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Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Mon Jul 02, 2012 11:11 pm

Since the bulk of the other thread was regarding the rumors and speculation about Airbus building a plant in Mobile, it has been decided to have a dedicated thread to the announcement so to separate the speculative posts now that this is official.


Airbus To Build Planes In Alabama, Challenging Boeing

Quote:
Airbus SAS plans to assemble single- aisle aircraft in the U.S. for the first time, encroaching on Boeing Co. (BA)’s home market to tap demand from North American airlines seeking to renew their fleets.

Airbus has chosen Mobile, Alabama, as the site to build A320 single-aisle aircraft that compete with Boeing’s 737, the Toulouse, France-based company said today. Construction will begin by the middle of next year, with deliveries starting in 2016 and output of 40 to 50 planes annually by 2018.

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KMOB1
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Mon Jul 02, 2012 11:36 pm

I've been a member here just over a month , my first post here .... Dont know a hell of a lot about planes compared to a lot of you , I love them and love to photograph them , although I am use to not being able to capture more than an Embraer 145, or MD88 .... If I'm lucky I can grab a FED EX Boeing or DC10 coming out of KBFM , where the Airbus plant will be .
As an airliner enthusiast living in Mobile , I was so pumped to hear the news last week , and to see it come to fruitition today . I look forward to the day I can see these baby's soaring out of KBFM  
 
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Mon Jul 02, 2012 11:42 pm

I'm an Alabama native, and I am very happy for my home state. The state's manufacturing sector is growing with good paying jobs. The south is very business friendly, and it is paying dividends. Glad to see commercial aerospace make it's mark on the southern tip of the state. I hope it will be a fruitful as it has been in Huntsville/Decatur.
 
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Stitch
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Mon Jul 02, 2012 11:44 pm

As I noted in the other thread, I find this a prudent move by Airbus.
 
ghifty
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:13 am

Interesting development, but I don't see why the Bloomberg article must cite this as a "challenge" to Boeing. Is it really? No. Airlines order what they need, I have a hard time believing where an aircraft was assembled plays a nominal role in choosing aircraft.
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September11
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:36 am

Nice surprise news

Alabama...
Little shock

40-50 aircraft/year...
Fantastic

Congratulations, Airbus & Alabama
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stasisLAX
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:22 am

Alabama's a "right to work" state - no union representation. I wonder how the wages for the Alabama employees of Airbus will compare to their European colleagues.
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Asiaflyer
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:30 am

Quoting ghifty (Reply 4):
Interesting development, but I don't see why the Bloomberg article must cite this as a "challenge" to Boeing.


That seems to be the way Boeing thinks about it. Boeing made comments already last week before it was official announced. Apparently they feel very threatened. Just keep making better planes and the airlines will buy them.
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:39 am

Quoting KMOB1 (Reply 1):
As an airliner enthusiast living in Mobile , I was so pumped to hear the news last week , and to see it come to fruitition today . I look forward to the day I can see these baby's soaring out of KBFM

You have every right to be happy! (welcome to A.net!) the more you hang around the plant, the more you'll learn   

Anyway:

When it comes to Boeing, do you think that

Quoting moderators (Thread starter):
Airbus SAS plans to assemble single- aisle aircraft in the U.S. for the first time, encroaching on Boeing Co. (BA)’s home market to tap demand from North American airlines seeking to renew their fleets.

Honestly, how is this a challenge? I highly doubt the current status quo won't change. UA will have the A350 sure, but they still have a lot of Boeing aircraft. DL isn't going to buy anymore either. They're still primary Boeing customers, and I think that Airbus is just saying that it's "challenging" Boeing, when in my honest opinion, it's just for convenience with US Airways and American Airline's orders.
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Aesma
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:46 am

Quoting stasisLAX (Reply 6):
Alabama's a "right to work" state - no union representation. I wonder how the wages for the Alabama employees of Airbus will compare to their European colleagues.

I looked up that term on wikipedia, and it seems to me it doesn't mean no union, but no mandatory union. Which is exactly the same situation as in France.
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Stitch
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:54 am

Quoting stasisLAX (Reply 6):
Alabama's a "right to work" state - no union representation. I wonder how the wages for the Alabama employees of Airbus will compare to their European colleagues.
Quoting Aesma (Reply 9):
I looked up that term on wikipedia, and it seems to me it doesn't mean no union, but no mandatory union. Which is exactly the same situation as in France.

That is correct.

