BommerJan
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HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:21 pm

just saw that on the ticker of German news channel n-tv.de. According to that ticker the new LH LCC will be "merged" with Germanwings.

[Edited 2012-09-19 09:30:09]

" Lufthansa platziert neue Billigfluglinie in Köln

Frankfurt/Main (dpa) - Die Lufthansa platziert ihre neue, umstrittene Direktfluglinie in Köln. Der Aufsichtsrat beschloss in Frankfurt die Verschmelzung der eigenen Direktflugverkehre außerhalb der Drehkreuze mit der Tochter Germanwings zum Jahresbeginn 2013. Auch Flugzeuge der Tochter Eurowings sollen im Auftrag der neuen Gesellschaft fliegen. Im ersten Jahr sollen rund 18 Millionen Passagiere befördert werden. Ein Name für die neue Gesellschaft steht noch nicht fest." (n-tv.de, 19.9.2012)

"Lufthansa locates its new LCC in Cologne

Frankfurt/Main (dpa) - Lufthana locates the HQ of its new and much debated LCC in Cologne. The Lufthansa Board of Directors decided to merge Lufthansa's direct services outside of its hubs with Lufthansa's subsidiary Germanwings at the beginning of 2013. Eurowings will also contribute some of its aircraft to the new company. In its first year of operations the new entity is expected to fly 18 million passengers. A new name has not been decided".


[Edited 2012-09-19 09:36:25]

[Edited 2012-09-19 09:37:59]
 
tailfin
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:28 pm

Expanding what they are already doing at Stuttgart to their other non-hub bases (Berlin, HAM, DUS, CGN). Services to/from FRA and MUC will not be affected across the network, including domestic German and European services.
 
wilco737
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:40 pm

To be honest, not real of a surprise for me. It was most certain in CGN and the merge with Germanwings makes only sense.
Let's see how It will be names and where the crews are coming from...

wilco737
  
 
MaverickM11
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:47 pm

This idea just gets worse and worse. I'd be lying if I said I didn't enjoy watching this slow motion train wreck.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
kl911
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:06 pm

I have heard rumours that the new name will be Direct4You, is that true?
 
wilco737
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:08 pm

Direct4U was Founded not too long ago, but if this will be the final name is not decided yet.

wilco737
  
 
kl911
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:13 pm

I like the use of " 4U " in the name  
 
wilco737
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:18 pm

Quoting kl911 (Reply 6):

4U is the 2 letter code for Germanwings for many years already.

wilco737
  
 
kl911
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:22 pm

I know, thats why i like it if they use it in the name.
 
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coronado
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:39 pm

Managments dont seem to learn. Both LH and AC management seems to think they can create and run an LCC within a full service corporate structure that will have different results than SONG or TED. Neither LH nor AC management must read or learn from experiences of others.
The Original Coronado: First CV jet flights RG CV 990 July 1965; DL CV 880 July 1965; Spantax CV990 Feb 1973
 
peanuts
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:39 pm

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 3):
This idea just gets worse and worse. I'd be lying if I said I didn't enjoy watching this slow motion train wreck.

Correct. If anything, this just confirms for many that European aviation is 10-15 years behind of US aviation. Many posters on here have been mocking their own future on this site over the past 10 years.

It's gonna be painful.

And to make matters even worse: oil is way higher...

[Edited 2012-09-19 10:46:17]
 
wilco737
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:41 pm

Quoting peanuts (Reply 10):
It's gonna be painful.

I hope not... I am feeling well at my employer and I like flying and working for LH... But the recent changes makes many of us feel uncomfortable and not knowing what the future brings. And that is one of the biggest fear one can have as an employee...

wilco737
  
 
peanuts
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:51 pm

Quoting wilco737 (Reply 11):
And that is one of the biggest fear one can have as an employee...

You should be in a safe spot with LH, as a wide-body aircraft pilot.
I'd be more worried as a narrow-body aircraft pilot with LH.

I can see how you'd be concerned for your colleagues though...
 
wilco737
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:53 pm

Quoting peanuts (Reply 12):
You should be in a safe spot with LH, as a wide-body aircraft pilot.
I'd be more worried as a narrow-body aircraft pilot with LH.

