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enilria
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OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 4:13 pm

INSTRUCTIONS

WHAT IS THIS REPORT?
This compares what is for sale THIS WEEK for the stated period versus what was for sale LAST WEEK...It does NOT compare to last year or now (UNLESS OTHERWISE STATED).

HOW DO I READ IT?
XXX-YYY DEC 4>5 JAN 4>5 ; means that the listed airline changed the frequency between the two airports to add from 4 to 5 roundtrips in December and January. No other months were changed. I only list one direction, although it is possible the listed change is only one way. It is too difficult to average the two directions. I assume the change is roundtrip and that is most often the case.

HOW ARE THE DAILY DEPARTURES CALCULATED?
This report uses total operations for the month listed, divided over the days in the month.

WHAT ARE THE FRACTIONAL FLIGHTS?
Non-daily operations create fractional weekly service. In most cases flights are rounded, but in the case of international service or markets with low frequency, fractions are shown. If a flight operated 5 days out of 7, it would show 0.8 flights.

WHY ARE THERE WEIRD FREQUENCIES IN FAR AWAY MONTHS FOR LCCs?
Most airlines publish schedules 11 months in advance. This report covers the next 9 months. That avoids seeing schedules as they are loaded. Several LCCs load their schedules less than 9 months into the future. Their schedules may also end mid-month. If B6 loads their schedule until Jan15, all flights in Janaury will show half frequency because of the way the report is created.

WHY IS A WHOLE AIRLINE'S SCHEDULE SHOWN AS CHANGING FOR A FUTURE MONTH?
Similarly to the previous question, some airlines load their schedule from nothing inside the 9 month window of this report. When their schedule is extended it will show as new service because there was no previous schedule to compare to. In some instances I will show a more valid comparison against another period.

THOSE FLIGHTS AREN'T DELTA, THEY ARE PINNACLE
This report only shows the marketing code. It is too complicated to show all the operators.

THE FREQUENCIES MAY HAVE CHANGED AS YOU SHOW, BUT THE SEATS DIDNT CHANGE BECAUSE OF EQUIPMENT SWAPS
That is a natural weakness of a frequency based report, but it provides something to discuss below.

THE FREQUENCY DOESN'T SHOW A CHANGE, E.G. 4>4
This happens as a result of rounding. There is a change in service that is large enough to be listed, but through rounding it does not appear.

I marked some of the ones I thought were interesting with an "*".

9K ACK-BOS SEP 16>13
9K ACK-EWB SEP 10>7
9K BOS-MVY SEP 14>11
9K BOS-PVC SEP 13>9
9K EWB-MVY SEP 5>4

AB LAX-TXL JUL 0.4>0.3

AC RSW-YYZ OCT 0.4>0.6

AM LAS-GDL JUL 0.3>0.1 AUG 0.3>0
AM MIA-MEX JUL 4>5 AUG 4>5
AM ONT-GDL AUG 1.0>0.8
I've gotten to the point where I assign zero credibility to the AM schedule
*AM ORD-GDL SEP 0.1>0.6 OCT 0>0.6 NOV 0>0.5 DEC 0>0.6 JAN 0>0.5 FEB 0>0.6
AM ORD-MTY AUG 0.5>0.3
AM SMF-GDL AUG 1.0>0.8

AR MIA-EZE OCT 1.0>2 NOV 1.0>2 DEC 1.0>2 JAN 1.0>2 FEB 1.0>2

Reverses last week
*AS SEA-ATL NOV 1.1>2 DEC 1.0>2 JAN 1.0>2 FEB 1.0>2

*B6 DCA-SJU AUG 0>0.3 SEP 0>1.0 OCT 0>1.0 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>1.0 JAN 0>1.0 FEB 0>0.5

