point2point
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DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:40 am

Sometime within the last year or two, I saw online a report that listed the number of domestic nonstop destinations from the U.S. airports. I remember ATL having the most, followed closely by DEN. I can’t find this report online for reference, perhaps someone can help me out here.

However, seeing DL cutting back some at ATL, and then despite all of the doomsday predictions of DEN, DEN has actually had quite a number of new domestic destinations added recently from UA, F9 and WN - that may now make it the top U.S. airport (at least per my observations here) in terms of number of domestic nonstop destinations. Per my own counting.....

here are the current (or soon to be) DEN nonstop domestic destinations (* designates seasonal service)

1) ABQ, 2) AIA, 3) ALS, 4) AMA, 5) ANC, 6) ASE, 7) ATL, 8) AUS, 9) BDL, 10) BFF, 11) BFL, 12) BHM, 13) BIL, 14) BIS, 15) BKG, 16) BLI*, 17) BMI, 18) BNA, 19) BOI, 20) BOS, 21) BUR, 22) BWI, 23) BZN, 24) CAK, 25) CDR, 26) CEZ, 27) CID, 28) CLE, 29) CLT, 30) CMH, 31) CNY, 32) COD, 33) COS, 34) CPR, 35) CVG, 36) CYS, 37) DAL, 38) DAY, 39) DCA, 40) DFW, 41) DIK, 42) DOC, 43) DRO, 44) DSM, 45) DTW, 46) EAR, 47) EGE, 48) ELP, 49) ERW, 50) EUG, 51) FAI*, 52) FAR, 53) FAT, 54) FCA, 55) FLL, 56) FMN, 57) FSD, 58) GCC, 59) GEG, 60) GFK (starts 10/3, 61) GFT, 62) GJT, 63) GRR, 64) GUC, 65) HDN, 66) HLN, 67) HNL, 68) HOU, 69) HSV, 70) HYS, 71) IAD, 72) IAH, 73) ICT, 74) IDA, 75) IND, 76) ISN, 77) JAC, 78) JAX, 79) JFK, 80) KOA, 81) LAR, 82) LAS, 83) LAX, 84) LBB, 85) LBF, 86) LBL, 87) LGA, 88) LIH, 89) LIT, 90) LNK, 91) MAD, 92) MAF, 93) MCI, 94) MCK, 95) MCO, 96) MDT*, 97) MDW, 98) MEM, 99) MFR, 100) MHT, 101) MIA, 102) MKE, 103) ML,I 104) MOT, 105) MSO, 106) MSP, 107) MSY, 108) MTJ, 109) MYR, 110) OAK, 111) OGG, 112) OKC, 113) OMA, 114) ONT, 115) ORD, 116) PDX, 117) PGA, 118) PHF*, 119) PHL, 120) PHX, 121) PIA, 122) PIR, 123) PIT, 124) PSC, 125) PSP, 126) PUB, 127) PVD, 128) PVU, 129) RAP, 130) RDM, 131) RD, 132) RFD, 133) RIW, 134) RKS, 135) RNO, 136) RSW, 137) SAN, 138) SAT, 139) SBA, 140) SEA, 141) SFD, 142) SFO, 143) SGF, 144) SHR, 145) SHV (starts 8/28), 146) SJC, 147) SLC, 148) SMF, 149) SNA, 150) STL, 151) TEX, 152) TPA, 153) TUL, 154) TUS, 155) TVC*, 156) TYS, 157) VEL, 158) XNA

for a total of 158 with 153 yearly and 5 seasonal destinations.

And here are the current (or soon to be) ATL nonstop domestic destinations (* designates seasonal service)

