Markam
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Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 1:08 pm

I cannot provide an official source for this yet, so take it with a grain of salt as a rumor if you wish, but according to an informal source in Qatar, which I cannot reveal but which has been very reliable in the past, Qatar Airways will join Oneworld and the announcement will be made in September.
 
rwy04lga
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 1:11 pm

Aww shucks, I was hoping for SkyTeam.
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Markam
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 1:42 pm

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 1):
Aww shucks, I was hoping for SkyTeam.

Well, with all respect for both alliances, I would say that Oneworld needs QR more than SkyTeam does, since although RJ has the middle east more or less covered, QR would provide invaluable connections to South Asia and East Africa, and reinforce S7 in Central Asia and MH in South East Asia, as well as provide another intermediate base in Doha for the Kangaroo route, together with Kuala Lumpur (my guess here is that they would both complement each other for traffic from Europe to Oceania, but that Doha would be a very competitive one-stop option for the U.S. East Coast traffic to Oceania and South East Asia when reinforced by AA feed). SkyTeam, on the contrary, already has two Middle East airlines on board, and will soon have a South East Asia one when GA joins next year, which together with their Chinese fortress should be enough to cover the above mentioned regions, with the exception of Oceania, but they may fix that if DL coziness with Virgin Australia lures the latter into SkyTeam (and Etihad may follow suit there, or even join on their own before, for all we know).

It is funny, because a few months ago Oneworld seemed very weakened, with MA closing shop and JL and AA in dire straights, but if, as also rumoured, JJ joins LA in Oneworld, and QR does indeed join too, the alliance will be considerably stronger next year than it was last one (AA form of emergence from bankruptcy pending, of course, but even if they were to merge with US, in my opinion the natural choice would be Oneworld).
 
aaexecplat
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 1:46 pm

No surprise. QR was always a natural fit for OW.
 
Markam
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 1:55 pm

Quoting AAExecPlat (Reply 3):
No surprise. QR was always a natural fit for OW.

Well, I must confess that given their codeshare strategy until very recently I was convinced that if QR were to join an alliance, it would be Star, but agreed, I think they would be a very good fit for current and announced Oneworld members.
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 1:56 pm

Quoting Markam (Reply 2):
It is funny, because a few months ago Oneworld seemed very weakened, with MA closing shop and JL and AA in dire straights, but if, as also rumoured, JJ joins LA in Oneworld, and QR does indeed join too, the alliance will be considerably stronger next year than it was last one (AA form of emergence from bankruptcy pending, of course, but even if they were to merge with US, in my opinion the natural choice would be Oneworld).

Agreed. The additions of JJ, MH, and QR would be HUGE.
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 2:05 pm

Quoting AAExecPlat (Reply 5):
Agreed. The additions of JJ, MH, and QR would be HUGE.

AA has invited JJ as was reported on this forum a few months back, but I think LATAM only stated that JJ would leave Star. I don't believe that there has been any mention of JJ in oneworld.

Maybe oneworld gave Baker the most bang for his buck, maybe QF loves the fact that QR does not serve SYD, or maybe this is a case of a bunch of oneworld's smaller airlines overpowering a few of the bigger ones. Though these discussions are all naturally closed door and confidential, I am interested in what prompted QR's shift in alliance strategy.

This constant shifting among airlines is what makes this industry so much fun to observe. At one point, EY seemed an inevitability for oneworld and QR for Star, but its amazing how a couple of partnership changes can change the game.
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mfe777
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 2:07 pm

Does this mean we will probably see a DFW-DOH route in the near future? Maybe on a QR 777-300ER?
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 2:13 pm

Quoting blink182 (Reply 6):
maybe QF loves the fact that QR does not serve SYD

So could we see Qantas launching SYD-DOH?
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 2:15 pm

Quoting blink182 (Reply 6):

There's been talk about QR serving SYD however has not been achievable due to the lack of slots... This could go in both BA and QF favor... BA can serve DOH from LHR while QF can feed traffic from SYD / MEL via DOH...
Achievable no?

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Markam
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 2:16 pm

Quoting blink182 (Reply 6):
Maybe oneworld gave Baker the most bang for his buck, maybe QF loves the fact that QR does not serve SYD, or maybe this is a case of a bunch of oneworld's smaller airlines overpowering a few of the bigger ones. Though these discussions are all naturally closed door and confidential, I am interested in what prompted QR's shift in alliance strategy.