Some folks might be surprised that when Boeing bought the Charleston plant, the workforce there was part of the IAM, just like the workers in Everett and Renton. The workforce subsequently chose to decertify the union, but Boeing can't work them like serfs lest the IAM successfully re-unionize the shop.
 
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:58 am

I think the challenge to Boeing is that Airbus now have the advantage of multiple facilities worldwide. Which includes...
1. Airbus would be able to achieve equal or lower labor costs for its US facility
2. Better delivery slots paving way for more sales
3. Ease of purchase - from finance, tax to paperwork - for US based carriers, in Boeing's own home turf
4. Better sales presence in US and Canada
5. Inability on Boeing's front to develop an EU plant, due to its own unattractiveness

Overall, it takes away Boeing's 'home advantage'. It is one of those small steps that can have a big impact. It may be just an A320 line for the moment, but don't expect it to be another Tianjin line.
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:00 am

Just because Alabama is a Right to Work state does not mean that Airbus' plant will be and remain non-union. It simply means that no workers can be compelled to join a union.

It remains incumbent upon Airbus to earn the degree of loyalty from its employees that is required for the employees to reject union representation. One hopes they will be wise enough to do just that - often said (and I agree) that an employer gets the union it deserves.
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jayhup
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:02 am

As a former employee of a Boeing subsidiary I think this is great news for Alabama and for Airbus. It will keep the competition hot and heavy between the two companies and should benefit the airlines and us passengers.

Interesting however is the lack of "protest" from the White House over Airbus coming to a right to work state. Seems that they weren't so accommodating to Boeing when they first tried to open up in South Carolina.
 
ThereandBack
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:11 am

My only concern is how well the new facility will handle hurricanes and tornadoes in the area. If I were Airbus and selecting a site to build aircraft I would have went for an area less natural hazard prone.
 
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:20 am

Quoting KFlyer (Reply 11):
. Ease of purchase - from finance, tax to paperwork - for US based carriers, in Boeing's own home turf

Financing, financing, financing. That is what it takes to close the deal. Given that the European banks are in shaky ground along with the ECB, why not start another production in the US of A and tap the EXIM as it was mentioned in the previous thread?

This move will tap more financial resources away from Boeing (.......to close deals).
Only the paranoid survive
 
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par13del
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:30 am

Quoting Tangowhisky (Reply 15):
Financing, financing, financing. That is what it takes to close the deal. Given that the European banks are in shaky ground along with the ECB, why not start another production in the US of A and tap the EXIM as it was mentioned in the previous thread?

Does the financing and incentives provided pass the WTO test based on the last rulings that are being appealed and does / could it have any effect?
How about the EXIM directive of both OEM's not competing on each others home turf, does this plant offer Airbus a route to circumvent?

Quoting jayhup (Reply 13):
It will keep the competition hot and heavy between the two companies and should benefit the airlines and us passengers.

Try to imagine the duopoly in 20 years time, there are some scarey visions as well as good ones.

Quoting jayhup (Reply 13):
Interesting however is the lack of "protest" from the White House over Airbus coming to a right to work state. Seems that they weren't so accommodating to Boeing when they first tried to open up in South Carolina.

If they were not forewarned they are probably looking at GM, Ford and Chrysler and imagining the day when Boeing is no longer the aviation leader in the USA.
 
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:39 am

Quoting ThereandBack (Reply 14):
My only concern is how well the new facility will handle hurricanes and tornadoes in the area. If I were Airbus and selecting a site to build aircraft I would have went for an area less natural hazard prone.

Hurricanes aren't actually all that common in Mobile, with some years being notable exceptions- http://www2.wkrg.com/weather/2011/au...iles-hurricane-history-ar-2217159/
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Tangowhisky
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:41 am

Quoting par13del (Reply 16):
Does the financing and incentives provided pass the WTO test based on the last rulings that are being appealed and does / could it have any effect?
How about the EXIM directive of both OEM's not competing on each others home turf, does this plant offer Airbus a route to circumvent?

I don't know intimately these rulings, but my sense is that airlines need financing and a guarantee to the lending commercial bank by the government where the product is manufactured for export must be a big reason why Airbus is setting up this plant. It is a common worldwide problem that banking thus financing is under strain. Airbus is just spreading its wings so that it can increase such access.
Only the paranoid survive
 
flyguy89
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:54 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 10):
but Boeing can't work them like serfs lest the IAM successfully re-unionize the shop.

