flyaa757
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Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Mon Jun 25, 2012 10:06 pm

As has been covered in numerous other threads, AA will soon begin taking delivery of new 777-300s.

The following routes have been announced:

JFK-LHR 2x
DFW-LHR
DFW-GRU(takes 2 ac)
JFK-GRU(takes 2 ac)
LAX-LHR

This frees up 8 772s to perform other duties. Not to mention the cancellation of ORD-DEL.

So...what is AA going to do with these spare airplanes? Thoughts?

My perspective is that the 77Ws directly replace 772s which will directly replace 763s.

I believe that these 763s will then have an FC reinstalled and will replace thee 762s on transcons. There are currently 15 762s in service, with 9x JFk-lax and 4x JFK-SFO, along with a few other tags. I believe that only 10 763s will be needed - they can cut a frequency on LAX, and presumably lower need for spares due to the newer airframes. I would expect that as a result, the 15 762s and perhaps 5 or so oldest 763s will be retired.
 
Bobloblaw
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Mon Jun 25, 2012 10:26 pm

Quoting FlyAA757 (Thread starter):
My perspective is that the 77Ws directly replace 772s which will directly replace 763s.

Probably. Though this then brings up the possibility of two-class 777s in some markets. Thus an additional 777 subfleet which complicates seheduling.

Quoting FlyAA757 (Thread starter):
There are currently 15 762s in service, with 9x JFk-lax and 4x JFK-SFO, along with a few other tags. I believe that only 10 763s will be needed -

hmmmmm...the 763 would only be an improvement over the 762 pigs if one of two conditions was met.
1. They could sell the additional seats
2. Could meet additional cargo demand

I dont know what the LF is for AA on JFK-LAX/SFO, but if current demand is being met by the 762, the 763 would make things worse. Remember while the 763 has a lower CASM, it has a higher block hour costs. The 763 doesnt make sense if at least some of those additional seats can be filled. If they cant, the 762, bad as it is, is better. It is like a CRJ has much higher CASM than a 737,but if there is only demand for 45 pax, the CRJ is better cuz its block hour costs are lower.
 
LAXdude1023
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Mon Jun 25, 2012 10:50 pm

DFW-EZE has been upgraded starting in the fall to 772.
It is what it is...
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Mon Jun 25, 2012 11:12 pm

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 2):
DFW-EZE has been upgraded starting in the fall to 772.

Yeah, but isn't that just part of the seasonal upgrades for Northern Winter? DFWMAD is a 772 this summer but will revert back to a 763 the week that DFWEZE is upgraded.
confidence is silent. insecurities are loud.
 
LAXdude1023
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Mon Jun 25, 2012 11:33 pm

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 3):
Yeah, but isn't that just part of the seasonal upgrades for Northern Winter? DFWMAD is a 772 this summer but will revert back to a 763 the week that DFWEZE is upgraded.

It typically didnt upgrade until late November, this year it starts in August.
It is what it is...
 
jfk777
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:18 am

Maybe Miami to Santiago will be a 777-200ER. Miami to RIO would also be a good route for the 777 upgrade.
 
nomorerjs
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:40 am

Probably not ORD, the red-headed, step-child of the AA network.
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:54 am

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 4):
It typically didnt upgrade until late November, this year it starts in August.

You're right; interesting that they are moving forth with this during shoulder season for EZE. Last I had checked, the changes were supposed to take place in October.

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 5):
Maybe Miami to Santiago will be a 777-200ER. Miami to RIO would also be a good route for the 777 upgrade.

Maybe, but I am not counting on it. AA has been saying for years that they would switch MIASCL to a 777 and it never happened. Their experiment with DFWSCL going 10x weekly as opposed to just daily was also very short-lived. I'm convinced that AA is just content with the cargo performances on their SCL flights and not really all that concerned with chasing after premium traffic or going on the offense with increased market share by offering additional ASMs on either of those flights. Wouldn't surprise me given that their primary competitor (LAN) offers a superior premium product and quite frankly, traffic volumes to Chile from the US simply don't compare to those of Argentina and Brazil, so there is really no urgent need to dedicate two 777 airframes on their routes to Santiago.
confidence is silent. insecurities are loud.
 
na
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 9:19 am

AA needs urgent replacement for its old 767s, as they have 30 or so which are older than 1990, very old by the standards of a reputable airline and more what you would expect in the third world. I know maintenance is key and not age per se, but still, those planes surely must feature in a shortterm phase-out plan.
 
LY777
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 9:28 am

AA needs to send their 777s to CDG. The 763s they send are awful
Flown:717,727,732,734,735,738,73W,742/744/748,752,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W, 788, D8,D10,L1011, A3B2,A320,A321,A332,A343,A388
 
SCL767
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 11:43 am

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 5):
Maybe Miami to Santiago will be a 777-200ER.

Once AA reconfigures their B777-200ERs into a 2 class configuration, I would not be surprised to see them operating MIA-BOG and MIA-SCL.

