is doing well what I've understood...

True. But usually that flight originate/terminate in POS over the years so they could still successfully operate it from their home base.
greenheart
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Wed May 30, 2012 8:37 pm

Quoting A388 (Reply 39):

I do know that this summer BW will have more service to SXM out of KIN and POS than they will have to ANU. This is a traditional BWIA route, its lucrative and there is no competition.

Very different from KIN/MBJ YYZ/JFK/FLL where competition is intense and the competitors are ruthless. Apparently they are still looking at other routes to drop and as they have stripped out much of the overheads out of KIN I dont see how much further they can go to reduce losses. The KIN base has way lower overhead expenses than it did under JM so should be profitable. Clearly it isnt based on the US$38MM losses reported.

I see no evidence that Jcans are warming to them either. It is merely another option and will be selected based on fares, baggage policies, etc. B6 has definitely committed heavily to the Jcan VFR market.

The "love/hate" relationship that Jcans had with AirJ hasnt transferred over. By this I mean continuing to use AJ even as their service standards dropped out of the notion that it was "fi wi ting" (our thing). BW isnt lucky like that.
 
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Sat Jun 02, 2012 9:46 am

Well, 90 more Jamaicans have been made redundant at BW, including some who were working in POS................


'' AIRCRAFT MAINTENANCE in Jamaica has been dealt a severe blow as Caribbean Airlines Limited (CAL) carried out another round of redundancies, sending home 90 Jamaican employees.

The latest group to be issued with redundancy letters by the Trinidad-based company includes 30 aircraft mechanics, human resource officers, customer relations and finance personnel. The staff received their letters of termination on Thursday afternoon. ''


'' The source said everything had been moved to Trinidad and even the Jamaicans who were there working in Port-of-Spain have been sent back home. ''


http://jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/20120602/news/news4.html


The ever evolving saga continues...............
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RE: A Hop To Sir Turtle Land....Jamaican Thread # 44

Sat Jun 02, 2012 4:59 pm

Fly Jamaica has updated their website...I heard they may start on or about June 14, 2012..

http://fly-jamaica.com/

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 29):
I think NK will try their best to hang on to FLL-KIN as much as they possibly can. They are known for adjusting their Jamaican frequencies from time to time over the years. But it will be interesting to see how that sector play out with all three carriers.

From what I have seen from my visits to FLL,NK is here to stay..They have a cost structure, that allows them to remain competitive in the market...

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 29):
Very interesting stats. B6 extremely impressive on JFK-KIN as usual. The PHL-MBJ route speaks for itself.

A definite money making route for B6....

Quoting N312RM (Reply 30):
All aircraft are now wearing the new livery. The tail is an oversized image of Cayman's Coat of Arms.

Are there plans to modernize the fleet?...I assume the B737s have at least 5 more years of flying before it becomes scrap..

Quoting guyanam (Reply 31):
Aside from NAS its now cut to the bone.

With the added competition, I assume some frequencies will be cut from FLL and JFK....

Quoting jmbweeboy (Reply 32):
In South Florida where I live, B6 is not considered the "2nd coming" like they migtht be currently in Jamaica. Bottom line, the diaspora here will ultimately stick with CAL, however much they mourn the loss of the old JM.

I beg to differ..Earlier this week, while in uniform, I accompanied my mother to the check in counter for BW034..The check-in agent inquired about our loads, then she mentioned, the flights to Jamaica are not full as before and average loads are below the 40s....I assume, you are referring to the minority of the society who are of the belief, JM is in existence....

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 33):
When B6 inaugurated JFK-KIN, their loads were not super spectacular like their previous JFK-MBJ start up. However that has now changed, and it is quite clear Jamaicans at home and abroad have embraced B6's services. I am sure the carrier is quite cognisant of that, and no doubt they will try to replicate the same sucess on their FLL-KIN route. At the end of the day the KIN market is very competitive and is getting even more so, with the entry of WS etc. Time will tell though.

I anticipate WS to take a greater slice of the huge migrant and overseas work community..Recently, alot of Jamaicans are now participating in programmes that have extended to areas as Calgary..

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 34):
'' The Government of Jamaica assumed all liabilities of Air J, providing CAL a clean slate as it relates to Air Js operations - Lalor said, adding that this was done to ensure that CAL would have no disadvantages when it got the Air Jamaica brand.

Buju was right when he said " A Yardman get the blame", lol..

Quoting guyanam (Reply 42):
Simply put, if CAL cant make these routes work QUICKLY they will have to shut down the base.

Soon..I am only hoping for FlyJam to succeed in their ventures...

Quoting guyanam (Reply 44):
One gets the impression thatB6 is very sensitive to the Jamaican traveler as they seem to use Jcan cultural symbols in their marketing more so than BW does. B6, seeing blood, will set out to reduce yields on the KIN routes knowing that this will force BW to be the secondary carrier on the route (and maybe exit MBJ). Can BW make $ being a secondary carrier to Jca, given overheads associated with that operation will be a question that will need to be answered.
Quoting airjamaica (Reply 46):
All this was predicted from day one, and will not be a surprise to many if it does happen.

That is a part of their long term plan, to dominate the KIN-US market...

Quoting A388 (Reply 45):
Don't know if you know it that those flights continue to KIN which is why the route is doing well what I've understood...
Quoting airjamaica (Reply 46):
From what I understand, the KIN to EC operations historically has performed very well for them, so it is highly unlikely that they would discontinue those services all together if they eventually decide to close shop in KIN.

With little or no competition on their EC-KIN sector, these routes are safe..

Quoting airjamaica (Reply 42):
Well, 90 more Jamaicans have been made redundant at BW, including some who were working in POS................

This writing is clear..
The sky is the limit, but never stop grasping until you get the glory cloud..