1) ABE*, 2) ABQ, 3) ABY, 4) ACY*, 5) AEX, 6) AGS, 7) AHN, 8) ALB, 9) ATW, 10) AUS, 11) AVL, 12) AVP, 13) BDL, 14) BHM, 15) BKG, 16) BMI, 17) BNA, 18) BOS, 19) BQK, 20) BTR, 21) BUF, 22) BWI, 23) BZN*, 24) CAE, 25) CAK, 26) CHA, 27) CHO, 28) CHS, 29) CID, 30) CLE, 31) CLT, 32) CMH, 33) COS, 34) CRW, 35) CSG, 36) CVG, 37) DAB, 38) DAY, 39) DCA, 40) DEN, 41) DFW, 42) DHN, 43) DSM, 44) DTW, 45) ECP, 46) EGE*, 47) ELP, 48) EVV, 49) EWN, 50) EWR, 51) EYW, 52) FAY, 53) FCA*, 54) FLL, 55) FNT, 56) FWA, 57) GNV, 58) GPT, 59) GRK, 60) GRR, 61) GRT, 62) GSO, 63) GSP, 64) HDN*, 65) HNL, 66) HOU, 67) HPN, 68) HSV, 69) IAD, 70) IAH, 71) ICT, 72) ILM, 73) IND, 74) JAC*, 75) JAN, 76) JAX, 77) JFK, 78) LAS, 79) LAX, 80) LEX, 81) LFT, 82) LGA, 83) LIT, 84) MCI, 85) MCO, 86) MCN, 87) MDT, 88) MDW, 89) MEI, 90) MEM, 91) MGM, 92) MHT, 93) MIA, 94) MKE, 95) MLB, 96) MLI, 97) MLU, 98) MOB, 99) MSN, 100) MSP, 101) MSY, 102) MTJ*, 103) MYR, 104) OAJ, 105) OKC, 106) OMA, 107) ONT, 108) ORD, 109) ORF, 110) PBI, 111) PDX, 112) PHF, 113) PHL, 114) PHX, 115) PIA, 116) PIT, 117) PNS, 118) PVD, 119) PWM, 120) RDU, 121) RIC, 122) ROA, 123) ROC, 124) RSW, 125) SAN, 126) SAT, 127) SAV, 128) SBN, 129) SDF, 130) SEA, 131) SFO, 132) SGF, 133) SHV, 134) SJC, 135) SLC, 136) SMF, 137) SNA, 138) SRQ, 139) STL, 140) SWF, 141) SYR, 142) TLH, 143) TPA, 144) TRI, 145) TUL, 146) TUS, 147) TVC* (starts 6/30), 148) TYS, 149) VLD, 150) VPS, 151) XNA

for a total of 151 with 142 yearly and 9 seasonal destinations.

The next airport is ORD, very close behind ATL with a total of 150, with 140 yearly and 10 seasonal destinations. DFW, DTW, LAS, and MSP are among the top here as well.

I counted domestic destinations as any point within the 50 states. And any flight that has at least 52 flights per year throughout the year is counted as yearly.

So as per above, has DEN taken the top spot (although unofficial) in terms of airports in the U.S. for the most number of commercial nonstop domestic destinations?

And then per the T-100, the cities of BUF, RIC, ORF, ALB, and PBI do not have nonstop service to/from DEN, but show passenger counts that could at least support nonstops on mainline from O&D alone. Will these nonstops materialize sometime soon? There could be a few more destinations as well, and certainly some regional airports such as SAF, MHK, SUN and GRI that may well feed into DEN.

I gathered my information from several sources to best have current accuracy. However, any corrections, comments, etc, are welcome.
 
mhkansan
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:52 am

MHK is actively evaluating DEN service. It will materialize in a year or more, nothing short term, afaik.

DFW is growing lots of new little spokes. GCK, MHK, GRI, JLN, etc. on Eagle. More to come!
 
HPRamper
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 12:56 am

LAS? Really, with no hub other than a large WN station. That is surprising to me.
 
point2point
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:00 am

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 2):
LAS? Really, with no hub other than a large WN station. That is surprising to me.

Remember a little airline called G4.....? That's some 45 or so destinations right there.....


 
 
bristolflyer
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:31 am

Quoting point2point (Thread starter):
doomsday predictions

What predictions? As a somewhat recent transplant to the Denver are I'd be interested to know.
Fortune favours the brave
 
point2point
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 1:51 am

Quoting bristolflyer (Reply 4):
What predictions?
DEN can't support all of the capacity that it currently has, and there's going to be lots of cuts............ it can't support three major airlines hubbing here...........

UA/CO doesn't need DEN and will leave it after the merger.....

F9 is going to go broke and will close down.... (which, who knows?) or abandon DEN altogether and find a new hub.....