Yes, for now I might be safe, but I don't know how my future at LH looks like. Once I am upgrading to Captain...

Quoting peanuts (Reply 12):
I can see how you'd be concerned for your colleagues though...

I am concerned for the all of us... We don't know in which direction this goes and it is all very difficult to understand for us crews...

wilco737
  
 
C010T3
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 6:02 pm

Is this really news? LH's HQ is also located in Köln, not to mention Germanwings'.

[Edited 2012-09-19 11:03:53]
 
LondonCity
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 6:39 pm

There's more information on the new airline brand here. I suppose that German Wings' costs are higher than those of what Lufthansa would expect a budget airline to achieve.


http://www.businesstraveller.com/new...l-create-budget-brand-to-cut-costs
 
MaverickM11
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 6:59 pm

Quoting peanuts (Reply 10):
If anything, this just confirms for many that European aviation is 10-15 years behind of US aviation. Many posters on here have been mocking their own future on this site over the past 10 years.

   It's going to be morbidly fun to watch, after hearing forever how ____fill-in-the-blank____ apreciate and are willing to pay for good service 
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
UALWN
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:04 pm

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 16):
It's going to be morbidly fun to watch, after hearing forever how ____fill-in-the-blank____ apreciate and are willing to pay for good service 

Well, it goes both ways. When Skybus started and failed, we read here over and over again that Americans would never accept anything like Ryanair. Now Spirit is thriving going even further than Ryanair...
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TC957
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:31 pm

But why ditch the Germanwings branding and name ? Rebranding can only add to the start-up costs. Does the brand not have a good reputation in Germany ?
 
MaverickM11
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:41 am

Quoting UALWN (Reply 17):
When Skybus started and failed, we read here over and over again that Americans would never accept anything like Ryanair.

I don't think I ever heard that; Americans won't bother flying to places they've never heard of to save $0 versus the city they actually want to go to however, and that's what doomed SX.
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Lufthansa
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:46 am

Quoting Coronado (Reply 9):
Neither LH nor AC management must read or learn from experiences of others.

What about Jetstar? It's worked and expanded to other countries.
 
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EK413
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:48 am

Quoting wilco737 (Reply 7):
4U is the 2 letter code for Germanwings for many years already.

Wasn't Germanwings LHs low-cost carrier?

EK413
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twa@fra
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 5:05 am

What I don’t get is always the ref. to LCC, where does LH really has competition by a LCC within Germany? Within Europe on some routes.
Anyhow, within DE / Europe, certainly AB (LCC ?) is in the market, from my experience not always cheaper and on certain routes they just can’t offer the same frequency or even a direct routing.
So IMO that’s just an excuse that their overall cost structure is too high to produce a product they can sell

I also agree that these LCC within a full service airlines haven’t proofed to be the best solution, but how shall they reduce their cost?

As a quite loyal LH customer I’m a little bit scared, I don’t want these LCC 5:30 a.m. departures, give me some space to be able to work my laptop, some motivated FA (after a long day a smile, a joke etc.,. from a FA is just nice), give me some miles, some flexibility, a fast way through the airport and yes I’m willing to pay for that, not 600 EUR for a 1 h flight, but also not as low as 99 EUR

[Edited 2012-09-19 22:08:34]
 
AF185
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 6:43 am

Bloomberg explains LH will combine its short Haul unit with Germanwings for flights out of the FRA and MUC hubs

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-0...an-flights-into-low-cost-unit.html

Quote:
Deutsche Lufthansa AG (LHA), Europe’s second-biggest airline, will combine its European short-haul operations outside its main Frankfurt and Munich hubs with the Germanwings low-cost unit as part of a cost-reduction effort.

The new unit will begin operations in January and fly 18 million passengers annually, Cologne, Germany-based Lufthansa said late yesterday. Former Chief Executive Officer Wolfgang Mayrhuber and former Chief Financial Officer Karl-Ludwig Kley have been nominated to join the supervisory board next year, with Mayrhuber taking over as chairman, the airline said.

Enlarge image
Lufthansa to Combine European Flights Into One Low-Cost Division Hannelore Foerster/Bloomberg
Deutsche Lufthansa AG , Europe’s second-biggest airline, will combine its European short-haul operations outside its main Frankfurt and Munich hubs with the Germanwings low-cost unit as part of a cost-reduction effort.

