kkephart13
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6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Fri Aug 03, 2012 10:48 pm

http://www.10news.com/news/31328161/detail.html

Apparently the kid retracted the landing gear just as the A/C touched down....
EVERYTHING i type on here, is the opinion of ME and not of any airline/company.
 
rwy04lga
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:34 am

Last line was funny: ''There is no word on whether the boy has been grounded as well''.
Just accept that some days, you're the pigeon, and other days the statue
 
C767P
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:45 am

I want to know why he is taking a twin into Fallbrook.
 
gordomatic
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 3:34 am

Quoting C767P (Reply 2):
I want to know why he is taking a twin into Fallbrook.

What do you mean? I'm sure twins fly in & out of L18 often enough.
We have clearance, Clarence. Roger, Roger. What's our vector, Victor?
 
Type-Rated
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 3:45 am

I flew with a guy once who had his private pilot's license once. He had a very strange practice for his passengers. He wanted everyone on the plane (a 4 place single) to sit on their hands during take off and landings. How weird! He wouldn't start the aircraft unless everyone complied.

I asked him what his reasoning was for this. He said that he had "heard" that if some people get scared while in an aircraft they will try to wrestle the controls away from you. He made everyone sit on their hands so that would be less likely to happen.

So maybe if this guy had his kid sitting on his hands this wouldn't have happened.
Fly North Central Airlines..The route of the Northliners!
 
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DeltaMD90
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 4:20 am

Someone's going up for adoption...
Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
 
ATCtower
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 4:25 am

Isnt there a pressure sensor on the Baron that when a certain weight (pressure) is on the gear that it will not retract?

Story is fishy. Sorry daddy, did you forget to put your gear down and decided to blame your 6 year old? Classy!
By reading the above post you waive all rights to be offended. If you do not like what you read, forget it.
 
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 4:35 am

Quoting ATCtower (Reply 6):
Isnt there a pressure sensor on the Baron that when a certain weight (pressure) is on the gear that it will not retract?

There is but sometimes when taxiing a plane can get "lite on it's feet" and the sensor can get fooled. Remember the sensor is there as a safety backup and should not be used as a method for controlling the landing gear.

I still find it amazing how many pilots land each year inadvertently gear up.
Fly North Central Airlines..The route of the Northliners!
 
rwy04lga
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 4:41 am

Quoting type-rated (Reply 4):
I asked him what his reasoning was for this. He said that he had "heard" that if some people get scared while in an aircraft they will try to wrestle the controls away from you. He made everyone sit on their hands so that would be less likely to happen.

In 1969, my mother's boss was flying her to INF (Inverness Florida) and in a mild panic, she grabbed the wheel while on short final. He ''learned about flying from that''.
Just accept that some days, you're the pigeon, and other days the statue
 
ATCtower
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 4:45 am

Quoting type-rated (Reply 7):
There is but sometimes when taxiing a plane can get "lite on it's feet" and the sensor can get fooled. Remember the sensor is there as a safety backup and should not be used as a method for controlling the landing gear.

I still find it amazing how many pilots land each year inadvertently gear up.

Yea, the 6 year old 'accidentally hitting the landing gear lever' when the plane is 'light on its feet' for less than a second, I think not. Daddy is blaming his kid. Prick.

It is sad how many pilots land gear up and believe me, I see plenty of them!
By reading the above post you waive all rights to be offended. If you do not like what you read, forget it.
 
Type-Rated
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 4:49 am

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 8):
In 1969, my mother's boss was flying her to INF (Inverness Florida) and in a mild panic, she grabbed the wheel while on short final. He ''learned about flying from that''.

Well, I can now say that I've heard of it too. Would I make my passengers sit on their hands? No, that's just plain stupid. When that guy told me his policy I thought he was just a control freak getting his jollies with his passengers. The guy is a good pillot, but also an idiot too. If you think about it, making someone sit on their hands is going to do nothing to stop them from their actions.

If I were worried that someone may lose control while being in the air, they'd never get in my airplane in the first place.
Fly North Central Airlines..The route of the Northliners!
 
Daysleeper
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 9:23 am

A long shot I know.....

Quoting ATCtower (Reply 9):

Yea, the 6 year old 'accidentally hitting the landing gear lever' when the plane is 'light on its feet' for less than a second, I think not. Daddy is blaming his kid. Prick.

