USAirALB
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CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 2:40 am

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/201...charlotte-douglas-plans-fifth.html

Construction likely to begin in 2014, will be 12000, and will "allow flights to the Pacific Rim and deep into Europe", and the new runway will be used as a noise abatement runway. Will be CLT's fourth parallel runway.

Also, according to the article, "The airport has long planned to build a new international concourse on the surface parking lots for rental cars, just north of Concourse A. Orr said that project will be built when there is demand.

But he said Monday he plans to build a small portion of that new international concourse, which would be initially used for domestic flights by Delta, United and Southwest. The four new satellite gates would be connected to the main terminal by a new walkway."
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HPRamper
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 2:50 am

I didn't know the runway lengths at CLT were what was holding it back from all those long haul flights.
 
rfields5421
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 2:59 am

Rwy 18C/36C - 10,000 ft
Rwy 18R/36L - 9,000 ft
Rwy 18L/36R - 8,676 ft - with an arresting gear at the departure end of 36R
Rwy 5/23 - 7,502 ft

http://www.airnav.com/airport/KCLT
 
PHX787
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 3:31 am

Quoting USAirALB (Thread starter):
Construction likely to begin in 2014, will be 12000, and will "allow flights to the Pacific Rim and deep into Europe", and the new runway will be used as a noise abatement runway. Will be CLT's fourth parallel runway.

Hmmm Are they banking on a positive outcome of the potential AA/US merger (if that disaster happens)?
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HPRamper
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 3:48 am

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
Hmmm Are they banking on a positive outcome of the potential AA/US merger

Last I read, the airport director expects big things even without a merger...he even seems to think CLT would thrive without US there.
 
DashTrash
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 3:55 am

So the new runway is going to be in the middle of 18C and 18R? The way the article is written it sounds like they're taking a mulligan on the recently built runway.
 
flyguy89
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 3:59 am

A good move that I hope will alleviate the congestion developing there.

Quoting USAirALB (Thread starter):
Also, according to the article, "The airport has long planned to build a new international concourse on the surface parking lots for rental cars, just north of Concourse A. Orr said that project will be built when there is demand.

Very wise. Orr is definitely overly excited about the future of CLT, but for CLT's sake I'm happy to see that his actions have erred on the side of prudence.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
Quoting USAirALB (Thread starter):
Construction likely to begin in 2014, will be 12000, and will "allow flights to the Pacific Rim and deep into Europe", and the new runway will be used as a noise abatement runway. Will be CLT's fourth parallel runway.

Hmmm Are they banking on a positive outcome of the potential AA/US merger

In past statements Orr has very much said so, though I hope he's not letting the sweet nothings Doug Parker is no doubt whispering into his ear dictate his decisions.
 
simairlinenet
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 3:59 am

Quoting USAirALB (Thread starter):
Construction likely to begin in 2014, will be 12000, and will "allow flights to the Pacific Rim and deep into Europe", and the new runway will be used as a noise abatement runway.

While I don't think the fate will be the same, CVG used a potential NRT flight to justify their runway about 12 years ago.
 
HPRamper
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:16 am

Another runway isn't going to solve the congestion, which is largely the result of constricted taxiways.
 
PHX787
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:19 am

Quoting simairlinenet (Reply 7):
While I don't think the fate will be the same, CVG used a potential NRT flight to justify their runway about 12 years ago.

Woah crap! I never heard about that! I guess that explains a lot!

Just to be sure, (I trust you but...) do you have a link about this?
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amccann
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:36 am

Maybe I'm being naive but why would CLT airport build an entirely new runway as opposed to lengthening an existing runway?

Google Map of KCLT

I will admit, I do not know the topography of the land at/around the CLT airport however it would appear they could lengthen the recently built runway (18R-36L) by relocating Old Dowd Rd and possibly Wallace Neel Rd. Again, maybe I am being naive, but that seems like a much more easy and fiscally responsible decision.
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PHX787
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:18 am

Quoting amccann (Reply 10):
I will admit, I do not know the topography of the land at/around the CLT airport however it would appear they could lengthen the recently built runway (18R-36L) by relocating Old Dowd Rd and possibly Wallace Neel Rd. Again, maybe I am being naive, but that seems like a much more easy and fiscally responsible decision.

