LAXintl
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Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Sun Jul 22, 2012 10:49 pm

According to Malaysian CEO Ahmad Jauhari Yahya, the carrier will park its remaining 9 747-400 aircraft by the end of November. He also mentioned the 777 fleet would be "gone in 3 years".

I guess the financial upheavals, and change strategy is the normal course at MH these days.


Looking in GDS, the last 744 flight I can see operates SYD-KUL on November 25th.


Story:
Malaysia Air Speeds Boeing Exit from Fleet
http://www.nasdaq.com/article/malays...ing-exit-from-fleet-20120709-01693

=
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mercure1
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Sun Jul 22, 2012 10:54 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Thread starter):
777 fleet would be "gone in 3 years"

I suppose the latest iteration of the IGW A330-200/300 should serve all of their intl long haul needs?
 
PHX787
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Sun Jul 22, 2012 10:54 pm

Strange they're parking the 777 too. Sad to see both being parked  

Are the 747s going to be converted to freighters like the others?
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cedarjet
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Sun Jul 22, 2012 10:55 pm

I think we all know the 747* is a gas-guzzler by 2012 standards and her days are numbered. Surprised they're looking at exiting the 777. Most airlines see it as part of the solution, not part of the problem. If the 777 is uneconomical for MAS, what is economical? Is the A330 so much better? I think of the two as fairly closely matched.

* was spotting at the threshold of 27R at LHR today - fantastic - and BA sure rule the roost with 747s. In fact I don't think I saw a 747 of another airline all afternoon. (Koreanair flew over my flat in East London when I got home.) I wonder how BA can expect to make money with 54 747s when everyone else has parked theirs.
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skipness1E
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Sun Jul 22, 2012 10:58 pm

Quoting cedarjet (Reply 3):
I think we all know the 747* is a gas-guzzler by 2012 standards and her days are numbered.

A more commercially astute airline can still make it pay though let's be honest, a bad workman blames his tools.
 
LAXintl
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:01 pm

Looking a bit deeper some of the currently 744 deployed markets will become as follows:

LHR – 7x 380, 7x 777
SYD – 7x 380, 7x 777

With random regional flying getting 738, 330 and 777 assigned.
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phxa340
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:12 pm

Quoting cedarjet (Reply 3):
I wonder how BA can expect to make money with 54 747s when everyone else has parked theirs.

A paid off 747 might still make you more money than a 777 or 330 that you have to pay lease payments on. BA has found a way to make 54 744s make them cash, in fact , its international ops make up most of its profits.
 
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BasilFawlty
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:20 pm

Quoting mercure1 (Reply 1):
I suppose the latest iteration of the IGW A330-200/300 should serve all of their intl long haul needs?

I know they have about 10 -300's on order, but how many -200's? Will the -200 make it to Europe non-stop?

Quoting cedarjet (Reply 3):
I wonder how BA can expect to make money with 54 747s when everyone else has parked theirs.

DL, UA, KL, LH, TG, QF, all still have a significant fleet of 747 in service.  
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Stitch
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:50 pm

The A330-300 will be fine for regional missions and a fair bit more efficient than the 777-200ER thanks to lower OEWs and MTOWs. And as they have the same seat count, there is no loss in capacity.

For longer missions, the A330-200 will take a payload hit due to it's smaller size, but with the heavier premium cabin and smaller Economy cabin, MH could be looking to increase RASM by reducing capacity on such routes.
 
LAXintl
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:51 am

I guess 744 values will only continue to drop as more global airlines park their fleets. From what I can tell most the fleet is leased so the carrier will only a few frames to market on its own.

I suspect with the recent arrival of the A380, the 744 somewhat lost its place. With 380 going on a few trunk routes like LHR and SYD, and the 777 running pretty much everything else longhaul, the 744 was probably too inefficient to hang onto. One does not need a 744 for a HKG or China hop when an A330 can do it easily.

The idea of dumping the 777 it’s a bit more perplexing, but I suppose here also MH made a mistake by continuing to build a herd of now 17 strong 777-200ER’s, when the world was instead adopting mostly the -300ER. Just off the bat, MH loses 40-50 seats of revenue compared to peers with the 77W.


Anyhow the continued problems of MH are a bit sad.

As shown over and over they do win awards for their service and product, they just have yet to be able to put together a financial plan to go along with it.

Endless government medling, over staffing, trial and error network all hurt the bottom line.

