KFly
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British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:41 am

Just saw the news that the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge (Will and Kate to the masses) are flying SQ from Brisbane after their trip to the Pacific islands.

Apparently they also flew SQ from LHR to SIN when kicking off the Queen's Diamond Jubilee tour. So one will assume they will be also flying SQ back to the UK after transiting in SIN.

Just wondering how SQ manage to "win" the tender for this Royal visit?

And is this a slap in the face for BA given BA has daily flights from LHR to SIN as well as from SYD to LHR (via SIN)?

Will be interesting to see who Prince Charles and wife will fly with for their visit to Australia later in the year.

Meanwhile, Will and Kate will have to slump it out in Business Class on the SQ A330 flight from BNE :P


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starrymarkb
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:59 am

All Royal Travel is put out to tender, but minor royals (ie not the Queen*) usually travel scheduled. It's not been unknown for Royalty to use Easyjet and Flybe for domestic travel.


*The Queen does use scheduled rail services to Sandringham from London, a first class compartment is usually closed off for her use (with the rest of the carriage being public)
 
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RWA380
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:55 am

Quoting starrymarkb (Reply 1):
All Royal Travel is put out to tender, but minor royals (ie not the Queen*) usually travel scheduled. It's not been unknown for Royalty to use Easyjet and Flybe for domestic travel.

Is this done for both public and private trips the royal family takes? Am I correct in assuming that British flag carriers, ie....VS, BA are not given any preferential treatment when it comes to bidding?
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EK773
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:04 am

Singapore is a member of the Commonwealth, for which Queen Elizabeth is the head of. The fact that royal members flew Singapore Airlines rather than a British flag carrier should not be an issue. If they choose to fly with a carrier such as Emirates or JAL, then you could say their loyalties were not within the Commonwealth  
 
mainMAN
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:05 am

Quoting Kfly (Thread starter):
Meanwhile, Will and Kate will have to slump it out in Business Class on the SQ A330 flight from BNE :P

The British (and Australian) Royal Family are not known to be precious types, they often act just like the rest of us, when security allows. One exception to that rule might be Princess Michael of Kent.
 
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:08 am

The host country of an official royal visit will usually provide the transport for senior royals. Thus you will usually see the national carrier of the host country flying them.
 
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:20 am

The queen flew NZ from LHR to AKL via LAX (Scheduled) a while back for the CHOGM conference in AKL. So this is not unknown.
 
slinky09
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 10:21 am

It's not a state visit, that would be when the Queen is travelling officially.

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 2):
Am I correct in assuming that British flag carriers, ie....VS, BA are not given any preferential treatment when it comes to bidding?

Absolutely, do you think taxpayers would accept higher costs just to be jingoistic?

Quoting mainMAN (Reply 4):
The British (and Australian) Royal Family are not known to be precious types, they often act just like the rest of us, when security allows. One exception to that rule might be Princess Michael of Kent.

Absolutely, William and Kate are known to fly EasyJet for example (as does Queen Sofia of Spain), and you may be surprised to know that PMoK is not that stuffy!
 
vv701
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 10:31 am

Quoting bastew (Reply 5):
The host country of an official royal visit will usually provide the transport for senior royals. Thus you will usually see the national carrier of the host country flying them.

This is the key. A Commonwealth Head of State visit will always use transpoirt provided for it by the host Commonwealth country. While the Cambridges are not Head of State this tour is on behalf of Queen Elizabeth to mark her Diamond Jubilee. I guess that SQ won over MH as the first country in their itinary.
 
Bongodog1964
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 10:50 am

How is this a "slap in the face" for BA or VS ?

If they ahd been the chosen airline, they would have been expected to provide 1st class travel at economy prices for the royal couple plus their aides, without publicising that they ahd done so.
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:27 pm

Quoting VV701 (Reply 8):
I guess that SQ won over MH as the first country in their itinary.

They flew MH from SIN to KUL.
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sq_ek_freak
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 2:45 pm

Quoting Kfly (Thread starter):
Meanwhile, Will and Kate will have to slump it out in Business Class on the SQ A330 flight from BNE :

Though I am assuming SQ would have blocked out the entire Business Cabin? And if they did this, I would assume SQ might have catered F meals for the flight and staffed the cabin with their best Singapore Girls and Boys.

