sunking737
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Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:19 am

Has anyone heard about a new airline starting up in Alaska?? My information comes from a reliable source, but due to a contract just signed with their business, that is all that can be said.

No information on routes or equipment or start up date given.
Just an MSPAVGEEK
 
HPRamper
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Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:31 am

Is this an existing airline new to Alaska, or a startup, brand-new airline?
 
sunking737
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Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:36 am

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 3):
Is this an existing airline new to Alaska, or a startup, brand-new airline?

As far as I would assume its new?? All I know is an airline in Alaska.
Just an MSPAVGEEK
 
sunking737
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Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:41 am

More information as far as A/C type...MD80. I guess it is in early start up planning. That all I know due to NDA.

[Edited 2012-07-03 22:05:12]
Just an MSPAVGEEK
 
F9Animal
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Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:47 am

Interesting. I would expect AS to go ape poop if this was true. MD-80? If anything, I wonder if an MD-80 could be converted into a COMBI? With the huge amount of freight up there, I could see something like that working!
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alaska737
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Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 5:40 am

I'm calling BS on this...I know that Everts is getting an MD-80 combi and/or freight (possibly more than one) and they might be wanting to get more into the passenger market.

If this isn't someway related to Everts then I'm willing to bet this will never get off the ground.
 
woodsboy
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Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 5:42 am

Haven't heard a thing up here in ALASKA. Searched the Fairbanks newspaper for any chatter, nothing came up. The only entity in Alaska that currently exists that could possibly be able to bring on and support MD-80s (or DC-9s) is Everts Air Cargo/ Everts Air Alaska based in Fairbanks. Currently they operate a scheduled passenger and charter passenger operation with Embraer EMB 120s, Cessna Caravans, Pilatus PC-12s and Piper Lance. Their cargo ops use DC-6s, C-46s and DC-9-30CFs so it would not be out of the question for them to be thinking of moving further into the pax market although I know of no plans, it is a thought though.

I would really doubt a new large passenger airline "startup" in Alaska unless it was an expansion of an existing company. Dare I say that Neil Bergt, he of MarkAir fame is trying again to start another airline? God help us all if that is the case!
 
wedgetail737
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Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 6:04 am

Quoting woodsboy (Reply 8):
Dare I say that Neil Bergt, he of MarkAir fame is trying again to start another airline? God help us all if that is the case!

What about the reincarnation of the Wien?

I saw a NAC 737-300 at BFI yesterday...new equipment? Maybe NAC will spin off a new combi airline simply called Northern Air?

Also, I've seen Everts EMB-120F at Paine Field.

Maybe a low-cost carrier between ANC-SEA.
 
Wingtips56
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Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 8:04 am

I have my doubts that a carrier would choose a DC9 variant (up to MD 80/90) for Alaska the way those skinny little wings ice up. So that part of the rumor seems unfounded. But time will tell, of course.
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines
 
bjorn14
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 11:35 am

A few months ago, I had heard of an airline called Aleutian Pacific who was trying to find frames that would make it from DUT or ADK to SEA. Hadn't heard much lately.
"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
 
AA737-823
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:11 pm

Quoting Wingtips56 (Reply 10):
I have my doubts that a carrier would choose a DC9 variant (up to MD 80/90) for Alaska the way those skinny little wings ice up. So that part of the rumor seems unfounded. But time will tell, of course.

AS used them here for years, up until retirement in 2008. Heat blankets were installed after SAS had their MD-87 crash.

But on topic, I've heard nothing.

And yes, NAC seems to be getting another -300, since there's one painted at BFI.
 
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RWA380
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:28 pm

I would expect AS to make quick work of scaring off any intruder, they can get into a big pissing match and not dent their bank account too badly, if the proposed startup carrier was competing head to head in AS markets. This proposed startup would have to have some pretty deep pockets, or suffer the fate of Wien and Markair. Alaska is the strong hold fortress for AS, they bring good money in from flying around the state, I can't see any other carrier being able to penetrate that market.
And that is also my biggest argument as to why AS will remain an independent carrier forever.
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HPRamper
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:43 pm

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 9):
Maybe a low-cost carrier between ANC-SEA.

God knows that route needs something a little more affordable.