I was hoping entry into Oneworld would be the inspiration to blossom, but it seems the story simply repeats itself with MAS.
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ZaphodB
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:55 am

So is the LAX flight going to be a 330 or a 380? ... or canned?
 
PHX787
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:57 am

Quoting ZaphodB (Reply 10):
So is the LAX flight going to be a 330 or a 380? ... or canned?

Is this the one that connects through NRT or am I mistaken?

I assume it'll be A380
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jfk777
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:58 am

Quoting phxa340 (Reply 6):
A paid off 747 might still make you more money than a 777 or 330 that you have to pay lease payments on. BA has found a way to make 54 744s make them cash, in fact , its international ops make up most of its profits.

BA's average sector with a 744 is probably 3 hours less then Malaysia's when you consider the US east coast and all the BA 744's to those cities.
 
LAXintl
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:20 am

Quoting ZaphodB (Reply 10):
So is the LAX flight going to be a 330 or a 380? ... or canned?

744 was pulled off LAX earlier this year and became a 772.

They also swapped the intermediate stop to NRT from TPE.

Malaysian Airlines Adjust US Service (by LAXintl Jan 10 2012 in Civil Aviation)
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lightsaber
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:24 am

Quoting LAXintl (Thread starter):
According to Malaysian CEO Ahmad Jauhari Yahya, the carrier will park its remaining 9 747-400 aircraft by the end of November. He also mentioned the 777 fleet would be "gone in 3 years".

What is up with the 777s? Have they selected a replacement? I'm not aware of a Malaysia A350 or 787 order...

Quoting cedarjet (Reply 3):

I think we all know the 747* is a gas-guzzler by 2012 standards and her days are numbered.

744 days are numbered. The 748 has life left. In particular after weight is removed.

Quoting cedarjet (Reply 3):
I wonder how BA can expect to make money with 54 747s when everyone else has parked theirs.

BA needs to develop a strategy to replace both the 744s, but also the IB A346s. I will be very curious to see what they do (as will most of us on a.net).

I personally see a mix of 77Ws, A380s, and a possibility of a 748i subfleet. But the last would be dependent upon Boeing improving 748i performance, in particular empty weight and fuel burn.

Quoting phxa340 (Reply 6):
A paid off 747 might still make you more money than a 777 or 330 that you have to pay lease payments on.

If the 744 had any resale value that wouldn't be the case. The 777 burns 15% less fuel per passenger. That is about a 6% lower cost per seat mile or about half the lease. So if that paid off 747 requires expensive maintenance (which a 4 engine plane is likely to require just by stats), than no. That comment made more sense when fuel was 20% of the operating costs and the lease was 15% to 20%. Now fuel is 40% and the lease is 12% to 15%. However, an airline with rapid fleet turnover such as SQ and EK will keep maintenance to

Lightsaber
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Stitch
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:32 am

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 14):
What is up with the 777s? Have they selected a replacement?

They appear to be looking at the 240t A330-200 and A330-300X.
 
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:39 am

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 14):
I personally see a mix of 77Ws, A380s, and a possibility of a 748i subfleet

It would be highly unlikely that they'd be interested in the 748. It seems they will use the A380 for their flagship routes and the A330s for a significant regional network. They have realised they can't be a match for SQ so will gradually give up lesser long-haul routes and use Oneworld partners to maintain a significant virtual network.
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Kent350787
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:49 am

Unsurprising decision given the 380s slowly coming online. I was MH122/123 ealier in the month in both C and Y, and whilst the service and Y seat pitch helped make up for other shortcomings, the 744 is clearly getting old and dosn't even have the advantages of the ER models which QF is keeping on.
 
EddieDude
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 3:06 am

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 11):
Quoting ZaphodB (Reply 10):
So is the LAX flight going to be a 330 or a 380? ... or canned?

Is this the one that connects through NRT or am I mistaken?

I assume it'll be A380

It'd be very nice to see MH using the A380 for KUL-NRT-LAX. The updated A333 could make it from NRT to LAX too. Similar routes were mentioned by Airbus as examples of possible routes that the new A333 could do.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 15):
They appear to be looking at the 240t A330-200 and A330-300X.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-0...as-airbus-a330-revamp-appeals.html

http://www.ainonline.com/aviation-ne...s-increases-a330-payload-and-range
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PHX787
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 3:28 am

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 18):
It'd be very nice to see MH using the A380 for KUL-NRT-LAX. The updated A333 could make it from NRT to LAX too. Similar routes were mentioned by Airbus as examples of possible routes that the new A333 could do.