Quoting starrymarkb (Reply 1):
All Royal Travel is put out to tender, but minor royals (ie not the Queen*) usually travel scheduled. It's not been unknown for Royalty to use Easyjet and Flybe for domestic travel.

My understanding was that the Queen, Duke of Edinburgh, Prince Charles, Camilla, William, Kate and Harry were all senior royals? And everyone else were "minor royals"?

Anyway, I've read stories (and actually threads on here too) that William, Kate and Harry all fly Easyjet, Flybe, Wizzair, etc when its permitted. In fact I read somewhere that Harry had flown in Euro Traveler on BA on some trip even though Club Europe was available on the aircraft - there were several passengers who tweeted about that. There was also Will and Kate on Flybe, acting just as any other passenger with no VIP treatment. Good on 'em, especially on those short intra-Europe trips.

Quoting mainMAN (Reply 4):
One exception to that rule might be Princess Michael of Kent.

Which is all the more appalling given how the much more senior albeit young royals act.

Quoting SInGAPORE_AIR (Reply 10):
They flew MH from SIN to KUL.

Did MH upgrade the equipment for the flight or did they send their tattered 734 with the "red" seat covers in Biz?  
Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 9):

If they ahd been the chosen airline, they would have been expected to provide 1st class travel at economy prices for the royal couple plus their aides, without publicising that they ahd done so.

Agreed - wasn't there some (minor) backlash that William and Kate were upgraded from J to F on BA on their return flight back to London from Los Angeles at the end of their Canada/US trip? I know that when Harry flew to DC to accept the Atlantic Council's humanitarian award he flew paid J and refused the upgrade to F.

Quoting VV701 (Reply 8):
This is the key. A Commonwealth Head of State visit will always use transpoirt provided for it by the host Commonwealth country.

Exactly, per William and Kate flying the Canadian air force A310 over for their visit, this is nothing new.
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DTWPurserBoy
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 2:56 pm

There is a dvd out called "Monarchy" that shows in detail how a BA crew is hand selected to work Royal flights for The Queen and the Duke of Edinburgh. They all seemed to be old hands at it as the purser quickly recalled HM's preference for Gin and Dubbonet and in what percentages. Very interesting to watch the crew being briefed by palace officials. They flew a BA A320 to Talinn.
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rfields5421
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 3:00 pm

Quoting Kfly (Thread starter):
And is this a slap in the face for BA

A lot of us forget that nations like Singapore are part of the Commonwealth - and flying SQ is flying the 'national' airline for the royals.
 
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 3:16 pm

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 13):
A lot of us forget that nations like Singapore are part of the Commonwealth - and flying SQ is flying the 'national' airline for the royals.

Not quite. Sinapore, like South Africa is a republic. Australia, NZ and canada have QE2 as head of state, not a president.
 
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 3:27 pm

Quoting sq_ek_freak (Reply 11):
Though I am assuming SQ would have blocked out the entire Business Cabin? And if they did this, I would assume SQ might have catered F meals for the flight and staffed the cabin with their best Singapore Girls and Boys.

Probably, but out of consideration for other passengers as much as the royals. It's not like they are just a couple flying home from a holiday -- there are assistants, security, aids whatever travelling with them so the party probably consumes most of the cabin anyway.
 
PHX787
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:00 pm

Just a quick question: I know that the royal family owns some smaller private jets but why don't they have a fleet of long-haul aircraft like the US, Germany, or Japan?   
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vv701
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:04 pm

Quoting sq_ek_freak (Reply 11):
My understanding was that the Queen, Duke of Edinburgh, Prince Charles, Camilla, William, Kate and Harry were all senior royals? And everyone else were "minor royals"?

I think it depends on circumstances.

The Cambridges' tours to Canada and now to South East Asia and Oceania were on behalf of and representing Queen Elizabeth as part of her Diamond Jubilee celebration. So they were accorded the same treatment that the Queen and Prince Philip would have been accorded on an official Head of State visit.

For the Canadian tour (as has already been pointed out) they were collected by an RCAF Airbus CC-150 Polaris (A310). The aircraft also carried them on domestic flights within Canada. I believe it also flew them from Canada at the end of the Official Tour.