As it has been mentioned I think that in terms of route network QR is a good fit for current Oneworld members, and probably all the factors that you mention have played a bigger or smaller role, but I would say that the apparently really good personal rapport between Al Baker and Willie Walsh may have also been conductive to an agreement. I mean, QR is not obviously to take business decisions based on personal relationships, but, you know, things are always easier to work out among friends. Another example of this is the personal rapport and long-term relationship of the Cueto family, in control of LAN and now of LATAM, which is also rumoured to be a big factor behind the likely decision of LAN to stay in Oneworld, and of TAM following them there, if they do).

Quoting blink182 (Reply 6):
This constant shifting among airlines is what makes this industry so much fun to observe. At one point, EY seemed an inevitability for oneworld and QR for Star, but its amazing how a couple of partnership changes can change the game.

Agreed, and after QR the other Gulf carriers may feel the urgence to join an alliance too, so, grab the popcorn!   
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 2:22 pm

Quoting mfe777 (Reply 7):
Does this mean we will probably see a DFW-DOH route in the near future? Maybe on a QR 777-300ER?
Quoting mfe777 (Reply 7):
So could we see Qantas launching SYD-DOH?

I am really not familiar with the figures for those markets, but in principle I would say that they would certainly be natural Oneworld routes if QR joins, although I would say that on whose metal they would be flown, AA, QF or QR, is far from clear.
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 2:34 pm

Quoting mfe777 (Reply 7):
Does this mean we will probably see a DFW-DOH route in the near future? Maybe on a QR 777-300ER?

Very possible at some point - though I'd bet ORD-DOH would be launched first given the large subcontinent population in Chicagoland. No doubt that flight would do extremely well particularly in the back, and hopefully up front too. Will AA continue to codeshare with EY on their ORD-AUH flight then? An ORD-DOH with QR in oneworld would be in direct competition.
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 2:38 pm

Emirates and Etihad alliance speculation posts starting in 3...2...1...   
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mikey72
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 2:46 pm

Hoorah...an airline in Oneworld with some money !

I take back what I said about them being state owned.

It's no longer an issue for me.


  
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 3:01 pm

Quoting 9w748capt (Reply 12):
Very possible at some point - though I'd bet ORD-DOH would be launched first given the large subcontinent population in Chicagoland

The Subcontinent population in Dallas is also huge. Its the 6th largest in the US after NYC, Bay Area, Chicago, DC, and Los Angeles. Dont know if that would drive it or not, the yields are typically low to the Subcontinent.

[Edited 2012-07-13 08:02:02]
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 3:10 pm

Quoting blink182 (Reply 6):
AA has invited JJ as was reported on this forum a few months back, but I think LATAM only stated that JJ would leave Star. I don't believe that there has been any mention of JJ in oneworld.

Yup, and that is a very important thing to bear in mind. At the very least, however, I am optimistic that LAN will stay in OneWorld. Given LAN's current network and their connectivity to powerhouse OneWorld hubs, it seems illogical to me why they'd ever leave the alliance.

Quoting 9w748capt (Reply 12):
Very possible at some point - though I'd bet ORD-DOH would be launched first given the large subcontinent population in Chicagoland.

It's interesting how people have long surmised about the potential of an ORDDOH route over the years, but it never materialized. It's definitely only a matter of time before EK comes to ORD. Not sure about QR though.
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 3:13 pm

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 15):
The Subcontinent population in Dallas is also huge. Its the 6th largest in the US after NYC, Bay Area, Chicago, DC, and Los Angeles. Dont know if that would drive it or not, the yields are typically low to the Subcontinent.

Minor edit : Dallas is 7 ... BOS is #5 and Bay Area #6

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_o...s_primary_census_statistical_areas
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 3:28 pm

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 17):
Minor edit : Dallas is 7 ... BOS is #5 and Bay Area #6

You didnt read my post. I was talking about South Asian population (or residents from the Indian subcontinent) and it is number 6.
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mogandoCI
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 4:19 pm

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 18):
You didnt read my post. I was talking about South Asian population (or residents from the Indian subcontinent) and it is number 6.

