jetskipper
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UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 11:50 am

Starting October 15th, UA (sCAL) will no longer operate IAH-CDG.
 
cat3dual
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 11:51 am

Meaning the flight returns to PMUA metal, or the sector is gone entirely?
 
avi8
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 11:53 am

WHAT?!! This is a surprise to me, truly. Does anyone know why the flight will end? What will happen to the spare aircraft? Maybe they could operate it with the 787 once it arrives.
avi8

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DLD9S
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:18 pm

Well that is a nice little gift for AF.
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jfklganyc
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:21 pm

It's because of Love Field! I mean Hobby Airport! Or...

See we told you!  
 
peanuts
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:31 pm

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 4):
It's because of Love Field! I mean Hobby Airport! Or...

Didn't you hear? WN is starting HOU-CCS next week so UA has no need for IAH-CDG...  
 
SRT75
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:44 pm

Could this be seasonal?

Doesn't Total have its U.S. headquarters in Houston?

Quoting peanuts (Reply 5):
Didn't you hear? WN is starting HOU-CCS next week

You mean HOU-PHX-LAS-MEX-PTY-CCS? But, you get a glass of soda and a snack box on most sectors!
 
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STT757
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:46 pm

Quoting avi8 (Reply 2):
What will happen to the spare aircraft?

I don't know exactly, but EWR-CDG is going from 2x daily 757 to 2x daily 1 764, 1 757.
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drerx7
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:54 pm

I could see this being related to 762 retirement and I could see the 763 sUA going on it. I'd be shocked if they cancelled this route completely. I wouldn't put it past them though.
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FSDan
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:58 pm

UA's thank you gift for AF dropping EWR-CDG?  

On a more serious note, there probably is more traffic originating in IAH and going beyond CDG than there is originating in CDG and going beyond IAH. There are many connections available through CDG to Europe, North Africa, the Middle East, and India. I would imagine that the AF flight is especially popular with any oil traffic going to North Africa.

The O&D probably goes to both airlines right now, but perhaps AF is favored for better service.
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calpsafltskeds
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:05 pm

Simple, UA is in Star, that's why IAH-FRA was started. CDG was flown when CO was ins SkyTeam. UA can funnel CDG traffic through IAD and EWR. Who knows, maybe it will go seasonal.
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drerx7
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:12 pm

Quoting CALPSAFltSkeds (Reply 10):
CDG was flown when CO was ins SkyTeam. UA can funnel CDG traffic through IAD and EWR. Who knows, maybe it will go seasonal.

CO flew IAH-CDG yeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaars before any of this alliance business started. I know AF goes seasonal in the Jan/Feb timeframe from 6x weekly to daily. AF currently uses a 77W on the route.
Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
 
mogandoCI
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:17 pm

Quoting STT757 (Reply 7):

I don't know exactly, but EWR-CDG is going from 2x daily 757 to 2x daily 1 764, 1 757.

Another victim of the merger - now that UA/CO has 2.5 European hubs (EWR, IAD, and 0.5 in the form of ORD), the business case for non-star-hub European routes out of IAH without multiple corporate contracts is weakening by the day =(
 
IAHFLYR
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:20 pm

Incredible. CDG has been a fixture for years out of IAH, guess this Slimezek run airline is truly seeking to eliminate Houston from their route structure piece by piece. What will leave the schedule next from IAH, NRT, SFO, and EWR?   

Quoting SRT75 (Reply 6):
You mean HOU-PHX-LAS-MEX-PTY-CCS?

You left out MAF and ELP from the HOU-PHX leg!
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tommy767
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:21 pm

Eh, this isn't all that surprising. Wonder if IAH-AMS will be toast next?
"KEEP CLIMBING" -- DELTA
 
drerx7
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:23 pm

Quoting tommy767 (Reply 14):
Eh, this isn't all that surprising. Wonder if IAH-AMS will be toast next?

No. UA has corporate contracts on that route and currently operates 764. The rumor has it that this route will be going 787 early on. CDG has been a very weak performer for UA from IAH since they left Skyteam.
Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
 
codc10
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:24 pm

Smisek's favorite saying is that he has no "sacred cows". If a given route isn't performing well, it goes. Plain and simple.

