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Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 3:42 am

What restrictions do airlines usually place on employees about what they can do while in uniform but not at work?

(I was just on a live cam site... real uniform... oh lord!)
 
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mayor
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 3:52 am

With DL, it used to be only to and from work.....if you stopped off on the way, that was ok, but I imagine stopping at a bar was verboten..........
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
crj900lr
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 3:57 am

Going into a place such as a bar or strip club is probably not the best idea when you have your uniform on. If you are going to Wal-Mart or some place like that there is nothing wrong with it. Definatly do not wear your ID anyplace other then work.
 
B777LRF
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 7:29 am

Our outfit allows wearing the uniform to a bar, provided you remove your ID badge and shoulder boards. Then you are, after all, just a bloke in shirt and dark pants.
From receips and radials over straight pipes to big fans - been there, done that, got the hearing defects to prove
 
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fxramper
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 8:08 am

I use to frequent a certain gas station directly across the airport and it was always full of pilots wearing uniforms, id badges, & empty holsters.   
 
michaeljp
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 3:38 pm

My previous occupation was Black shirt with Black cargo trousers, black boots and a stab vest   so wearing it anywhere but to and from work was a big no no
 
Mcoov
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 4:09 pm

Quoting fxramper (Reply 4):

Somehow I think this one is fine, since these guys are just filling up and/or grabbing stuff before heading home.
 
BC77008
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 4:24 pm

Yes, having drinks at a bar is STRICTLY FORBIDDEN. Even the appearance of such, such as having a glass of water or ordering food is strictly forbidden... That and chewing gum are pretty much the only things I can think of off the top of my head that one should not do in uniform. Well ok, you can't make a sex video in one either...
"He waited his whole damn life to take that flight. And as the plane crashed down he thought 'Well isn't this nice...'"
 
falkerker
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 4:53 pm

Quoting BC77008 (Reply 7):
Well ok, you can't make a sex video in one either...

They would be in a pile in the floor!   

Quoting BC77008 (Reply 7):
chewing gum

Why is chewing gum forbidden?
 
Ferroviarius
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 5:18 pm

Good evening,

I think, this is a very interesting question.

However, which legal implications does "wearing a uniform" have for a person wearing a "uniform" doing little more than indicating that he is employed by a certain - private - employer?

I do not have any education in law, but I think - and might be totally wrong - that wearing a police or military uniform, or the uniform of any public agency, organisation or other legal entity provides the person, who wears the resp. uniform, with a number of rights and duties, which do not apply to persons NOT wearing that uniform, irrespectively of when and where the person wearing the uniform is present (provided it is within the borders of the "uniform issuing country", unless special agreements exist as, e.g., Swedish Policemen on duty in Copenhagen when there is a football mach involving a Danish and a Swedish club).

Passengers IN an airplane are, as far as I know, forced by law to follow instructions given by the uniformed crew, but outside the airplane the crew normally will not be allowed to give any instructions (please, correct me if I am wrong).

Interestingly enough - and, again: please, correct me if I am wrong - there is in some countries uniformed security staff at the airport, who, in spite of the uniform, do NOT have any rights as, e.g., police staff has. How is it, e.g., with TSA staff?

So, to which degree is a private employer entitled to demand that his uniformed staff behaves in a certain way?

Best,

Ferroviarius
 
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mayor
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 5:48 pm

Quoting Ferroviarius (Reply 9):
So, to which degree is a private employer entitled to demand that his uniformed staff behaves in a certain way?

As long as that employer is paying your salary, I would imagine that they can dictate your behavior, as long as you're in uniform, as much as they want. At DL, there is a dress code while in uniform as well as a code of conduct and behavior. If one doesn't like it, I suppose they shouldn't sign on with the company.

Besides that, I believe that if you dispose of any uniforms, any logos, etc. of the company have to be removed first.....this is for security reasons.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
Fabo
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 7:17 pm

Quoting Ferroviarius (Reply 9):
there is in some countries uniformed security staff at the airport, who, in spite of the uniform, do NOT have any rights as, e.g., police staff has

In here, security screening staff is airport employees in an airport uniform (which is usually different from other airport employees though) - obviously they have a right to confiscate any forbidden object you would have on you when entering safe zone, but nothing beyond that.
The light at the end of tunnel turn out to be a lighted sing saying NO EXIT
 
wjcandee
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 7:59 pm

Hello? Why hasn't anybody asked the obvious:

WHAT LIVE CAM SITE? Give us her screen name!