Maybe this new carrier would be starting up that Vladivostok run.
 
wedgetail737
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:51 pm

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 11):
A few months ago, I had heard of an airline called Aleutian Pacific who was trying to find frames that would make it from DUT or ADK to SEA. Hadn't heard much lately.

If there is such an airline, that would be something that hadn't been done since Reeve used Electras between SEA and Cold Bay. This route would be a perfect route for a 737-700C, but one would think that ETOPS would be required.

Who knows...I would be curious to see what happens.
 
hiflyeras
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 4:10 pm

I call BS...no one starting service within, to/from Alaska would use a MD80 with their poor ability to carry freight. The cargo hold is small and difficult to work in when just dealing with suitcases, let alone freight.

That said, it would NOT surprise me if someone is trying to take advantage of AS's pullout from Adak. There's a multimillion dollar EAS contract on the table for someone to pick up. PenAir entered a bid but it was rejected, probably due to their proposed subsidy was an outrageous sum ($3.7 million per year) and that they'd fly a 30 seat Saab that required a fuel stop and had little cargo capacity. AS continues to fly the route until a new entrant is approved.
 
flightmedic72
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Wed Jul 04, 2012 6:33 pm

From today's Anchorage Daily News (July 4th)

http://www.adn.com/2012/07/03/253053...rthern-air-cargo-leases-kulis.html

"Regional air carrier Northern Air Cargo (NAC) has entered in to a lease agreement with Ted Stevens Anchorage International Airport for space at the former Kulis Air National Guard base on Raspberry Road. The property will support transportation of Shell Alaska Exploration personnel during the summer offshore exploration season.

Northern Aviation Services, a division of NAC,, has reconfigured the building that once served as the mess hall and kitchen, transforming it into a charter terminal for use by Shell's employees and contractors. The company has also chartered a Boeing 737-400 passenger aircraft from Miami Air that will be based at the site.

NAC is the first air operator to lease space at the former base, located on 129 acres owned by the state, according to the Department of Transportation of Public Facilities. Kulis operated from the 1950s until February, 2011, when Air National Guard operations were relocated to Joint Base Elmendorf-Richardson.
 
woodsboy
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Thu Jul 05, 2012 5:01 am

NAC's operation is considerably smaller than Everts and their moving into the old Kulis building I dont think means anything. They only operate a couple 737-200s, no more DC-6s and their "experiment" with ATRs is long since history.

I think I found the source of this rumor and indeed it is Everts. It isnt a new airline and it isn't a passenger operation, seems like Everts is going to be taking the first MD-80SF (freighter conversion) from AEI....soon? Anyone please add to this if they have more info but my former colleague at Everts confirms that they have had this in the works for over a year and plan to eventually add more MD-80SFs as the DC-6s wind down over the next decade. So, not a passenger operation! It is understandable that if MD-80s were mentioned as a new type for an Alaskan operator it would be assumed that it would be for passengers since no MD-80s exist as freighters...apparently this is about to change!

The MD-80s to be added to the Everts fleet are ex-AA "Super 80s", two are slated for delivery with more to follow, albeit slowly.
 
hiflyeras
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Thu Jul 05, 2012 5:09 am

Quoting woodsboy (Reply 16):
The MD-80s to be added to the Everts fleet are ex-AA "Super 80s", two are slated for delivery with more to follow, albeit slowly.

Good luck with that...I can't imagine there being enough life in an AA Super80 to justify not only a likely D check but the expensive of converting it to a freighter AND getting FAA certification. But you can buy a MD80 for nothing...that'd help. If they're the first MD80 conversion to a freighter then certification will likely be a long process. Have they actually promised a start date for scheduled service?
 
woodsboy
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Thu Jul 05, 2012 5:35 am

Luck is apparently on AEI's side...the D-check was done over the winter, all major components were overhauled including engines and landing gear and the conversion is done. The first MD-80 is N73444, a 1987 vintage MD-82 and that reg suggests that it was a TWA bird to begin with. If you go to AEI's website they have an amazing day by day documentation of the tear down and build up the freighter conversion with LOTS of photos of the work. There are 15 orders right now for the conversion and Everts Air Cargo is indeed going to get the first conversion. I cant believe I didn't know about this since I use to work at Everts and I drive by their MX hanger all the time to see what it going on. I was so excited when the DC-9 30CFs showed up about 18 months ago that I guess I didnt even think about the possibility of their bringing on-line MD-80s freighters!
http://www.aeronautical-engineers.co...MD80SF%20Conversion%20Progress.pdf
check out the link above.