I guess I agree, given that I only see that runway being positioned to the west of the current 3. It's kind of a bad location, IMHO, but I've actually never been into CLT so I'm not necessarily qualified to criticize an idea  
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flyguy89
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 6:34 am

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 9):
Quoting simairlinenet (Reply 7):
While I don't think the fate will be the same, CVG used a potential NRT flight to justify their runway about 12 years ago.

Woah crap! I never heard about that! I guess that explains a lot!

Just to be sure, (I trust you but...) do you have a link about this?

I don't believe NRT was specifically mentioned, but yeah, one of the main points they were touting about it was that it would allow trans-Pacific flights to land and take-off. Perhaps not an unthinkable proposition at the time as DL did apply to fly CVG-PEK, but it was pretty poor planning. To be fair though, it did all work out in the end as it's now extensively used by DHL for flights as far as Hong Kong, Seoul, and Bahrain.
 
southwest737500
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 10:12 am

Awesome, this is great news, the airport is getting busier every year.
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r2rho
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 11:33 am

CLT already has three independent runways which should allow it to easily handle 120 movements an hour. That should be enough for an airport of 38 million pax/year... CLT ranks 6th busiest worldwide in terms of aircraft movements (529,000) but only 25th in terms of passengers (38million) (2010 data). I think the first thing to work on is to encourage an increase in average a/c size (by fee structure, incentives, slot restrictions, etc), to handle more pax with the same movements. The 5th runway can still be considered for the long-term, but I would start with optimizing current operations first.

Quoting amccann (Reply 10):
would appear they could lengthen the recently built runway (18R-36L)

Indeed, lengthening that rwy seems a no-brainer, and could be done quickly for little money.
 
bobnwa
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 11:51 am

Quoting southwest737500 (Reply 13):
Awesome, this is great news, the airport is getting busier every year.
Quoting HPRamper (Reply 8):
Another runway isn't going to solve the congestion, which is largely the result of constricted taxiways.


I agree with HPRamper, that another runway is not what CLT needs, but new and improved taxiways are needed.
 
simairlinenet
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 12:05 pm

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
don't believe NRT was specifically mentioned, but yeah, one of the main points they were touting about it was that it would allow trans-Pacific flights to land and take-off. Perhaps not an unthinkable proposition at the time as DL did apply to fly CVG-PEK, but it was pretty poor planning.

Thanks for the correction.

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
To be fair though, it did all work out in the end as it's now extensively used by DHL for flights as far as Hong Kong, Seoul, and Bahrain.

And the good counter!

Sadly, the new runway at STL built for TWA is now not justified...
 
rfields5421
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 12:37 pm

Quoting DashTrash (Reply 5):
So the new runway is going to be in the middle of 18C and 18R? The way the article is written it sounds like they're taking a mulligan on the recently built runway.

I was surprised that the newest runway was built 4,300 feet west of the older runways. I had assumed the idea of putting it at the limit of possible western expansion was so that a new terminal complex and better traffic flow taxiways could be built between the newest runway and the now 18C.

Guess I was wrong.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 11):
I guess I agree, given that I only see that runway being positioned to the west of the current 3.

They can't go west of the current runway. They can't move the freeway. The farther west they go, the closer to the lake - the worse the terrain issues become. The expense of a new runway could double or more in that terrain.

Quoting amccann (Reply 10):
Maybe I'm being naive but why would CLT airport build an entirely new runway as opposed to lengthening an existing runway?

They could take the newest runway to 12,500 ft easily and the center runway to 14,000 ft easily. However the extensions would have to be all on the south ends of the existing runways. There is no real room for expansion to the north.
 
DashTrash
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 1:03 pm

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 17):
I was surprised that the newest runway was built 4,300 feet west of the older runways. I had assumed the idea of putting it at the limit of possible western expansion was so that a new terminal complex and better traffic flow taxiways could be built between the newest runway and the now 18C.

Guess I was wrong.

Same here. Could be that 4300ft isn't enough distance.
 
rfields5421
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 1:20 pm

I think 4,300 ft is enough. The original N/S runway pair is about 4,950 ft apart. The taxiway network is constricted by not being able to go to the north around the terminal.

ATL - the terminal and taxiways fit between two runways about 4,400 ft apart

LAX - the terminal and taxiways fit between two runways about 4,550 ft apart

LHR - the terminal and taxiways fit between two runways about 4,625 ft apart

(Distances are from Google Earth and are runway centerline to runway centerline)

[Edited 2012-08-28 06:21:41]
 
saab2000
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 1:21 pm

CLT does not need a new runway. They do need to rework some taxiways and allow flights from the back side of the D concourse and the entire E concourse gates access to 18R and 18C without having to go around the whole airport. This would involve major reworking of parking and roadways but the fact is that there is a major bottleneck in CLT due to very poor foresight and design. Much of the congestion of CLT is on the ground.