CDG has more than ample service from EWR/ORD/IAD for a SkyTeam hub. Perhaps we will finally see IAH-MUC or ZRH next summer?
 
traindoc
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:33 pm

Hope that this is being done for rational, not punitive reasons! It is hard for me to believe that their is NO market for IAH-CDG on UA! On the other hand, with the degradation in customer service on the "new" UA, nothing would surprise me. As a longtime CO flyer (1K now) it pains me to see the slide downhill. As consistent as the poor service has been this year, I am starting to believe that this is what management wants.
 
cat3dual
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:41 pm

Quoting cat3dual (Reply 1):

Meaning the flight returns to PMUA metal, or the sector is gone entirely?

Just realized my mistake; misread it as IAD. Hadn't had my coffee yet before I replied.
 
tommy767
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:42 pm

Quoting CODC10 (Reply 16):
CDG has more than ample service from EWR/ORD/IAD for a SkyTeam hub. Perhaps we will finally see IAH-MUC or ZRH next summer?

Anywhere from IAH to Europe is a very long flight and costly to fly. UA is likely maximizing opportunities via the other hubs in order to not operate such expensive sectors. Remember, CO only had two prime international hubs. Now with United they can split the hub flights to Europe between IAH, IAD, EWR, ORD, SFO, LAX.

Quoting drerx7 (Reply 15):

I'd be concerned since AMS is a major sky team hub.
"KEEP CLIMBING" -- DELTA
 
DFWHeavy
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:42 pm

This just chaps my A**. There is no way UA can't make a daily flight to Paris work from Houston. That is like saying you can't get a monkey to eat a banana.

If UA can't make a daily Houston-Paris flight work, they have some serious issues on their hands. If they are doing it in retaliation to WN over at HOU, then I will renounce my flying on them.
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ripcordd
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:42 pm

CDG is a weak performer for a lot of people who arnt in the Skyteam alliance.
 
CALMSP
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:45 pm

Quoting drerx7 (Reply 15):

  

Quoting DFWHeavy (Reply 20):

why is that? Its a different ball game than AF. UA is not generating the traffic beyond CDG, it is relying solely on terminating passengers, and those pax may or may not be transiting through ORD/IAD/EWR rather than flying to IAH.
 
tommy767
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:46 pm

Quoting DFWHeavy (Reply 20):

This just chaps my A**. There is no way UA can't make a daily flight to Paris work from Houston. That is like saying you can't get a monkey to eat a banana.

It's really not as bad as you would think. Europe's ecnonomy is in the s***er and weak performers get dropped. UA even dropped EWR-CPH and made EWR-FCO, IAD-DME only seasonal -- First time they have ever done this.
"KEEP CLIMBING" -- DELTA
 
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kgaiflyer
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:46 pm

Quoting DLD9S (Reply 3):
Well that is a nice little gift for AF.

Oh well. I'm a UA 1-K, and even I fly AF IAD-CDG.

I just hope AF fares don't go crazy.
 
steex
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:47 pm

Quoting tommy767 (Reply 19):
I'd be concerned since AMS is a major sky team hub.

I think there's too much oil business on IAH-AMS for it to be in danger.
 
cat3dual
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:49 pm

Quoting DFWHeavy (Reply 20):
There is no way UA can't make a daily flight to Paris work from Houston.

Actually, there is a way: exiting Skyteam, Brent crude hovering around $100 a barrel, and no connecting traffic at the termination point means United will (and rightly so) cut its losses and deploy the aircraft elsewhere; or send them to desert in the 767-200ER's case.
 
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kgaiflyer
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:49 pm

Quoting kgaiflyer (Reply 24):
Oh well. I'm a UA 1-K, and even I fly AF IAD-CDG.

I just hope AF fares don't go crazy.

Ooops My bad. I misread the header.

That's what I get for being out all night.   
 
mogandoCI
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:50 pm

Quoting DFWHeavy (Reply 20):
This just chaps my A**. There is no way UA can't make a daily flight to Paris work from Houston. That is like saying you can't get a monkey to eat a banana.

