LY777
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Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Wed Aug 01, 2012 8:47 am

AF introduced their new livery more than 3 years ago, and I am surprised to see that most AF a/c still wear the old livery...
Why is AF so slow at painting their a/c in new colours?
Flown:717,727,732,734,735,738,73W,742/744/748,752,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W, 788, D8,D10,L1011, A3B2,A320,A321,A332,A343,A388
 
Ideekay
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Wed Aug 01, 2012 9:10 am

I think its something like this, that they need every aircraft. Let's say they want paint a 777 into the new livery so in this time where the aircraft can't fly they need another plane which flies the route..
 
LY777
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Wed Aug 01, 2012 3:01 pm

A shame they didn't introduce a radically new livery
Flown:717,727,732,734,735,738,73W,742/744/748,752,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W, 788, D8,D10,L1011, A3B2,A320,A321,A332,A343,A388
 
goldorak
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Wed Aug 01, 2012 6:08 pm

Quoting LY777 (Reply 4):

A shame they didn't introduce a radically new livery

Why ? Don't you think they have other priorities, in the current economic environment ? Updating/improving premium cabins is way more important than changing the livery. But that's just my humble opinion.
 
shaq
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Wed Aug 01, 2012 6:28 pm

I think that the real answer is that they want to save money.
Specially, looking at their billion loss, painting and washing a/c isn't their priority right now
Studying hard, for flying right!
 
spacecadet
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Wed Aug 01, 2012 6:57 pm

Quoting goldorak (Reply 6):
Why ? Don't you think they have other priorities, in the current economic environment ? Updating/improving premium cabins is way more important than changing the livery. But that's just my humble opinion.

Why are these things mutually exclusive?
I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
 
LY777
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Wed Aug 01, 2012 7:37 pm

Quoting goldorak (Reply 3):
Why ? Don't you think they have other priorities, in the current economic environment ?

My guess is that they wasted money with a new livery and a new logo with no interest. If they introduced a radically new livery, they would have spent as much, not more IMHO.
Flown:717,727,732,734,735,738,73W,742/744/748,752,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W, 788, D8,D10,L1011, A3B2,A320,A321,A332,A343,A388
 
skipness1E
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Wed Aug 01, 2012 8:06 pm

It's a corporate refresh not a rebrand. You need to look twice to tell the difference, unless they intended to paint aircraft for the sake of painting them, like Delta did so well to have one livery, then it take's 7-8 years before the fleet cycles through the paintshop.
No one at AF thinks it was a mistake, indeed feedback seems to gave been positive about a subtle update.
 
SXDFC
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Wed Aug 01, 2012 8:36 pm

Quoting LY777 (Reply 2):
A shame they didn't introduce a radically new livery

The reasoning behind this is because the water bill would have been too high..   
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
qf002
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Wed Aug 01, 2012 9:10 pm

It's just too expensive -- planes will be repainted as they need to be. The change is pretty subtle, which means it's not particularly important to rush the entire fleet through.

It's been 4 years since QF introduced their new branding, and they've also been extremely slow... It's just the nature of the industry today.
 
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zkojq
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Wed Aug 01, 2012 9:26 pm

It probably isn't too higher priority. A great feature of the new livery is that the changes from the old livery are quite subtle so most customers won't notice if the aircraft they fly in has the old livery. Because of this there is little point of actively withdrawing aircraft from the fleet for a repaint. Might as well just wait for a C or D check and do the repaint then. This will save money too.

Quoting qf002 (Reply 9):

  
First to fly the 787-9 (ZK-NZE, NZ103, 2014-10-09)
 
NASCARAirforce
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Wed Aug 01, 2012 10:22 pm

In order to paint planes, they can't be dirty      
 
NWADTWE16
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:09 pm

does anyone have comparison pics of the 'sublte' difference? i wasnt aware they changed anything
 
Viscount724
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:27 pm

Quoting NWADTWE16 (Reply 12):
does anyone have comparison pics of the 'sublte' difference? i wasnt aware they changed anything

New: different smaller font. no space between "AIR" and "FRANCE", red "swirl" added, bottom of stripes on tail curved forward, one less blue stripe on tail, red stripe is larger.


