gothamspotter
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:25 pm

Reports today that Airbus may announce on Monday plans to build an A320 assembly plant in Mobile, Alabama.

The biggest reason cited has been to convince US carriers to buy Airbus planes. But do you think Delta and United really care where their planes are made? Maybe Airbus just wants to reduce their labor costs, which are undoubtedly lower in right-to-work Alabama than they are in France.

http://www.nycaviation.com/2012/06/airbus-build-a320-factory-alabama
 
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STT757
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:28 pm

This is the link to the NY Times article referenced:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/28/bu...t-us-plant.html?_r=2&smid=tw-share
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
phxa340
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:46 pm

UA is about to buy the MAX, DL has signed up for 100 737-900s, AA has already bought a ton of NEOs OEOs, NGs and MAXs so that leaves US which is already in the Airbus bag anyways. I don't think they are doing this for more American (US airline) orders. Alabama has VERY friendly labor laws to corporations so I am betting its Airbus hedging themselves against an expensive Euro and taking advantage of low labor prices.
 
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EPA001
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:51 pm

Quoting phxa340 (Reply 2):
Alabama has VERY friendly labor laws to corporations so I am betting its Airbus hedging themselves against an expensive Euro and taking advantage of low labor prices.

Those are strong arguments in favor of Airbus doing so. A move which was not unexpected I guess.
 
point2point
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:52 pm

The majority of those in Alabama, along with a lot of Southern states, sure seem to be railing a lot against the European policies, cultures and attitudes. But when it comes to business, oh well, the more the better, eh?

Money sure talks......



 
 
phxa340
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:53 pm

Quoting EPA001 (Reply 3):
Those are strong arguments in favor of Airbus doing so. A move which was not unexpected I guess.

Airbus is a very well run company , and well run companies often hedge themselves against over/under valued currencies so I am guessing it is a matter of when not if.
 
AWACSooner
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:57 pm

Quoting phxa340 (Reply 2):
UA is about to buy the MAX,

Really? Care to supply a source?
 
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rotating14
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:06 pm

Quoting AWACSooner (Reply 6):

Its been talked about and there was even a thread regarding it.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...s-ual-boeing-idUSBRE84304D20120504  
 
eaa3
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:06 pm

This is great. I had the feeling that they would do this. Will there be any Lockheed involvement?

I guess they will push up the NEO production rates which is just what is needed.
 
phxa340
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:08 pm

Quoting point2point (Reply 4):
The majority of those in Alabama, along with a lot of Southern states, sure seem to be railing a lot against the European policies, cultures and attitudes.

I seriously doubt that Southern States will be railing against massive job creation  
 
strfyr51
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:11 pm

Quoting AWACSooner (Reply 6):

Yeah!! I'd like to know about that m'self Especially since I Work for United and I haven't heard any such thing. It Could Happen since We're down over 106 airplanes from where we should be.
 
eaa3
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:12 pm

Quoting phxa340 (Reply 9):
I seriously doubt that Southern States will be railing against massive job creation

They already have quite a few European car factories.
 
ATLgaUSA
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:12 pm

Quoting phxa340 (Reply 9):
Quoting point2point (Reply 4):
The majority of those in Alabama, along with a lot of Southern states, sure seem to be railing a lot against the European policies, cultures and attitudes.

The majority of those in Southern states are railing against governments spending more money than they take in. I'm sure Airbus, as a business, understands the concept of fiscal responsibility. Therefore, there shouldn't be much of a conflict.
 
BMI727
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:24 pm

Quoting gothamspotter (Thread starter):
But do you think Delta and United really care where their planes are made?

No. This is all about reducing costs.
Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
 
jpetekyxmd80
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:26 pm

Quoting point2point (Reply 4):

The majority of those in Alabama, along with a lot of Southern states, sure seem to be railing a lot against the European policies, cultures and attitudes. But when it comes to business, oh well, the more the better, eh?