DL ATL-COU SEP 1.0>1.8 OCT 1.0>2 NOV 1.0>2 DEC 1.0>2 JAN 1.0>2 FEB 1.0>2
DL ATL-EVV SEP 4>5 OCT 4>5 NOV 4>5 DEC 4>5 JAN 4>5 FEB 4>5
DL ATL-FSM SEP 1.0>1.9 OCT 1.0>2 NOV 1.0>2.0 DEC 1.0>2 JAN 1.0>2 FEB 1.0>2
DL ATL-HSV OCT 10>9 NOV 9>8 DEC 8>7 JAN 8>7 FEB 9>8
DL ATL-MCO DEC 14>15
DL ATL-MLI SEP 4>3 OCT 4>3 NOV 4>3 DEC 4>3 JAN 4>3 FEB 4>3
DL ATL-ROA SEP 5>6 OCT 5>6
DL ATL-SGF SEP 4>5 OCT 4>5 NOV 4>5 DEC 4>5 JAN 3>4 FEB 4>5
DL ATL-SHV DEC 6>5 JAN 7>6 FEB 7>6
DL ATL-TLH SEP 9>8 OCT 9>8
DL DLH-MSP SEP 5>6
DL DTW-CMH OCT 8>7 NOV 8>7
DL DTW-TUL SEP 1.7>1.0
*DL DTW-YHZ SEP 1.0>0.1 OCT 1.0>0
DL DTW-YOW SEP 3>1.9 OCT 3>1.9 NOV 3>1.9 DEC 3>1.4 JAN 3>1.7 FEB 3>1.9
*DL FLL-MSP SEP 1.0>0.1
DL FNT-MSP SEP 3>1.9 OCT 3>1.9
DL JAX-MSP SEP 1.9>1.1 OCT 1.9>1.0
DL JFK-ORF OCT 3>2 NOV 3>2
*DL LGA-AVL SEP 1.0>0.1 OCT 1.0>0
DL LGA-BOS DEC 10>11 JAN 12>13
DL LGA-ORD DEC 10>11
DL LGA-TVC SEP 0.1>0.0
*DL MEM-CLE SEP 1.8>1.0 OCT 1.9>1.0 NOV 1.8>1.0 DEC 1.4>1.0
*DL MEM-COU SEP 1.8>1.1 OCT 1.9>1.0 NOV 1.8>0.9 DEC 1.8>1.0 JAN 1.9>1.0 FEB 1.9>1.0
*DL MEM-FSM SEP 2.0>1.1 OCT 2>1.0 NOV 1.9>1.0 DEC 2>1.0 JAN 2>1.0 FEB 2>1.0
*DL MEM-MKE SEP 3>1.9 OCT 3>1.9 NOV 3>1.9
*DL MEM-OMA SEP 3>1.9 OCT 3>1.9 NOV 3>1.9 DEC 2>1.0 JAN 2>1.0 FEB 2>1.0
*DL MEM-PHL SEP 3>1.9 OCT 3>1.9 NOV 3>1.8 DEC 3>1.8
*DL MEM-SGF SEP 1.8>1.1 OCT 1.9>1.0 NOV 1.8>1.0 DEC 1.8>1.0 JAN 1.9>1.0 FEB 1.9>1.0
Strange swap
*DL MSP-ORF SEP 1.1>0.2 OCT 1.0>0 NOV 1.0>0 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0
*DL MSP-RIC SEP 0>0.9 OCT 0>1.0 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>1.0 JAN 0>1.0 FEB 0>1.0
DL MSP-TUS SEP 1.0>0.1
DL SLC-BIL SEP 5>4
DL SLC-FCA SEP 4>3

*EK LAX-DXB AUG 2>1.0 SEP 2>1.0 OCT 2>1.0 NOV 2>1.0 DEC 2>1.0 JAN 2>1.0 FEB 2>1.0

G4 OAK-RDM AUG 0.3>0.1

KX JFK-GCM FEB 0.4>0.5

LA LAX-LIM NOV 1.6>1.9

OZ SPN-PUS JUL 0>0.3 SEP 0.0>0.3 OCT 0>0.3

TA ORD-GUA DEC 0.6>0.7

More cuts. Looks to me like they will definitely exercise the October contract option with the city to reduce flying this year.
UA CLE-BUF NOV 4>3
UA CLE-CMH OCT 3>4
UA CLE-CVG JUL 1.6>1.1 AUG 0.7>0
UA CLE-DAY AUG 4>3
UA CLE-MHT NOV 1.6>3
UA CLE-PVD AUG 4>3
UA CLE-PWM NOV 0.7>0.2
UA CLE-ROC AUG 3>1.8
UA CLE-SBN JUL 1.7>1.0 AUG 0.8>0
UA DEN-CPR OCT 4>5
*UA DEN-GFK OCT 0>1.9 NOV 0>2 DEC 0>2 JAN 0>2 FEB 0>2
UA DEN-ICT OCT 4>5
UA DEN-LAS OCT 4>5
UA DEN-MFR OCT 0.9>1.9
UA DEN-OKC OCT 4>5
UA DEN-PDX OCT 4>5
*UA DEN-SHV SEP 0>1.0 OCT 0>1.0 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>1.0 JAN 0>1.0 FEB 0>1.0
UA DEN-SJC OCT 4>5
UA DEN-SMF OCT 4>5
UA DEN-TUL OCT 4>5
UA DEN-TUS OCT 5>3
UA EWR-ALB NOV 4>5 DEC 4>5 JAN 4>5 FEB 4>5
UA EWR-AVL NOV 1.7>1.0
UA EWR-BDL DEC 3>4 JAN 3>4 FEB 3>4
UA EWR-MAD DEC 1.0>0.9 JAN 0.9>0.6 FEB 0.9>0.6
UA EWR-ORF OCT 5>4 NOV 5>4 DEC 5>4 JAN 5>4 FEB 5>4
UA EWR-SAT OCT 1.8>1.0 NOV 1.9>1.0 DEC 1.8>1.0 JAN 1.6>0.9 FEB 1.6>1.0
UA IAD-BUF DEC 4>3 JAN 4>3 FEB 4>3
UA IAD-MCO OCT 3>4
UA IAD-MHT NOV 1.9>1.1
UA IAH-BHM JUL 6>5
UA IAH-CHS JUL 1.9>1.1
UA IAH-HDN JAN 0>1.0 FEB 0>1.0
UA IAH-MLU JUL 4>3
UA IAH-ORF JUL 1.8>1.0 AUG 1.6>1.1
UA LAX-COS OCT 3>4
UA LAX-DEN OCT 8>7
UA LAX-EWR OCT 8>7 NOV 8>7
UA LAX-IAD OCT 8>9
UA LAX-PSP OCT 6>5 NOV 6>5
UA LAX-SAN OCT 14>13 NOV 14>13 DEC 14>13 JAN 14>13 FEB 14>13
UA LAX-SBP OCT 6>5 NOV 6>5 DEC 6>5 JAN 6>5 FEB 6>5
UA LAX-SLC OCT 3>1.9 NOV 3>1.8
UA LAX-SMF OCT 4>3 NOV 4>3
*UA ORD-JAN OCT 0.9>0 NOV 1.0>0 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0
UA ORD-LAX OCT 13>12 NOV 13>12
UA SFO-BOS OCT 7>6 NOV 7>6 DEC 7>6 JAN 7>6 FEB 7>6
UA SFO-CIC OCT 4>3 NOV 4>3 DEC 4>3 JAN 4>3 FEB 4>3
UA SFO-DEN OCT 9>10 NOV 9>10
UA SFO-EWR OCT 8>10
UA SFO-RDD AUG 5>4