The other thing which would greatly help would be a revision of the noise abatement policies which have only one runway in use during some of the busiest times of the day.

More runways sound great but the reality is it's not needed. If they really want a half dozen long haul flights per day deep into Europe or to the Pacific region they should lengthen an existing runway. There's no need to spend hundreds of millions on a 12000 foot runway in CLT when they don't use their current facility at even close to its potential.

And ATC needs to be run better too. They can't handle the existing traffic they have very well as it is.

Taxpayers should be aghast at these plans.
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N202PA
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 1:51 pm

Is this one of those situations where there's Federal use-it-or-lose-it money that's being used to bankroll the project?
 
Cubsrule
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 2:01 pm

Quoting saab2000 (Reply 20):
CLT does not need a new runway. They do need to rework some taxiways and allow flights from the back side of the D concourse and the entire E concourse gates access to 18R and 18C without having to go around the whole airport. This would involve major reworking of parking and roadways but the fact is that there is a major bottleneck in CLT due to very poor foresight and design. Much of the congestion of CLT is on the ground.

I agree with you. I wonder if there is a way to make the D/E situation better without ripping out all of the terminal infrastructure. Would something like chopping 18R off at Alpha (perhaps with an extension to the south, or perhaps not) and using 23 as the primary arrival runway on that side in a south flow work? Then, they could use Delta and C12 for "inbound" traffic to the ramp and C for "outbound" traffic to the ramp.
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bobnwa
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 2:33 pm

Quoting saab2000 (Reply 20):
Taxpayers should be aghast at these plans.

I'm not sure it will bother the CLT taxpayers one bit as the funds for it will probably come from bonds and the federal government.
 
saab2000
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 3:01 pm

Quoting bobnwa (Reply 23):
I'm not sure it will bother the CLT taxpayers one bit as the funds for it will probably come from bonds and the federal government.

Well, at a time when we see several other nearly dead airports (CVG and PIT come to mind) huge expansion is a waste when there's little need for it. Someone pays for this stuff and it's usually taxpayers.

A couple years ago GSO built a new runway. Yeah, that was needed.   That's a small airport in terms of passengers. Why the need for a second, long, parallel runway? Guess the senators bring home the bacon for local jobs on make-work projects.

I'm not against aviation (I work in it) but these plans need to be tempered against reality I think. And the reality is that it's not needed and I'm a frequent user of the CLT facility. They need changes, but not growth of the number of runways. Longer runway and revised taxi routes, yes, but more runways, no. That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it.
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enilria
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 3:06 pm

Quoting USAirALB (Thread starter):
Construction likely to begin in 2014, will be 12000, and will "allow flights to the Pacific Rim and deep into Europe"

INSTRUCTIONS
1) Open pipe
2) Insert dream into pipe.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 3):
Hmmm Are they banking on a positive outcome of the potential AA/US merger (if that disaster happens)?

Either way they won't get those flights. CLT will be de-emphasized in a merger. Those routes won't make since for a stand-alone US either. ATL has even lost a bunch of that stuff because it doesn't work.
 
apodino
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 3:07 pm

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 22):

I agree with you. I wonder if there is a way to make the D/E situation better without ripping out all of the terminal infrastructure. Would something like chopping 18R off at Alpha (perhaps with an extension to the south, or perhaps not) and using 23 as the primary arrival runway on that side in a south flow work? Then, they could use Delta and C12 for "inbound" traffic to the ramp and C for "outbound" traffic to the ramp.

23 already is the primary landing runway in a south config on that side. One big problem that CLT has is the fact that ATC will just guide planes to the Ramp area by the quickest way possible without using their own taxiways, which leaves USAirways (Who controls the ramp in CLT) to be responsible for most of the ground control in CLT as a result. For example, an express plane going from the E gates to 18C for departure will not even talk to an ATC ground controller until on the taxiway parallel to 18C. Other problems include the ramp between D and E, and the backside of the E ramp in which there is just no way to move traffic.

What would be a big help would be for a bridge taxiway (think MCO, PHX or ORD) to be built over the airport roadway on the northside of the airport. The question is, would ATC actually use it or would USAirways just keep using the ramp to get planes from one end of the airport to the other.