I'll certainly enjoy the irony. Been waiting quite a while for this to finally come out. Everybody wins, IMO.
The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
 
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zeke
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:32 pm

I wonder what sort of A320 factory it will be ....

A320 only, or to include the A319 & A321, NEO or no NEO.

The plant in China seems to be working well.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
 
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par13del
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:34 pm

Quoting gothamspotter (Thread starter):
The biggest reason cited has been to convince US carriers to buy Airbus planes.

Let's see, the USA already has the carrier with the largest Airbus fleet - US Airways - and when you count UA, DL, B6, NK fleets you get additional numbers which are quite impressive in Boeings backyard, and all this was done with a/c being built / asembled in Europe and flown across the pond, so I question that reason.

Now if folks want to revisit the idea of currency hedging between the US Dollar and the Euro I would give that more credibility. In any event, unless it is a obsolete A320 classic line being packaged and shipped across the pond to create space for the NEO lines, I would expect the Europe unions to raise merry hell since there is no military offset which was going to compensate for the tanker deal.
 
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rotating14
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:35 pm

Quoting strfyr51 (Reply 10):
Yeah!! I'd like to know about that m'self Especially since I Work for United and I haven't heard any such thing. It Could Happen since We're down over 106 airplanes from where we should be.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...s-ual-boeing-idUSBRE84304D20120504

http://airnation.net/2012/04/24/united-737-order-boeing/

http://www.sharewellnewswire.com/ord...eing-finalized-by-united-airlines/

http://www.bizjournals.com/albuquerq...t-united-airlines-to-make-10b.html


The likelihood of this order not happening is just as likely as WN ordering a fleet of 777's,   
 
point2point
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:41 pm

Quoting phxa340 (Reply 9):
I seriously doubt that Southern States will be railing against massive job creation

hmmmmmmm?

Quoting ATLgaUSA (Reply 12):
The majority of those in Southern states are railing against governments spending more money than they take in. I'm sure Airbus, as a business, understands the concept of fiscal responsibility. Therefore, there shouldn't be much of a conflict.

AIrbus has never, ever taken any monies from any governments?

Quoting jpetekyxmd80 (Reply 14):
I'll certainly enjoy the irony. Been waiting quite a while for this to finally come out. Everybody wins, IMO.

  

All the best.......

 
 
bhmdiversion
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:44 pm

Reports from Mobile were saying that this would be occupying the land that Airbus wanted to use for their Tanker deal that Boeing ended up getting. Airbus already has an MRO in BFM (I beleive) that is pretty proficient in Airbus technology.

Good to finally see something good come to this state... For those of you interested, here is a list of International Companies here in Alabama include:

Mercedes Benz
Hyandai
Toyota
Boeing
ThyssenKrupp Steel
LG
JVC
Sony
Michelin
 
PlaneAdmirer
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:55 pm

Quoting point2point (Reply 4):
The majority of those in Alabama, along with a lot of Southern states, sure seem to be railing a lot against the European policies, cultures and attitudes. But when it comes to business, oh well, the more the better, eh?

Let's see BMW in Spartansburg is the largest volume auto plant in the US and produces for domestic and export markets. Mercedes is in Alabama so is Hyundai. Nissan is in Tennessee and so is VW in Chattanooga specifically. Freightliner is in North Carolina and owned by Daimler. Michelin is in South Carolina. Honda is in Alabama, Ohio, Indiana, . Toyota is in Mississippi, West Virginia, Kentucky, Texas, and Indiana. Volvo Trucks has 1.6 million square feet in Virginia.

Maybe this is about business and not about stereotypes.

Or if we must stick to a stereotype let's reverse your statement: The majority of those in France, along with the rest of Europe, sure seem to be railing a lot against the policis of the southern states, cultures, and attitudes. But it when it comes to business, oh well, the more the better, eh?

[Edited 2012-06-27 15:58:36]

[Edited 2012-06-27 16:07:22]

[Edited 2012-06-27 16:07:53]
 
bennett123
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:58 pm

Would you regard a Boeing factory in China as a good thing as well.
 