View Large View Medium
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Photo © Darren Wilson



Old:


View Large View Medium
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Photo © Darren Wilson



[Edited 2012-08-02 12:29:08]
 
Silver1SWA
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:41 pm

Quoting LY777 (Thread starter):
AF introduced their new livery more than 3 years ago, and I am surprised to see that most AF a/c still wear the old livery...
Why is AF so slow at painting their a/c in new colours?

With the exception of mergers where airlines want to quickly re-brand, new or modified liveries are painted according to maintenance schedules. Aircraft paint jobs typically have 7 to 10 years of life so it would make little sense to paint an aircraft if in 2 or 3 years the aircraft goes through a heavy maintenance check where it will need to be repainted again. So they wait until each aircraft goes in for heavy maintenance and add the livery at that time.

Look at how long it took Delta to get everything under one livery! At one time they had at least 3 different liveries flying around out there!

UA took a while as well, it's only since the merger with CO that things sped up, again for re-branding purposes.

It took WN almost ten years to change the entire fleet to the canyon blue scheme.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
LY777
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Thu Aug 02, 2012 7:48 pm

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 14):

IIRC, BA changed their livery quite quickly, didn't they?
Flown:717,727,732,734,735,738,73W,742/744/748,752,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W, 788, D8,D10,L1011, A3B2,A320,A321,A332,A343,A388
 
NWADTWE16
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Thu Aug 02, 2012 8:07 pm

i Guess i like it, really not much difference. What are the stars on the tail of AF planes for? Ive always wondered..i like them and at first thought Star Alliance but ofcourse, duh they are an anchor in SKYTEAM
 
Viscount724
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Thu Aug 02, 2012 8:25 pm

Quoting NWADTWE16 (Reply 16):
What are the stars on the tail of AF planes for?

The 12 stars of the European Union flag.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b7/Flag_of_Europe.svg/800px-Flag_of_Europe.svg.png

[Edited 2012-08-02 14:27:02]
 
dcaviation
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Thu Aug 02, 2012 9:24 pm

Why the flag has 13 stars not 27?
 
Viscount724
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Thu Aug 02, 2012 9:29 pm

Quoting dcaviation (Reply 18):
Why the flag has 13 stars not 27?

I miscounted. It's actually 12 stars. Corrected my other reply.

The stars aren't intended to represent the number of members.
http://europa.eu/about-eu/basic-information/symbols/flag/index_en.htm
 
FlySSC
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Fri Aug 03, 2012 7:51 am

Quoting LY777 (Thread starter):
I am surprised to see that most AF a/c still wear the old livery...

Wrong.
Most of the AF fleet is now wearing the "new" livery ... and for a long time already.

When the "new" livery was unveiled it was also said that this change would be done at no extra cost, which mean that the aircraft would not be repainted before their turn comes...
Add to this that the aircraft scheduled to leave the fleet in a short term won't be repainted (some A319/A320/A340).
 
LY777
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Fri Aug 03, 2012 10:44 am

Quoting FlySSC (Reply 20):
Most of the AF fleet is now wearing the "new" livery ... and for a long time already.

I am a bit surprised, but you must be right.
Anyway, I flew AF 2 weeks ago, the planes wore the old livery on both legs. And at CDG, most AF a/c I saw were still wearing the old livery.

Quoting FlySSC (Reply 20):
Add to this that the aircraft scheduled to leave the fleet in a short term won't be repainted (some A319/A320/A340).

Also, which A319s/A320s/A340s are leaving the fleet first(I know some of them are pretty old)?
The A321s I flew on 2 weeks ago were from 1998 (F-GTAE, and the other F-GTAD IIRC): the interior looked so old, the seats were ugly (old seats). Will these birds leave the fleet soon, too? I flew recently on a newer A321 (F-GTAV), and the difference was huge
Flown:717,727,732,734,735,738,73W,742/744/748,752,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W, 788, D8,D10,L1011, A3B2,A320,A321,A332,A343,A388
 
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ZSOFN
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Fri Aug 03, 2012 11:02 am

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 13):
New: different smaller font. no space between "AIR" and "FRANCE", red "swirl" added, bottom of stripes on tail curved forward, one less blue stripe on tail, red stripe is larger.

As your list is relatively comprehensive, it's probably worth mentioning that the blue used in for the stripe and the titles is darker and less saturated. Looks smart.
 
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sturmovik
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Fri Aug 03, 2012 11:19 am

The changes in the 'new' livery are minor enough that no one would notice them once the customary layer of dirt covers it  
'What's it doing now?'
 