Been thinking about this.. and got me wondering if the 6 year old was "helping Daddy fly". Perhaps if he let the kid pull the gear lever he still had his hand on it when they touched down. If it were a little heavy, or perhaps bounced then maybe the force of the touchdown caused the kid inadvertently raise it again.
 
A320ajm
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 12:37 pm

Quoting ATCtower (Reply 9):
Yea, the 6 year old 'accidentally hitting the landing gear lever' when the plane is 'light on its feet' for less than a second, I think not. Daddy is blaming his kid. Prick.

You are making such an assumption. This could be the truth - stranger things have happened in the world of aviation!
If the British Empire and its Commonwealth last for a thousand years, men will still say, 'This was their finest hour.'
 
C767P
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 2:36 pm

Quoting gordomatic (Reply 3):
What do you mean? I'm sure twins fly in & out of L18 often enough.

I am sure if you run the numbers, this guy nor anyone else should be. The accelerate stop distance won't work for Fallbrook.
 
26point2
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 2:51 pm

....but is still legal (in a GA light twin).
 
PIEAvantiP180
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 3:02 pm

Quoting C767P (Reply 13):

Yes but there are plenty of crazy pilots out there. We had a LR55 pilot take his plane into Clearwater Air Park for fun. And believe me thats a small airport. The same guy on a different ocasion took the Challeger he was flying that day and decided to follow me around the ramp after i guided him in to a parking spot. It was so loud on the ramp that day due to coast guard C130's running their engines that are next to our ramp and I did not notice him behing me till i was almost on the other side of our ramp.
 
C767P
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 3:10 pm

Quoting 26point2 (Reply 14):
....but is still legal (in a GA light twin).

No different from taking off over weight. And when someone gets injured when you can an engine on takeoff does it matter if it’s legal?

I am sure the FAA will ask him how he was planning to get out of there. If nothing else it will come up on his 709 ride.
 
copter808
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 3:31 pm

Quoting ATCtower (Reply 6):
Isnt there a pressure sensor on the Baron that when a certain weight (pressure) is on the gear that it will not retract?

Story is fishy. Sorry daddy, did you forget to put your gear down and decided to blame your 6 year old? Classy!

I was thinking the same thing. The neat thing is that the child will probably tell what actually happened if he is interviewed away from his father! It's always neat interviewing young kids!
 
DiamondFlyer
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 3:54 pm

Quoting C767P (Reply 16):
No different from taking off over weight. And when someone gets injured when you can an engine on takeoff does it matter if it’s legal?

For a part 91 flight, there is no legal requirement that you have to meet an accelerate stop distance, or anything like that. Not sure how you are saying it was illegal. Heck, most GA piston twins have horrible accelerate stop distances.

-DiamondFlyer
From my cold, dead hands
 
C767P
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 4:03 pm

Quoting DiamondFlyer (Reply 18):

Never said it was illegal. What I am saying is does that matter?
 
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Tugger
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 4:23 pm

Quoting C767P (Reply 19):
Never said it was illegal. What I am saying is does that matter?

Not really. You are not flying paying passengers in a commercial operation. You are flying friends and family and such and they are trusting you and taking the same chances as you the pilot. I mean you can carry passengers in an "experimental" class aircraft. Why is that much different?

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
 
lhrnue
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 5:24 pm

Quoting ATCtower (Reply 6):
Story is fishy. Sorry daddy, did you forget to put your gear down and decided to blame your 6 year old? Classy!

That's what I thought too.
 
Mir
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 5:37 pm

Quoting C767P (Reply 16):
Quoting 26point2 (Reply 14):
....but is still legal (in a GA light twin).

No different from taking off over weight.

Taking off overweight is definitely not legal.

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
BE77
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 5:37 pm

Quoting C767P (Reply 13):
I am sure if you run the numbers, this guy nor anyone else should be. The accelerate stop distance won't work for Fallbrook.
Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 15):
Yes but there are plenty of crazy pilots out there.
Quoting gordomatic (Reply 3):
What do you mean? I'm sure twins fly in & out of L18 often enough.

I'm with gordo here. Unless the pilot is completely reckless, where is the problem? The runway is 2100 ft. If not at gross, a B55 needs maybe 1000 or 1200 feet to get get airborne at something comfortably above Vmc in still air. Accelerate - stop is not the standard either legally or for reasonable levels of safety...but unless you are at gross weight the math probably works out (or pretty close) anyway for accelerate/stop in a Baron with 2100 feet, especially if you throw in a bit of headwind component.