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 7):
Their experiment with DFWSCL going 10x weekly as opposed to just daily was also very short-lived.

IMO, AA added additional frequencies for a specific reason, to deter UA from launching IAH-SCL.
 
Jonathanxxxx
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:11 pm

Quoting SCL767 (Reply 10):

Right, with 2 class 772's destinations such as GIG, SCL, LIM and CDG would all be logical places for up gauges in equipment without too many F class seats.
 
cedarjet
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:43 pm

I think we'll definitely see more 777 action at MIA on flights to S America. Also some of the 767 flights to Paris (from ORD etc) will become 777.

Such a shame AA are going 3-4-3. Have had many nice flights on AA 777s including in Y. Will miss having them as an option, cos 3-4-3 is really to be avoided (AF, EK, NZ, EY) unless there's no other way of getting there.
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
dirtyfrankd
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 1:22 pm

Any speculation on what new routes may be added as a result of taking delivery of new planes? Are we expecting any new international destinations in the near future (i.e., HKG, ICN, KIX, etc.?)
 
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hOMSaR
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 1:28 pm

Quoting na (Reply 8):
AA needs urgent replacement for its old 767s, as they have 30 or so which are older than 1990

I thought part of AA's Aribus/Boeing narrowbody order was to replace the older 767s...or am I thinking of Delta?
The plural of Airbus is Airbuses. Airbii is not a word.
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tommy767
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:14 pm

Would love to see an AA 777 on JFK-LAX!
"KEEP CLIMBING" -- DELTA
 
flyguy1
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:18 pm

The second daily JFK-GRU, will take up two of them.
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LAXdude1023
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:45 pm

Quoting dirtyfrankd (Reply 13):
Any speculation on what new routes may be added as a result of taking delivery of new planes? Are we expecting any new international destinations in the near future (i.e., HKG, ICN, KIX, etc.?)



Probably not. Its AA were talking about. More than likely we will see the freed up 777s on routes like MIA-GIG, DFW-FRA, and a few other routes that exist between the size of the 763 and 777. AA isnt adventurous and I cant see that being any different going forward.
It is what it is...
 
Tod
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:51 pm

Engineering has begun for a AA 772 fleet reconfig.


Tod
 
eastern023
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 2:52 pm

Quoting Jonathanxxxx (Reply 11):
Right, with 2 class 772's destinations such as GIG, SCL, LIM and CDG would all be logical places for up gauges in equipment without too many F class seats.

I agree SCL was a 772 station in the past on and off for the MIA-SCL fllight. I believe the pax and especially the cargo loads are there. I hope they upgrade the route, either that or UA needs to make the move in. I know if UA was to open SCL would be logically from IAH, but I feel like IAD would be a good seller for all of us Mid Atlantic pax.
AA will Rise Again!
 
ORDJOE
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 4:36 pm

Rumored might see DFW-China with the 772. I think the 763 will be around for a while, the 772 is too much plane for some of their 763 routes. Would be nice to see ORD-S. America, but neither AA or UA has been expanding international ops from ORD.
 
777STL
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 4:54 pm

Quoting ordjoe (Reply 20):
I think the 763 will be around for a while, the 772 is too much plane for some of their 763 routes.

I agree. The 772 might be able to replace the 763 on some of the more popular routes, but there's quite a jump in capacity between a two class 763 and a two class 772, especially when you consider that the 772s will also be going to 3-4-3 in Y. A 772 certainly can't replace the 763 across the board.

I'm rather curious to see if HNL will see a two class 772 at some point, perhaps seasonally.
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cat3dual
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 5:13 pm

Quoting FlyAA757 (Thread starter):
So...what is AA going to do with these spare airplanes? Thoughts?

Return them to the lessors?
 
lhcvg
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 5:30 pm

Quoting 777STL (Reply 21):
I agree. The 772 might be able to replace the 763 on some of the more popular routes, but there's quite a jump in capacity between a two class 763 and a two class 772, especially when you consider that the 772s will also be going to 3-4-3 in Y. A 772 certainly can't replace the 763 across the board.

I'm rather curious to see if HNL will see a two class 772 at some point, perhaps seasonally.

See what DL and UA have done with 764s and two-class 777s. There are various routes where the range, cargo, and/or pax demand is larger than a 763, but which have less premium demand than would normally justify a 777. Those will vary some between carriers and alliances, but will be good candidates for refitted 2-class 772s at AA. There may also be some current 767 routes where AA is using that in lieu of a 777 because they can't spare a triple due to lower premium demand, but where a 2-class one might work fine.
 
kl911
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 5:35 pm

Quoting FlyAA757 (Thread starter):
So...what is AA going to do with these spare airplanes? Thoughts?

Selling or returning to lessor? These old 777 types must be getting to the point that maintenance cost and fuel are getting to high.
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 6:17 pm

Quoting ordjoe (Reply 20):
Would be nice to see ORD-S. America, but neither AA or UA has been expanding international ops from ORD.