Deutsche Lufthansa AG , Europe’s second-biggest airline, will combine its European short-haul operations outside its main Frankfurt and Munich hubs with the Germanwings low-cost unit as part of a cost-reduction effort. Photographer: Hannelore Foerster/Bloomberg
Lufthansa has a companywide goal of saving 1.5 billion euros ($1.96 billion) through 2014 under a reorganization program dubbed Score. The company is cutting 3,500 jobs in administrative and as many as 1,000 catering slots may be eliminated. The program has already helped improve earnings, with second-quarter operating profit increasing 28 percent to 361 million euros and exceeding analyst estimates.

“Combining our domestic German and European point-to-point services has enormous potential to improve efficiency,” CEO Christoph Franz said in a statement. “Our aim is to once again fly these services profitably under the umbrella of a single company.”

Lufthansa is predicting full-year operating profit in the “mid-three-digit million-euro range,” excluding restructuring costs of 100 million euros to 200 million euros.
 
UALWN
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 6:54 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 19):
I don't think I ever heard that; Americans won't bother flying to places they've never heard of to save $0 versus the city they actually want to go to however, and that's what doomed SX.

Well I did read that often here at that time. SX was doomed by their hub-and-spoke model having CMH as only hub. Spirit (as FR) has a very different route network.
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EK413
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 7:03 am

Quoting EK413 (Reply 21):
Quoting AF185 (Reply 23):

Forget I asked... question has been answered...

EK413
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PanHAM
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 7:28 am

That includes Eurowings as well which could mean that the 23 CRJ900 are transferred to that outfit as well.

Germanwings currently has about 30+ A320, another 60 or so would need to be transferred to 4U. There are different models possible how this can be realised, I doubt that the Lufthansa brand will disappear on these routes, likely is that a similar solution and color scheme as LH Regional mwill be adapted. The cost reduction will be achieved by lower employee costs and higher utilisation of aircraft.

Let's wait for the information that will come.

Good news is the new LH Cargo Center at FRA. was about time to replace the old building with 30 year old hardware. An investment that will have a high roi:
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nighthawk
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 7:56 am

Quoting AF185 (Reply 23):

Bloomberg explains LH will combine its short Haul unit with Germanwings for flights out of the FRA and MUC hubs

quite the opposite actually - flights NOT from FRA and MUC will be combined into the new new loco airline.
 
PanHAM
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:06 am

The 90 aircraft will be made up of the current 4U fleet, the current EW fleet and 35 A3197320 from LH mainline. Assuming that current 4U and EW schedules will not be cut back, that leaves 35 ex LH aircraft and the potential higher utilisation
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vfw614
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:53 am

Quoting twa@fra (Reply 22):
As a quite loyal LH customer I’m a little bit scared, I don’t want these LCC 5:30 a.m. departures, give me some space to be able to work my laptop, some motivated FA (after a long day a smile, a joke etc.,. from a FA is just nice), give me some miles, some flexibility, a fast way through the airport and yes I’m willing to pay for that, not 600 EUR for a 1 h flight, but also not as low as 99 EUR

Realistically, this was only the case in the early days of Germanwings. Nowadays, their first departures on business routes are in the 0645-0700 time bracket, just like the competition.

My guess is that Lufthansa hopes that its new offspring will give the airline some leverage on the human resources front, just like Tyrolean has been a bargaining chip in Austria or as Swiss European was used to relaunch a leaner Swiss(air). The other hope probably is that the travelling public can be tricked into the LCC mantra, despite Germanwings nowadays being all but non-expensive compared to Lufthansa if you disregard the handful of cheap tickets that are used to create this "fly for 29,99 EUR"-image. Thirdly, it is probably also a way to introduce all kinds of extra fees for luggage, food, seat assignment etc. that would have been difficult to introduce under the Lufthansa brand.
 
LHRFlyer
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 9:42 am

So BA will have no competition in short-haul business class between, London-Berlin, Dusseldorf, Hamburg, Hanover and Stuttgart. Interesting.
 
LondonCity
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 10:09 am

Quoting LHRFlyer (Reply 30):
So BA will have no competition in short-haul business class between, London-Berlin, Dusseldorf, Hamburg, Hanover and Stuttgart. Interesting.