That's really an old out-dated argument that the threat of unionization somehow motivates companies to treat their employees better. While companies will take measures and actions to persuade employees away from unionization for obvious reasons, even if the threat of unionization didn't exist, companies wouldn't suddenly start treating their employees like "serfs" for a number of reasons: 1) Codified federal law would prohibit such treatment 2) It's the 21st century and corporate management is better developed than the days of yore, it's a generally accepted law of business management now that having a happy, motivated workforce with a strong sense of internal and external equity results in a more productive workforce and a healthier bottom-line.

Quoting Aesma (Reply 9):
Quoting stasisLAX (Reply 6):
Alabama's a "right to work" state - no union representation. I wonder how the wages for the Alabama employees of Airbus will compare to their European colleagues.

I looked up that term on wikipedia, and it seems to me it doesn't mean no union, but no mandatory union. Which is exactly the same situation as in France.

Being "Right to Work" is definitely an advantage, but the greater advantage for an Airbus factory in Alabama will be the lower overall cost of labor. Employee compensation will be lower because the cost-of-living is lower, not as many government-mandated benefits, labor flexibility ("employment at will" philosophy here in the US would permit Airbus to fire or lay-off less productive employees more easily while hiring or retaining better skilled or better productive ones), and higher worker productivity because of the longer work week in the US.


This is a win-win for both Airbus and Alabama, congrats to them both!
 
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 2:56 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 10):
Quoting stasisLAX (Reply 6):
Alabama's a "right to work" state - no union representation. I wonder how the wages for the Alabama employees of Airbus will compare to their European colleagues.
Quoting Aesma (Reply 9):
I looked up that term on wikipedia, and it seems to me it doesn't mean no union, but no mandatory union. Which is exactly the same situation as in France.

That is correct.

Some folks might be surprised that when Boeing bought the Charleston plant, the workforce there was part of the IAM, just like the workers in Everett and Renton. The workforce subsequently chose to decertify the union, but Boeing can't work them like serfs lest the IAM successfully re-unionize the shop.
Quoting sccutler (Reply 12):
Just because Alabama is a Right to Work state does not mean that Airbus' plant will be and remain non-union. It simply means that no workers can be compelled to join a union.

I too was puzzled by this term "right to work". From the above, does that mean in "non right to work" states one can be MADE to join a union to get/keep a job?

Gemuser
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par13del
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:08 am

Quoting Tangowhisky (Reply 18):
It is a common worldwide problem that banking thus financing is under strain.

In setting up the Exim Bank and its Europe counterpart both sides agreed not to finance a/c from carriers from each others turf, hence DL throwing a hissy fit about competition on routes from Middle East carriers who used EXIM financing to purchase new a/c. DL and other US carriers had no problem when the bank was set up, probably too busy looking near term and not down the road, now the horse has left the barn, they have since moved on to oil refinaries.

The WTO issues I guess may be date limited, but some rulings did render anti-competive some actions / incentives by states.
Interesting times.
 
flyguy89
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:08 am

Quoting gemuser (Reply 20):
I too was puzzled by this term "right to work". From the above, does that mean in "non right to work" states one can be MADE to join a union to get/keep a job?

It's a type of legislation that a number of state governments have passed. Essentially in states that don't have this legislation, if 60% of employees vote in a union, it means 100% of the employees have to join the union basically forcing the 40% that voted against the union join one against their will. However, in states with "Right-to-work" legislation, basically only those employees that want to join the union can join the union and those that don't aren't forced to join one...hope that helps, it's of course a bit more nuanced but I think I explained the gist of it.
 
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Stitch
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:24 am

Quoting gemuser (Reply 20):
I too was puzzled by this term "right to work". From the above, does that mean in "non right to work" states one can be MADE to join a union to get/keep a job?


National Labor Relations Act and the Taft–Hartley Act make it illegal for a union to require employees be union members to work (a "closed shop" or "union shop"). So you are not required to join the union, but you are required to pay union dues.

When I was in high school, I did a summer working in retail for a drug store chain and a portion of my paycheck went to cover the dues of being a member of the United Food and Commercial Workers Union whether or not I actually chose to become a member of the union.

[Edited 2012-07-02 20:30:09]
 
AvObserver
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:33 am

Quoting jayhup (Reply 13):
Interesting however is the lack of "protest" from the White House over Airbus coming to a right to work state. Seems that they weren't so accommodating to Boeing when they first tried to open up in South Carolina.