What's the source of your #6 ? I found some older data based on Census 2000, and DFW is #8 :

http://www.usindiafriendship.net/census/citypop.htm
 
blink182
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 4:32 pm

Bearing in mind that neither QR nor oneworld has issued an official press release, this entire thread is pure speculation.

Quoting Markam (Reply 10):
As it has been mentioned I think that in terms of route network QR is a good fit for current Oneworld members,

Yes, but can't the same be said for EY?

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 16):
It's interesting how people have long surmised about the potential of an ORDDOH route over the years, but it never materialized.

Agree. UA is ORD's #1 carrier. Either the pax numbers just aren't there with EY and RJ in the market, or QR doesn't have the amount of planes to do it. If this were about connecting feed, the route would have been started while QR partnered with UA. Now they have no partner.

Quoting ju068 (Reply 8):

So could we see Qantas launching SYD-DOH?

I'm sure if a QF-QR alliance comes to fruition QF will be on it immediately. Do their 332s have the range for nonstop? It may be more important for QF that they fly the route to prove that they aren't just cutting and cutting.
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 4:36 pm

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 19):
What's the source of your #6 ? I found some older data based on Census 2000, and DFW is #8 :

Below is the data from the 2010 census:

1) NYC: 526,133
2) Bay Area: 237,556
3) Chicago: 171,901
4) Washington/Baltimore: 160,156
5) Los Angeles: 119,901
6) Dallas: 100,386
7) Houston: 91,637
8) Philadelphia: 90,286
9) Boston: 62,598
10) Detroit: 55,087
11) Seattle: 52,652

Of course this is the Indian populations only, but even when you factor in all the other South Asian ethnicities, Dallas is still number 6. The list left off Atlanta for whatever reason, but I remember seeing that its Indian population was around 70,000 putting it between Boston and Philly.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_American

[Edited 2012-07-13 09:37:56]
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 4:43 pm

Quoting blink182 (Reply 20):
As it has been mentioned I think that in terms of route network QR is a good fit for current Oneworld members,
Yes, but can't the same be said for EY?

hmmmh.....   

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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 4:46 pm

Based on this turn of events if factual and true then you have to wonder about alignment of OW carriers at focus cities like IAH? Would QR uproot from IAH and move the stable north to DFW since that is the fortress hub for AA with QF & BA as honorable mentions?

OR does QR continue to enjoy its solid yields regarding the O&G business down in Houston and AA instead decides to go crazy and ALSO wants access to Term. D gates D1-4 (mind you these are RJ, MD80, 737 and possibly 757 capable) at IAH to be closer to its other OW partners QR & the double daily BA's?

Please Note: this is also what DL is trying to secure with respect to it wanting to be close to its Sky Team partners in AM, AF & KLM.
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 4:54 pm

Quoting blink182 (Reply 20):
Quoting ju068 (Reply 8):

So could we see Qantas launching SYD-DOH?

I'm sure if a QF-QR alliance comes to fruition QF will be on it immediately. Do their 332s have the range for nonstop? It may be more important for QF that they fly the route to prove that they aren't just cutting and cutting.

SYD-DOH is nearly 7700smi. Even with zero headwinds, the 332 would probably struggle on the westbound leg. QF's upcoming 787 might be better suited (assuming QF does it instead of QR, which has plenty of planes to choose from).

But with QF's cost structure, that's a painfully long flight that's heavily tilted towards connections instead of O&D.
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 5:32 pm

Yea, I doubt QR would leave IAH for DFW. I could see DFW being added with 787 intitially and then upgauging as needed , QR has a helluva reputation here in Houston and they also pulled out all the stops in terms of an investment - they have leased office space in Houston Pavillions and have invested heavily in marketing.
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 5:45 pm

Quoting drerx7 (Reply 25):

Yea, I doubt QR would leave IAH for DFW. I could see DFW being added with 787 intitially and then upgauging as needed , QR has a helluva reputation here in Houston and they also pulled out all the stops in terms of an investment - they have leased office space in Houston Pavillions and have invested heavily in marketing.

QR wont leave IAH. That said, if QR joins OW and develops a close relationship with AA, DFW-DOH would work, but it would exist alongside IAH.
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 6:05 pm

Quoting Markam (Reply 2):

Well, with all respect for both alliances, I would say that Oneworld needs QR more than SkyTeam does
Quoting AAExecPlat (Reply 3):
No surprise. QR was always a natural fit for OW.