FlySSC
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Fri Aug 03, 2012 12:33 pm

Quoting LY777 (Reply 21):
Also, which A319s/A320s/A340s are leaving the fleet first(I know some of them are pretty old)?
The A321s I flew on 2 weeks ago were from 1998 (F-GTAE, and the other F-GTAD IIRC): the interior looked so old, the seats were ugly (old seats). Will these birds leave the fleet soon, too? I flew recently on a newer A321 (F-GTAV), and the difference was huge

2 A319LR were recently retired from service and transfered to Air Côte d'Ivoire.

The A340 fleet is reduced to 13 after after the "retirement" of F-GLZT & F-GLZL (now with Air Madagascar) and F-GNIH (now with AR). Another 4 are scheduled to leave the fleet within the next 18 months so I guess they won't be repainted before.

The 20 A321 will all remain in service. The one based at ORY are all in the new colors. Maybe a few of them at CDG are not repainted yet. All the interior are also progressively renovated and the seats changed.

The B744 fleet is now reduced to the 7 aircraft that will be kept in service until 2016/2017. They are all wearing the "new" colors and are completely refurbished with the new seats and the new IFE (except one : F-GEXB)
 
citationjet
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Fri Aug 03, 2012 1:15 pm

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 14):
Look at how long it took Delta to get everything under one livery! At one time they had at least 3 different liveries flying around out there!

  

Three different paint schemes on three different aircraft at the same time.

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LY777
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Fri Aug 03, 2012 1:41 pm

Quoting FlySSC (Reply 24):
The 20 A321 will all remain in service. The one based at ORY are all in the new colors. Maybe a few of them at CDG are not repainted yet. All the interior are also progressively renovated and the seats changed.

I thought they had 25 A321s (5 based at ORY, and 20 based at CDG.

Quoting FlySSC (Reply 24):

The B744 fleet is now reduced to the 7 aircraft that will be kept in service until 2016/2017. They are all wearing the "new" colors and are completely refurbished with the new seats and the new IFE (except one : F-GEXB)

So, this summer, all the 744s (except GEXB) have now PTVs in all classes? They were pretty fast!
Do all the 744s have NEV 4 in J now?
I guess GITI/J/H have kept their original seats in Y since they were already equipped with PTVs in all classes?
Flown:717,727,732,734,735,738,73W,742/744/748,752,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W, 788, D8,D10,L1011, A3B2,A320,A321,A332,A343,A388
 
FlySSC
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Fri Aug 03, 2012 3:26 pm

Quoting LY777 (Reply 26):
I thought they had 25 A321s (5 based at ORY, and 20 based at CDG.

Ooops .. typo.
AF has indeed a total of 25 A321 (5 A321-100 + 20 A321-200) but 9 of them are based at ORY : the 5 -100 (inherited from Air Inter and registered F-GMZA / ZB / ZC / ZD / ZE ) + 4 -200 : F-GTAO / AP / AQ / AX.

Quoting LY777 (Reply 26):
Do all the 744s have NEV 4 in J now?

Only F-GITD / TE / TF and soon F-GEXB, in a 2 x 2 x 2 config and 36J (iso 40J)

F-GITH / TI / TJ still have the old NEV2 but will be retrofitted with the NEV4 before Dec. 2012 (and the new seats in Y also).
 
LY777
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RE: Why Is AF Slow At Painting Their Fleet In New C/s?

Fri Aug 03, 2012 4:07 pm

Quoting FlySSC (Reply 27):
Only F-GITD / TE / TF and soon F-GEXB, in a 2 x 2 x 2 config and 36J (iso 40J)

F-GITH / TI / TJ still have the old NEV2 but will be retrofitted with the NEV4 before Dec. 2012 (and the new seats in Y also).

That's good news. Thanks for the info.
A shame they don't operate anymore to MIA though. The new 77Ws used on the MIA route are good, the PTVs are larger than on the "old" 77Ws, but the 3-4-3 is a real shame.
When the MIA route was operated by 744s, it used to be a real lottery for the PTVs in Y: unfortunately, GITI/J/H were rarely used on the route, and I usually ended with the older 744 with the poor interior
Flown:717,727,732,734,735,738,73W,742/744/748,752,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W, 788, D8,D10,L1011, A3B2,A320,A321,A332,A343,A388