That would make 2 Asian routes connecting through NRT to LAX, including the SQ one.

Quoting Kent350787 (Reply 17):
Unsurprising decision given the 380s slowly coming online. I was MH122/123 ealier in the month in both C and Y, and whilst the service and Y seat pitch helped make up for other shortcomings, the 744 is clearly getting old and dosn't even have the advantages of the ER models which QF is keeping on.

How many 380s will they get by year's end?
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 3:36 am

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 19):
That would make 2 Asian routes connecting through NRT to LAX, including the SQ one.

Well, that is already happening. MH launched flights to LAX via NRT back in March (?) of this year. Instead of flying to LAX via TPE, MH is now stopping at NRT. It is flights 92 and 93.
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Thomas_Jaeger
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 4:13 am

Does anyone have any insight as to how many B737-400 are still flying given all of the B737-800s being delivered constantly?
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LAXintl
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 4:42 am

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 18):
It'd be very nice to see MH using the A380 for KUL-NRT-LAX.

They had daily 744 service at one time, then the frequency was reduced, and now its swapped to even smaller 777.

LAX is no where near near an A380 market for MAS.

I doubt their sole remaining Americas route makes them much if any money.
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EddieDude
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 4:48 am

You are right, it probably doesn't. I suppose they will keep the 77E and will eventually use the upgraded A333.
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LAXintl
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 4:58 am

Hey maybe if they can get back the LAX-MEX tag they could use the 380  

We know that flight was packed much to the dismay of the Mexican authorities.
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frigatebird
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 6:39 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 15):
Quoting lightsaber (Reply 14):What is up with the 777s? Have they selected a replacement?
They appear to be looking at the 240t A330-200 and A330-300X.

I wonder what aircraft MH will use to AMS, the 772 seems a perfect fit for that destination. It has been rotating between 747 and 777 the past couple of seasons, but the 747 seemed to me too much premium. Same for the A332, which has less Y but more Business seats than the 772. The A380 is too big and also has too many premium seats to fill for a destination like AMS, and even the A333X must leave too much payload behind to make it. I fear that if they downgrade to A332, AMS will eventually disappear completely from their route map  
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United Airline
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 6:58 am

Oh my....

I know they ordered 6 A380 (firm).What about options? How many?
 
TreeHillRavens
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 11:57 am

Quoting BasilFawlty (Reply 7):

I know they have about 10 -300's on order, but how many -200's? Will the -200 make it to Europe non-stop?

They ordered 15 -300X, and I think they have 7 or 8 in operation now. They have not ordered any new 332 to date.

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 14):

What is up with the 777s? Have they selected a replacement? I'm not aware of a Malaysia A350 or 787 order...

That's the thing. There is still no replacement for the 772 yet. It is not as efficient as their new 333X but it still is the perfect type for its flights to Europe. The current CEO of MAS has said a lot of things over the past few months. One shouldn't take everything he said seriously. He's like a clown!

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 18):

It'd be very nice to see MH using the A380 for KUL-NRT-LAX. The updated A333 could make it from NRT to LAX too. Similar routes were mentioned by Airbus as examples of possible routes that the new A333 could do.

It is not happening though.

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 20):

Well, that is already happening. MH launched flights to LAX via NRT back in March (?) of this year. Instead of flying to LAX via TPE, MH is now stopping at NRT. It is flights 92 and 93.

MAS used to fly to LAX via NRT back in the 90s. So this is actually more like a route resumption  
Quoting United Airline (Reply 26):

Oh my....

I know they ordered 6 A380 (firm).What about options? How many?

6 and that's all.

Quoting frigatebird (Reply 25):

Same for the A332, which has less Y but more Business seats than the 772.

The leased 332 they have now are on their way out too.


There is one blog posted by fellow A.netter, Paparadzi in a local forum > http://weechookeong.wordpress.com/20...conspiracy-or-sabotage/#more-11310

Do look for the comments posted by this user that goes by the username GE Man. He posted several comments in the blog and it's a good read. Apparently, Air Asia took away one much prized charter contract from Malaysia during the share swap period. Quite a few dirts were dished out.
 
Tupolev160
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:53 pm

Really surprised about the 777, what their destiny might become now?
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United Airline
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:55 pm

Quoting TreeHillRavens (Reply 27):
6 and that's all.

I thought they have options too.

Umm...... Will they order a few more?
 
na
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:34 pm

Quoting Tupolev160 (Reply 28):
Really surprised about the 777, what their destiny might become now?