If you're not at gross or have some other special situation, at 1000 feet down the runway you're likely aware in a Baron if the acceleration is going to get you to Vmc in the next two seconds or if you should be using the next 1000 feet to stop, which is more than enough if you haven't got enough speed to fly. It shouldn't require Ace of the Base skills either, especially after the first few times on a shorter field (I used to think 3000 feet at sea level was short for a C172 with two people once upon a time, as the 'other' runway was 5000 feet where I learned. I still dig out the takeoff performance manuals if it's anywhere close to being marginal, but wouldn't need to in most cases for a well known personal airplane on a 2100 foot runway near sea level (I was based at a similar field for a few years, and got to know what the limitations were for me and the aircraft I normally fly, which is definitely not high performance...see user name.
In this case, I imagine the owner knows the performance parameters pretty well, and knows what he can safely do under what conditions after calculating it for the first 20 or 30 flights if that is where he lives.

For sure at gross weight on a hot day with no headwind it would closer than I would want, but how often would you depart for personal flying in at gross weight in a Baron anyway? For longer trips, it would be really easy to plan a fuel stop with a longer runway for the occasional time you needed to really fill the cabin. Even for the longer trips, most personal Baron's would go out with two people - say 500 lbs in the cabin with people and stuff and even with 800 lbs of fuel, it leaves you maybe 500 lbs under gross which cuts the runway req a lot. You definitely need to keep the seats / luggage / fuel / weather math in mind, but that holds true for every airplane ever built.

Quoting A320ajm (Reply 12):
You are making such an assumption. This could be the truth - stranger things have happened in the world of aviation!

I agree - it could easily be true IMHO.

Can I believe that a 6 yo would want to play with levers switches and everything else in an airplane?
Umm - yes - for sure, and here are some of my reasons:
a) I remember doing it (under perhaps better supervision since I never caused anything like this...at least not with an airplane  
b) Many, many years later I still am accused (and admit to) being a little boy at heart, and still like playing with levers and switches and everything else in airplanes.
c) When flying Young Eagles (although they are slightly older) most of them really enjoy being allowed to handle the controls and 'fly' the airplane.
d) Haven't any of the non-believers spent any time around 6 year olds? They want to play with everything!
I can so easily understand how you wouldn't think anything of it with your own child or any other 'regular' passenger with you and not pay as much attention to what they were doing as you would with a less frequent passenger (probably a lesson there).

Or, since I stopped being surprised by anything a long time ago, maybe the dad is not manning up to his screwup and trying to blame the kid.  
Tower, Affirmitive, gear is down and welded
 
atct
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 6:53 pm

I see King Air 200's, Navajo's, and Skyvans going into a 2200ft strip all the time. Ive personally flown the King Air 200 into a 3400ft runway with no issues as well as a Baron into 2500ft with no problems. You cant fly around everywhere planning on an engine quitting. We fly over open water in super cubs and 206's because thats the only way to get where we are going. We land on short strips in twins because thats the only strip at the destination.

Would I fly "my" 310 into 2100ft, depending on conditions, you bet. Buddy of mine keeps a Cessna 340 (ground hog) on a 3000ft grass strip. If its light, no worries, if its heavy, we went elsewhere for gas then continued on.

Its pure speculation but I think someone forgot to put the gear down.

atct
Trikes are for kids!
 
DrColenzo
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 7:02 pm

Quoting ATCtower (Reply 9):
Yea, the 6 year old 'accidentally hitting the landing gear lever' when the plane is 'light on its feet' for less than a second, I think not. Daddy is blaming his kid. Prick.

Agree 100%!

Quoting A320ajm (Reply 12):
You are making such an assumption. This could be the truth - stranger things have happened in the world of aviation!

Nothing that weird happens that often and certainly not in that aircraft; the guy is blaming his young son for an event which, lets face it, has around a 90% probability of being due to his oversight.

That is possible one of the more asshole things someone to do, be a man, own up and don't blame a poor little child. Seriously, the dude flying that plane will end up having one hell of a mid life crisis when he is between 45 - 50 because he sounds like a right........[insert 30 minute rant]
 
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Aesma
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 7:29 pm

The article says the plane is worth 150K, is that true ? That seems low to me. And would the damage be really severe ? Well maybe the gear is bent. An uncle of mine was receiving the Bonanza turbo he just bought when he looked horrified as the mechanic landed it on its belly. In the end there was almost no damage and he flew that plane for a long time.

