LIPZ
Topic Author
Posts: 483
Joined: Thu Jun 08, 2006 4:29 am

EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Mon Jul 02, 2012 2:20 pm

As per a press release, EK announces the introduction of a 2nd daily A380 service eff from 01JAN13, replacing the 77W I guess.
By then EK will fly 14xw A380 + 5xw B77W on CDG-DXB route.


more
http://www.dubaichronicle.com/2012/07/02/emirates-paris/
 
User avatar
N14AZ
Posts: 2050
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:19 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 11:03 am

Amazing, so there will be three airports with more than 1 daily EK- A 380:
1.) LHR
2.) NYC
3.) CDG
 
cloudyapple
Posts: 1261
Joined: Sun Jul 24, 2005 7:01 am

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:15 pm

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 1):
Amazing, so there will be three airports with more than 1 daily EK- A 380:
1.) LHR
2.) NYC
3.) CDG

4.) HKG
A310/A319/20/21/A332/3/A343/6/A388/B732/5/7/8/B742/S/4/B752/B763/B772/3/W/E145/J41/MD11/83/90
 
Unflug
Posts: 698
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2012 5:25 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:23 pm

Quoting cloudyapple (Reply 2):

4.) HKG

5.) DXB  
 
vincewy
Posts: 533
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2005 8:32 am

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:39 pm

Quoting cloudyapple (Reply 2):
4.) HKG

AFAIK, EK380/381 aren't A380 year round at this point.
 
cedarjet
Posts: 8101
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 1:12 am

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:46 pm

Quoting N14AZ (Reply 1):
Amazing, so there will be three airports with more than 1 daily EK- A 380:

Isn't Heathrow FOUR a day?!
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
gkirk
Posts: 23347
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2000 3:29 am

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:48 pm

Expecting Manchester to go twice daily A380 soon as well.
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
User avatar
N14AZ
Posts: 2050
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:19 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:15 pm

Quoting cedarjet (Reply 5):
Quoting N14AZ (Reply 1):
Amazing, so there will be three airports with more than 1 daily EK- A 380:

Isn't Heathrow FOUR a day?!

Yes, and 4 > 1 quod erat demonstrandum  
Quoting Unflug (Reply 3):
5.) DXB

This is "Unfug".  
Quoting gkirk (Reply 6):
Expecting Manchester to go twice daily A380 soon as well.

Is this your personal expectation or do you know more?
 
mikey72
Posts: 1439
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2009 1:31 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:39 pm

Forgive me and I don't mean to rain on anyone's parade but they do have to send them all somewhere ?

Do they not ?

At a time soon to be reached regardless of whether they are actually required or not.

Upgauging because of demand and upgauging because new aircrraft are being delivered are two very different things.

How are we to know the difference at this stage with so many A380's in the pipeline ?
Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand.
 
goosebayguy
Posts: 555
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 1:12 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:06 pm

Quoting gkirk (Reply 6):
Expecting Manchester to go twice daily A380 soon as well.

Its been a good solid rumour for the past year now. Expected to be the evening flight.
 
airbazar
Posts: 6936
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:10 pm

Quoting mikey72 (Reply 8):
How are we to know the difference at this stage with so many A380's in the pipeline ?

Here's a crazy idea: Perhaps they odered that many A380's because they entecipated the demand?   
 
HB-IWC
Posts: 4033
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2000 1:09 am

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:14 pm

Quoting gkirk (Reply 6):
Expecting Manchester to go twice daily A380 soon as well.
Quoting goosebayguy (Reply 9):
Its been a good solid rumour for the past year now. Expected to be the evening flight.

Actually, a fourth daily MAN roundtrip is more likely. Flight numbers 23 and 24 have been reseved for that very purpose.
 
mikey72
Posts: 1439
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2009 1:31 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:39 pm

Quoting airbazar (Reply 10):
Here's a crazy idea: Perhaps they odered that many A380's because they entecipated the demand?

I'm not sure if 'anticipation' is going to cut it in this instance but I hope to be proved wrong.

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 11):
Actually, a fourth daily MAN roundtrip is more likely. Flight numbers 23 and 24 have been reseved for that very purpose.

When's 5,6 and 7 and 8 ?

Ridiculous.
Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand.
 
skipness1E
Posts: 3396
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:18 am

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 4:35 pm

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 11):
Actually, a fourth daily MAN roundtrip is more likely. Flight numbers 23 and 24 have been reseved for that very purpose.