However, at the end of their Canadian tour the Cambridges did not fly back to the UK. They visited California. This part of that tour was not on behalf of the Queen. So how did they travel home? First class on a scheduled BA 744 flight from LAX.

On long haul flights they made as the UK's Head of State or as Head of the Commonwealth, the Queen accompanied by Prince Philip has travelled by BA. The airline has a Royal Suite and two 772s with the floor of their F Class cabin adapted to allow the Royal Suite - two beds, a table, two chairs and a clothes hanging area - to be fitted. Whether the use of these two 772s (and a BA 763 prior to their adaptation) reflects the age of Queen Elizabeth and Prince Phillip (86 and 91 respectively) or would also be used by their (younger) successors under similar circumstances we will have to wait and see.

As far as I know no other members of the Royal Family have used this Royal Suite. The only people apart from Queen Elizabeth and Prince Philip to use BA's 772 Royal Suite are Tony and Cherie Blair. When Tony Blair was Prime Minister in 2006 the Queen accompanied by Prince Philip had flown to LHR-SIN-CBR on a visit to Australia in her role as Head of the Commonwealth. It then flew them CBR-MEL for the Opening Ceremony of the Commonwealth Games. After the Opening Ceremony the 772 flew them MEL-SIN-LHR. Six days later (after being parked at LHR) it flew the Blairs with the Royal Suite still fitted LHR-BRU for an EU summit. It then flew them and their party (non-stop) BRU-MEL where they attended the Closing Ceremony of the Commonwealth Games. Four days later it flew them MEL-AUK on a one-day Official Visit to New Zealand and then AUK-CGK on another one-day Official Visit to Indonesia. The final leg carrying the Blairs was CGK-LHR. After arrival at LHR, the Royal Suite was removed and the F Class cabin was restored. The aircraft returned to scheduled service four days after its arrival at LHR.
 
Bongodog1964
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:40 pm

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 16):
Just a quick question: I know that the royal family owns some smaller private jets but why don't they have a fleet of long-haul aircraft like the US, Germany, or Japan?

The Royal family do not, and never have owned any private jets. Years ago they used to have use of the RAF's Royal flight, this has now been combined with the RAF's own communication fleet and become 32 (Royal) squadron which provides VIP transport for the Rpyal family, the armed forces and the government.

As to a fleet of long haul aircraft, this is discussed on Anet about every two months. Its not going to happen, as the taxpayers of the UK won't stomach a wide bodied executive palace for either the Queen or the Prime minister.
 
sq_ek_freak
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:50 pm

Quoting qf002 (Reply 15):
Probably, but out of consideration for other passengers as much as the royals. It's not like they are just a couple flying home from a holiday -- there are assistants, security, aids whatever travelling with them so the party probably consumes most of the cabin anyway.

Very true - I didn't even think of it that way. While I doubt their entourage would take up the entire cabin, I'd imagine it would be rather bothersome to other paying J passengers.

Quoting VV701 (Reply 17):
The Cambridges' tours to Canada and now to South East Asia and Oceania were on behalf of and representing Queen Elizabeth as part of her Diamond Jubilee celebration. So they were accorded the same treatment that the Queen and Prince Philip would have been accorded on an official Head of State visit.

For the Canadian tour (as has already been pointed out) they were collected by an RCAF Airbus CC-150 Polaris (A310). The aircraft also carried them on domestic flights within Canada. I believe it also flew them from Canada at the end of the Official Tour.

However, at the end of their Canadian tour the Cambridges did not fly back to the UK. They visited California. This part of that tour was not on behalf of the Queen. So how did they travel home? First class on a scheduled BA 744 flight from LAX.

Thanks for the distinction there - makes it totally clear. Suppose the same would have applied to Harry, Andrew, Edward et al who all did Diamond Jubilee tours on behalf of the Queen. I know from press coverage Harry had a private jet to ferry him around the Caribbean and down to Brazil for his segment of the tour.

Quoting VV701 (Reply 17):
On long haul flights they made as the UK's Head of State or as Head of the Commonwealth, the Queen accompanied by Prince Philip has travelled by BA. The airline has a Royal Suite and two 772s with the floor of their F Class cabin adapted to allow the Royal Suite - two beds, a table, two chairs and a clothes hanging area - to be fitted. Whether the use of these two 772s (and a BA 763 prior to their adaptation) reflects the age of Queen Elizabeth and Prince Phillip (86 and 91 respectively) or would also be used by their (younger) successors under similar circumstances we will have to wait and see.