Quoting type-rated (Reply 7):
There is but sometimes when taxiing a plane can get "lite on it's feet"

Who talked about taxiing ? The plane was landing, and I wouldn't trust that article to know when exactly the gear retracted. Looking at the picture I see that the plane seems to be resting on its left wing, so I would think that there is a half retracted gear under the right wing.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
BE77
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 7:47 pm

Quoting Aesma (Reply 26):
The article says the plane is worth 150K, is that true ? That seems low to me. And would the damage be really severe ? Well maybe the gear is bent. An uncle of mine was receiving the Bonanza turbo he just bought when he looked horrified as the mechanic landed it on its belly. In the end there was almost no damage and he flew that plane for a long time.

Used plane prices have dropped a LOT during the last few years (economy and all that), and a browse through Controller shows B55's available all day from $100k to $150k, depending on the conidtions and hours.

A full belly landing is almost always less damaging than a partial gear failure. With a little luck a full gear up landing requires a belly pan, prop blades, an engine inspection, maybe one wingtip, and higher insurance premiums to get back in the air.
A partial failure though means all sorts of lateral stresses on the wings, replaced gear at least but maybe worse depending on how the gear is configured and what stresses were put on the wongs and airframe - the gear is obviously strongly attached to the ariframe so it is easy to bend things if the loads are at unexpected angles.
The shop I use is just finishing a big job on a Navajo due to a gear failure while it was parked on a ramp. A gear up landing would have been much in the same plane would typically have been much less to repair!!!
Tower, Affirmitive, gear is down and welded
 
njxc500
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 7:50 pm

Isn't this the airplane that had the gear lever in a non-standard position? Does that not make it somewhat likely that the pilot accidentally retracted it himself? That is just on top of the chance he had never lowered it in the first place......
 
ak
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 7:56 pm

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 1):
Last line was funny: ''There is no word on whether the boy has been grounded as well''.

Ya that last sentence forced a little soda out of my nose!
" I am serious...and don't call me Shirley!
 
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lightsaber
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 9:09 pm

Quoting ATCtower (Reply 6):
Story is fishy. Sorry daddy, did you forget to put your gear down and decided to blame your 6 year old? Classy!

I'm being a cynic too.

Is there any insurance benefit for a pilot to deflect blame?

Lightsaber
"They did not know it was impossible, so they did it!" - Mark Twain
 
canoecarrier
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 9:20 pm

Quoting type-rated (Reply 7):
There is but sometimes when taxiing a plane can get "lite on it's feet" and the sensor can get fooled. Remember the sensor is there as a safety backup and should not be used as a method for controlling the landing gear.

When I was 15 I started working at my local airport washing airplanes. A couple months after I got the job I was washing one of our rental 172RGs, I turned the master switch on to lower the flaps and a loud buzzer went off. I freaked, grabbed the gear lever and lowered the gear. There's supposed to be a squat switch that keeps that from happening on the ground but the nose gear retracted. Not one of my proudest moments in aviation.
The beatings will continue until morale improves
 
bristolflyer
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 9:44 pm

Quoting type-rated (Reply 7):
There is but sometimes when taxiing a plane can get "lite on it's feet" and the sensor can get fooled.

By 'lite on it's feet' you mean if it goes over a bump a gear could momentarily show no load? I would think that at sensor would be programmed to ignore that?
Fortune favours the brave
 
avroarrow
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sat Aug 04, 2012 10:48 pm

There is no way to program a delay in a squat switch on GA aircraft (generally speaking), they are wired in series with the lever, so the second the contact makes the lock pins pop out and the gear motor starts running.
Give me a mile of road and I can take you a mile. Give me a mile of runway and I can show you the world.
 
A320ajm
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sun Aug 05, 2012 12:44 am

Quoting DrColenzo (Reply 25):
Nothing that weird happens that often and certainly not in that aircraft; the guy is blaming his young son for an event which, lets face it, has around a 90% probability of being due to his oversight.

What's ever happened to innocent until proven guilty? Apart from speculation, there is no evidence (official) to suggest this a cover up. A few of you on here have already abused the guy who could be perfectly innocent. Why don't you wait until something official is released before casting judgement?