I thought growth had stalled on MAN-DXB with the morning A332 being cancelled a fair few times recently?
 
AF022
Posts: 1637
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 10:41 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 4:42 pm

I would think that CDG target markets for EK are different from UK target markets. Where is most of CDG demand going with EK? Probably SGN and HAN?
 
varig md-11
Posts: 1112
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2000 7:17 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 6:43 pm

@AF022: lots of pax out of EK at CDG are from India, Pakistan (PK has disapeared from radars at CDG...), Bangladesh and of course South East Asia and Australia
AF TW AA NW DL UA CO BA U2 TP UX LH SK AZ MP KL SN VY HV LS SS TK SQ PC RG IW SE LI TN
 
cedarjet
Posts: 8101
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 1:12 am

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:22 pm

Quoting varig md-11 (Reply 15):
lots of pax out of EK at CDG are from...Australia

Australia has been badly served from France since the demise of UTA in 1992. Qantas have had a few attempts but in recent decades it was on-again, off-again, and as a tag-on to Frankfurt, so a bit of a pain for such a long-haul flight, SYD-SIN-FRA and then sit around just to fly another forty minutes to Paris. And it was only a few days a week. Not really a serious attempt.

Historically, there was also some antipathy between the two cultures, partly because of French nuclear testing in the South Pacific (it was Australia's entirely reasonable position that the French should test nukes in their own backyard eg in France, not someone else's). Also, you can imagine traditional ideas of masculinity differed somewhat - one sipped wine and would hang out in Speedos and a Mickey Mouse t-shirt, the other would drink beer and fight. Now, I would say, both groups have chilled out a lot. Good wine and good food have arrived in Australia at last, and French men are a lot less into handbags and weird facial hair.
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
Senchingo
Posts: 119
Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2010 9:59 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:14 pm

Quoting mikey72 (Reply 8):
At a time soon to be reached regardless of whether they are actually required or not.

HB-IWC posted (and still posts) some really interesting material regarding EK's strategy, routes, banks etc (you may want to read Emirates At DXB - Ultimate Operational Analysis (by HB-IWC Sep 27 2010 in Civil Aviation)).I feel pretty safe to say: EK does nothing just to impress. They really do have the passengers, the cargo and the usage to utilize their flights. It's a miracle to me how they can do it (as DXB is not really THE centre of the world for connections), but they do. I read somewhere (don't remember where though) their strategy is to test routes with the smalles metal available (A330), if successfull upgrade to A343. Then A343&B777. Then A346&B777. Then A380&B777. Then A380xX as needed.

Guess it's all about "we don't give a sh** if O/D traffic is low, we just go for the connexs" and beating competition by offering one great product, state of the art a/c, capacity and reliability.

Often i can recall myself swearing at EK for "destroying the market", but now my opinion changed to: May the best win. If EK is the best to even steal traffic from EU/USA/Asia - they shall win.

Back to topic: Double daily A380 plus 5xW 77W is just amazing.... Can't even imagine how CDG can produce that much traffic to/via DXB to grant such flights
 
mikey72
Posts: 1439
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2009 1:31 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Wed Jul 04, 2012 7:46 am

Quoting Senchingo (Reply 17):
)).I feel pretty safe to say: EK does nothing just to impress.

Well that's a departure from the way their city base is run.........."Dubai is the parable of what money makes when it has no purpose but its own multiplication and grandeur"

Quoting Senchingo (Reply 17):
Guess it's all about "we don't give a sh** if O/D traffic is low, we just go for the connexs"

That works for me good luck to them.

Quoting Senchingo (Reply 17):
and beating competition by offering one great product, state of the art a/c, capacity and reliability.

They actually don't though do they....the service isn't 'stellar' (by comparison to their peers in the area) and where poaching European O&D is concerned their service is not non-stop. As someone else said....business travellers like frequency but they like non-stop even more.

EK's 'specialities' if you like are....

- The world's non-hub regional airports where I think they will be maxing out soon. After all they are regional airprts for a reason.

- Civil aviation in India is a sitting duck so in countries like this they will score highly but I cannot see India 'not ever' getting its act together on this front.

The big major airports of the world are geographically located in such a way that their airlines will always have one advantage on the routes that matter - non-stop. (ever more so with the range ability of new generations of aircraft)

On several of those EK are not and never will be even a consideration.
Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand.
 