I agree, I can't see QR going to any other alliance. It was either OW or no alliance at all.

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 24):
SYD-DOH is nearly 7700smi. Even with zero headwinds, the 332 would probably struggle on the westbound leg. QF's upcoming 787 might be better suited (assuming QF does it instead of QR, which has plenty of planes to choose from).

IIRC wasn't this a route discussed to be operated under the 787? Or was I mistaken?

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 26):
QR wont leave IAH. That said, if QR joins OW and develops a close relationship with AA, DFW-DOH would work, but it would exist alongside IAH.

I can definitely see QR being able to pull both off profitably. DFW because of the AA connections, and IAH because- well, you know
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 7:11 pm

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 16):
It's interesting how people have long surmised about the potential of an ORDDOH route over the years, but it never materialized. It's definitely only a matter of time before EK comes to ORD. Not sure about QR though.

If QR joins oneworld then it should almost be a given for someone (AA or QR - most likely QR) to start ORD-DOH right? I agree, it's pretty amazing that EK hasn't started ORD yet, even with another gulf carrier already in. Or is AA going to scale back ORD enough to where there won't be enough feed for a DOH flight? That would be crazy - the Chicago market counting O&D plus connections should definitely be large enough to support two large hubs. I can't imagine BA would be too thrilled about this as QR would definitely siphon off a large number of India-bound passengers.
 
kiwiandrew

RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 7:44 pm

While I have doubts about the wisdom of accepting QR into the fold it has been good in the last couple of years to see OW move forward after a long period of stagnation. I am still not sure what QR offers to an alliance although I suppose the old saying about it being better to have an unwelcome guest in your tent pissing out of it rather than leaving them outside pissing in may apply.
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 8:09 pm

I don't mean this to be rude or sarcastic, but what exactly makes QR a good fit for OW? Several people have mentioned their route structure compliments the OW network. Can someone please explain how?
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jumpjets
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 8:13 pm

Given that Etihad have a substantial stake in AB would this mean AB are likely to leave Oneworld should QR join?
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 8:23 pm

Quoting 9w748capt (Reply 28):
If QR joins oneworld then it should almost be a given for someone (AA or QR - most likely QR) to start ORD-DOH right? I agree, it's pretty amazing that EK hasn't started ORD yet, even with another gulf carrier already in. Or is AA going to scale back ORD enough to where there won't be enough feed for a DOH flight? That would be crazy - the Chicago market counting O&D plus connections should definitely be large enough to support two large hubs. I can't imagine BA would be too thrilled about this as QR would definitely siphon off a large number of India-bound passengers.

EY is currently making ORDAUH work on a codeshare basis, so yes, I'd imagine that does indicate promising potential that *if* QR were to join OW, then a flight between ORD and DOH would make logical sense. However, as we all know EY carriers a certain type of traffic in and out of ORD, so it wouldn't surprise me that QR would likely be carrying the same type of passenger make-up. Therefore, hypothetically, I'd see QR flying the route over AA, especially because AA's 787 deliveries will not materialize for a few more years.

BA certainly does carry India-bound traffic, but remember that ORDLHR is also a big O&D hub with plenty of business ties, so I would not worry too much about that one.

Also, I don't think AA is going to scale back on ORD. They may right-size it a bit more, but overall the ORD hub does provide decent value to the AA network.
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:18 pm

Am I the only one totally shocked by this?

I figured EY would go into Oneworld.
QR was debating between *A and Skyteam.
EK was laughing at the idea of an alliance.

I also think it is more important for the alliances to pick an Indian partner than a mid-east partner.

Quoting AAExecPlat (Reply 3):

No surprise. QR was always a natural fit for OW.

I'm shocked.

Quoting Markam (Reply 4):
I was convinced that if QR were to join an alliance, it would be Star

Ditto, but my impression is that *A (LH probably) was dragging their feet on QR and thus why QR had talks with Skyteam.

Quoting kordcj (Reply 30):
Several people have mentioned their route structure compliments the OW network. Can someone please explain how?

All of the alliances need better connections in the mid-East, India, and some other connections.