I do agree thought that this new runway is a waste of money, and money would be better off being spent elsewhere.
 
airbazar
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 3:22 pm

Quoting amccann (Reply 10):
Maybe I'm being naive but why would CLT airport build an entirely new runway as opposed to lengthening an existing runway?

Because their biggest problem is congestion so a new runway should alleviate that.

Quoting bobnwa (Reply 15):
I agree with HPRamper, that another runway is not what CLT needs, but new and improved taxiways are needed.

I would expect that that will be bundled with the construction of a new runway.
 
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jfklganyc
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 3:27 pm

Why is CLT an "at risk" airport in terms of expansion?

It is a "hub" airport that has more movements than the population of the city and surrounding burbs require. Even though CLT is a growing city, the rate of air service is still very high vs population size.

This means, the traffic at the airport is very dependent on an airline (any airline) wanting to have a MAJOR hub there.

So the question is, if US went out of business tomorrow, or had a change in business (merger) and CLT was downsized to 1) a focus city 2) a small hub 3) a spoke, would someone come in and pick up the artifical slack that is created with a major hub?

Answer: likely not.

If I were CLT, I would do my best to work with US on all expansion plans using a joint investment method. Examples: DL/AA/B6 at JFK, CO at EWR, AA at MIA. Make the airline have some "skin in the game."

I would focus on keeping costs to airlines low while making incremental improvements (taxiway reconfig is a great idea)

And I would do everything I can to lower my exposure to the risk described above.
 
HPRamper
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:14 pm

Quoting saab2000 (Reply 24):
A couple years ago GSO built a new runway. Yeah, that was needed. That's a small airport in terms of passengers. Why the need for a second, long, parallel runway? Guess the senators bring home the bacon for local jobs on make-work projects.

Several years back, Fedex built a hub facility at GSO that was supposed to be the southeast equivalent of the AFW, OAK or EWR regional hubs. Right about when it was finished, the economy tanked and the hub now sits largely unused except as a normal line station with I believe flights to MEM, IND and Puerto Rico and some feeder ops. If the hub had gone into operation - which it is still ready for - the new runway was probably intended to take some of the heavy cargo ops which would have included MD10/11 and possibly 777 at some point. At the moment it is almost entirely an Airbus station.

Quoting airbazar (Reply 27):
Because their biggest problem is congestion so a new runway should alleviate that.

But it won't, because runway capacity isn't the problem.

Quoting airbazar (Reply 27):
I would expect that that will be bundled with the construction of a new runway.

Do you really think it will? Common sense isn't usually reflected in these kinds of financial decisions...
 
PITrules
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:37 pm

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 8):
Another runway isn't going to solve the congestion, which is largely the result of constricted taxiways.
Quoting bobnwa (Reply 15):

I agree with HPRamper, that another runway is not what CLT needs, but new and improved taxiways are needed.
Quoting saab2000 (Reply 20):
CLT does not need a new runway. They do need to rework some taxiways and allow flights from the back side of the D concourse and the entire E concourse gates access to 18R and 18C without having to go around the whole airport

From a related article a few months ago, IIRC the plan is to close 5/23 after the new runway is built. This will allow for a dual taxiway system to be built around the southern part of the terminal complex, solving much of the ground congestion.

Quoting saab2000 (Reply 20):
Taxpayers should be aghast at these plans.
Quoting saab2000 (Reply 24):
Someone pays for this stuff and it's usually taxpayers

Actually taxpayers rarely pay for airport improvement projects. Bonds for projects are paid for by the airports, which generate their revenue from PFCs, landing fees, etc.
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saab2000
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:42 pm

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 29):
But it won't, because runway capacity isn't the problem.

This is correct. I am a pilot who flies in and out of CLT a lot and there are many things that should be done to improve efficiency before they spend a billion dollars on a new runway. The fourth runway helped but the fifth is not needed.

The next round of improvements for CLT needs to be a rethinking of ATC arrivals as well as a change in the taxiway and ramp design. Adding a fifth runway is not going to solve the bottleneck that exists behind the D concourse which allows exactly one airplane in or out at a time from an area that holds up to about 30+ aircraft at a given time at the back side of the D concourse and the entire E concourse. And given the nature of the departures it is not uncommon during a south operation to push off of an E gate and have to transit all the way to 18C for departure while someone from the B, C or D gates has to go to 18L to depart. This ground congestion and ramp congestion is the real headache at CLT and the addition of a fifth runway at CLT will do nothing to solve the problem. The addition of the fourth runway did not involve any taxiway construction other than to or from that runway and there's no reason to believe that the new project includes this thinking either.