PlaneAdmirer
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:02 pm

Quoting bennett123 (Reply 23):
Would you regard a Boeing factory in China as a good thing as well.

If the technology and methods stayed with Boeing and weren't appropriated and if the profits flowed to back to the company, yes.
 
PPVRA
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:02 pm

Quoting bennett123 (Reply 23):
Would you regard a Boeing factory in China as a good thing as well.

Embraer has a factory in China. Apparently they have decided it's a good thing.
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
zhiao
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:03 pm

I think people greatly overstate Alabama's low wages. First of all, using the current exchange rates, French full time equivalent wage in 2010 was about $43,000. In Alabama, using the same definition, it was $42,000. Now of course this is for the whole economy and not the manufacturing sector, but it puts to rest the myth that Alabama is low wage. Perhaps there is still an adv in AL vs FR because of the more flexible labor laws and flexibility. It's not just about compensation.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_...ountries_by_average_wage#section_2
 
peanuts
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:05 pm

Airbus is getting smart. Gotta spread the risk a bit. When the french strike, Alabama can keep on humming along...
Americans have a great work ethic.
 
phxa340
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:12 pm

Quoting zhiao (Reply 27):
French full time equivalent wage in 2010 was about $43,000. In Alabama, using the same definition, it was $42,000.

Its not just about wages. It is about Holidays, benefits, taxes, worker productivity , overtime rules etc ...
 
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Stitch
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:26 pm

Not a surprising move by Airbus and certainly a prudent one - especially if the Eurozone weakens or even collapses (as a currency - NOT as an economy).

Quoting zeke (Reply 15):
I wonder what sort of A320 factory it will be ....

A320 only, or to include the A319 & A321, NEO or no NEO.

I could see them starting with the A320-200 (as it is the most popular variant) and then adding others if conditions warrant.
 
PPVRA
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:28 pm

Quoting zhiao (Reply 27):

You gotta look up Unit Labor Costs. Compensation can be the same or even higher in one country, but it can have an overall lower ULC.
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
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Polot
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:33 pm

Quoting PPVRA (Reply 32):
You gotta look up Unit Labor Costs. Compensation can be the same or even higher in one country, but it can have an overall lower ULC.

  
Much of Europe practically take an entire month off in the middle of the summer, that alone probably costs Airbus millions.
 
threeifbyair
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:34 pm

How much is the subsidy package worth? This probably has a lot to do with where the factory is located.

I'm surprised that Texas and Georgia, 2 states with aviation manufacturing histories (not to mention fewer hurricanes in Fort Worth and Marietta) can't seem to compete for the new plants, but perhaps these states are unwilling to subsidize A/B to the same extent as Alabama and South Carolina.
 
PHX787
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Wed Jun 27, 2012 11:35 pm

Money isn't just talking, it's screaming in our ear.

Good news for the alabama economy though~


I think this may be for AA and US being burgeoning A customers
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nomorerjs
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 12:50 am

Business will go where they can utilize a good labor pool and cost advantages. Most southern US states are "Right to Work" states with less unionized labor that offers a better economic environment to do business in. BMW moved production to the southern US to take advantage of this.

If you run a company and had to chose a place to manufacture in where would you chose? EU (some countires with 35 hour work weeks and retirement at 60 or 55), rust belt USA, similar to EU, but retirement kicks in a few years later, or the southern US (Right to Work, lower cost of living, etc.).

People bash the southern US "rednecks" as non-cosmopolitan, but they do a great job and many companies do business there. I applaud Airbus for opening a line in the US. While it may not generate significant orders for 320s, it will be beneficial to Airbus shareholders as the company is doing what any well run business would do, go where you can afford to do business! Washington state and policies drove Boeing to SC, and EU policies are drving Airbus to the southern US. If policies towards business in Alabama change, Airbus will just move elsewhere (Mexico, Brazil, Colombia, India, etc.), Boeing and others will do the same.