WN is going to get tired of throwing all of its hard-earn $$$$ down the bottomless DEN money pit, and will cede to UA and F9 and will leave DEN.....

ZK is going to go broke and will close down..... (again, who knows?)

I think that those are the bulk of it......

And I think that everyone here has seen such posts.......


 



[Edited 2012-06-17 19:05:07]
 
dlramp4life
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 2:23 am

Quoting point2point (Reply 5):
UA/CO doesn't need DEN and will leave it after the merger....

Please explain this to me because DEN is still a crucial part of the UA system....

Quoting point2point (Reply 5):
F9 will abandon DEN altogether and find a new hub.....

And go where? DEN is still crucial to F9's operations.

Quoting point2point (Reply 5):
WN is going to get tired of throwing all of its hard-earn $$$$ down the bottomless DEN money pit, and will cede to UA and F9 and will leave DEN.....

What is the bottomless DEN money pit?

Quoting point2point (Reply 5):
ZK is going to go broke and will close down..... (again, who knows?)

Please explain to me how they are going to go broke when they set up a pretty big operation in MSP working with DL
SEA Ramp, wettest place on earth
 
HPRamper
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 2:46 am

point2point was just listing the various doomsday scenarios that have been brought up at various times...not necessarily saying any of them are legitimate.

[Edited 2012-06-17 19:46:49]
 
slcdeltarumd11
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 2:47 am

What is truly so impressive about denver is how many cities have three or four carriers. That is the impressive thing not the number of destinations
 
point2point
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 3:33 am

Quoting dlramp4life (Reply 6):
Please explain

I'm being very sarcastic to all of the DEN doomsdays posts that I read here........

DEN IS A GREAT AIRPORT!

 
 
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RWA380
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 5:54 am

Quoting point2point (Reply 9):
DEN IS A GREAT AIRPORT!

Yes it is, and a great place to break up a trans-con journey that doesn't offer a non-stop service. Stapleton sucked, but DIA is a very nice facility, I would choose it over DFW, ORD, DTW or MSP.
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slcdeltarumd11
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 6:24 am

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 7):
point2point was just listing the various doomsday scenarios that have been brought up at various times...not necessarily saying any of them are legitimate.

I think most of reading that knew what he was doing. I think they are legitimate scenarios its the timeline thats not realistic of people on here. I expect denver to keep three hubs for a while just not permanently. Its gonna take either a huge huge spike in fuel costs, frontier to finally go under, southwest high ups change, or uniteds contracts being over from the city of denver and willing to abandon the profitable small rocky mountain airports. Any of those i think are along time away but one thing is for certain Denver will be someones hub that airport will never be hubless even in this turbulant industry we have. I dont think anyone on here or anywhere can possibly see a scenario where denver is hubless which is just awesome for the city and companies considering a relocation
 
dlramp4life
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 7:22 am

Quoting point2point (Reply 9):
DEN IS A GREAT AIRPORT!

Oh yes it is a great airport. that is why I was defending (or at least trying to) in my post above.
SEA Ramp, wettest place on earth
 
mcg
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 4:29 pm

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 8):
What is truly so impressive about denver is how many cities have three or four carriers.

Four airlines to PHL is astounding to me. The converse is the very limited service to Europe.
 
boslax
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 5:50 pm

From the July 2012 schedules (OAG) - number of domestic nonstop destinations; (top 10)

DEN, 156
ATL, 153
ORD, 147
DFW, 141
MSP, 119
DTW, 117
IAH, 111
CLT, 108
PHL, 89
DCA, 87
 
point2point
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 7:08 pm

Quoting boslax (Reply 14):

From the July 2012 schedules (OAG) - number of domestic nonstop destinations; (top 10)

DEN, 156
ATL, 153
ORD, 147
DFW, 141
MSP, 119
DTW, 117
IAH, 111
CLT, 108
PHL, 89
DCA, 87

Hey, this is really cool...... and many thanks...... didn't know about this site. Is this an anyone-can-view site, or by membership? And if anyone-can-view, is it possible to post link?

At any rate, I guess DEN is tops here, and I guess that the variances may be due to seasonal flights, but these numbers are pretty close to what I got - as well as me adding in some future routes.