QR also is big, but not so big to threaten the major members of each alliance. For example, EK competes with Oneworld on routes from Europe to Austalia. Why bring them into the alliance? While QR has yet to set up their Australian network and QR could feed to DOH while European OW partners feed DOH as well.

In some ways QR is ideal as they can fill holes in OneWorld's network without too much overlap (there is some however). There is no regional OW partner QR would 'step on.'

With *A, QR is going head to head with AI/9W (whomever joins *A in India) and competes with LH for Europe to India. However, *A could use the connections; in particular Asia to India and Africa. However, that competes somewhat with TK. In other words, any new mid-east partner for *A is going to go 'head to head' with two large *A airlines: LH and TK. (But LH might have the only vote that counts...)

Skyteam has Saudia and thus QR would complete partially. However, QR has a far more extensive network than Saudia, so most here on a.net expect Skyteam to take on both an Indian partner and another mid-east partner.

That is my   

EY is even less of a threat to any alliance. But they also add less benefit. So they are being talked to as a fallback instead of the main business plan.

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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:33 pm

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 33):
Am I the only one totally shocked by this

Nope...me too

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 33):
I figured EY would go into Oneworld.
QR was debating between *A and Skyteam.

Yep.... me too....

So, how does that leave AB/EY...?

AB in Oneworld, with EY have a 1/3 share..?
Surely EY will gain too much "info" into OW with QR posibly heading into OW.

?????
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Fri Jul 13, 2012 11:35 pm

Quoting mfe777 (Reply 7):
Does this mean we will probably see a DFW-DOH route in the near future?

What about MIA???

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 15):
The Subcontinent population in Dallas is also huge. Its the 6th largest in the US after NYC, Bay Area, Chicago, DC, and Los Angeles.

Oh, that's why it won't be MIA
 
kiwiandrew

RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sat Jul 14, 2012 3:40 am

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 33):
Quoting Markam (Reply 4):I was convinced that if QR were to join an alliance, it would be Star
Ditto, but my impression is that *A (LH probably) was dragging their feet on QR and thus why QR had talks with Skyteam.

I am not sure that *A actually wanted them. I remember a while back someone senior in *A ( it may have been Jan Albrect but I'm not 100% sure) stating that *A wasn't interested in adding any 'artificial hubs in the desert'. Of course that was before someone else wanted QR .... we often don't want something until we realise that someone else has already taken it  
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sat Jul 14, 2012 5:55 am

So, as expected...

I wonder when the EY SkyTeam announcement will come?
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Markam
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sat Jul 14, 2012 9:08 am

Quoting blink182 (Reply 20):
Bearing in mind that neither QR nor oneworld has issued an official press release, this entire thread is pure speculation.

Agreed, and that is why "Rumor" is the first word of its title. That said, my source was even more specific, quoting September 12th as the expected date for the announcement, so it looks like it has very specific information. In any case, in a month and a half we will know whether my source was reliable on this or not!  
Quoting kordcj (Reply 30):
I don't mean this to be rude or sarcastic, but what exactly makes QR a good fit for OW? Several people have mentioned their route structure compliments the OW network. Can someone please explain how?


I already tried, however please bear in mind that I am no expert in the region, so this is all my personal point of view:

Quoting Markam (Reply 2):
I would say that Oneworld needs QR more than SkyTeam does, since although RJ has the middle east more or less covered, QR would provide invaluable connections to South Asia and East Africa, and reinforce S7 in Central Asia and MH in South East Asia, as well as provide another intermediate base in Doha for the Kangaroo route, together with Kuala Lumpur (my guess here is that they would both complement each other for traffic from Europe to Oceania, but that Doha would be a very competitive one-stop option for the U.S. East Coast traffic to Oceania and South East Asia when reinforced by AA feed)

  

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 33):
Am I the only one totally shocked by this?

Quoting Markam (Reply 4):
I was convinced that if QR were to join an alliance, it would be Star

Ditto, but my impression is that *A (LH probably) was dragging their feet on QR and thus why QR had talks with Skyteam.

As you mention, I shared your expectation of *A membership for QR until some time ago, when they started to get cozy with QF, Willie Walsh wrote tender words about them, they announced the end of their codeshare with UA, etc., at what point I could not help but wonder "hum, maybe, after all...."