Nerds.  silly 

[Edited 2012-09-01 13:01:48]
 
hiflyer
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 8:24 pm

Quoting wjcandee (Reply 12):
Hello? Why hasn't anybody asked the obvious:

WHAT LIVE CAM SITE? Give us her screen name!

Just anet...hehehe
 
chrisair
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 8:46 pm

Quoting wjcandee (Reply 12):
WHAT LIVE CAM SITE? Give us her screen name!

It may not be a her....you are on airliners.net, after all...
 
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longhauler
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sat Sep 01, 2012 10:32 pm

We are only allowed to wear our uniforms to and from work, plus a reasonable stop on the way. And ... we are reminded that when we are in public and in uniform, we represent the airline and must act accordingly.

To wear it other than work, (for example, Career Day at school) then we must receive written permission.
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
michaeljp
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:32 am

Quoting Ferroviarius (Reply 9):
I do not have any education in law, but I think - and might be totally wrong - that wearing a police or military uniform, or the uniform of any public agency, organisation or other legal entity provides the person, who wears the resp. uniform, with a number of rights and duties, which do not apply to persons NOT wearing that uniform, irrespectively of when and where the person wearing the uniform is present (provided it is within the borders of the "uniform issuing country", unless special agreements exist as, e.g., Swedish Policemen on duty in Copenhagen when there is a football mach involving a Danish and a Swedish club).

Other countries apart from the U.K I cant answer that question however in the U.K, regardless if a police officer (sworn in by magistrate carrying a warrant card) has exactly the same rights and powers as another officer not in uniform.
A warrant card does exactly what it says on the tin. It gives you the power of "constable" and the privileges to exercise those rights when its required or you feel they should be used.
As most people have said, I think most airlines will give you the option of having a stop along the way to pick up for example water etc.
EK ask/explain that when in uniform you are not allowed to smoke, drink/eat something i.e coffee unless at a designated establishment and as you are representing the airline behave accordingly. However for F/D crew once you take off your gold bars no one is any the wiser as to whom you work for.
 
AirframeAS
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sun Sep 02, 2012 12:42 am

What about old/phased out airline uniforms? I once saw someone wear an old AS (1990's) dress a few months back here in DEN.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
acidradio
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sun Sep 02, 2012 3:17 am

At my previous employers (ramp uniform) there were no particular prohibitions against drinking in public but we were forbidden from drinking alcohol in the airport restaurants/bars while in uniform or giving any appearance that we were employees (ie. dressed in regular clothes but wearing airport badges). But the price of drinking in the airport is prohibitive anyways so that was unlikely to ever happen in the first place.

On at least one occasion while at an area bar (often a TGI Fridays nearest the airport) people actually came up to us and told us that they flew in on us and thanked us for taking good care of them  
Ich haben zwei Platzspielen und ein Microphone
 
Maverick623
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Sun Sep 02, 2012 3:31 am

Quoting BC77008 (Reply 7):
That and chewing gum are pretty much the only things I can think of off the top of my head that one should not do in uniform

Gum? Really?

Quoting acidradio (Reply 18):
At my previous employers (ramp uniform) there were no particular prohibitions against drinking in public

Technically, for me (ramper), we're not allowed to consume while in uniform (and certainly not when wearing our ID, just in case some random person reports us). Guys I work with have run into bigger bosses (directors and such) at bars, and it caused nothing more than a glare and an inside-out shirt or jacket over it.

Otherwise, nobody really cares unless you get belligerent.

Quoting Ferroviarius (Reply 9):

So, to which degree is a private employer entitled to demand that his uniformed staff behaves in a certain way?

Absolutely entitled. When in uniform, you represent the company you work for.
"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way
 
smi0006
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Wed Sep 05, 2012 10:31 am

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 19):

Quoting BC77008 (Reply 7):
That and chewing gum are pretty much the only things I can think of off the top of my head that one should not do in uniform

Gum? Really?