Why? Other than for the 744 there are fine 1:1 replacements for the 777 on the market, or soon will be. A333s, 787s, A350s. And their 777s arent young anymore. Time is moving on and doesnt stop for the Triple Seven. As they are ERs I am sure there will be takers from the second row of airlines or the the developing countries. Or they´ll make good spares sources, stored 777s are still very rare and these planes should raise some interest.

But also MAS 744s should have good chances to continue to fly somewhere else. They are no older than the 777s and would be perfect for F-conversions.
 
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lightsaber
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:50 pm

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 18):

It'd be very nice to see MH using the A380 for KUL-NRT-LAX.

It would be a very nice way to lose a truck load of money. If anything, that route should be downgauged:

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 22):
LAX is no where near near an A380 market for MAS.

I doubt their sole remaining Americas route makes them much if any money.

  
The NRT-LAX-NRT sector is just too competitive for the 5th (6th) placed contestant to make any money.

Once MA is in Oneworld, they should consider handing over the TPAC portion to JAL and CX.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 15):
They appear to be looking at the 240t A330-200 and A330-300X.

Thank you. With EddieDude's links, that appears to be the case. For MA, it is a rational 'right sizing.'


Lightsaber
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EddieDude
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 3:33 pm

Quoting frigatebird (Reply 25):
The A380 is too big and also has too many premium seats to fill for a destination like AMS, and even the A333X must leave too much payload behind to make it. I fear that if they downgrade to A332, AMS will eventually disappear completely from their route map  

The updated A333, KUL-AMS will be possible. This article: http://www.ainonline.com/aviation-ne...s-increases-a330-payload-and-range discusses how the updated A333 is designed to make KUL-CDG viable. KUL-AMS is about the same distance.

Quoting TreeHillRavens (Reply 27):
It is not happening though.

Again, MH is very likely going to order the updated A333. Once this happens, KUL-NRT-LAX will be a candidate for the new type of plane. That is, unless MH hands over the trans-Pacific portion to its allies JL and CX as Neil suggests.
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FlyingHollander
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 3:41 pm

Quoting frigatebird (Reply 25):
I wonder what aircraft MH will use to AMS

Before they had announced that they would join oneworld AMS was a given for the A380. I would love to see this happen despite the change of plans. Unfortunately I doubt this will happen for the same reasons you don't find the 747 to be the ideal aircraft. I guess we're going to be seeing an A330, which I don't mind if KLM can respond in a positive way.
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Ps76
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 4:13 pm

Hi!

I shall miss seeing the 747's at Heathrow. I guess it will be A380 with the new color scheme in the future.



Many thanks.

Pierre
 
ultrapig
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 4:55 pm

Quoting cedarjet (Reply 3):
Quoting skipness1E (Reply 4):
Quoting skipness1E (Reply 4):
think we all know the 747* is a gas-guzzler by 2012 standards and her days are numbered. Surprised they're looking at exiting the 777. Most airlines see it as part of the solution, not part of the problem. If the 777 is uneconomical for MAS, what is economical? Is the A330 so much better? I think of the two as fairly closely matched.

I realize that a 777 probably has lower operating costs per sm. However what about an airline like EL which constantly flys full flights. If they can aquire a used 747 400 at a low enough cost is the overall cost of operations such that it makes sense buying them or are 777 economics such that even with a free airframe a 777 is less expensive?
 
LAXintl
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 5:03 pm

Quoting Ps76 (Reply 34):
shall miss seeing the 747's at Heathrow. I guess it will be A380 with the new color scheme in the future.

LHR goes mix of A380 and 777 starting this winter.
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jumpjets
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 5:14 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 36):

LHR goes mix of A380 and 777 starting this winter.

The MAS A380 is already in service to LHR - 3 days a week I think at present, and will increase to daily at the end of August.
 
LAXintl
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 5:26 pm

Yes see my Reply#5 for the winter LHR schedule. It will be a mix of A380 and 772 ops.
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9MMPQ
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 8:22 pm

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 2):
Are the 747s going to be converted to freighters like the others?

There have been several frames which have found homes with other carriers & a few have been subsequently converted. I particularly like the fact 9M-MPA exsist today as N718BA, now a Boeing Dreamlifter. Anything is possible for the next frames leaving the fleet.

Quoting BasilFawlty (Reply 7):
I know they have about 10 -300's on order, but how many -200's?