Hmm I wouldn't be surprised if this layout was retained for Charles and Camilla when he ascends to the throne, especially for long hauls where they have to be well rested upon arrival and also have an atmosphere conducive to prep work. Neither of them will be...particularly young when they become King and Queen Consort (correct term?) either  
Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 18):
As to a fleet of long haul aircraft, this is discussed on Anet about every two months. Its not going to happen, as the taxpayers of the UK won't stomach a wide bodied executive palace for either the Queen or the Prime minister.

And I believe this is as it should be. I am a supporter of the Royal Family and part of the reason why is they seem to have adapted well to modern society and current constraints in the UK, especially as of late. There is a time for pomp and circumstance, which Brits do better than anyone else - and there is a time for pragmatic budgeting.
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n729pa
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:53 pm

Quoting mainMAN (Reply 4):
The British (and Australian) Royal Family are not known to be precious types, they often act just like the rest of us, when security allows. One exception to that rule might be Princess Michael of Kent

.....and the Duke of York!

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 16):
I know that the royal family owns some smaller private jets but why don't they have a fleet of long-haul aircraft like the US, Germany, or Japan?

...because it would be one of the quickest ways to turn the UK into a Republic! (ones tongue is firmly in ones cheek ma'am)

Money and cost...... basically. Why do they need it, if they're that desperate they can ring Hounslow 125 and get a 747 at a drop of a royal standard.

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bthebest
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:17 pm

Quoting bastew (Reply 5):
The host country of an official royal visit will usually provide the transport for senior royals. Thus you will usually see the national carrier of the host country flying them.

Who do you think rented the Global 6000 they island-hopped around on? Would that have been the Palace?

Quoting sq_ek_freak (Reply 11):
Though I am assuming SQ would have blocked out the entire Business Cabin?

Not necessarily, if your going to go scheduled you may as well save as much as possible. Surely some aides could have gone premium economy.

Quoting sq_ek_freak (Reply 11):
Agreed - wasn't there some (minor) backlash that William and Kate were upgraded from J to F on BA on their return flight back to London from Los Angeles at the end of their Canada/US trip? I know that when Harry flew to DC to accept the Atlantic Council's humanitarian award he flew paid J and refused the upgrade to F.

If the airline is willing to upgrade them, then I think that's perfectly justified. It just as if they were an important loyalty club member. The amount of pressure their under from the intense media coverage and public scrutiny, I don't think its a bad thing if they take a few perks now and then.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 16):
Just a quick question: I know that the royal family owns some smaller private jets but why don't they have a fleet of long-haul aircraft like the US, Germany, or Japan?   

Just don't go there   
 
PHX787
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 6:23 pm

Quoting n729pa (Reply 20):
Quoting Bthebest (Reply 21):
Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 18):

Woah jeez sorry for even bringing it up   
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G-CIVP
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:05 pm

Quoting Kfly (Thread starter):
And is this a slap in the face for BA given BA has daily flights from LHR to SIN as well as from SYD to LHR (via SIN)?

No, BA may have tendered for the work and bid too high. Singapore Airlines may have provided the travel cheaper, who knows. Whether there is any quodos in flying the Royals in this day and age, I doubt it.

[Edited 2012-09-19 12:05:42]
 
n729pa
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:20 pm

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 22):
Woah jeez sorry for even bringing it up

No worries....but I had to laugh at your reaction!  


It struck me after posting my reply that it was a good job SQ don't have any passenger 747s now......can you imagine a SQ 744 arriving to collect Kate and Will. Now what would the media have made of a photo opportunity of Kate and Will standing in the doorway of a SQ 744 with MegaTop written above their heads.

They would have had to take that off.....oh no, that's how it all started lets not go there!