Absolutely with the airlines I have work for there are many such rules, generally the uniform comes with a comprehensive book containing grooming guidelines and behavioural guidelines. If I see any of the staff I supervise chewing gum they will be asked immediately to spit it out, and it is ongoing disciplinary action will follow;

-No smoking in uniform
-No eating or drinking whilst walking (must be seated at a cafe/food outlet)
-No headsets or non-operational phone usage
-No sun glasses in-side and if worn outside must be removed to talk to passengers
-Alcohol must not be consumed or drunk in uniform

Also of note I was told during training that as an FA in uniform if a medical emergency was to happen in public as first aid trained and visually identifiable we were legally required to assist, even if in a supermarket or the likes. Not that one would ever go out in public in their uniform, but still interesting.

There are many more, however most I think are basic etiquette. I see nothing wrong with high, grooming, presentation and behavioural standards. So long as there is no discriminatory element involved I am all for them!!
 
Fabo
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Wed Sep 05, 2012 11:32 am

Quoting michaeljp (Reply 16):
EK ask/explain that when in uniform you are not allowed to smoke

No smoking? Seems a bit excessive to me, but I live in a country where smoking is generally not frowned upon too much.

Quoting michaeljp (Reply 16):
drink/eat something i.e coffee unless at a designated establishment

Hmm. I kind of see the point in that, but what exactly is a designated estabilishment? I understand that getting a cup/eat from roadside stand is a no no, but how about I stop for a coffee in a local cafe?

Quoting michaeljp (Reply 16):
However for F/D crew once you take off your gold bars no one is any the wiser as to whom you work for.

Unless EK has a very atypical bar design, I guess the same could be said even when wearing bars without other identifiable parts e.g. hat. However I see the point, pilot without bars being "just a bloke in shirt and dark pants" as B777LRF put it.

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 20):
-No headsets or non-operational phone usage

Hmm, so no bluetooth headset for me to talk to scheduling?

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 20):
Not that one would ever go out in public in their uniform, but still interesting.

I have met quite a bit of uniformed crewmembers at supermarkets in base cities. Suppose they were generally on their way to/from work, but still. Interesting point though. I would not think of that, but it does make perfect sense.
The light at the end of tunnel turn out to be a lighted sing saying NO EXIT
 
michaeljp
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Wed Sep 05, 2012 3:00 pm

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 19):
Gum? Really?

A big no no at EK. Not allowed. Against grooming regs.

Quoting Fabo (Reply 21):
No smoking? Seems a bit excessive to me, but I live in a country where smoking is generally not frowned upon too much.

Also not allowed, against grooming regs. Should you be caught my a manager (has happened on many occasions) you may find yourself visiting for tea and biscuits  
I can see the point to a degree. I'm neither for nor against smoking and wont start a dispute as this isnt the time or place however there is no doubt that it smells and leaves a lingering smell on clothes and should you be smoking heavily in uniform then this will undoubtedly leave a smell on uniform and when dealing with pax for some they may find this unacceptable.

Quoting Fabo (Reply 21):
Hmm. I kind of see the point in that, but what exactly is a designated estabilishment? I understand that getting a cup/eat from roadside stand is a no no, but how about I stop for a coffee in a local cafe?

For EK is somewhat different as crew & F/D get picked up and dropped off in DXB (for the most part) so there is no real "stops" on the way to the airport. And when at an outstation the crew is together so once again there wont be any stops per se. Granted if your at an outstation and have family etc there and make your own way back to the hotel/airport you may stop but for the most part people tend to leave uniform in hotel and go to and from in civvies.
Designated establishment being - getting coffee in starschmucks in the terminal  

Everything is all down to professional image and any one of these things can detract - although its a basic human function (eating and drinking anyway) there is a time and place and I dont disagree with them.
 
Fabo
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Wed Sep 05, 2012 3:28 pm

Quoting michaeljp (Reply 22):
I can see the point to a degree. I'm neither for nor against smoking and wont start a dispute as this isnt the time or place however there is no doubt that it smells and leaves a lingering smell on clothes and should you be smoking heavily in uniform then this will undoubtedly leave a smell on uniform and when dealing with pax for some they may find this unacceptable.