UN LAX-DME NOV 0.1>0.3 DEC 0.2>0.3 JAN 0.1>0.3 FEB 0.1>0.3
UN MIA-DME NOV 0.1>0.3 JAN 0.1>0.3

US CLT-AVL SEP 9>8
US CLT-EWR SEP 10>9
US CLT-FLL SEP 8>7
US CLT-GPT SEP 4>3
US CLT-IND SEP 9>8
US CLT-LGA SEP 14>12
US CLT-OAJ SEP 8>7
US CLT-ROC SEP 1.1>1.8
US CLT-SBY SEP 3>2.0
US CLT-SJU SEP 1.5>1.4
US DCA-BNA SEP 4>3
US DCA-CHS SEP 4>5
US DCA-CLT SEP 12>10
US DCA-GSO SEP 3>4
US DCA-MCI SEP 1.8>3
US DCA-ORF SEP 3>5
US DCA-PWM SEP 3>4
US DCA-RDU SEP 8>7
US DCA-SAV SEP 1.3>3
US PHL-BDL SEP 8>7
US PHL-BOS SEP 18>17
US PHL-CLT SEP 11>10
US PHL-DCA SEP 10>9
US PHL-GSO SEP 6>5
US PHL-ITH SEP 5>6
US PHL-LGA SEP 12>13
US PHL-MDT SEP 8>7
US PHL-MKE SEP 4>5
US PHL-ORF SEP 7>8
US PHL-PVD SEP 8>7
US PHL-ROA SEP 3>4
US PHL-ROC SEP 6>7
US PHL-SCE SEP 6>7
US PHL-YHZ SEP 3>4
US PHL-YOW SEP 4>3
US PHX-FLG SEP 7>6
US PHX-FLL SEP 1.0>0.6
US PHX-LAX SEP 8>6
US PHX-PSP SEP 6>5
US PHX-TUS SEP 10>9
US PHX-YEG SEP 1.9>1.0
US PHX-YUM SEP 6>5

*VX DCA-SFO SEP 0>1.0 OCT 0>1.0 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>1.0

I guess this is a restart of the old Vacation Express flying under Sunwing?
*WG BNA-MBJ JUL 0>0.1
*WG CVG-CUN JUL 0>0.2 AUG 0>0.1 SEP 0>0.2 OCT 0>0.1
*WG CVG-MBJ JUL 0>0.1 AUG 0>0.1 SEP 0>0.2 OCT 0>0.1
*WG CVG-PUJ JUL 0>0.1 AUG 0>0.2 SEP 0>0.1 OCT 0>0.1
 
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KLASM83
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 4:16 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*UA DEN-GFK OCT 0>1.9 NOV 0>2 DEC 0>2 JAN 0>2 FEB 0>2

Bueno! I can finally get some *A FFM's from northeast NoDak without having to go to FAR or YWG! I hope it lasts.

As always, thanks for these threads!
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Beechtobus
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 4:44 pm

Good to see UA in DEN making up some lost ground. Looks like a net increase of 11 or so flights.

[Edited 2012-06-07 09:45:42]
 
azstar
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 5:06 pm

Wow. What's up (down) with TUS? No more nonstop to MSP. 3 RJ flights to DEN. Reduced US TUS-PHX. AA reduced by 1 flight. The airport is already a ghost town. Half of it is empty.
 
aztrainer
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 5:11 pm

Quoting azstar (Reply 3):
Wow. What's up (down) with TUS? No more nonstop to MSP. 3 RJ flights to DEN. Reduced US TUS-PHX. AA reduced by 1 flight. The airport is already a ghost town. Half of it is empty.