Danfearn77
Posts: 557
Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2008 11:52 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Wed Jul 04, 2012 8:02 am

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 13):

It was cancelled in may about 6-8 times, not too sure of the reason but the morning flight is very popular and in a little over 4 weeks it reverts from an A330 to a 77W, leving MAN with 2x daily 77W and 1 daily A380. Whether the cancellations had anything to do with aircraft shortage etc I don't know, there didn't seem to be a pattern to the cancelled flights (I.e it wasn't done when the loads seemed lower etc)

The evening flight has been rumoured for an A380 upgrade for a long while now, as it's a very strong performing flight. Indeed it went through a spell around Feb/Mar/Apr where it came in full, and I'm talking completely full almost every day for weeks. EK has said the A380 is a big pulling tool at MAN.

Now QR has dropped from double daily to 10x weekly ex MAN, I'm sure there is even more scope for EK to expand. time will tell though.
Eagles may soar high, but weasels dont get sucked into jet engines!
 
mikey72
Posts: 1439
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2009 1:31 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Wed Jul 04, 2012 8:36 am

Quoting danfearn77 (Reply 19):
Now QR has dropped from double daily to 10x weekly ex MAN,

If QR join Oneworld.......

http://www.travelweekly.com.au/trave...-to-join-alliance-within-12-months

......will this impact any on EK's ops ex the UK in the long run ?
Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand.
 
HB-IWC
Posts: 4033
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2000 1:09 am

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:09 am

In addition to CDG, EK will also upgauge EK131/132 DXB DME DXB from B77W to A388. The flight will operate with A388 from December 01.
 
AirGAbon
Posts: 676
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2003 10:37 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:44 am

Quoting Senchingo (Reply 17):
Back to topic: Double daily A380 plus 5xW 77W is just amazing.... Can't even imagine how CDG can produce that much traffic to/via DXB to grant such flights

Plus 3 daily QR A340-600, 2 daily EY, daily GF and daily Oman Air.

And in 2011, CDG handled 60,970,550 passengers, world's 6th busiest airport and Europe's 2nd busiest airport after LHR, in passengers served.

So there is a traffic to/from CDG for airlines, not only AF!

And about Australia, there are 75,000 French citizens living in Australia (including dual citizenship French-Australian) mainly in Sydney and Melbourne, but only 18,000 French expat, plus around 18,500 "work-vacations" visa program.
 
Senchingo
Posts: 119
Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2010 9:59 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Wed Jul 04, 2012 9:25 pm

Quoting mikey72 (Reply 18):
- The world's non-hub regional airports where I think they will be maxing out soon. After all they are regional airprts for a reason.

DWC/OMDW is open since 2010, already having the first runway and basic facilities. The final plans for "Dubai World Central" until 2025 are 140 square KILOMETERS of size, living and working for more than 800000 people, 5x4500m runways, 160 Mio. Passengers a year, replacing DXB as main airport soon, Emirates repositioning the A380 fleet completely there.
I guess we can in no way talk about "regional" airports which will be stuck in their form forever. These are more than huge projects, proving to work as seen with DXB/EK.

Quoting mikey72 (Reply 18):
They actually don't though do they....the service isn't 'stellar' (by comparison to their peers in the area)

Hm... Please don't get me wrong, i'm not working for EK nor am i their biggest fan. I'm just really convinced that their overall status is impressive. I don't know what you mean by "stellar" and "their peers in the area", but my vote goes to EK when comparing to airlines near them like QR, EY and WY.

Quoting mikey72 (Reply 18):
The big major airports of the world are geographically located in such a way that their airlines will always have one advantage on the routes that matter - non-stop. (ever more so with the range ability of new generations of aircraft)

Of course that is or may be correct. Nevertheless i guess non-business travellers have a first look at price before direct flight.
Speaking as a European, there are several choices to travel from the EU to i.e. Asia. There are airports located and designed in perfect conditions as a hub (SIN, HKG, BKK, PEK, BOM, DEL, NRT) but still a huge amount of travellers seems to prefer travelling via DXB. Plus the loadfactors seem to prove that with EK utilizing their widebodies with like what... 80-90%?
I can just take my home airport, MUC, as an example:
We have daily SQ77W SIN, daily TG744 BKK, daily LH346 NRT, daily NH77W NRT, daily WYA330 MCT, daily EYA330 AUH, daily LHA346 DXB.
Still EK manages to effectively fill their flights on a daily B77W plus daily A380.