That does make sense in a way. As a matter of fact, when I do smoke in work clothes when I work with customers, I make it a point to try and minimise lingering effects. Rule number one - no smoking in enclosed spaces - and I would guess this is, too, one of those rules that are not easy to follow as a crew member, even if there is a smoking room somewhere on your way through the terminal.
I will have to ask a smoker friend of mine who works as an uniformed ground staff how does she deal with that.
The light at the end of tunnel turn out to be a lighted sing saying NO EXIT
 
NYCAAer
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Wed Sep 05, 2012 3:35 pm

Why would anyone want to wear their uniform when they're not working? When I come home from working a trip, the first thing I do is jump in the shower. The 55% polyester, 45% wool blend uniform (with the 60% cotton 40% polyester shirt and 100% polyester tie) is extremely uncomfortable and hot, and the summer months in it are brutal! You can feel the droplets of sweat running down your back in that thing after a ride on the New York City subway, it's disgusting. I can't get that thing off fast enough. Even if I have to run errands once I'm home, like the supermarket, the bank, the post office, the dry cleaners, I'll shower and change first. Not only is it uncomfortable, but who wants to draw attention to yourself and have to make conversation about your job everywhere you go?
 
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mayor
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Wed Sep 05, 2012 4:24 pm

Quoting NYCAAer (Reply 24):
Why would anyone want to wear their uniform when they're not working?

Mainly because there are others, wearing uniforms, that don't work trips. You DO remember the folks on the ticket counter, ramp and gates, don't you? Many times you might want to stop somewhere to grocery shop, on the way home, instead of going all the way home, change clothes and then shop. Or you might want to stop and get gas or any other number of small stops. Now, if you're particularly filthy after a day on the ramp, it might not be the best of ideas, but that's a personal preference.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
RyanairGuru
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Wed Sep 05, 2012 4:37 pm

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 20):
Not that one would ever go out in public in their uniform, but still interesting

I've seen a QF flight attendant (who presumably lives near me) a couple of times in uniform at my local Woolworths and Subway. Presumably she was going to or from work and stopped for some food, but some crew do appear in the community in uniform

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 20):
No smoking in uniform

This one I agree with: BA let their staff smoke in uniform and a few times I've thought it looked sloppy seeing crew standing out the front of the terminal with a cigarette. (I think I've seen AA crew smoking as well, but I'm not 100% sure)
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
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fxramper
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Wed Sep 05, 2012 4:46 pm

Quoting NYCAAer (Reply 24):
Why would anyone want to wear their uniform when they're not working?

EGO!

Anyone that knows or has a relative that flies can understand. Even the most humble pilot has a massive ego. Just sayin'.   
 
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tjwgrr
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Wed Sep 05, 2012 5:09 pm

Quoting acidradio (Reply 18):
At my previous employers (ramp uniform) there were no particular prohibitions against drinking in public but we were forbidden from drinking alcohol in the airport restaurants/bars while in uniform or giving any appearance that we were employees

Reminded me of this classic spoof:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hL6nXfBhj0
.
.
.
.
Direct KNOBS, maintain 2700' until established on the localizer, cleared ILS runway 26 left approach.
 
jetblast
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Wed Sep 05, 2012 5:27 pm

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 26):
This one I agree with: BA let their staff smoke in uniform

According to our uniform standards smoking in public BA uniform is not allowed (on or off duty) unless in 'designated staff smoking areas', however I have never seen this enforced.
Speedbird Concorde One
 
Maverick623
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RE: Restrictions For Wearing Uniform, Not Working?

Wed Sep 05, 2012 9:12 pm

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 20):
If I see any of the staff I supervise chewing gum they will be asked immediately to spit it out

Interesting. On duty (for gate agents and cabin crew), it's not allowed here in the US, but off duty, you'd almost be able to tell the manager to piss off.

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 20):

Also of note I was told during training that as an FA in uniform if a medical emergency was to happen in public as first aid trained and visually identifiable we were legally required to assist

I would assume that even out of uniform, if you are certified, you are required to assist.
"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way

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