Welcome to the global world!
 
jetblueguy22
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 1:04 am

How would the pieces come together? From my understanding the pieces for the planes are made all across Europe. Would they ship the pieces from Europe and assemble them in Alabama or would they build up an American supply chain? This is a pretty interesting move and if it does come to happen good luck to Airbus!
Blue
Look at sweatpants guy. This is a 90 million dollar aircraft, not a Tallahassee strip club
 
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Stitch
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 1:15 am

Quoting jetblueguy22 (Reply 38):
How would the pieces come together? From my understanding the pieces for the planes are made all across Europe. Would they ship the pieces from Europe and assemble them in Alabama or would they build up an American supply chain?

A fair bit of the content comes from America, but I would imagine that the current European subs would be used for major structural sections and they would be shipped over as I am not sure the A300-600ST has the legs. Then again, maybe Airbus will finally build the A340-600ST.  
Airbus A340-600ST Super Transporter Concept
 
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MillwallSean
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 1:21 am

Having production in every region reduces risk. Currency risks and similar.
Airbus is also debating whether to stop using the Dollar for sales/purchasing and use more local currencies. (Quite a few major EU companies have already started this, using both Euro and/or Yuan as their main trading currencies - H&M is the most recent example)
US dollar for North America and North American aircrafts produced locally makes a huge difference in risk reduction when lead times are a decade.

I guess with the world changing its a good thing. Being able to have a few production units also makes the company less vulnerable to industrial action.
No One Likes Us - We Dont Care.
 
col
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 1:22 am

This is great news, should have been a tanker plant to begin with, but that is history now. The China plant is doing well, even though the Chinese are developing their own, but they would have done this anyway. Even though they open this plant it may not produce all the narrow bodies for that market. China still gets supplied narrow bodies from Europe, so I do not see this changing for USA.



Exciting times for USA and Airbus.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 31):
Quoting zeke (Reply 15):
I wonder what sort of A320 factory it will be ....

A320 only, or to include the A319 & A321, NEO or no NEO.

I could see them starting with the A320-200 (as it is the most popular variant) and then adding others if conditions warrant.

My money would be on 320/321, then over to NEO.
 
bohica
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 1:50 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 39):
A fair bit of the content comes from America, but I would imagine that the current European subs would be used for major structural sections and they would be shipped over as I am not sure the A300-600ST has the legs.

The A300-600ST can make a stop or two on the way across the pond. That's not the issue. I don't think Airbus has enough of them to meet demand. I'm sure they could build several more if they need to. Does Airbus still have the Guppies?

Quoting Stitch (Reply 39):
maybe Airbus will finally build the A340-600ST.

I think that might be a bit of overkill. I can see an A330ST though.  
 
RDUDDJI
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:07 am

More good news for AL's manufacturing industry. I have to give Airbus credit, this is a smart move. Cheaper production costs in the World's top narrow body market...

Quoting PlaneAdmirer (Reply 21):
Let's see BMW in Spartansburg is the largest volume auto plant in the US and produces for domestic and export markets.

Not true. BMW's tact times (and those of most German manufacturers) are 50-100% longer than those of US manfs. Asian plants are even faster than US plants. BMW produces about 1,000 cars a day between the *two* plants in GSP. GM produces far more than that at many of their plants, some of which run 24/6. BMW only has two shifts (currently). BMW's output will increase over the next few years when they get the X4 and a 5 series line, but they are still quite slow compared to non-German manufacturers.
Sometimes we don't realize the good times when we're in them
 
flybyguy
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:41 am

Airbus opening up a factory in Alabama is a good thing. I think growth in the technology sector will allow that region to attract highly educated people and to be introduced to new ideas, new nationalities and international culture. Maybe through this kind of change, southern states may employ greater moderation on social and political issues.
"Are you a pretender... or a thoroughbred?!" - Professor Matt Miller
 
thomasphoto60
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 3:07 am

Quoting flybyguy (Reply 44):
Airbus opening up a factory in Alabama is a good thing. I think growth in the technology sector will allow that region to attract highly educated people and to be introduced to new ideas, new nationalities and international culture. Maybe through this kind of change, southern states may employ greater moderation on social and political issues.