But i'm getting of topic here, sorry for that. As stated, i couldn't believe a 2xdaily A380 plus 5xW B777 could be profitable on CDG-DXB, but as proven by AirGabon ("Plus 3 daily QR A340-600, 2 daily EY, daily GF and daily Oman Air") it seems to be legit.
Now that i recall my post above there really is a significant traffic between the EU and Arabian countries.

Even though i more and more support the "may the best win" spirit, i'm quite of afraid that local flag carriers and competitors will disappear soon...
 
User avatar
lightsaber
Crew
Posts: 11857
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:55 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:55 pm

EK is doing quite the French expansion with more seats to CDG and Lyon.

Quoting mikey72 (Reply 20):
If QR join Oneworld.......

http://www.travelweekly.com.au/trave...-to-join-alliance-within-12-months

......will this impact any on EK's ops ex the UK in the long run ?

A little. The new-DOH airport will have more of an impact as the current facilities have forced QR into a hubbing strategy that isn't fully competitive with EK. This will help QR feed DOH from France and carry passengers to Australia. The question is, with QF fly to DOH?

But if QR does join OW (instead of *A), it will help QF tremendously with European feed. But it will break the QF/BA joint venture. There is more discussion here:
QR To Join An Alliance Within Next 12 Months (by LX138 Jul 4 2012 in Civil Aviation)

Lightsaber
"They did not know it was impossible, so they did it!" - Mark Twain
 
mikey72
Posts: 1439
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2009 1:31 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Thu Jul 05, 2012 3:20 pm

Quoting Senchingo (Reply 23):
Of course that is or may be correct. Nevertheless i guess non-business travellers have a first look at price before direct flight.
Speaking as a European, there are several choices to travel from the EU to i.e. Asia. There are airports located and designed in perfect conditions as a hub (SIN, HKG, BKK, PEK, BOM, DEL, NRT) but still a huge amount of travellers seems to prefer travelling via DXB. Plus the loadfactors seem to prove that with EK utilizing their widebodies with like what... 80-90%?
I can just take my home airport, MUC, as an example:
We have daily SQ77W SIN, daily TG744 BKK, daily LH346 NRT, daily NH77W NRT, daily WYA330 MCT, daily EYA330 AUH, daily LHA346 DXB.
Still EK manages to effectively fill their flights on a daily B77W plus daily A380.

All true which is why after one member said....

Quoting Senchingo (Reply 17):
Guess it's all about "we don't give a sh** if O/D traffic is low, we just go for the connexs"

I said...

Quoting mikey72 (Reply 18):
That works for me good luck to them.

Your point about the price sensiive passenger is correct but until the 'others' start deserting the legacies from their hubs to fly one-stop instead of non-stop (and I don't see that happening as there is a 'western hemisphere' too) I think the major European carriers are safe.

Quoting Senchingo (Reply 23):
Even though i more and more support the "may the best win" spirit, i'm quite of afraid that local flag carriers and competitors will disappear soon...

Yes and how boring would that be ?

More's the point what the hell would 'we' all talk about ?

[Edited 2012-07-05 09:17:57]
Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand.
 
Senchingo
Posts: 119
Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2010 9:59 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Thu Jul 05, 2012 7:34 pm

Quoting senchingo]Even though i more and more support the "may the best win" spirit, i'm quite of afraid that local flag carriers and competitors will disappear soon...[/quote]
[quote=mikey72
(Reply 25):
Yes and how boring would that be ?
More's the point what the hell would 'we' all talk about ?

Catastrophic for a.nutters  

Anyway, reading that EK will start Adelaide, Lyon and Warsaw plus upgrading existing legs with to A388 to NRT,AMS,MEL AKL,JNB,DME,CDG,JFK and LHR i guess it's once more proven that in no way EK is just sending A380's everywhere because they would otherwise stay unused. Still think their business plan is impressive and other major carriers have to come up with a revised scheme asap to keep from being pushed aside.

P.S: "Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand." This one really got me laughing hard   
 
LH121GLA
Posts: 344
Joined: Sat May 01, 2004 5:42 pm

RE: EK To Launch 2nd Daily A380 To Paris

Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:31 pm

Quoting cedarjet (Reply 5):
Isn't Heathrow FOUR a day?!

All A380 from Feb 2013 I think.