I'm puzzled that LAS isn't up there..... does OAG count G4?

So again, ty, and It's good to see DEN be tops in another metric.

 
 
spiritair97
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 7:12 pm

Quoting point2point (Thread starter):
4) ACY*

The only scheduled commercial service into Atlantic City is from Spirit. Delta hasn't flown into ACY in years.
 
Beechtobus
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 7:24 pm

Quoting spiritair97 (Reply 16):

Spirit flies seasonally ATL-ACY.
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 8:04 pm

Quoting boslax (Reply 14):
From the July 2012 schedules (OAG) - number of domestic nonstop destinations; (top 10)

DEN, 156
ATL, 153
ORD, 147
DFW, 141
MSP, 119
DTW, 117
IAH, 111
CLT, 108
PHL, 89
DCA, 87

I'm guessing a lot of people want to get out town (DEN).
 
slcdeltarumd11
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 8:46 pm

Quoting point2point (Reply 15):

I'm puzzled that LAS isn't up there..... does OAG count G4?

That is an excellent question G4 serves just a ton of unique cities to las. It seems hard to believe las isn't in the top ten. Ifind it hard to imagine dca has more destinations than las? Las is such massive airport o & d but it always feels to me like it has a ton of destinations also
 
boslax
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 8:56 pm

Quoting point2point (Reply 15):
I'm puzzled that LAS isn't up there..... does OAG count G4?

Good catch. G4 does not file their scheds, outside of their website. However, from another source, adding in G4, LAS has 120 nonstop destinations.
 
spiritair97
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 10:18 pm

Quoting beechtobus (Reply 17):
Spirit flies seasonally ATL-ACY.

Oh yeah, that's right. I forgot we weren't takling about just Delta.  
 
point2point
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:37 pm

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 18):
I'm guessing a lot of people want to get out town (DEN).

Yep, and it seems that there are a lot of places to fly from the airport..... at least within the 50 states......

And I'm sure a lot of people want to get into town for a while..... or at least get into DEN and then get up into the mountains.

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 8):
What is truly so impressive about denver is how many cities have three or four carriers. That is the impressive thing not the number of destinations

SEA/LAX/PHX/SLC/MSP/DTW/ATL/PHL/BOS/LGA/LAS and DEN are 11 routes that I believe currently have four carries on them. Sometime a year or two ago I remember counting an additional 25 or so routes with 3 carriers, but since then, F9 has dropped a handful of them, and then NK picks up a couple...... so I'm guesstimating about 22-23 of the 3-carrier destinations.



Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 11):
Denver will be someones hub that airport will never be hubless even in this turbulant industry we have

Or maybe likely a dual hub, or a triple hub, or even the current quadruple hub if we count ZK? And yes, it is fortunate to have a good number of options and selections with competitive fares. Yet who knows what the future will bring, and certainly any or the many number of things can happen that could upset present status at DEN?

With some 52M+ pax in 2011 (around 55% O&D), and while looking at current guesstimates by city officials here of some 62M pax at DEN by 2020 - maybe even another major airline can decide it wants a hub here too..... along with UA, F9, WN, and ZK?

Who knows, eh?

So with all of the above, we have to remember - Bluecifer
with his welcome to the airport -
to those of the New World Order -
and also to those who have scheduled to visit us from outer space......





heh-heh  
 
slcdeltarumd11
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Tue Jun 19, 2012 2:31 am

Quoting boslax (Reply 20):
Good catch. G4 does not file their scheds, outside of their website. However, from another source, adding in G4, LAS has 120 nonstop destinations.

ok so LAS is at least in the top five that seems realistic at least! Remember Allegiant doesnt fly to all destinations daily. Allegiant lists 47 destinations non stop out of LAS and very few of them have competators so they really do add alot to the airport
 
LAXdude1023
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Tue Jun 19, 2012 3:37 am

Congrats to DEN! Having the most nonstop domestic destinations in the US is a pretty awesome thing. Denver is a pretty cool city and very beautiful.   

I think what helps drive this figure is DEN's geography. DEN is located within a prop planes flight of many communities that have limited road service. Because of this, ZK has a huge operation there. Its a similar effect with ATL and CLT.