I wonder if this is reflective on US Airways Express?

It also could be the summer slow down as we like to melt our metal in the Sonoran Desert.
 
azstar
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 5:19 pm

Quoting aztrainer (Reply 4):
I wonder if this is reflective on US Airways Express?

Years ago US (America West) flew 16 Airbus/737 flights per day between TUS-PHX. Then, they downsized to 15-17
85 seat Mesa RJ's. Now, they're down to six 85 seaters and three 50 seaters per day. Pretty dramatic reduction. And,
MSP is one of the top 5 O&D destinations from TUS. No nonstops in September, apparently. F9 removed 276 seats per day between TUS-DEN (2 A319's) and UA is down to 2 nonstops (RJ's) TUS-DEN this summer.
 
PHX787
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 5:26 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*DL DTW-YHZ SEP 1.0>0.1 OCT 1.0>0

Not doing anything for DL i see. I heard it's difficult to pull a profit out of YHZ.

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
I've gotten to the point where I assign zero credibility to the AM schedule
*AM ORD-GDL SEP 0.1>0.6 OCT 0>0.6 NOV 0>0.5 DEC 0>0.6 JAN 0>0.5 FEB 0>0.6
AM ORD-MTY AUG 0.5>0.3

Why does AM list the American destination as the starting point?

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*DL MEM-CLE SEP 1.8>1.0 OCT 1.9>1.0 NOV 1.8>1.0 DEC 1.4>1.0
*DL MEM-COU SEP 1.8>1.1 OCT 1.9>1.0 NOV 1.8>0.9 DEC 1.8>1.0 JAN 1.9>1.0 FEB 1.9>1.0
*DL MEM-FSM SEP 2.0>1.1 OCT 2>1.0 NOV 1.9>1.0 DEC 2>1.0 JAN 2>1.0 FEB 2>1.0
*DL MEM-MKE SEP 3>1.9 OCT 3>1.9 NOV 3>1.9
*DL MEM-OMA SEP 3>1.9 OCT 3>1.9 NOV 3>1.9 DEC 2>1.0 JAN 2>1.0 FEB 2>1.0
*DL MEM-PHL SEP 3>1.9 OCT 3>1.9 NOV 3>1.8 DEC 3>1.8
*DL MEM-SGF SEP 1.8>1.1 OCT 1.9>1.0 NOV 1.8>1.0 DEC 1.8>1.0 JAN 1.9>1.0 FEB 1.9>1.0

I guess we're starting to say "Bye" to memphis now.

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
US PHX-FLG SEP 7>6

This route is operated on a Dash-8, I thought these were retired?

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
I guess this is a restart of the old Vacation Express flying under Sunwing?
*WG BNA-MBJ JUL 0>0.1
*WG CVG-CUN JUL 0>0.2 AUG 0>0.1 SEP 0>0.2 OCT 0>0.1
*WG CVG-MBJ JUL 0>0.1 AUG 0>0.1 SEP 0>0.2 OCT 0>0.1
*WG CVG-PUJ JUL 0>0.1 AUG 0>0.2 SEP 0>0.1 OCT 0>0.1

At CVG it's operated by F9; is that being switched? I haven't seen anything posted on the OAG threads recently (It appeared there a few months ago as F9 CVG-CUN
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SouthernDC9
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 5:30 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*UA ORD-JAN OCT 0.9>0 NOV 1.0>0 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0

So I take it this route is not happening after all...
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wn676
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:03 pm

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 6):
This route is operated on a Dash-8, I thought these were retired?

They will be at the end of this month, to be replaced by CRJs.
Tiny, unreadable text leaves ample room for interpretation.
 
HPRamper
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:55 pm

Quoting azstar (Reply 3):
Wow. What's up (down) with TUS? No more nonstop to MSP. 3 RJ flights to DEN. Reduced US TUS-PHX. AA reduced by 1 flight. The airport is already a ghost town. Half of it is empty.

Only 110 air miles between airports - US at least probably has more profitable places to put planes. In my opinion what TUS needs is decent commuter rail to PHX. Been talked about for years, but apparently not as important as a border fence  
 
point2point
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 7:20 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
UA LAX-COS OCT 3>4
UA LAX-DEN OCT 8>7

Sorta looks like UA getting back at F9 for starting on the LAX-COS route?