In other monkey-banana related news, AA doesn't fly either JFK-AMS or JFK-FRA.
 
tommy767
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:51 pm

Quoting cat3dual (Reply 26):

Or, use that a/c to expand to a georaphical region that makes more sense from Houston: SOUTH AMERICA!
"KEEP CLIMBING" -- DELTA
 
tsnamm
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:53 pm

Quoting STT757 (Reply 7):

I don't know exactly, but EWR-CDG is going from 2x daily 757 to 2x daily 1 764, 1 757

EWR was downgraded to a 757 for the last couple of months, and is supposed to go back to a 764 in Jan...EWR was always a wide body on at least 1 segment until this year...its about time they got it back.
 
2travel2know2
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:57 pm

PAR has been a Continental destination a very long time. Seeing it go completely because UA is sad and upsetting.
UA is saying that IAH-CDG can't even support seasonal 4 per week service any-more?

Quoting CODC10 (Reply 16):
Perhaps we will finally see IAH-MUC or ZRH next summer?

IAH-OSL would be interesting for Houston and Norway oil sector, same as an IAH-GLA or EDI (depending which city has more oil-related business) .
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CALMSP
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 1:59 pm

Quoting tsnamm (Reply 30):

well, we spent a number of days with 764 a/c out of service durnig the refurb of the interior. And since the EWR-CDG route is doable on a 757, it was an easy pair to downgrade.
 
cat3dual
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:02 pm

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 31):

Oil is $100 a barrel. Surely you've been paying attention to that? Houston - Oslo? I mean really?
 
cle757
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:04 pm

CLE-CDG was full and they took that away!.
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cat3dual
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:05 pm

Quoting cle757 (Reply 34):
CLE-CDG was full and they took that away!

Full of discount fares. Full does not equal profit. Unless you're a state-run airline, which CO nor UA are.
 
tommy767
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:08 pm

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 31):

Absolutely not. A 757 wouldn't make it -- it can barely do EWR-OSL
"KEEP CLIMBING" -- DELTA
 
LAXdude1023
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:21 pm

Well, on one hand I feel somewhat vendicated. I mentioned a few months ago on a seperate thread that IAH-CDG was the one European route out of IAH on UA/CO that lost money and had for a long time. I had very reliable data on that as well.

On the other hand, Im sad to see this one go. Its been around for so many years. Perhaps its just seasonal?
It is what it is...
 
Jamake1
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:26 pm

I am curious where the op got their source. I have not seen an official announcement posted either internally or externally re: IAH-CDG.
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LAXdude1023
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:29 pm

Quoting jamake1 (Reply 38):
I am curious where the op got their source. I have not seen an official announcement posted either internally or externally re: IAH-CDG.

The flight is zeroed out in GDS. Its gone.
It is what it is...
 
CALMSP
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:33 pm

and its actually zeroed out on the 9th
 
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IrishAyes
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:43 pm

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 37):

Well, on one hand I feel somewhat vendicated. I mentioned a few months ago on a seperate thread that IAH-CDG was the one European route out of IAH on UA/CO that lost money and had for a long time. I had very reliable data on that as well.

I do remember you saying this and it came to mind when I read this news. Still somewhat of a shock, you'd think that they'd at least reduce it to less-than daily or make it seasonal.

Quoting 2travel2know2 (Reply 31):
IAH-OSL would be interesting for Houston and Norway oil sector, same as an IAH-GLA or EDI (depending which city has more oil-related business) .

I thought that UA 38/39 actually had originated in IAH as a direct flight between IAH and OSL. Or maybe I'm hearing things - I looked this up and it wasn't the case.

Also, just FYI - oil related business doesn't necessarily drive traffic onto nonstop flights. Many people in the industry fly on private aircraft or corporate jets - not just commercial airlines.
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blueflyer
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:46 pm

Quoting avi8 (Reply 2):
What will happen to the spare aircraft?

I've heard rumors that the aircraft will either be moved to ORD to upgauge ORD-BRU or that UA will open IAH-BRU. I would take both with a grain of salt, however.

The rumors about IAH-BRU have been going around for months, if not year, and BRU definitively isn't an oil platform on the same level as CDG or AMS (just a few connections to second-tier African oil producers). BRU does well as a secondary European Star hub for UA on the other hand.