A320ajm
If the British Empire and its Commonwealth last for a thousand years, men will still say, 'This was their finest hour.'
 
threepoint
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sun Aug 05, 2012 1:31 am

Quoting ATCtower (Reply 6):
Story is fishy. Sorry daddy, did you forget to put your gear down and decided to blame your 6 year old? Classy!
Quoting ATCtower (Reply 9):
Daddy is blaming his kid. Prick.

Raising the possibility that the pilot may have deflected blame to hide his own error is perfectly reasonable. Calling him names and laying down your own holier-than-thou judgement is not. Particularly when you have absolutely none of the facts in the matter.
The nice thing about a mistake is the pleasure it gives others.
 
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Aesma
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sun Aug 05, 2012 1:39 am

So, nobody is seeing what I'm seeing in the photo, that the plane does not appear to have belly landed, disproving most of you naysayers ?
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
Type-Rated
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sun Aug 05, 2012 7:22 am

Quoting bristolflyer (Reply 32):
ere is but sometimes when taxiing a plane can get "lite on it's feet" and the sensor can get fooled.

By 'lite on it's feet' you mean if it goes over a bump a gear could momentarily show no load? I would think that at sensor would be programmed to ignore that?

You can be taxiing pretty fast and say a wind gust comes by, the aircraft fuselage moves about a bit from the gust. This can fool the gear sensor if your gear switch is in the gear up position. The answer to this problem is to always have the gear switch in the down position when the aircraft is on the ground. This is indeed a very rare occurance but it does happen every once in awhile.

I can't think of any reason why anyone would select gear up when the airplane is on the ground except for an inspection and the aircraft is properly supported in a maintenance hangar.
Fly North Central Airlines..The route of the Northliners!
 
threepoint
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sun Aug 05, 2012 7:13 pm

Quoting Aesma (Reply 36):
So, nobody is seeing what I'm seeing in the photo, that the plane does not appear to have belly landed, disproving most of you naysayers ?

Yes, it certainly seems to have been moving at speed when the gear either collapsed or was retracted. Pay attention to the propeller tips, which are bent back. This airplane didn't simply plop down from a standstill.
The nice thing about a mistake is the pleasure it gives others.
 
Flaps
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Sun Aug 05, 2012 7:27 pm

Quoting type-rated (Reply 37):
I can't think of any reason why anyone would select gear up when the airplane is on the ground except for an inspection and the aircraft is properly supported in a maintenance hangar.

Except.....perhaps when one reaches to (or calls for) the flaps to be retracted and the gear is selected instead. This is not an unheard of occurrence with the 55's.
 
bristolflyer
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Mon Aug 06, 2012 12:51 am

Regardless of whether or not the father forgot to put the gear down, he is to blame for allowing the child near the controls. 6 year olds like to play with stuff, that's why you put locks on kitchen cabinet doors, sponge bumpers on doors, outlet protectors on electrical outlets etc. If the kid had done something that would have resulted in injury or worse, surely the father would be to blame?
Fortune favours the brave
 
threepoint
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Mon Aug 06, 2012 6:17 am

Quoting bristolflyer (Reply 40):
Regardless of whether or not the father forgot to put the gear down, he is to blame for allowing the child near the controls.

Sure, like any front-seat occupant isn't immune from touching something they shouldn't. Why are we so quick to assign blame before knowing any facts?

Quoting bristolflyer (Reply 40):
6 year olds like to play with stuff, that's why you put locks on kitchen cabinet doors, sponge bumpers on doors, outlet protectors on electrical outlets etc.

Dear Lord, however did we survive as a species before we safeguarded everything children could possibly come into contact with? Why do we allow them to leave the house without bubble wrap and 3 inches of high-density foam? I certainly didn't grow up with overly paranoid parents and my kids survived their adolescence without ever knowing what a sponge-bumpered door looked like. Fortunately their parents were smart enough not to leave harmful objects within reach and didn't fret over a bloody nose or skinned knee..
The nice thing about a mistake is the pleasure it gives others.
 
DrColenzo
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Mon Aug 06, 2012 6:56 am

Quoting A320ajm (Reply 34):
What's ever happened to innocent until proven guilty?

On Airliners.net?

We all joined the forum to discuss all things airliner no matter how dorky and make either sensible comments or, in my case, wild assertions with more than the element of truth encrusted within.  