 
 
flyguy89
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 8:19 pm

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 6):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
I guess this is a restart of the old Vacation Express flying under Sunwing?
*WG BNA-MBJ JUL 0>0.1
*WG CVG-CUN JUL 0>0.2 AUG 0>0.1 SEP 0>0.2 OCT 0>0.1
*WG CVG-MBJ JUL 0>0.1 AUG 0>0.1 SEP 0>0.2 OCT 0>0.1
*WG CVG-PUJ JUL 0>0.1 AUG 0>0.2 SEP 0>0.1 OCT 0>0.1

At CVG it's operated by F9; is that being switched? I haven't seen anything posted on the OAG threads recently (It appeared there a few months ago as F9 CVG-CUN

Hmm, not sure, F9 may indeed be dropping their Vacation Express flying, but I do remember hearing about WG starting CVG, I also think MBJ is new, I don't recall that being served before even with USA 3000.
 
PHX787
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 8:34 pm

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 11):
Hmm, not sure, F9 may indeed be dropping their Vacation Express flying, but I do remember hearing about WG starting CVG, I also think MBJ is new, I don't recall that being served before even with USA 3000.

It wasn't. With USA3000 we had CUN, PUJ, and Santo Domingo, IIRC

[Edited 2012-06-07 13:34:37]
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yellowtail
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 8:39 pm

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 11):
Hmm, not sure, F9 may indeed be dropping their Vacation Express flying, but I do remember hearing about WG starting CVG, I also think MBJ is new, I don't recall that being served before even with USA 3000.

Sunwing bought out Vacation Express..they will be doing caribbean flying to CUN, PUJ and MBJ from ATL, BNA and CVG I believe. This was in a thread in Jan.
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PHX787
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 8:45 pm

Quoting yellowtail (Reply 13):
Sunwing bought out Vacation Express..they will be doing caribbean flying to CUN, PUJ and MBJ from ATL, BNA and CVG I believe. This was in a thread in Jan.

Is F9 just holding them over while WG gets their aircraft together, or something?

Unfortunately I haven't seen anything from CVG in the Database that shows F9 (I'm hoping someone could catch it for me)
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mariner
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 8:53 pm

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 14):
Unfortunately I haven't seen anything from CVG in the Database that shows F9 (I'm hoping someone could catch it for me)

The Apple Vacations website has Frontier listed for CVG-CUN/PUJ through next year - CUN to November 2013 and PUJ to August 2013, which is as far out as the Apple schedules presently go:

http://www.applevacations.com/flight-schedule/cvg-cincinnati/:

Frontier shows both routes as scheduled service as well.

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cokepopper
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 9:22 pm

I'm curious, was it ever noted that DL cut EWR-SLC to one flight a day?
 
BD338
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:11 pm

Quoting cokepopper (Reply 16):
I'm curious, was it ever noted that DL cut EWR-SLC to one flight a day?

Can't say if it was noted or not but I keeping hoping for UA to start this route, more one stop options to the UK rather than relying on SLC-CDG and connecting through the delight that is CDG  
 
PHX787
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:50 pm

Quoting mariner (Reply 15):
The Apple Vacations website has Frontier listed for CVG-CUN/PUJ through next year - CUN to November 2013 and PUJ to August 2013, which is as far out as the Apple schedules presently go:

I meant photos   but thanks for the info, I'll look into flight times to be able to catch one of the F9's landing next time I'm in Ohio.
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N766UA
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Fri Jun 08, 2012 3:11 am

What do we make of this, then?

http://www.cleveland.com/business/in...t_cuts_2_others_to_cincinnati.html

I don't see the additions here. Are they seasonal?
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PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Fri Jun 08, 2012 3:35 am

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
Strange swap
*DL MSP-ORF SEP 1.1>0.2 OCT 1.0>0 NOV 1.0>0 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0
*DL MSP-RIC SEP 0>0.9 OCT 0>1.0 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>1.0 JAN 0>1.0 FEB 0>1.0

DL (and NW) has typically been flying MSP-RIC on-again, off again, summer seasonal for several years. Both of these are hub over-flights that essentially overfly DTW and ATL. They've usually kept MSP-ORF year-round though.

My uneducated guess is that RIC may have more business ties than ORF, particularly with the likes of Capital-One in RIC versus the military related traffic at ORF.

Quoting azstar (Reply 3):
Wow. What's up (down) with TUS? No more nonstop to MSP. 3 RJ flights to DEN. Reduced US TUS-PHX. AA reduced by 1 flight. The airport is already a ghost town. Half of it is empty.

It should be noted that when DL drops MSP-TUS after Labor Day in September, they increase capacity on ATL-TUS. ATL-TUS goes from 2x 738 to 2x 757 in September.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 6):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*DL DTW-YHZ SEP 1.0>0.1 OCT 1.0>0

Not doing anything for DL i see. I heard it's difficult to pull a profit out of YHZ.

DL is starting LGA-YHZ 2x daily in July. It appears that they would rather serve this market over LGA where they can use 50 RJs versus from DTW where they fly it with a 2-class RJ since it is more than 750 miles.
More O&D potential at LGA versus DTW, and with the new hub most of the larger markets can connect over LGA to acccess YHZ.
 