[Edited 2012-09-19 12:36:06]
 
imiakhtar
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:36 pm

Their Royal Highnesses’ travel arrangements and their tour party. The Duke and Duchess will travel by scheduled flights to and from London to the region, and on all flights except between Kuala Lumpur and Kota Kinabalu and between Sabah, Solomon Islands and Tuvalu. It is always The Duke and Duchess’s preference to travel by scheduled flight wherever they can, but the practicalities of getting from Malaysia to Solomon Islands mean that a charter was the only option available in the time available. The same charter aircraft will take the Royal party, and a small pool of media, from Solomon Islands to Tuvalu, since there is no scheduled flight open to The Duke and Duchess. The charter plane is as small as possible, given the distances involved. We have done everything in our power to ensure that the costs of the travel arrangements are kept as low as possible.

http://www.princeofwales.gov.uk/news...the_duke_and_duche_1794772462.html

Quoting Bthebest (Reply 21):
Who do you think rented the Global 6000 they island-hopped around on? Would that have been the Palace?

Do you know which specific aircraft they used (registration) ?

I managed to catch a glimpse of the tail which had an Austrian flag but that was it.
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G-CIVP
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:39 pm

If they were travelling scheduled for LHR-SIN then the cost would inevitably be lower than a charter. Just as well really, as many have noted, it seems to be akin to a posh holiday rather than a Royal tour.
 
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mariner
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:43 pm

Quoting G-CIVP (Reply 26):
Just as well really, as many have noted, it seems to be akin to a posh holiday rather than a Royal tour.

Then people misunderstand the point of it.

As one small example, the tiny company that makes the island dress she wore is having to take on more staff because of the demand that it created, world wide.

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bthebest
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:52 pm

Quoting imiakhtar (Reply 25):
Do you know which specific aircraft they used (registration) ?
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/n...-stop/story-fndo1yus-1226477100582

OE-LXX I believe.
 
Viscount724
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:01 pm

Quoting VV701 (Reply 17):
For the Canadian tour (as has already been pointed out) they were collected by an RCAF Airbus CC-150 Polaris (A310). The aircraft also carried them on domestic flights within Canada. I believe it also flew them from Canada at the end of the Official Tour.

They also used an RCAF Challenger business jet and a float-equipped Twin Otter chartered from a commercial operator for visits to a few smaller points. One or two helicopters if not mistaken.

As a sidenote, photo below of the late Queen Mother (mother of the current Queen) arriving in YUL from LHR on a scheduled Trans-Canada Air Lines DC-8-40 on June 7, 1982. It was the first time she had travelled on a commercial flight..

http://75.aircanada.com/assets/Uploads/1962-Queen-in-colour2.gif
 
brilondon
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:56 pm

Doesn't the hosting country arrange for the transport of the royal family? IIRC when the Queen came to Canada did she not arrive and travel on Canadian Forces transport while travelling through Canada?
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vv701
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:04 pm

Quoting brilondon (Reply 30):
Doesn't the hosting country arrange for the transport of the royal family?

This depends on the reason for her visit.

If the Queen is visiting a Commonwealth country as Queen of that country all her travel arrangements will b e made and paid for by the government of that country. As a matter of prestrige that government is likely to choose a mode of transport originating in its own country.

If the Queen is travelling to a Commonwealth country as Head of the Commonwealth - for example to attend the opening session of a CHOG (Commonwealth Heads Of Government) Meeting or to open the Commonwealth Games or if she is travelling to that country as the Head of State of the UK then the arrangements will be made by the UK government and ultimately the British tax payer will carry the cost. More obviously the same applies when the Queen flies on a State Visita non-Commonwealth country.
 
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:08 pm

Why all the angst?

As the American saying goes, keep your shirt on!

All except for Kate, that is! 
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Viscount724
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Wed Sep 19, 2012 11:12 pm

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 29):
As a sidenote, photo below of the late Queen Mother (mother of the current Queen) arriving in YUL from LHR on a scheduled Trans-Canada Air Lines DC-8-40 on June 7, 1982. It was the first time she had travelled on a commercial flight..