That's a good point. It means BA will be the only carrier with a premium product on what are essentially business travel routes. It remains to be seen whether or not the new LH budget brand will provide passengers with free food/drinks and baggage checking as part of its price package.
 
Joost
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 10:36 am

Quoting LHRFlyer (Reply 30):

So BA will have no competition in short-haul business class between, London-Berlin, Dusseldorf, Hamburg, Hanover and Stuttgart. Interesting.

LHR-HAJ used to be a bmi regional route, which became BD and will become BA. But competition wasn't expected anyhow, irrespective of the deal.

LHR-STR, like LHR-CGN are being flown by 4U since a few months.

Quoting LondonCity (Reply 31):
It remains to be seen whether or not the new LH budget brand will provide passengers with free food/drinks and baggage checking as part of its price package.

4U is already offering 3 products:
- Basic (nothing included, except for Miles)
- Best (checked luggage, drink and snack, pre-selected seating and higher seat pitch rows 1-10)
- Flex (best + flexibility)

During the last decade, 4U has moved towards a very hybrid carrier (Miles & More, airports like LHR, frills) so the integration with LH Direct is hardly a surprise.

My guess:
- A brand featuring the Lufthansa name, for example Lufthansa Direct
- Germanwings fare / offer-structure (no-frills entry fares, full-frills possible)
- StarAlliance miles redeeming, maybe only for Best-fares
- No flights at all to FRA and MUC, also not from their own airports (4U MUC-CGN will stop next month, MUC-HAM has been ceased for a while already)
 
vfw614
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 10:55 am

Quoting joost (Reply 32):
4U is already offering 3 products:
- Basic (nothing included, except for Miles)
- Best (checked luggage, drink and snack, pre-selected seating and higher seat pitch rows 1-10)
- Flex (best + flexibility)

There are Lufthansa customers who are joking that Germanwings indeed offers the better product on business routes within Europe because of the more comfortable seats / seat pitch as the only difference between LH C and Y is the empty middle seat in a cabin that otherwise has Y standard and some extra food which can be bought in better quality and cheaper (compared to the C fares) at any airport outlet anyway.
 
LondonCity
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 11:06 am

Quoting joost (Reply 32):
No flights at all to FRA and MUC,

Yes I would agree with what you say about the different tariff tiers and FFP awards. But LH has already confirmed that its new low-cost brand will not operate to FRA and MUC, ie its main hub airports.
 
tailfin
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 11:49 am

Quoting LondonCity (Reply 31):
It means BA will be the only carrier with a premium product on what are essentially business travel routes.
Quoting LHRFlyer (Reply 30):
So BA will have no competition in short-haul business class between, London-Berlin, Dusseldorf, Hamburg, Hanover and Stuttgart. Interesting.

Most business travellers on these flights (when not mileage upgrades) still fly economy when flying point-to-point. BA might have good premium loads (?) but the majority of full-fare business pax will be connecting at LHR to the wider long-haul BA network. That is a different market to LH's on those routes. LH is marketing these passengers through FRA and MUC. Short-haul business class point-to-point has a very limited market. They will just have to work out the FFP and lounge access issue. On board product is much less of an issue. In any case, LH has not even stated if C class will be withdrawn. Lets wait and see.
 
PanHAM
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:01 pm

Spoke to spoke will also mean that overnight stops will be eliminated, higher utilisation of aircraft., crew scheduling, all items on which cost can be saved.
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wilco737
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:06 pm

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 36):

Germanwings doesn't have many night stops anyway.

Will be interesting to see what they do to cut costs...

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Burkhard
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:18 pm

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 36):
Spoke to spoke will also mean that overnight stops will be eliminated, higher utilisation of aircraft., crew scheduling, all items on which cost can be saved.

Which might be the bigger sum. In the end I wonder, how do crew costs really contribute to the ticket costs. My rough estimate is for an A320, that the costs share between (aircraft, stuff, maintenance and fees, fuel) like 1:1:1:2 on an inner European flight. Second I estimate the crew costs to be half the total staff costs, and the cabin crew to be the same as the flight deck - which means that the cabin crew costs are 1/20th of the CASM. A 20% reduction of cabin crew wages reduces CASM by 1%. Correct me if you have better numbers, I guess they are correct with a factor of two.
Fuel costs are 40%, so a 2.5% change of fuel costs as much as the more expensive stuff.
 