I am somewhat skeptical of the ORD-BRU theory as well. UA does very well upfront to BRU. Substituting a 764 for a 763 adds 9 seats in Business, but loses First entirely, and First to BRU is a moneymaker on the three current flights.

Quoting tommy767 (Reply 19):
I'd be concerned since AMS is a major sky team hub.

Corporate contracts. As long as UA has these contracts, the flight isn't going anywhere. If the competition (say KLM) gets them, the flight will be canceled in a nanosecond.

[Edited 2012-06-29 07:55:16]
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LAXdude1023
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:52 pm

Quoting blueflyer (Reply 42):
I've heard rumors that the aircraft will either be moved to ORD to operate ORD-BRU or that UA will open IAH-BRU. I would take both with a grain of salt, however.

If this had anything to do with opening a new route out of IAH, they would have done it at the same time to minimize bad press. Its much easier for the loyal UA fliers in IAH to swallow a flight being moved from Paris to Brussels than a flight to Paris being canned outright.

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 41):
I do remember you saying this and it came to mind when I read this news.

Yeah, I had a couple of UA and IAH loyalists jumping on me for that. Oh well.
It is what it is...
 
phxa340
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 2:58 pm

Quoting DFWHeavy (Reply 20):
If UA can't make a daily Houston-Paris flight work, they have some serious issues on their hands. If they are doing it in retaliation to WN over at HOU, then I will renounce my flying on them.

UA wouldn't cut a route that makes money just to get back at Houston for allowing WN international routes. They are cutting a non-stop to CDG from IAH because they can easily funnel any of their passengers through their other hubs in a more cost effective way. Smisek , like the Spirit CEO has stated, if a route doesn't make money - its gone , pure and simple.

While many might disgree , I am happy to see UA is being actively managed on its route structure to maintain profitability.
 
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redzeppelin
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:00 pm

Quoting cat3dual (Reply 18):
Just realized my mistake; misread it as IAD. Hadn't had my coffee yet before I replied.
Quoting kgaiflyer (Reply 27):
Ooops My bad. I misread the header.

What is it about IAH and IAD getting mixed up? A DL phone agent I spoke to a few months ago had the same issue. My flight out of IAH was cancelled, and when I called in to re-book, she tried to put me on a flight ex-IAD! Luckily I recognized that the flight number she quoted to me was mainline, and I knew that DL didn't have any mainline flights from IAH to SLC at the time.
 
tommy767
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:10 pm

Quoting blueflyer (Reply 42):
The rumors about IAH-BRU have been going around for months, if not year, and BRU definitively isn't an oil platform on the same level as CDG or AMS (just a few connections to second-tier African oil producers). BRU does well as a secondary European Star hub for UA on the other hand.

Definitely doubt IAH-BRU. Too risky when they already fly IAD, EWR, ORD to BRU.
"KEEP CLIMBING" -- DELTA
 
mogandoCI
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:45 pm

Quoting tommy767 (Reply 46):
Definitely doubt IAH-BRU. Too risky when they already fly IAD, EWR, ORD to BRU.

That's why the 787 is perfect for UA. Instead of concentrating on a couple 777s out of the East Coast, they could do 787s from EWR+IAD+ORD+IAH. IAH-CDG could re-appear under this strategy, and IAH-BRU may pop up.

Same for the Pacific. PMUA trumped DL by bypassing NRT. The next evolution for UA+CO is to have a full route network that bypasses SFO too. At the very least, complete the missing links to ICN and PEK.
 
Type-Rated
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:55 pm

Quoting FSDan (Reply 9):
On a more serious note, there probably is more traffic originating in IAH and going beyond CDG than there is originating in CDG and going beyond IAH.

That's exactly right. Air France is big with the oil companies (like ExxonMobil, Chevron) to send workers to/from Africa/Russia via CDG. A lot of oil employees have huge AF frequent flyer accounts.

Either AF will add more flights daily, increase the gauge of the aircraft or another carrier will step in. Maybe AA?
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point2point
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RE: UA Ending IAH-CDG

Fri Jun 29, 2012 3:56 pm

Hey.....

Maybe, since there's a spare bird now here, UA can get another $22M in rent breaks, paydowns, debt-forgiveness, whatever, from DEN, and then DEN can get its own UA DEN-CDG route?

Just thinking out loud here, eh?  

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