If a DC-9 can last for 45 years as both a pax carrier and a freighter then an MD-80 can certainly be almost new after just 25 years!!   Oh, then there are Everts DC-6s and C-46s that range between 55 and 70 years old and those beauties fly out of FAI and ANC every day of the year- still!
 
snowzilla
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Thu Jul 05, 2012 7:41 am

Quoting HiFlyerAS (Reply 14):
Quoting HiFlyerAS (Reply 14):
That said, it would NOT surprise me if someone is trying to take advantage of AS's pullout from Adak. There's a multimillion dollar EAS contract on the table for someone to pick up. PenAir entered a bid but it was rejected, probably due to their proposed subsidy was an outrageous sum ($3.7 million per year) and that they'd fly a 30 seat Saab that required a fuel stop and had little cargo capacity. AS continues to fly the route until a new entrant is approved.

Alaska decided to re-bid Adak and won...
 
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RWA380
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Thu Jul 05, 2012 10:22 am

Quoting snowzilla (Reply 19):

Alaska decided to re-bid Adak and won...

Boy AS does have the state of Alaska by the B*L*S huh? No way another carrier would pour the resources into trying to compete intra-state with AS, nor compete with AS on their lift out of Alaska to the lower 48. I'd be surprised if all the other carriers that serve Alaska other than AS, equal the amount of lift AS provides to the lower 48. Still love them, in my top 2 favs.
Next Flights: PDX-HNL-OGG-LIH-PDX On AS, WP & HA
 
hiflyeras
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Thu Jul 05, 2012 1:15 pm

Quoting snowzilla (Reply 19):
Alaska decided to re-bid Adak and won...

Am curious about your source....haven't heard that they decided to re-bid on Adak. Doesn't surprise me considering that the original subsidy was a now-paltry $1.6 million per year for two flights a week. PenAir's bid that was turned down was for a whopping $3.4 million on a prop. If AS were smart they'd resubmit their bid for close to that amount and it'd probably be accepted. They likely never imagined they could ask for that high of number.
 
wedgetail737
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Thu Jul 05, 2012 3:03 pm

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 20):
No way another carrier would pour the resources into trying to compete intra-state with AS, nor compete with AS on their lift out of Alaska to the lower 48. I'd be surprised if all the other carriers that serve Alaska other than AS, equal the amount of lift AS provides to the lower 48. Still love them, in my top 2 favs.

Remember when there was a ton of intra-Alaska jet traffic with Reeve, Wien, Markair and AS.
 
atct
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Thu Jul 05, 2012 6:44 pm

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 7):
I saw a NAC 737-300 at BFI yesterday...new equipment? Maybe NAC will spin off a new combi airline simply called Northern Air?

Also, I've seen Everts EMB-120F at Paine Field.

NAC has had the -300 for 2-3 years now, usually flies out of Laredo, TX. Everts has also had the Brasilia's for a while now as well.



I've heard rumblings around the office of Allegiant looking at service. Cant back it up but its been around the office a few times.

atct
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RWA380
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:06 am

Quoting wedgetail737 (Reply 22):
Remember when there was a ton of intra-Alaska jet traffic with Reeve, Wien, Markair and AS.

I do remember each carrier, they all flew to SEA at one time or another, I remember Reeves Electras. Both Markair and Wien failed when they decided to make a market for themselves in the lower 48, It worked for AS because they did it slowly over many years, while both Markair and Wiens expansions were done rather quickly and not well covered. Now AS enjoys the spoils of being the tortoise in the race, and the big winner.
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usxguy
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Fri Jul 06, 2012 6:18 pm

Actually Alaska hasn't been 'reawarded' ADAK - they are being held in.