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Fri Jun 08, 2012 11:18 am

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*VX DCA-SFO SEP 0>1.0 OCT 0>1.0 NOV 0>1.0 DEC 0>1.0

So this is the one and only daily flight that VX operates to DCA? How cool VX can offer the alternate option to SFO. I'm guessing they will have great options for connections to places that already have non-stop service to DCA, like PDX, SEA, LAS, LAX, SAN.

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
G4 OAK-RDM AUG 0.3>0.1

Since G4 is leaving Redmond's Roberts Field anyway, this is by no means a surprise. Wish this flight had been operating when I was living in San Francisco, instead of paying the mad fares UAX had SFO-PDX, especially at the holidays with full EMB-120's for 2 hours.
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Fri Jun 08, 2012 12:13 pm

Quoting DTW.SCE" class="quote" target="_blank">PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 20):
DL (and NW) has typically been flying MSP-RIC on-again, off again, summer seasonal for several years. Both of these are hub over-flights that essentially overfly DTW and ATL. They've usually kept MSP-ORF year-round though.

Ehhhh, I would not say that route overflies ATL. DTW and I suppose CVG yes.
 
aztrainer
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:28 pm

Quoting azstar (Reply 5):
Years ago US (America West) flew 16 Airbus/737 flights per day between TUS-PHX.

I did the flight on HP and it was a nice 20 - 30 minute flight. Did it when I was 10 by my self after visiting my grandfather in Tucson and going back to my family in Phoenix. This was my first unaccompanied flight.

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 9):
Only 110 air miles between airports - US at least probably has more profitable places to put planes. In my opinion what TUS needs is decent commuter rail to PHX. Been talked about for years, but apparently not as important as a border fence

Agree, even without the light rail you can drive from TUS to PHX in about an hour and a half. Also the train traffic is the east/west traffic and very busy, so I would surmise that they would need to build a whole new system and not just use the available infrastructure.
 
lat41
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:48 pm

US PHL-PVD SEP 8>7

It may be just seasonal, but with WN gone off the route, typical US logic calls for setting a stupidly expensive tariff, downgrading the aircraft and driving all the business away.
 
azstar
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Fri Jun 08, 2012 1:49 pm

No one really flies just between TUS & PHX. Almost all, if not all, the traffic is connecting. Besides, the fare is so absurdly high, over $250.00 each way, I've known people who have flown TUS-DEN-PHX, or TUS-LAX-PHX for a reasonable fare.
 
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Fri Jun 08, 2012 2:25 pm

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 6):
I guess we're starting to say "Bye" to memphis now.

Well Delta has already said to Memphis "We need to see other hubs," "Can we still be friends?" and "It's not you, it's me," so yes "Bye" is the next logical progression in the breakup...
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Fri Jun 08, 2012 2:38 pm

Quoting N766UA (Reply 19):
I don't see the additions here. Are they seasonal?

Yes, mostly seasonal.
 
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Sat Jun 09, 2012 8:32 am

Quoting SouthernDC9 (Reply 26):
Well Delta has already said to Memphis "We need to see other hubs," "Can we still be friends?" and "It's not you, it's me," so yes "Bye" is the next logical progression in the breakup...

Well said, too bad Hallmark doesn't make a card for that, sorry but we're tearing down our hub in your city, I'm sure MEM, CVG, RDU, SJC and more would have appreciated the thought. Best place is a crowded restaurant with witnesses.  
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EricR
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Sat Jun 09, 2012 4:24 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
US PHX-LAX SEP 8>6

Down to 6 flights per day. AA & DL's relatively recent entrance on this route combined with competition from UA & WN (5 airlines total) can't be good for margins.

Quoting aztrainer (Reply 23):

Agree, even without the light rail you can drive from TUS to PHX in about an hour and a half. Also the train traffic is the east/west traffic and very busy, so I would surmise that they would need to build a whole new system and not just use the available infrastructure.

From what I recall, a recent study determined a rail project was cost prohibitive. The interim solution was to expand the I-10 corridor to a minimum of 3 lanes in each direction, with more lanes in higher traffic areas.
 
wn676
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Sat Jun 09, 2012 4:41 pm

Quoting EricR (Reply 29):
Down to 6 flights per day. AA & DL's relatively recent entrance on this route combined with competition from UA & WN (5 airlines total) can't be good for margins.

It's a seasonal reduction. They cut back to 6x in the last few years from September to mid-December as well.

[Edited 2012-06-09 09:43:46]
Tiny, unreadable text leaves ample room for interpretation.
 
EricR
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Sat Jun 09, 2012 4:45 pm

Quoting wn676 (Reply 30):
It's a seasonal reduction. They cut back to 6x last fall as well.

Sorry, I intended to compare this to the days when they had double digit N/S flights to LAX.
 
BoeingGuy
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Sat Jun 09, 2012 6:13 pm

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 28):
Quoting SouthernDC9 (Reply 26):
Well Delta has already said to Memphis "We need to see other hubs," "Can we still be friends?" and "It's not you, it's me," so yes "Bye" is the next logical progression in the breakup...