Too late to edit. The date in my earlier reply with photo of the Queen Mother should read June 7, 1962 (not 1982).
 
jetblast
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Thu Sep 20, 2012 3:27 am

Quoting VV701 (Reply 17):
Whether the use of these two 772s (and a BA 763 prior to their adaptation)

Just curious if you recall the registration of the 763? Never knew the Royal Suite was fitted to one and I work them every day 
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vegetables2001
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Thu Sep 20, 2012 4:21 am

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 2):
Is this done for both public and private trips the royal family takes? Am I correct in assuming that British flag carriers, ie....VS, BA

The UK doesn't have a 'flag carrier' VS and BA should be treated no differently than EZY, BEE, TCX or even EZE
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Thu Sep 20, 2012 7:16 am

Quoting vegetables2001 (Reply 35):

The UK doesn't have a 'flag carrier' VS and BA should be treated no differently than EZY, BEE, TCX or even EZE

I was really only thinking of a carrier who had the aircraft capable of doing a trip like the one being discussed without ten stops for fuel.  
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richcandy
Posts: 625
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Thu Sep 20, 2012 11:35 am

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 16):

Just a quick question: I know that the royal family owns some smaller private jets but why don't they have a fleet of long-haul aircraft like the US, Germany, or Japan?  
Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 18):
As to a fleet of long haul aircraft, this is discussed on Anet about every two months. Its not going to happen, as the taxpayers of the UK won't stomach a wide bodied executive palace for either the Queen or the Prime minister.

Personal view, but I think this is one of the good reasons for keeping a Royal Family/King or Queen. They have grown up with money and for some slightly strange reason seem to value it. Queen Elizabeth is said to use unmatched china because she doesn't see any reason to replace it. She is also said to get very unhappy with staff who leave lights on in empty rooms.

Where as the first action of many newly elected presidents has been to order private jets and fleets of brand new cars. As if in some way to say I am soo important I should have this, and the poor tax payer will have to pay for it.

Alex

[Edited 2012-09-20 05:29:58]
 
Bongodog1964
Posts: 3134
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:20 pm

Quoting Richcandy (Reply 37):
Personal view, but I think this is one of the good reasons for keeping a Royal Family/King or Queen. They have grown up with money and for some slightly strange reason seem to value it. Queen Elizabeth is said to use unmatched and china because she doesn't see any reason to replace it. She is also said to get very unhappy with staff who leave lights on in empty rooms.

The Queen is very relaxed when it comes to her personal travel, her normal mode of transport from London to her private residence at Sandringham is the 1st class section of the train from Kings Cross to Kings Lynn. As you rightly say she abhors waste and wouldn't want a private long haul jet for her personal use, and wouldn 't want it for her family either.
 
AirbusA6
Posts: 1502
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Thu Sep 20, 2012 3:19 pm

Quoting VV701 (Reply 17):
On long haul flights they made as the UK's Head of State or as Head of the Commonwealth, the Queen accompanied by Prince Philip has travelled by BA. The airline has a Royal Suite and two 772s with the floor of their F Class cabin adapted to allow the Royal Suite - two beds, a table, two chairs and a clothes hanging area - to be fitted. Whether the use of these two 772s (and a BA 763 prior to their adaptation) reflects the age of Queen Elizabeth and Prince Phillip (86 and 91 respectively) or would also be used by their (younger) successors under similar circumstances we will have to wait and see.

As far as I know no other members of the Royal Family have used this Royal Suite. The only people apart from Queen Elizabeth and Prince Philip to use BA's 772 Royal Suite are Tony and Cherie Blair. When Tony Blair was Prime Minister in 2006 the Queen accompanied by Prince Philip had flown to LHR-SIN-CBR on a visit to Australia in her role as Head of the Commonwealth. It then flew them CBR-MEL for the Opening Ceremony of the Commonwealth Games. After the Opening Ceremony the 772 flew them MEL-SIN-LHR. Six days later (after being parked at LHR) it flew the Blairs with the Royal Suite still fitted LHR-BRU for an EU summit. It then flew them and their party (non-stop) BRU-MEL where they attended the Closing Ceremony of the Commonwealth Games. Four days later it flew them MEL-AUK on a one-day Official Visit to New Zealand and then AUK-CGK on another one-day Official Visit to Indonesia. The final leg carrying the Blairs was CGK-LHR. After arrival at LHR, the Royal Suite was removed and the F Class cabin was restored. The aircraft returned to scheduled service four days after its arrival at LHR.