I do have to point out that the flip side of that coin is that DEN only serves 16 International destinations (by my count). Outside of Mexico and Canada, they only serve four (including the upcoming NRT service).
It is what it is...
 
gigneil
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Tue Jun 19, 2012 5:51 am

Denver, moreso than even Chicago, is ideally located in the US for connecting traffic, and there are many mountain West towns that support service to Denver due to their small size but relatively far distance from anywhere else.

That accounts for the quantity of destinations. That, and Denver is a stellar facility with 300 days of sun a year.

NS
 
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RWA380
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Tue Jun 19, 2012 10:48 am

Quoting boslax (Reply 20):
Good catch. G4 does not file their scheds, outside of their website. However, from another source, adding in G4, LAS has 120 nonstop destinations

So that makes LAS 5th instead? Seems a surprise to me, but who can argue with facts? Well at least a few will.... 
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SRT75
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Tue Jun 19, 2012 11:34 am

Quoting point2point (Thread starter):
I counted domestic destinations as any point within the 50 states.

To be fair, shouldn't you include Puerto Rico and the U.S. Virgin Islands? Those are "domestic" in that they are part of the U.S. and there is no passport requirements. Adding those may give ATL the edge?
 
Beechtobus
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Tue Jun 19, 2012 2:45 pm

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 24):

Outside Canada and Mexico, I assume the 4 international cites you mean are LHR, FRA, NRT, and KEF but don't forget F9's service to SJO, Liberia, and PUJ.

[Edited 2012-06-19 07:46:35]
 
point2point
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Tue Jun 19, 2012 5:59 pm

Quoting SRT75 (Reply 27):
To be fair, shouldn't you include Puerto Rico and the U.S. Virgin Islands? Those are "domestic" in that they are part of the U.S. and there is no passport requirements. Adding those may give ATL the edge?

If you included those, then we can add SJU, STT and STX to ATL. That's three more. If you go by the OAG count, then it's a tie. I'd like to see what's involved in the OAG count, I think that there's some seasonality factor involved, but by my count, since I counted the complete year, ATL would still not be up with DEN because my count is DEN 158 and ATL 151. And also, per the OAG changes thread posted here today, ATL is also losing SWF, so...... I still think that DEN has more even if we allow ATL to get Puerto Rico and the U.S. Virgin Islands.

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 24):
ZK has a huge operation there

ZK gives DEN 24 unique destinations, and because of ZK, it alone pushes DEN from 4th to 1st.

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 24):
I do have to point out that the flip side of that coin is that DEN only serves 16 International destinations (by my count). Outside of Mexico and Canada, they only serve four (including the upcoming NRT service).

A CAPA report ranks DEN highest among major airports around the world in terms of the percentage of domestic to international. I don't know if this is good or bad..... but hey, at least it puts DEN tops in another metric. And I think that since DEN has so much domestic capacity...... a lot of international would have to be added before any meaningful change in this percentage would be seen (like 97% to 3% if I remember). I don't think the new KEF flight or the planned NRT flight will put a dent in these percentages.

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 24):
Congrats to DEN! Having the most nonstop domestic destinations in the US is a pretty awesome thing.

Yea, it is.... DEN leads both domestically and worldwide in a number of obscure metrics, but hey..... that's setting the standard. Within the next couple of days I'm going to e-mail the DEN marketing people with this info..... maybe they are unaware of this (although maybe they aren't) and can use this info in their promotional products.



 
 
slcdeltarumd11
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Tue Jun 19, 2012 7:51 pm

I didnt want to set the OAG thread too far off topic so ill post it here

Quoting enilria (Reply 14):
United Airlines could cut its annual lease payments to Denver International Airport by $22 million a year if it ramps up its traffic at the airport, according to a deal backed Wednesday by a Denver City Council committee.
The deal is structured so that DEN-NRT and a few other tiny things meet the requirement.

Heck estimated that of DIA's other major airlines, Frontier Airlines is likely to see its annual lease payments reduced by $2 million under the deal and Southwest Airlines is likely to save $1 million.
http://www.denverpost.com/businessheadlines/ci_20598032?source%3DAP
The service increase requirement "raises the question of whether the relief United is receiving is essentially a United-centric marketing incentive masquerading as a facilities deal," wrote Robert Ashcroft, Frontier's senior vice president of finance.
The agreement was approved, Tokyo was announced the next day, and F9/WN said they would go to FAA. A DIA spokesperson said go for it.