I would hate for this forum to have to adhere to the accept Common Law rules of evidence set down in the 12th century.

So, on the 'balance of probabilities' it is 'highly likely' the pilot is 'most likely' a sad sack who blamed his son for something that 'in my experience' is a very unlikely occurrence and is 'almost certainly' a type of gentleman reaching 'a certain age' that will have a 'age related episode' involving a 18 year Ukrainian 'actress/model' he met on a forum 'very different' from this one.

How's that?

[Edited 2012-08-06 00:36:50]
 
BE77
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Mon Aug 06, 2012 10:45 am

Quoting DrColenzo (Reply 42):
Quoting A320ajm (Reply 34):
What's ever happened to innocent until proven guilty?

On Airliners.net?

Congrat's - you got at least one 'coffee through the nose' point for that!

I agree with the rest of your post as well, but, as outlined in the second half of my post 23, I am more believing that it could have gone down as claimed, as I could so easily see a Calvin and Hobbes type 6 year old doing exactly what was reported (OK - I admit, I could see me as a 6 y.o. doing it).

But, knowing a few guys that have made middle aged idiots of themselves, and, having been to the Ukraine (not to meet a model by the way - although there were guys in my hotel that were!), I grant that your politically correct description may be true.
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DrColenzo
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Mon Aug 06, 2012 12:14 pm

Quoting BE77 (Reply 43):
I grant that your politically correct description may be true.

I've never been called politically correct before, even done with irony I have to admit to being dead pleased with that.

Quoting BE77 (Reply 43):
I could so easily see a Calvin and Hobbes type 6 year old doing exactly what was reported (OK - I admit, I could see me as a 6 y.o. doing it).

That is a possibility, I will admit, but a very slight one and I was thinking more along the lines of screwing up a mental checklist combined with pretty standard safety features leading to a pilot, as opposed to a six year old, error. However, if the boy managed to pull that off, well, hats off to the little dude!
 
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sturmovik
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Mon Aug 06, 2012 12:44 pm

Quoting DrColenzo (Reply 25):

Nothing that weird happens that often and certainly not in that aircraft; the guy is blaming his young son for an event which, lets face it, has around a 90% probability of being due to his oversight.

An Aeroflot A310 once crashed after the captain let his son sit in his seat and play with the controls. Not implying that it's similar to this incident, but weirder things have indeed happened, with far more disastrous results.

Quoting DrColenzo (Reply 42):
On Airliners.net?

Add me to the 'coffee through the nose' list  
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A320ajm
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Mon Aug 06, 2012 10:32 pm

Quoting DrColenzo (Reply 44):
I've never been called politically correct before, even done with irony I have to admit to being dead pleased with that.

I'm sorry but petulance and pretentiousness do not impress me.  

However, I will add that I am scientist; I go by evidence. No matter whether I am posting on Airliners.net or undertaking research, I only go by evidence or fact (or at least try to) especially when judging people. You abused a guy who you claim blamed his six year old for a crash which was his mistake. Please present me some evidence which suggests or proves this theory? I am not saying it wasn't a possibility, I was just pointing out that there is also the possibility a six year old did cause this. I do not think it was just using words like 'prick' and 'asshole' when we don't know the whole story yet. I will be the first to hold my hands up and agree with these words if the dad is blaming the son in the end but as yet, there is no evidence.

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A320ajm
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HAWK21M
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Thu Aug 09, 2012 8:03 pm

In certain professions...one needs to be a thorough professional......Its not the park....
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Acey559
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RE: 6 Year Old Totals Dads Airplane!

Thu Aug 09, 2012 9:12 pm

Quoting type-rated (Reply 4):

I flew with a guy once who had his private pilot's license once. He had a very strange practice for his passengers. He wanted everyone on the plane (a 4 place single) to sit on their hands during take off and landings. How weird! He wouldn't start the aircraft unless everyone complied.

I asked him what his reasoning was for this. He said that he had "heard" that if some people get scared while in an aircraft they will try to wrestle the controls away from you. He made everyone sit on their hands so that would be less likely to happen.

So maybe if this guy had his kid sitting on his hands this wouldn't have happened.

I've heard of instances where the seat was not locked completely and on takeoff the seat started to slide aft on the rails. Natural human reaction is to grab onto the closest thing to keep you from falling back and unfortunately that that thing happens to be the yoke. Understandably this could present a very dangerous situation on takeoff.

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