I had to laugh that the Blairs are the only other people to use the Royal Suite  

It's a sensible use of resources, I presume BA has enough slack in its 772 fleet to allow 1 or 2 to be out of scheduled service. What was used in the old days before the 763?
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bthebest
Posts: 434
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2008 4:35 pm

RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Thu Sep 20, 2012 4:50 pm

I'm of two minds really.

I understand the arguments for a dedicated or semi-dedicated fleet, for the obvious security and practicality reasons, but then I think something of the order that the US has is completely unnecessary.

A big part of it is the appearance to the public as well though. Whilst other heads of state need to project a level of power (Germany, US, Japan etc) the British Royal Family is mostly ceremonial and patriotic, not really getting involved in Government matters. Imagine a US-style entourage arriving on one these small islands - would look like recolonisation!

On the other hand I would support something a bit more substantial for our Head of Government, even just a Bizjet able to get to asia or the west coast non-stop, with the rest of the entourage on scheduled.

As I understand at the moment, No. 32 Sqn is utilised by the RAF but is available for VIP travel if not needed elsewhere. I think a similar arrangement might be in place for the Voyagers, which would definitely be an improvement.
 
vv701
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Thu Sep 20, 2012 5:01 pm

Quoting jetblast (Reply 34):
Just curious if you recall the registration of the 763?

The last time that the Queen and Prince Phillip took a long haul flight in a BA aircraft other than a 772 it was a notable occasion in BA's history.

The airline had been much derided following the launch of its "World Images" tails in 1997. Amongst those images were its Concorde Fleet all painted in what was variously known as "Chatham Historic Dockyard" or "Union Flag" livery:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © George Canciani



On 18 April 1999 the Queen and Prince Philip were to depart from LHR on a State Visit to South Korea. Just before they arrived at LHR 763 G-BNWR was rolled out. Not only was it the first sub-sonic aircraft to be painted in Union Flag livery:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © George William



but the F Class cabin had indeed been refurbished with the Royal Suite and with the M Class seats at the rear of the aircraft removed to create a store area for the flight to SEL.

The aircraft arrived back at LHR with Queen Elizabeth and Prince Philip on 23 April. It went straight to the BA Maintenance area for cabin refurbishment. Once this was complete it was ferried to LGW on 27 April where it became the first BA subsonic aircraft to operate a scheduled flight in Union Flag livery.

In May 1999, by which time a second 763, G-BNWL had been rolled out in Union Flag livery, I was fortunate enough to meet a BA Manager involved in the livery issues. When I asked him about the Union Flag livery and subsonic aircraft he told me they were planning to paint two aircraft of each of three types in that livery. Very soon after that conversation the first 752 was rolled out in it. But before the third type appeared - I am guessing it was planned to paint two 763s, two 752s and two 744s in Union Flag livery - it was announced that with immediate effect BA aircraft would only be repainted in the Union Flag livery. This no doubt was a response to the media reaction to 'WR when it was rolled out.
 
jetblast
Posts: 950
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RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Thu Sep 20, 2012 5:11 pm

Quoting VV701 (Reply 41):
the Queen and Prince Philip were to depart from LHR on a State Visit to South Korea. Just before they arrived at LHR 763 G-BNWR was rolled out. Not only was it the first sub-sonic aircraft to be painted in Union Flag livery:

A wealth of information as always, I am much obliged - will think of NWR as the 'Royal' 767 every time I see her now!
Speedbird Concorde One
 
sq_ek_freak
Posts: 1179
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2000 4:48 pm

RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Mon Sep 24, 2012 3:07 pm

Quoting AirbusA6 (Reply 39):
I had to laugh that the Blairs are the only other people to use the Royal Suite

That is rather ironic, isn't it?

Quoting bongodog1964 (Reply 38):
The Queen is very relaxed when it comes to her personal travel, her normal mode of transport from London to her private residence at Sandringham is the 1st class section of the train from Kings Cross to Kings Lynn. As you rightly say she abhors waste and wouldn't want a private long haul jet for her personal use, and wouldn 't want it for her family either.

I think that's part of the reason why the British Royal Family has remained relevant (and is so visible globally) while other European monarchies continue to fade into the background. From what I understand that the Nordic monarchies are all quite popular with their constituencies but they simply don't carry the same gravitas as the Queen and her family. Well, that's my take on it at least.