Quoting aeroblogger (Reply 37):

So, as expected...

I wonder when the EY SkyTeam announcement will come?

Irrespective of QR joining Oneworld, in my opinion at this point I think that Etihad going into SkyTeam is not a crazy thought, and nor is that Virgin Australia joins them there at some point, given their close relationships with Etihad themselves, but also with Delta. I think that Air Berlin leaving Oneworld for SkyTeam, as it has been suggested in some posts above, is more difficult, I would say, since as far as I know Etihad's stake is not a controlling one, but hey, nothing is written in stone, so if it makes sense for them they will jump ship in no time, and Etihad's stake would not harm in the process (if they indeed join SkyTeam).
 
TeamintheSky
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sat Jul 14, 2012 9:09 am

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 33):
Am I the only one totally shocked by this?

I figured EY would go into Oneworld.
QR was debating between *A and Skyteam.
EK was laughing at the idea of an alliance.

First, thanks Lightsaber for your thorough analysis as always. I would tend to agree with your sentiment of surprise until a couple of months ago. What changed?

Al Baker's and Willy Walsh's mutual comments of bromances of each other's airline.
AF's and EY's open discussions about a code share

Also, as much as I am a fan of SkyTeam. QR's profile does not seem to fit in as it is much nicer than most in SkyTeam.

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 33):
Skyteam has Saudia and thus QR would complete partially. However, QR has a far more extensive network than Saudia, so most here on a.net expect Skyteam to take on both an Indian partner and another mid-east partner.

Your comments about Star and SkyTeam are right on about Gulf Carriers, and I do believe much of this has to do with Indian aviation for the alliances. With Star being selfish with Indian carriers and IT's eventual demise, both SkyTeam and oneworld have to pursue Gulf Carriers as the next best thing to serve India. I am not sure if EY will ever sign up with SkyTeam, but with the limitless funds of the airline right up the road (aka EK), it could certainly help, especially if they became one of the cogs for SkyTeam in the Indian and Kangaroo routes. I also do not think EY or QR steps on any toes if they were to join either discussed alliances.

Quoting TUGMASTER (Reply 34):
So, how does that leave AB/EY...?

I think the EY influence is over-played. Also it is horrible expensive to change and AB isn't in the best financial position for such change. However, AF purported has beenin discussions with AB as well.

Quoting aeroblogger (Reply 37):


I wonder when the EY SkyTeam announcement will come?


Not soon enough in my opinion, however, as discussed about Indian aviation, until 9W makes their choice, you will not see any announcement for EY in SkyTeam.

Regards,

Team
Since 2010: DL, KL, AF, WX, IG, FR , FL, U2, AK, BA, OK, UX, VS, VN, K6, AT, US, AY, BE, EI, LG, AZ, 9W, SG, AA, JL, W6
 
bill142
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sat Jul 14, 2012 10:23 am

Quoting TUGMASTER (Reply 34):

AB in Oneworld, with EY have a 1/3 share..?
Quoting lightsaber (Reply 33):
Am I the only one totally shocked by this?

I figured EY would go into Oneworld.
EY has a reasonable stake in Virgin Australia as well as a strategic partnership which seems to have gone unnoticed by many here. I can hardly see Qantas working with EY in oneworld. What also has gone unnoticed is that Qantas is currently holding high level talks with QR. Al Baker also has an admiration for Willie Walsh which oneworld will no doubt be using to win QR over.

[Edited 2012-07-14 03:25:42]
 
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sat Jul 14, 2012 2:10 pm

Quoting TeamInTheSky (Reply 39):
Al Baker's and Willy Walsh's mutual comments of bromances of each other's airline.
AF's and EY's open discussions about a code share

Ah... I guess my filter settings on Al Baker were set too high.   Good points.

Quoting TeamInTheSky (Reply 39):
First, thanks Lightsaber for your thorough analysis as always.

Thank you.

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 36):
*A wasn't interested in adding any 'artificial hubs in the desert'. Of course that was before someone else wanted QR .... we often don't want something until we realise that someone else has already taken it

After sleeping on this thread, I wonder if LH/TK/future india partner just do not want as strong a local competitor as QR. EY provides what *A is short of in the region without as much competitive threat.   