Besides the A333's on order there's still the option for another 10. With plenty of time left these slots (if taken up) could well be converted to the IGW A332.

Quoting cedarjet (Reply 3):
If the 777 is uneconomical for MAS, what is economical? Is the A330 so much better? I think of the two as fairly closely matched.

The real benefit lies in taking another type & everything that's associated with it out of the fleet. Longer haul would effectively become A330/A380 territory only. Plus personally i'd say it's also a much easier/nicer solution for current management with regards to the future. No risks/higher costs & criticism at home if one were to go with the A350/B787 right now.

Quoting TreeHillRavens (Reply 27):
There is still no replacement for the 772 yet. It is not as efficient as their new 333X but it still is the perfect type for its flights to Europe. The current CEO of MAS has said a lot of things over the past few months. One shouldn't take everything he said seriously. He's like a clown!

Absolutely right, personally i would not be surprised if the youngest aircraft are retained for the longest haul destinations. This also in light of rumors about a planned upcoming refurbishing of the B772s. Then again, anything can happen.....

Quoting United Airline (Reply 26):
I know they ordered 6 A380 (firm).What about options? How many?
Quoting TreeHillRavens (Reply 27):
6 and that's all
Quoting United Airline (Reply 29):
Umm...... Will they order a few more?

Don't expect it, there have & continue to be concerns about wether or not MH can fill these aircraft.
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AirbusA6
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 9:34 pm

Quoting jumpjets (Reply 37):
Quoting LAXintl (Reply 36):
LHR goes mix of A380 and 777 starting this winter.
The MAS A380 is already in service to LHR - 3 days a week I think at present, and will increase to daily at the end of August.

Yes, I'm looking forward to my first LHR-KUL MH A380 flight in November! It would have been very disappointing to have ended up on a 777...
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Kent350787
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Mon Jul 23, 2012 11:19 pm

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 19):
How many 380s will they get by year's end?

Not their full order, of course. This move is clearly part of a capacity realignment, rather than just an equipment replacement.

MH122/123 also switches to A380 in November. A downguage of the current 777 overnight service to A330 would make capacity sense.....
 
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9MMPQ
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Tue Jul 24, 2012 5:58 am

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 19):
How many 380s will they get by year's end?

4 with remaining 2 to be delivered Q1/2013.
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United Airline
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Tue Jul 24, 2012 7:08 am

I think they need a few more A380s to replace their B 747-400 fleet.

Is this news 100% confirmed?
 
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Tue Jul 24, 2012 11:48 am

Haven't seen confirmation on these last flight dates but there's little reason to doubt it. For MH the B744 is absolutely on the way out.
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Tupolev160
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Tue Jul 24, 2012 12:10 pm

We are taking about 17 frames and they are still phasing out 9 333. This is a bit awkward fleet revamp (actually downsizing) i have to admit.
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ZK-NBT
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Thu Jul 26, 2012 10:54 am

Quoting United Airline (Reply 43):
I think they need a few more A380s to replace their B 747-400 fleet.

Where would they fly them other than LHR, SYD? MEL and AMS are possibilites but really MH need more 250-300 seaters.

I'm picking if they plan to phase the 772s out in 3 years then routes like AKL, CDG, FRA need something more capable than the current A333. Maybe some A332s which would be good for AKL and FRA which are less than daily.

Sad to see the 744s go but there job and time is done at MH. I remember seeing them at AKL daily several years ago, just a great looking bird!!
 
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Fri Jul 27, 2012 12:06 am

What is the age range of the 747-400's?
 
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Fri Jul 27, 2012 2:39 am

Quoting ZK-NBT (Reply 46):
Where would they fly them other than LHR, SYD? MEL and AMS are possibilites but really MH need more 250-300 seaters.

LAX? NRT?

Will they restart JNB/EWR/EZE etc one day?
 
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RE: Malaysian To Park 747 Fleet

Fri Jul 27, 2012 7:44 am

Quoting Humanitarian (Reply 47):
What is the age range of the 747-400's?

Most of the last in use are in the 10-14 year range. Other frames which have either left the fleet or have been sitting around were/are in the 14-18 year range.

Quoting United Airline (Reply 48):
Will they restart JNB/EWR/EZE etc one day?

These were more prestige destinations & were finally cut when the realisation set in that the routes couldn't be protected any further & the notion of needing to be in the ''serving all continents'' club was given up. I'll give JNB an outsiders chance & even then it will be a long time away. The other 2 i don't ever see coming back.
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