Quoting vegetables2001 (Reply 35):
The UK doesn't have a 'flag carrier'

True, but they do seem to favour BA over VS. In fact I can't recall any of the senior members of the family flying VS?
Keep Discovering
 
bojangles
Posts: 41
Joined: Mon Sep 21, 2009 2:49 pm

RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Mon Sep 24, 2012 10:01 pm

Quoting mainMAN (Reply 4):
The British (and Australian) Royal Family are not known to be precious types, they often act just like the rest of us, when security allows. One exception to that rule might be Princess Michael of Kent.

"Acting" being the operative word here! They are nothing like pretty much all of us. How many of you have liveried footmen and everywhere you go smells of fresh paint?  
 
Viscount724
Posts: 19287
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Mon Sep 24, 2012 11:38 pm

Quoting VV701 (Reply 41):
On 18 April 1999 the Queen and Prince Philip were to depart from LHR on a State Visit to South Korea. Just before they arrived at LHR 763 G-BNWR was rolled out. It the first sub-sonic aircraft to be painted in Union Flag livery

As a sidenote, the Queen was also the first passenger to fly on an aircraft bearing the new Air Canada name and livery when she flew from YOW to LHR on October 13, 1964 after an official visit to Canada. The name change from Trans-Canada Air Lines to Air Canada wasn't official until January 1, 1965 but a DC-8-43 (CF-TJI) was repainted in the new livery for the Queen's flight. It was the first public appearance of the new AC name and livery. That was also the Queen's first flight on a Canadian commercial aircraft.



Sadly, that aircraft crashed after takeoff from Barbados in October 1976 due to a terrorist bomb explosion while being operated by Cubana, killing all 73 aboard.
 
Bongodog1964
Posts: 3134
Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2006 6:29 am

RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Tue Sep 25, 2012 6:06 am

Quoting sq_ek_freak (Reply 43):
Quoting vegetables2001 (Reply 35):
The UK doesn't have a 'flag carrier'

True, but they do seem to favour BA over VS. In fact I can't recall any of the senior members of the family flying VS?

The last member of the Royal family to publicly favour VS was princess Diana, who made an official statement that she was "withdrawing from public life" and a few days later was filmed naming a new aircraft for VS accompanied by SRB whose hands were all over her like an octopus.
Some of the younger Royals are friendly with SRB's children, I believe Price Harry was partying on Necker a few weeks back prior to his Vegas exposure, so its likely that they use VS quite regularly, its just that the vast majority of Royal transport is un noticed by the media.
 
User avatar
SKAirbus
Posts: 1462
Joined: Sat Oct 27, 2007 9:18 pm

RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Tue Sep 25, 2012 8:07 am

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 16):
Just a quick question: I know that the royal family owns some smaller private jets but why don't they have a fleet of long-haul aircraft like the US, Germany, or Japan?

There are a number of politicians in the South West of England and Wales who (for obvious reasons) have been trying to badger the government into buying Airbus long haul aircraft for use by the government and Royal Family. I think the costs of purchasing and maintaining these aircraft for what will essentially only be prestige cannot be justified and that by flying on scheduled aircraft you are only paying for "seats" as opposed to a whole piece of metal with the odd BA 777 charter for ma'am.

After the whole expenses scandal and economic turmoil, the UK government cannot afford to be frivolous like France, Germany or even the US.
Next Flights: LHR-OSL (738), OSL-CPH (320), CPH-LHR (321), LHR-HEL (359), HEL-LHR (359)
 
jumpjets
Posts: 1142
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:17 pm

RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Tue Sep 25, 2012 10:21 am

Quoting bongodog1964 (Reply 38):
The Queen is very relaxed when it comes to her personal travel

I recall an observation attributed to the Duke of Edinburgh that the only form of transport in which HMQ is particularly interested has four legs and could run in the Epsom Derby.
 
AirbusA6
Posts: 1502
Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:53 am

RE: British Royal Family Flying SQ For State Visit

Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:25 am

I presume they've done the costings, and if it was cheaper to buy a dedicated plane, then they would do so, though I imagine that even then there would be clashes between Royal and UK Government usage. A secondhand A345 wouldn't be that expensive though you'd imagine, and would look lovely  
it's the bus to stansted (now renamed National Express a6 to ruin my username)

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