In order to do this, they took an excess of PFC money and used it to pay off debt for projects that 88% benefited UA. Additionally, WN is now the largest O&D airline at DIA. Since customer parking is typically the largest generator of airport revenue, it is hard to imagine how UA would get 88% of the money.

Also, how about this one...DEN's PFC funds were originally fully committed. The huge surge in service by WN (F9 and UA are down from their peak) directly resulted in the PFC excess that was used to pay off UA's debt. So, the airport used revenue raised essentially exclusively from WN customers to pay off debt 88% benefiting UA.

Meanwhile, UA complains they got a raw deal in Houston. ROTFL

Doug Parker had a study recently showing IAH was one of the most profitable hubs in the USA. DEN is clearly a warzone with three carriers fighting. It was not on the list. Is "everything" profitable at IAH? Of course not. There's always a mix, but on the whole it makes a lot of money.

Enilria thanks again for another great OAG thread these are fantastic work! Denver is incredibly fascinating and is so complex

You cant really blame the airport for wanting to keep united, can you? On the other hand you cant really argue that southwest and frontier don't have a right to complain because the airport is clearly intentionally figuring out ways to help united and putting them as priority. Im sure the city and airport have realized what the three hub system has created which is ultra low fares and united has options. The airport basically is figuring out ways to legally help united main service in denver. united does offer more to denver than the other two airlines because its serves the more unique smaller cities and has the potential for international service that could really help the city so i dont blame them for wanting to keep united. At the same time it does stink for southwest and frontier who also do offer great service to denver i see both sides of this. Lets also remember the airport chose to let southwest roll into denver building all those gates on C and hurt united and frontier. Frontier is the one i think that got the worst deal out of all this arnt they? but i think the city/airport are cautious of frontiers long term financial situation which how can you blame them?

To have united and one LCC hub would be pretty awesome still and probably much more profitable and stable. The city doesn't want to end up with two LCC domestic hubs i think and none of the really small cities like ASE, EGE, DUR, etc etc with service. They want to help united and united has been reducing the number of seats out of denver for quite a while now and frontier doesn't look so hot to bet anything on long term. I dont think there was ever a real risk of united totally leaving denver but a much smaller hub was a real threat and still could be post all these contracts with the city if it remains a three hub city. For the time being the city looks like it has made united happy and them being mad at houston helps so they can play some hard ball with houston for more stuff.

Denver is always incredibly interesting to watch. It has so much going on and potential for real shake ups in the future
 
point2point
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Tue Jun 19, 2012 8:30 pm

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 30):

I think that this is in response to the OAG post..... but this may have relevance here. At any rate, thanks for the info here.

In response to the sweetheart deal that the city/airport recently gave UA, well, yes.... I believe that the city does really want to keep UA there and happy. And yes, UA has a lot to offer DEN, probably more so than F9 or WN. But in the long term, I think that the city/airport will do what it has to to keep both F9 and WN happy - and then watch all of the other carriers at DEN complain. Yet, the management there seems to be well prepared to handle this situation - a complex one of keeping three major airlines hubbing at the airport and everyone else happy. I have faith that this team is probably the best there is at doing this, and if anyone can, it's them.

With DEN's anticipated growth to 62M pax by 2012 (if one can believe these estimates) then there seems to be plenty of pie for all. And in the short term, I believe that the key to keeping three majors hubbing at DEN will be whether or not F9 is going to be showing a plus on its income statement. F9 seems to lose when it wants to expand into another airport beyond DEN, and we have a number of examples to that. Yet when F9 focuses on its Denver-centricity, it does well. And it will be positive $$$$ that F9 needs to have in order for DEN to remain the three hubber that it currently is.


 

[Edited 2012-06-19 13:38:55]
 
point2point
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RE: DEN - Most Domestic Nonstop Destinations?

Tue Jun 19, 2012 9:51 pm

Quoting point2point (Reply 31):
With DEN's anticipated growth to 62M pax by 2012

Oooops.... meant to say 2020, and didn't notice this in time for edit.....

 

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