AA is not going to re-start/re-launch ORD-S. America flights anytime soon. I feel like this keeps being brought up every 3 weeks, but the risks and costs are exceptionally high, and the yields are simply not there. It is futile for AA to connect Chicago with the Southern Hemisphere considering they run 9X daily flights to MIA and hourly shuttles to DFW to suit this purpose.
confidence is silent. insecurities are loud.
 
AF086
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 6:29 pm

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 17):
Probably not. Its AA were talking about. More than likely we will see the freed up 777s on routes like MIA-GIG, DFW-FRA, and a few other routes that exist between the size of the 763 and 777. AA isnt adventurous and I cant see that being any different going forward.

Two 772 could (finally) go to one of MIA-GIG's services. One of the freed up 763s could be used to boost DFW-GIG to 5x weekly perhaps.

[Edited 2012-06-26 11:29:49]
Please insert a "smart" joke here.
 
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lightsaber
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 6:49 pm

Does AA have 772s parked? It seems odd they wouldn't fully utilize the fleet, even in this economy.

Quoting kl911 (Reply 24):
These old 777 types must be getting to the point that maintenance cost and fuel are getting to high.

The RR powered 77Es are still competitive. The only issue is on routes competing with the latest A333s (lower CASM). Eventually, the 787 will be an issue too, but not until large numbers enter the fleet. The 777 has unusually low 'acceleration of maintenance costs,' so we'll see them around a while.

Are these owned or leased? Since everything at AA is in hock, I would expect the later.

Lightsaber
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American 767
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 9:02 pm

Quoting LY777 (Reply 9):
AA needs to send their 777s to CDG.

They did at one time, back in the early 2000s. AA 44/45 JFK-CDG-JFK used to be a 777.

Quoting LY777 (Reply 9):
The 763s they send are awful

They are not awful at all, I've flown on those numerous times.

Quoting hOMSAr (Reply 14):
I thought part of AA's Aribus/Boeing narrowbody order was to replace the older 767s...or am I thinking of Delta?

Yes, the 762s are to be replaced with the A321 NEOs at some point on the transcon routes. However, the NEOs might not yet be ready for delivery by the time the last 762 leaves the fleet in 2015 or early 2016 at the latest so an interim solution would be to phase in the 763s (or the Int'l 752s like Delta did) while waiting for the NEOs.
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LAXdude1023
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Tue Jun 26, 2012 9:13 pm

Quoting American 767 (Reply 28):
AA needs to send their 777s to CDG.

They did at one time, back in the early 2000s. AA 44/45 JFK-CDG-JFK used to be a 777.

DFW-CDG operated on a 777 for a summer a couple of years ago.
It is what it is...
 
eastern023
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Wed Jun 27, 2012 2:27 am

Quoting American 767 (Reply 28):
They are not awful at all, I've flown on those numerous times.

I think he/she meant if you fly Y on the the 763. The last one I flew had broken ceiling paneling. Seats were broken and some of the overhead TV (no pvtvs) were non functioning. Don't even get me started with the catering. It sounds like AA is trying to clean up their act. As far as awful, they're awful old and tired looking.
AA will Rise Again!
 
OB1504
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Wed Jun 27, 2012 3:40 am

Quoting eastern023 (Reply 30):
I think he/she meant if you fly Y on the the 763. The last one I flew had broken ceiling paneling. Seats were broken and some of the overhead TV (no pvtvs) were non functioning. Don't even get me started with the catering. It sounds like AA is trying to clean up their act. As far as awful, they're awful old and tired looking.

The experience might also depend on whether you get one of the original 763s delivered from 1988 to 1995, or one from the never 1998/1998 or 2003 batches.

[Edited 2012-06-26 20:41:33]
 
LipeGIG
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Wed Jun 27, 2012 3:58 am

Quoting flyguy1 (Reply 16):
The second daily JFK-GRU, will take up two of them.

No, they will use 2 frames that would be parked during the day. How many 772's stay on ground at JFK during the day ? I know that EZE and GRU arrives early morning.

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 5):
Maybe Miami to Santiago will be a 777-200ER. Miami to RIO would also be a good route for the 777 upgrade.

Before MIA-GIG i hope they will put the 772 back on JFK-GIG. In my view, and i flew 2 times on F (1 with FF miles, 1 paying), the last one, both JFK-GIG and GIG-JFK were packed on F/J/Y. AA got good loads, but i don't know how it means in terms of yields. They revert back to 763 (but daily this time) and the flight performs very well on J. Flying again to Rio this week for some meetings and both ways the flights looks very busy on Business. AA shall compete better also as JJ is about to announce 77W on GRU-JFK to begin Nov 5 and will fly GIG-JFK daily the week after.
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
 
flyguy1
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RE: Where Are AA's 772s Going?

Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:52 am

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 32):

As of this summer, 3 777 come into JFK early am. One goes on to LHR, but that still leaves 3 parked up (including a late LHR arrival from the night before)
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