Well said, too bad Hallmark doesn't make a card for that, sorry but we're tearing down our hub in your city, I'm sure MEM, CVG, RDU, SJC and more would have appreciated the thought. Best place is a crowded restaurant with witnesses.

Didn't DL promise that they would keep all of their hubs? Then again, I clearly recall DL stating that they had no intention of implementing a first-bag fee also. Nice to know that companies keep their word and practice good ethics when they make promises like this.
 
flyguy89
Posts: 2004
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Sat Jun 09, 2012 7:52 pm

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 32):
Quoting RWA380 (Reply 28):
Quoting SouthernDC9 (Reply 26):
Well Delta has already said to Memphis "We need to see other hubs," "Can we still be friends?" and "It's not you, it's me," so yes "Bye" is the next logical progression in the breakup...

Well said, too bad Hallmark doesn't make a card for that, sorry but we're tearing down our hub in your city, I'm sure MEM, CVG, RDU, SJC and more would have appreciated the thought. Best place is a crowded restaurant with witnesses.

Didn't DL promise that they would keep all of their hubs? Then again, I clearly recall DL stating that they had no intention of implementing a first-bag fee also. Nice to know that companies keep their word and practice good ethics when they make promises like this.

In all fairness, anyone with a half-way decent knowledge of the industry knew keeping all the hubs would not happen with the NW/DL merger. I knew as soon as I heard the merger was approved we could kiss MEM and CVG good-bye, just the reality of the industry, anyone who actually believed they would keep everything was just being naive. I don't blame DL, they're just doing what makes financial and economic sense.
 
hondah35
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Sat Jun 09, 2012 8:54 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
US PHX-FLL SEP 1.0>0.6

Wow, this is kind of shocking.
 
PHX787
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Sat Jun 09, 2012 10:26 pm

Quoting HONDAH35 (Reply 34):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
US PHX-FLL SEP 1.0>0.6

Wow, this is kind of shocking.

I don't know many people here who go to FLL for anything but business or summer stuff. AA serves MIA and WN has probably cheaper service to FLL. Seems like US doesn't want to compete too much with that market.
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HPRamper
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Sun Jun 10, 2012 3:50 am

Quoting EricR (Reply 31):
Sorry, I intended to compare this to the days when they had double digit N/S flights to LAX.

Used to be on smaller planes too. US probably decided an upgauge in equipment was a better plan than keeping frequency high.
 
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enilria
Topic Author
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:04 am

Quoting KLASM83 (Reply 1):
As always, thanks for these threads!

 
Quoting PHX787 (Reply 6):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
I've gotten to the point where I assign zero credibility to the AM schedule
*AM ORD-GDL SEP 0.1>0.6 OCT 0>0.6 NOV 0>0.5 DEC 0>0.6 JAN 0>0.5 FEB 0>0.6
AM ORD-MTY AUG 0.5>0.3

Why does AM list the American destination as the starting point?

That's just the way I do it. This is a USA based report.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 6):
I guess we're starting to say "Bye" to memphis now.

Been saying good bye.  
Quoting PHX787 (Reply 6):
At CVG it's operated by F9; is that being switched? I haven't seen anything posted on the OAG threads recently (It appeared there a few months ago as F9 CVG-CUN

F9 flies for Apple not Vacation Express.

Quoting SouthernDC9 (Reply 7):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
*UA ORD-JAN OCT 0.9>0 NOV 1.0>0 DEC 1.0>0 JAN 1.0>0 FEB 1.0>0

So I take it this route is not happening after all...

Who knows. Could be back next week.

Quoting point2point (Reply 10):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
UA LAX-COS OCT 3>4
UA LAX-DEN OCT 8>7

Sorta looks like UA getting back at F9 for starting on the LAX-COS route?

probably

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 11):
Hmm, not sure, F9 may indeed be dropping their Vacation Express flying

F9 never flew for VaExp did they?

Quoting N766UA (Reply 19):
What do we make of this, then?

http://www.cleveland.com/business/in...t_cuts_2_others_to_cincinnati.html

I don't see the additions here. Are they seasonal?

I think that is a PR article. I believe the adds are normal seasonal adds and the cuts are permanent.

Quoting SouthernDC9 (Reply 26):
Well Delta has already said to Memphis

Exactly

Quoting EricR (Reply 29):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
US PHX-LAX SEP 8>6

Down to 6 flights per day. AA & DL's relatively recent entrance on this route combined with competition from UA & WN (5 airlines total) can't be good for margins.

Didn't they have 15 at one point?

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 32):
Didn't DL promise that they would keep all of their hubs?

Yes, but we never believed them
 
N766UA
Posts: 7843
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:09 am

Quoting enilria (Reply 37):
I think that is a PR article.

PR by/for who?

It's getting to be kind of hilarious how Cleveland's not even allowed to have good news at this point.
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flyguy89
Posts: 2004
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:43 am

Quoting N766UA (Reply 38):
Quoting enilria (Reply 37):
I think that is a PR article.