Interesting observation and a seeming double standard from the Administration. But it should be a win-win for all concerned as Airbus gets a lower labor cost U.S. manufacturing base, Alabama gets some much needed jobs and Boeing really loses nothing of consequence, at least in the short term. Well, maybe the Administration loses a bit on credibility.
 
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:46 am

I do not believe the National Labor Relations Board can just target an employer on their own volition. The International Association of Machinists brought a complaint before the Board and the Board then agreed to file a complaint on behalf of the IAM. Once the IAM agreed to a new contract with Boeing, they withdrew their complaint with the NLRB and that forced the NLRB to withdraw their complaint with Boeing.

As this is the first Airbus facility in the United States, I would expect the IAM would have no grounds to file a complaint and therefore the NLRB would have no complaint to file against Airbus.

[Edited 2012-07-02 20:48:38]
 
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kanban
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 4:14 am

From the pictures I've seen this is strictly a Final Assembly operations, so everything will have to be flown in (Fuselage, wings, empennage, etc) . So how profitable will this really be?

Second, I think some pundits are correct in thinking this is a way to advance military sales (A400M) bidding legitimacy
 
Asiaflyer
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 4:54 am

Quoting kanban (Reply 26):
From the pictures I've seen this is strictly a Final Assembly operations, so everything will have to be flown in (Fuselage, wings, empennage, etc) . So how profitable will this really be?


Well, we see Boeing flying in 787 fuselages with the special built 747, so its not a new strategy.
As a fair bit of supplies also comes from North American suppliers, it would mean that a few things has not to be transported over to Europe.
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 4:58 am

Stitch: required to pay the dues but not required to join. As far as I'm concerned it's really like being forced to join. Why would you pay the dues and not get anything our of it.

Good for Airbus for creating jobs in a right to work state.
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moo
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 6:10 am

Quoting kanban (Reply 26):

It will be shipped in, they are using China as the blueprint for this FAL.
 
astuteman
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 6:58 am

Quoting kanban (Reply 26):
From the pictures I've seen this is strictly a Final Assembly operations, so everything will have to be flown in (Fuselage, wings, empennage, etc) . So how profitable will this really be?

About the same as the 787 was originally meant to be, perhaps......   

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FlyingAY
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:08 am

Just out of interest, does anyone have a nice picture or a description where the A320 parts do come from? I'd assume some of the parts are anyway manufactured in US so you save in the shipping and some parts you need to ship further than with the European FALs. But anyway, they have a FAL in China already, so I don't think this is anything new...
 
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:54 am

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 19):
Being "Right to Work" is definitely an advantage, but the greater advantage for an Airbus factory in Alabama will be the lower overall cost of labor. Employee compensation will be lower because the cost-of-living is lower, not as many government-mandated benefits, labor flexibility ("employment at will" philosophy here in the US would permit Airbus to fire or lay-off less productive employees more easily while hiring or retaining better skilled or better productive ones), and higher worker productivity because of the longer work week in the US.

Cost of living is lower than what ? As I said in the other thread, it's not a comparison between Alabama and another US state. With the Eurodollar always evolving, a USD salary can be lower than an Euro salary one day, higher the next. Government-mandated benefits are taxes on the salary, here, it just means you get a smaller paycheck. Labor flexibility is certainly an advantage, as for productivity, we work less hours but do as much work.
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DrColenzo
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:40 am

Quoting Aesma (Reply 32):
Cost of living is lower than what ?

That's the interesting part from an economics/business school perspective.

If there was a pure low wages vs. high wages argument, then Airbus and Boeing should build their plant in Rwanda. However, on the converse of that why build a plant in the US when the wages are much higher than other countries?

It is about inherent local capability in the workforce for the task required; in short, Airbus needs cheap but literate workers able to learn complex tasks, who are located in an area with ample infrastructure that will not be interrupted for arbitrary reasons. Alabama fulfils that criteria, along with local laws that prevent unionism and encourage foreign direct investment (FDI). Honda, Hyundai, Mercedes and Toyota have already set up there and ThyssenKrupp is building a steel plant in the state, too. The same logic applied to China in the 1980s, there was reliable infrastructure and ample literacy so workers could learn and look where that got them!

Believe me, if Airbus/Boeing just went for an area with the cheapest labour costs, they would spend a lot more building up capability and infrastructure than they would investing in a mature economy like that in Alabama or similar states in the US.

So, it makes perfect sense for Airbus to reduce costs, guarantee a certain quality of product and gain direct access to the NAFTA market.