While with the collapse of IT, Oneworld has lost what was a strong Indian partner (on the surface) and is not trying to do damage repair. If *A now has any interest in QR, it is them realizing that QR will be a competitor and perhaps it would be better to 'keep enemies close?'


Lightsaber
"They did not know it was impossible, so they did it!" - Mark Twain
 
RyanairGuru
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:08 pm

Quoting blink182 (Reply 20):
Do their 332s have the range for nonstop?

No. But they would likely be too small for SYD anyway. If SYD-DOH were to be a QF flight I think it would be a 747-400ER which could easily do it, although they would have to find some 747s first since once the planned retirements are completed the 747 fleet will be stretched pretty thinly.

More likely is that QF will lease a slot to QR to bring a 777 into SYD. I'm sure QF could find a suitable slot pair with no trouble at all (does CBR really need all those Dash 8s?). Don't forget that QF's cost structure is prohibitively high, and a JV (or whatever it is) with QR is aimed at negating that. Using QF metal for 70% of the distance doesn't really help out there.

Quoting Markam (Reply 38):
in my opinion at this point I think that Etihad going into SkyTeam is not a crazy thought, and nor is that Virgin Australia joins them there at some point, given their close relationships with Etihad themselves, but also with Delta

Don't forget that Joe Borgetti has gone on the record that SkyTeam is at least as attractive, if not more so, than Star then I can see that one coming pretty quickly if EY were to join. After all, they have three strategic partners: DL, EY and SQ. As Meatloaf noted, 2 out of 3 aint bad

Quoting mikey72 (Reply 14):
Hoorah...an airline in Oneworld with some money !

What are you talking about?

Signed: CEO of Swire  
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
mikey72
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:18 pm

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 42):
What are you talking about?

There are a handful of airlines in the world that don't count cash as a concern.

QR is one of them.

At least that's one airline we won't have to worry about going t*ts up if god forbid the economy gets worse or EK buy Heathrow airport or something !
Flying is like sex - I've never had all I wanted but occasionally I've had all I can stand.
 
RyanairGuru
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sat Jul 14, 2012 6:43 pm

Quoting mikey72 (Reply 43):

I realise that, but I was being somewhat sarcastic by referring to Swire - owners of Cathay Pacific
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
DTWLAX
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sat Jul 14, 2012 8:12 pm

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 21):
Below is the data from the 2010 census:

1) NYC: 526,133
2) Bay Area: 237,556
3) Chicago: 171,901
4) Washington/Baltimore: 160,156
5) Los Angeles: 119,901
6) Dallas: 100,386
7) Houston: 91,637
8) Philadelphia: 90,286
9) Boston: 62,598
10) Detroit: 55,087
11) Seattle: 52,652

Of course this is the Indian populations only, but even when you factor in all the other South Asian ethnicities, Dallas is still number 6. The list left off Atlanta for whatever reason, but I remember seeing that its Indian population was around 70,000 putting it between Boston and Philly.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_American

You are not completely correct either. This is data only for US citizens with Indian ancestry. There are still thousands of Indian origin people who are in the USA on visas and not as citizens.
 
LAXdude1023
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sat Jul 14, 2012 10:05 pm

Quoting DTWLAX (Reply 45):

The data is for those born in India but who live in those particular areas legally and permenantly in some form or fashion.

[Edited 2012-07-14 15:08:44]
It is what it is...
 
JAL
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sat Jul 14, 2012 10:48 pm

This would be a major boost for OneWorld!
Work Hard But Play Harder
 
DTWLAX
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sat Jul 14, 2012 11:02 pm

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 46):
The data is for those born in India but who live in those particular areas legally and permenantly in some form or fashion.

I agree with that but I am saying there are people living legally but are not permanent residents i.e. those without citizenship or green cards but with on work or student visas who are not included in your data.
 
aeroblogger
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RE: Rumor: QR To Join Oneworld, September Announcement

Sun Jul 15, 2012 5:45 am

Quoting DTWLAX (Reply 45):
You are not completely correct either. This is data only for US citizens with Indian ancestry. There are still thousands of Indian origin people who are in the USA on visas and not as citizens.

Correct.

BOS is slightly larger than DFW when you include visa holders.

(source: Indian Embassy figures added to census figures)
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