PR by/for who?

It's getting to be kind of hilarious how Cleveland's not even allowed to have good news at this point.

It's kind of like when the Cincinnati Enquirer called it a "coup" for CVG when DL added 3 flights to DTW and ATL. CLE is very much redundant in the UA network, combine that with the trend of mid-sized city hubs getting the axe and the overall declining flight numbers at CLE over the years and it would seem to indicate CLE probably won't be a hub for much longer. All of this consolidation in the industry has been sad to say the least, but it's just the reality of the times we're living in.

Quoting enilria (Reply 37):
Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 11):
Hmm, not sure, F9 may indeed be dropping their Vacation Express flying

F9 never flew for VaExp did they?

I'm not sure, I was just under the impression that they had taken over all of that charter flying.
 
masseybrown
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Mon Jun 11, 2012 4:05 am

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 39):
All of this consolidation in the industry has been sad to say the least, but it's just the reality of the times we're living in.

More than sad, really. The US is going to end up with four mega-carriers which will be considered "too big to fail"; the result will be government re-regulation. The unions should like it and maybe the bondholders, but nobody else - especially not the passengers.
 
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enilria
Topic Author
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Mon Jun 11, 2012 5:13 pm

Quoting N766UA (Reply 38):
Quoting enilria (Reply 37):
I think that is a PR article.

PR by/for who?

It's getting to be kind of hilarious how Cleveland's not even allowed to have good news at this point.

My point is that UA does seem genuinely interested in not being "the bad guy" in CLE. That article took normal seasonal adds in CLE and called them "new". Airlines only do that for PR purposes. UA is actually down in CLE YOY and is now below the service requirement in their contract since the SBN/CVG service was cancelled. It is my expecation that they will exercise the next tranche in the contract that will allow them to shrink something like 20%. I need to re-read it to remember the exact level. They could also ditch the whole deal if they are losing something like $3m/month. I do not expect that. I think they will just shrink according to the next phase of the deal.

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 39):
Quoting enilria (Reply 37):
Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 11):
Hmm, not sure, F9 may indeed be dropping their Vacation Express flying

F9 never flew for VaExp did they?

I'm not sure, I was just under the impression that they had taken over all of that charter flying.

All this flying is for Apple. I believe they are not involved with any other tour operators currently in terms of these quasi-charter/schedule flights.
 
N766UA
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Mon Jun 11, 2012 5:25 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 41):
They could also ditch the whole deal if they are losing something like $3m/month. I do not expect that. I think they will just shrink according to the next phase of the deal.

I read another article last week wherein UA's CFO said CLE was doing "pretty well." Obviously, they said the same thing before they left in the '80s, but it does seem like better news than "contract's up, we're out!"
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BoeingGuy
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Mon Jun 11, 2012 5:47 pm

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 33):
I knew as soon as I heard the merger was approved we could kiss MEM and CVG good-bye, just the reality of the industry, anyone who actually believed they would keep everything was just being naive. I don't blame DL, they're just doing what makes financial and economic sense.

Fine, but then don't lie about it. Don't try to sell a merger by promising everyone you'll keep all the hubs, but you know you have no intention of doing so.
 
PHX787
Posts: 7881
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Mon Jun 11, 2012 6:01 pm

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 43):
Fine, but then don't lie about it. Don't try to sell a merger by promising everyone you'll keep all the hubs, but you know you have no intention of doing so.

  

Quoting MasseyBrown (Reply 40):
More than sad, really. The US is going to end up with four mega-carriers which will be considered "too big to fail"; the result will be government re-regulation. The unions should like it and maybe the bondholders, but nobody else - especially not the passengers.

It's not just gonna be bad for passengers, but ALSO for the economical health of the US too.
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mariner
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Mon Jun 11, 2012 6:31 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 41):
All this flying is for Apple. I believe they are not involved with any other tour operators currently in terms of these quasi-charter/schedule flights.

Back when Frontier flew BNA-CUN, Vacation Express was involved and Frontier still has deals with Funjet - all MCI-Mexico, eg:

http://media.vaxvacationaccess.com/s...rid_CharterFlightScheduleAdobe.pdf

Although Funjet and Apple may be courting each other, they are starting to rationalize their separate schedules and use common flights.

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
wn676
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RE: OAG Changes 6/8/2012:DL/UA/US

Mon Jun 11, 2012 6:59 pm

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 36):
Quoting EricR (Reply 31):
Sorry, I intended to compare this to the days when they had double digit N/S flights to LAX.

Used to be on smaller planes too. US probably decided an upgauge in equipment was a better plan than keeping frequency high.

A lot of them were same-bank departures, where the flights would leave a few minutes apart from each other. If you compare the current flight schedule with that of 6 years ago, they operate two flights less but have lost only 76 seats.
Tiny, unreadable text leaves ample room for interpretation.

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