However, the real competitive question is the C919 and the Irkut MS-21, will then encroach and takeover the market dominated by the 737 and the A320? I doubt it and have reservations about both projects, but as Arthur C. Clarke once stated, when an established professor states that something is unlikely or impossible, he is usually wrong and so please ignore me on that!
 
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:42 am

Newspapers here reported that opening an Airbus plant in Boeing's backyard is a prequel to a A-B merger.   

     
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r2rho
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:44 am

Quoting KFlyer (Reply 11):
I think the challenge to Boeing is that Airbus now have the advantage of multiple facilities worldwide. Which includes...
1. Airbus would be able to achieve equal or lower labor costs for its US facility
2. Better delivery slots paving way for more sales
3. Ease of purchase - from finance, tax to paperwork - for US based carriers, in Boeing's own home turf
4. Better sales presence in US and Canada
5. Inability on Boeing's front to develop an EU plant, due to its own unattractiveness

Airbus will gain huge flexibility by being able to spread currency risk, balance delivery rates between several sites, have a presence on three continents... this also adds flexibility for the NEO ramp-up, and Airbus could create more aailable slots to lure airlines away from the MAX.

Quoting kanban (Reply 26):
this is strictly a Final Assembly operations, so everything will have to be flown in (Fuselage, wings, empennage, etc) .

No, it will be shipped in, similarly to what they are doing in TSN. FAL-installed equipment coming from US suppliers could be brought by rail directly from within the US. BFM is adjacent to Mobile's container port and 3 class I railways alllowing intermodal rail/ship transport. On the way back, ships could take US equipment to the EU FALs. The choice of BFM is not a random one; there is some pretty good infrastructure set up there. It seems Airbus always had in mind to build a FAL there, and after it didn't work out with the tanker, they're going for A320's.

http://www.airbus.com/company/americ...-of-a320-family-aircraft-in-the-u/
 
Burkhard
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:07 am

This 40-50 per year is far aways from the speculated 20 per months, but it will help Airbus to have more free slots for the NEO once it is in in production. It could do the AA order from 2017-2020, so it will help to sell more aircraft, reduce risk, create nice jobs in Alabama, create jobs in Europe for the parts - good on all sides for Alabama, for Airbus, for Europe, for the US - and 40-50 frames per year are not really bad for Boeing.
 
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InsideMan
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:44 am

The Tianjin FAL was started with the objective of 4/month max capacity and is supposed to delivery exclusively to chinese customers. Since it is an exact replica of the Hamburg flow line FAL capacity could easily be increased, provided the trained workforce is available.

I presume the same will happen in BFM. Capacity of 4/month for US customers only. However this is the foot in the door if you will. If by any means this leads to more US orders, either facilitated through ease of financing or other reasons, a few years from now the capacity could easily be increased.
 
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:49 am

Quoting InsideMan (Reply 37):
The Tianjin FAL was started with the objective of 4/month max capacity and is supposed to delivery exclusively to chinese customers. Since it is an exact replica of the Hamburg flow line FAL capacity could easily be increased, provided the trained workforce is available.

I too think that this FAL will start with conservative numbers, but in a couple more years it will be ready to have the production increased to the levels required if the market remains as strong for the narrow-bodies of Airbus (and Boeing for that matter) as they are today.
 
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:28 am

Quoting jayhup (Reply 13):
Interesting however is the lack of "protest" from the White House over Airbus coming to a right to work state. Seems that they weren't so accommodating to Boeing when they first tried to open up in South Carolina.

Might it be that the White House is gratified to see a company from another country create jobs here while so many American companies are moving their operations overseas or south? This is going to be very good for Alabama. More and more, industry is moving to the south and southeast. More jobs here means better life styles for southerners, or so I hope.
Dare to dream; dream big!
 
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par13del
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:30 am

Quoting Jerseyguy (Reply 28):
Why would you pay the dues and not get anything our of it.

Most employers give all workers the same benefits whether union or not, much simpler than having multiple sets of benefits, hence the mantra of the law that since you benefit you should pay.

Quoting flyingturtle (Reply 34):
Newspapers here reported that opening an Airbus plant in Boeing's backyard is a prequel to a A-B merger

Not such a fantasy, it has taken a couple decades but foreign vehicles assembled in the USA have driven the USA car companies into Chpt.11 so not a far fetched idea.
It could be regarded as fear mongering, but look around at the landscape and you can see where it is possible.
 
caljn
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:01 pm

Quoting stasisLAX (Reply 6):
Alabama's a "right to work" state - no union representation. I wonder how the wages for the Alabama employees of Airbus will compare to their European colleagues.