Many flights at of CLT are 30-60 minutes long and it is not uncommon for the ground time to be nearly equal to the flight time due to the ramp congestion resulting from the bottleneck behind D.
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saab2000
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:44 pm

Quoting PITrules (Reply 30):
From a related article a few months ago, IIRC the plan is to close 5/23 after the new runway is built. This will allow for a dual taxiway system to be built around the southern part of the terminal complex, solving much of the ground congestion.

This idea has merit.
smrtrthnu
 
PHX787
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 4:59 pm

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 12):
Quoting simairlinenet (Reply 16):

Thanks guys for the clarification. I keep forgetting we have 747s landing there now  

back on topic:

Quoting saab2000 (Reply 31):
This is correct. I am a pilot who flies in and out of CLT a lot and there are many things that should be done to improve efficiency before they spend a billion dollars on a new runway. The fourth runway helped but the fifth is not needed.

Maybe CLT needs to have a survey of the pilots who are based out of there to see what the airport itself needs, not what they think they need.
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USAirALB
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:13 pm

I think the reason for the fifth runway is not to ease congestion, but rather the noise. I live in Charlotte and have friends that live by the airport. They were told that when the fourth runway was built it was to be used "sparingly".....well that was a lie and local residents have been complaining..
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apodino
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:15 pm

I was just reading an article in the Charlotte Observer...apparently one of the reasons for the new runway is because 18R-36L was only supposed to be used sporadically, but ATC has used it a lot more than expected and if its not needed, they want to keep arrivals closer to other flight paths, which is why it seems like it is being built just west of 18C-36C. The article also states that the excessive use of the new runway has led to NIMBY lawsuits.

I believe the article I am referring to is the one posted by the OP. It is an interesting read into the thoughts of CLT management.
 
USAirALB
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:21 pm

Quoting apodino (Reply 35):
I was just reading an article in the Charlotte Observer...apparently one of the reasons for the new runway is because 18R-36L was only supposed to be used sporadically, but ATC has used it a lot more than expected and if its not needed, they want to keep arrivals closer to other flight paths, which is why it seems like it is being built just west of 18C-36C. The article also states that the excessive use of the new runway has led to NIMBY lawsuits.

Exactly...just what my other post said. I wonder if other people actually took the time to read the article....

Anyway, according to the article, it will only cost 160 million dollars, and I believe most of the land is already cleared for the runway.
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Aesma
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:29 pm

LHR, 2 runways.
CLT, 5 runways.

Yep, makes sense !
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PITrules
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 5:37 pm

Quoting Aesma (Reply 37):
LHR, 2 runways.
CLT, 5 runways.

Yep, makes sense !

Because the UK lacks the political ability to get anything done regarding London runway capacity every other airport in the world should suffer like LHR?
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southwest737500
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 8:39 pm

I don't get why everyone says we don't need another runway.

Mark my word. WE DO NEED THIS RUNWAY!

It's Great for CLT. Who cares about the US/AA possible merger. JO says this airport will thrive even if we loose the hub

Quite frankly we are not going to losse the hub. The southeast is a hole in the AA network
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 9:13 pm

Quoting Aesma (Reply 37):

LHR, 2 runways.
CLT, 5 runways.

Yep, makes sense !

Yes, but they "regulate things" in England. Our solution is 5 runways.

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saab2000
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 9:59 pm

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 33):

Maybe CLT needs to have a survey of the pilots who are based out of there to see what the airport itself needs, not what they think they need.

I can't think of anything better than to let pilots run the world of aviation! After all, we know everything there is to know! 
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flylku
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 10:46 pm

Quoting N202PA (Reply 21):
Is this one of those situations where there's Federal use-it-or-lose-it money that's being used to bankroll the project?

Yeah, it must be "shovel ready" ergo the 2014 start date!
...are we there yet?
 
amccann
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 10:58 pm

Aside from the following issues;
1 Improper ATC and ramp control communication/coordination
2 Lack of maneuvering space around concourses D and E
3 Noise complaints

Would not the following proposal work to alleviate taxiway congestion, specifically to the recently built runway? It should provide a runway long enough for Pacific rim or ultra long haul flight departures and arrivals. It would cost significantly less and cause less disruption to airport operations during construction of the new taxiways and runway extensions.

http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/769/cltproposal.jpg
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flyguy89
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 11:36 pm

Quoting southwest737500 (Reply 39):
I don't get why everyone says we don't need another runway.