The "new" airline is this:

Essential Air Service at Adak, Alaska

OST-2000-8556

June 26, 2012

Withdrawal of Bid of Tiny Aviation Enterprises

At this time Tiny Aviation Enterprises will not be entering a bid for the EAS contract for Adak, Alaska. I am not putting in a bid for two reasons, first the time required to obtain DOT Public Conveyance Permit (Up to six months) and second the time required to get my FAA Part 121 Air Carrier Certificate from the FAA Over a year).

I am continuing to work towards getting my airline up and running, and hope to be able to bid on the next EAS Contract Bid for Adak, Alaska.

By: Tiny Air, Raylin Martin, 704-830-6970

Index
xx
 
sunking737
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Fri Jul 06, 2012 6:23 pm

Just to add fuel to the fire, Rumor has company "A" putting its planes on company "Zs" AOC. Not sure how well that will go over with the Fed's. Wet lease or Dry or what have you??
Just an MSPAVGEEK
 
canoecarrier
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Fri Jul 06, 2012 6:58 pm

Quoting woodsboy (Reply 6):
The only entity in Alaska that currently exists that could possibly be able to bring on and support MD-80s (or DC-9s) is Everts Air Cargo/ Everts Air Alaska based in Fairbanks. Currently they operate a scheduled passenger and charter passenger operation with Embraer EMB 120s, Cessna Caravans, Pilatus PC-12s and Piper Lance. Their cargo ops use DC-6s, C-46s and DC-9-30CFs so it would not be out of the question for them to be thinking of moving further into the pax market although I know of no plans, it is a thought though.

I don't like the aircraft type for Alaska ops, but wouldn't Era be able to support an aircraft that size if they wanted to?

Quoting HiFlyerAS (Reply 14):
That said, it would NOT surprise me if someone is trying to take advantage of AS's pullout from Adak.

Adak's service demand must be highly seasonal? Everytime I've been in ANC there really didn't look like that many people getting on the Adak flight.

Quoting Flightmedic72 (Reply 15):
The property will support transportation of Shell Alaska Exploration personnel during the summer offshore exploration season.

Is this the same group that flies up to the North Slope out of B Concourse in ANC?

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 20):
Boy AS does have the state of Alaska by the B*L*S huh? No way another carrier would pour the resources into trying to compete intra-state with AS, nor compete with AS on their lift out of Alaska to the lower 48.

There are a number of other carriers that make a decent living flying to places that AS doesn't in Alaska.
The beatings will continue until morale improves
 
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usxguy
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Fri Jul 06, 2012 11:22 pm

Quoting sunking737 (Reply 26):
Just to add fuel to the fire, Rumor has company "A" putting its planes on company "Zs" AOC. Not sure how well that will go over with the Fed's. Wet lease or Dry or what have you??

can operate as a DOT 380 op....
xx
 
hiflyeras
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Sat Jul 07, 2012 12:24 am

That is so damn cute!! 'Tiny Air'! LOL Has anyone called him just to say hello?

Yes, AS had previously agreed to continue service to ADK until a new carrier began service. But as of today apparently no one is interested except Mr. Tiny.
 
atct
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Sun Jul 08, 2012 5:26 am

Quoting canoecarrier (Reply 27):
Is this the same group that flies up to the North Slope out of B Concourse in ANC?

This is "Shared Aviation Services" aka Conoco and BP shared flights under Conoco's certificate. They fly under the callsign "Conoco." For those who are up here, this is the -200's last summer so get em while you can.

atct
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GentFromAlaska
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Sun Jul 08, 2012 4:05 pm

Interesting Lynden Air Cargo (IATA L2) http://www.lac.lynden.com/ hasn't bid on the route.

Many years ago and out of the blue I saw a Lynden airframe taxi around at the Norfolk Naval Air Station; a long way from home. I assumed they were flying air cargo from Naval Force Alaska to the Atlantic fleet.
Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
 
as77w
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RE: Rumor: New Airline In Alaska?

Mon Jul 09, 2012 2:11 am

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 31):
Interesting Lynden Air Cargo (IATA L2) http://www.lac.lynden.com/ hasn't bid on the route.

The EAS contract requires the operator to be capable of supplying passenger service to ADK as well as cargo. Lynden Air Cargo does not meet the passenger service requirement.