...or more precisely, "right to work for less"
 
brilondon
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:17 pm

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 8):
Honestly, how is this a challenge? I highly doubt the current status quo won't change. UA will have the A350 sure, but they still have a lot of Boeing aircraft. DL isn't going to buy anymore either. They're still primary Boeing customers, and I think that Airbus is just saying that it's "challenging" Boeing, when in my honest opinion, it's just for convenience with US Airways and American Airline's orders.

What has this got to do with the A320 factory in Alabama, I think you have posted to the wrong thread.
Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
 
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InsideMan
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:20 pm

in Europe, you can't force somebody to join a union, nor to pay the union dues.
However, the employer has to treat all employees the same, union or not.

Interestingly only about 70% of workers as far as I know pay union dues, yet nobody
complains about a "free rider problem"....

The idea to force someone to pay union dues is absurd to me!  Wow!

[Edited 2012-07-03 05:30:01]
 
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par13del
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:32 pm

Quoting brilondon (Reply 42):
What has this got to do with the A320 factory in Alabama, I think you have posted to the wrong thread.
Quoting PHX787 (Reply 8):
Quoting moderators (Thread starter):
Airbus SAS plans to assemble single- aisle aircraft in the U.S. for the first time, encroaching on Boeing Co. (BA)’s home market to tap demand from North American airlines seeking to renew their fleets.

Honestly, how is this a challenge?

Poster was questioning how Airbus encroaching on Boeing home turf by opening a FAL in Alabama posed a challenge.
Seems appropriate and in the right thread.
 
Thenoflyzone
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:48 pm

Quoting kanban (Reply 26):
From the pictures I've seen this is strictly a Final Assembly operations, so everything will have to be flown in (Fuselage, wings, empennage, etc) . So how profitable will this really be?
Quoting moo (Reply 29):
It will be shipped in, they are using China as the blueprint for this FAL.

It will most likely be shipped in. That is the major reason for choosing Mobile, Alabama, in my opinion. The airport is right on the coast, which means a quick access to the Gulf of Mexico and the Atlantic Ocean.

Thenoflyzone

[Edited 2012-07-03 05:49:07]
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
Flyglobal
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:51 pm

I expect the following development.

Mobiles first 4 Planes/ months are for sure subject for increase if the assembly plant is constructed to be modular extend and if it is requested.

For increasing the Dollar content, I also believe that Airbus might be followed by Airbus suppliers which may open own facilities as well. Same happened when the Toyota, Nissan and others came to manufacture in the US. They partly brought their own suppliers (DENSO etc.) and didn't rely on e..g Delphi only.

So more to come along with that plant I believe. 4 Planes per month is just a starter.
Could be followed by A330s ('remaining production' in some years), M400s etc.

One of the biggest advantages for Airbus and in general European companies is probably that they rather think strategically and more long term and don't get quickly de-railed by just a single or a few weaker quarterly results.
So once now that they decided, they will keep track on straight roads and do not curve much.

Regards

Flyglobal
 
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scbriml
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 12:52 pm

Quoting ghifty (Reply 4):
I don't see why the Bloomberg article must cite this as a "challenge" to Boeing
Quoting PHX787 (Reply 8):
Honestly, how is this a challenge?

The thing is, there's a far bigger game in play than just building a handful of A320s every month. You only have to look at Boeing's comments on the subject to get a feel for their opinion. They are not happy.

Quoting InsideMan (Reply 37):
The Tianjin FAL was started with the objective of 4/month max capacity and is supposed to delivery exclusively to chinese customers.

While initial production was intended 100% for Chinese customers, it was always expected to build planes for non-Chinese customers at Tanjin. Indeed, the first A320 for a non-Chinese customer (Air Asia) will be delivered this year. Foreign deliveries were not originally expected before 2015.
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/cndy/2012-06/06/content_15476929.htm
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
 
lostsound
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:41 pm

Smart move by Airbus.

Telling your current customers that you will build their planes in their home country sounds like good customer service to me.

I'm hoping we'll see more NEO orders as the backlog should open up a bit.
 
trex8
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RE: Airbus Announces A320 Factory In Alabama

Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:47 pm

Quoting LostSound (Reply 48):
Telling your current customers that you will build their planes in their home country sounds like good customer service to me.

I seriously doubt any major airline cares where the plane is built as long as it performs as promised and they get the support they need. If airlines will fly their planes half way around the world for maintenance they will be happy to take delivery wherever the price is right.