WOW.. just...WOW!
"Show me the Braniffs"
 
zhiao
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 3:08 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 31):
Not a surprising move by Airbus and certainly a prudent one - especially if the Eurozone weakens or even collapses (as a currency - NOT as an economy).

What's the difference.

Quoting PPVRA (Reply 32):
You gotta look up Unit Labor Costs. Compensation can be the same or even higher in one country, but it can have an overall lower ULC.

Labor compensation per hour WORKED for latest year available, in manufacturing sector, using current exchange rates, puts both countries at roughly the same level. AL, being a lower wage state, is therefore no doubt lower than that of FR, however it's not this huge difference that everybody expects. AL afterall is still part of the US.

http://stats.oecd.org/
 
zhiao
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 3:13 am

Quoting flybyguy (Reply 44):
Airbus opening up a factory in Alabama is a good thing. I think growth in the technology sector will allow that region to attract highly educated people and to be introduced to new ideas, new nationalities and international culture. Maybe through this kind of change, southern states may employ greater moderation on social and political issues.

More blue collar workers will do no such thing. AL has excellent, large universities, which already attract a large amount of talented people and "culture," more than any manufacturing plant could ever do. Get your facts s8.

[Edited 2012-06-27 20:15:12]
 
DeltaB717
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 3:21 am

Quoting par13del (Reply 16):
numbers which are quite impressive in Boeings backyard, and all this was done with a/c being built / asembled in Europe and flown across the pond, so I question that reason.

I also doubt this decision is an attempt to attract more orders, but you have to admit having the same, or a subset of the same, product built with cheaper labour AND not having to be ferried across the Atlantic does make that product a little more attractive.
 
peanuts
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 3:32 am

Quoting thomasphoto60 (Reply 45):
WOW.. just...WOW!

I think it says more about his intolerance and lack of depth than it says about the great people of Alabama...
 
juantrippe82
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 3:49 am

Quoting gothamspotter (Thread starter):
The biggest reason cited has been to convince US carriers to buy Airbus planes. But do you think Delta and United really care where their planes are made? Maybe Airbus just wants to reduce their labor costs, which are undoubtedly lower in right-to-work Alabama than they are in France.


You mean the right to work for less, but I digress. But this is probably better for Airbus, it reduces the risk and increases production.
Don't worry, I'm never wrong.
 
juantrippe82
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 4:06 am

http://blog.al.com/live/2012/06/airbus_set_to_announce_a320_pr.html

Wow, providing tax breaks and subsidies. Kinda flies in the face of the free market doesn't it?
Don't worry, I'm never wrong.
 
juantrippe82
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 4:08 am

Sorry I meant the word "incentives"
Don't worry, I'm never wrong.
 
BCEaglesCO757
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 4:15 am

My mom is from and lives in Mobile with a number of other relatives. Myself I was born and raised in Boston,but lived in Mobile for about a year and a half and visit often.

On one hand..I'm happy to see the area get some jobs ( I will say I hope some people are in the loop or know.Seemed to me jobs considered good there where hard to break into: Papermill,Chevron, etc )

On the other hand, I'm guessing the workers will be third party......not Airbus employees. Benefits so-so, and pay comparable to Boeing but perhaps lower.

I'm all for people having a job and working. I'm also all for a company paying people what they are worth to produce their goods. Which is IMO I feel unions come in by trying to make companies honest in doing so. But there will always be a segment of our population that thinks they are bad altogether.

Knowing the demographics of Mobile, how do they feel about working for such a 'socialistic' French company heavily sudsidized by the government ?

If there is anything about this story and knowing Mobile....I find that part funny and ironic.

All said, good luck to those in Mobile looking for work and getting a job at the new plant. Best wishes.
 
madog
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Official: Airbus Announce A320 Factory In Alabama

Thu Jun 28, 2012 4:21 am

for low labour costs, i'd imagine the Tianjin factory in China would be ideal for Airbus?