Mark my word. WE DO NEED THIS RUNWAY!

Well apparently it's not. Per my comment earlier I thought it was needed to alleviate congestion, but as others have stated, the runways aren't the issue regarding congestion at CLT.

While I don't doubt that CLT will remain a busy airport in the long-term future, if they're building this runway just to accommodate trans-Pacific flights, that's nothing but delusions of grandeur which isn't healthy for any airport.
 
USAirALB
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Tue Aug 28, 2012 11:54 pm

Quoting flyguy89 (Reply 44):
if they're building this runway just to accommodate trans-Pacific flights

Please, look closely at the article. They are NOT building it for transpac flights, but rather because of noise complaints...

I feel terrible for the people who live near 18R/36L. First, the building of I485 and then the construction is 18R/36L.
E135/E140/E145/E70/E75/E90/CR2/CR7/CR9/717/732/733/734/735/73G/738/739/752/753/762/772/77W/319/320/321/333/343
 
SurfandSnow
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Wed Aug 29, 2012 12:16 am

Sounds like a great idea to me.

$160 million for a brand new parallel runway? What a bargain! The folks at SEA paid about 7 times that for their new parallel runway a few years ago. Even though another runway isn't really needed at this time, might as well build it now because the price is *very* good and ultimately everyone will be happier. Residents will appreciate the airport shifting as many ops/as much noise off that new western runway as possible, pax and operators will appreciate the decreased taxi times and reduced fuel consumption that results from using a runway closer to the terminal.

Nonstop flights "deep into Europe or the Pacific rim"? Please. Even the almighty ATL can't support flights any deeper into Europe than Germany/Switzerland/Italy - if the likes of Moscow, Tel Aviv, Istanbul, and Athens haven't worked from Atlanta, they wouldn't stand a chance from CLT. As for Asia, let's see if US ever actually decides to fly there before we even consider that, as I highly doubt any airline but US would realistically consider a nonstop CLT-Asia service. Even then, hubs at PHL and PHX would probably see Asian flights long before CLT. CLT should focus on realistic goals, primarily key Latin American markets. Seeing as how GIG is working, why not have US try EZE, SCL, LIM, and/or BOG too? In terms of Europe, they need not try to serve realms any more distant than they already do. Markets like BCN, MXP, and ZRH seem like good possibilities there.

Not only is the airport one of few major facilities with ample runway capacity, it also sounds like they are ready to provide tenants with as much gate space as they desire. US wants more mainline gates? Great, we'll build a dogleg extension off of Concourse B. More Express gates? No problem, we'll start expanding Concourse E tomorrow  . UA wants another gate - maybe they will restore DEN-CLT service or start SFO-CLT on their own metal, rather than relying on US codeshares? As for DL, they have kept the nonstop to SLC going, and one of the new LGA flights has already been upgraded to mainline! Then there's WN, which wants "at least" two gates. They'll probably start small, with a BWI/MDW/BNA/HOU/MCO offering like they run from nearby GSP. Given the beating WN took from US at PHL, I doubt they'll try to step on US's toes too much  .
Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!
 
Cubsrule
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Wed Aug 29, 2012 1:04 am

Quoting amccann (Reply 43):
Would not the following proposal work to alleviate taxiway congestion, specifically to the
recently built runway?

Taxiway congestion on the west side of the airfield really isn't too much of a problem, and aircraft move from 18R and 36L to the ramp without too much trouble. Moving on the ramp to a parking spot is the problem.

[Edited 2012-08-28 18:12:57]
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southwest737500
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Wed Aug 29, 2012 1:10 am

I wonder if this will take out the overlook
Next flight: TUL-ATL-CLT CRJ900 and MD88
 
RDUDDJI
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RE: CLT To Build New Runway

Wed Aug 29, 2012 2:45 am

Does anyone else see the irony in building another runway to *decrease* airport noise...   In all seriousness, if they are building another runway solely because they built the last one in the wrong place, heads should roll...

Quoting southwest737500 (Reply 39):

It's Great for CLT. Who cares about the US/AA possible merger. JO says this airport will thrive even if we loose the hub


Then JO needs a history lesson.



[Edited 2012-08-28 19:47:04]
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