PanHAM
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:01 pm

Without claiming to have the exact figures, but I remember that crews work something like 90 block hours per month. Assuming - I think that is rather at the low end - an average of 2500€ per month which, including sick time, , holiday and the usual percentage of insurances means roughly e 5000,00 to the employer divided by 90 hours that comes to € 55,55 per hour. times 3 on a 150 seater you have a good idea how much it is.

Now, take the overnights out, inclduing the allowances, and then you have already some significant reduction in costs.

Quoting wilco737 (Reply 37):
Germanwings doesn't have many night stops anyway.

OK, but the LH flights spoke to spoke which will be transferred to 4U might have overnights, even on a domestic roster. I could imagine that this will be eliminated and a hoigher utilisation will add to cost cuts.
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aerosol
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:07 pm

This company is weakening its position - they are leaving their brand roots - be it the new low cost, the new claim "nonstop you" or "score".

They need someone with a strategic vision, not the ongoing cost cutting. The war is won via the better product. Lufthansa used to be an innovative company, were travelling made a difference from booking till picking up your luggage at the destination.

Concerning the new LCC: What is the point for the customer: there is already a Germanwings - it is the same airport, the same aircraft?!? What is the "reason why" for someone to book them? Furthermore, how will they significantly reduce the cost with the same structure?
 
vfw614
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:12 pm

Quoting Aerosol (Reply 40):
Concerning the new LCC: What is the point for the customer: there is already a Germanwings - it is the same airport, the same aircraft?!? What is the "reason why" for someone to book them?

I don't understand your point. LH outside FRA and MUC will be replaced by the new airline, so there will be no choice unless you are referring to onestop flights via FRA and MUC instead of nonstop flights from places like DUS, HAM, STR, BER etc.

What I find interesting is that Lufthansa is pitching its new concept for Berlin against the extended Germanwings operation at STR in order to make their mind up under what brand the new operation will operate.
 
PanHAM
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:40 pm

Quoting Aerosol (Reply 40):
They need someone with a strategic vision, not the ongoing cost cutting

These flights lose money in the triple digit millions. These flights are not feeding hubs. these flights are a service for the local economy and have to be made viable or cut down altogether.

That's thew way BA used to go and it should be appreciated that LH at least tries to maintain a presence at non-hub cities and provide even more than just a feeder service.
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vfw614
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Thu Sep 20, 2012 3:33 pm

As I mentioned above, the most interesting question is whether the new airline follows the concept currently trialled at BER (a sort of Lufthansa light brand) or at STR (Germanwings on former Lufthansa routes). Other than that, there will be little change for BER, CGN, STR and HAJ that, as existing Germanwings bases, have, other than hub-feed to FRA and MUC, hardly any Lufthansa classic routes left. Biggest changes will be for DUS and, to a lesser extent, HAM that both have a sizeable European route network currently served by Lufthansa mainline, Lufthansa Cityline and Eurowings. All other German airports that Lufthansa serves - Bremen, Hanover, Dresden, Leipzig, Dresden, Nuremberg, Paderborn, Muenster, Friedrichshafen - only have hub feed to FRA and MUC by Lufthansa anyway and won't be affected. You can pretty much boil the whole new airline down to the Germanwings concept being extended to Hamburg and Duesseldorf.
 
PHX Flyer
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RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Fri Sep 21, 2012 4:11 am

Quoting C010T3 (Reply 14):
Is this really news? LH's HQ is also located in Köln, not to mention Germanwings

Well, here's news for you: Lufthansa's headquarters has been in Frankfurt, probably for the last 20 years. You're confusing it with the registered business address, which is in Cologne, but that's otherwise meaningless.

The fact that Cologne will once again play a bigger role in the LH network is indeed news to the rest of us, given the history the airline has with that city. Having said that, I am skeptical that this new business model is going to "fly", even though I hope it will. But I don't know of any major airline that operates mainline jets and Canadair regional jets within the same fleet, under the same labor contracts. We'll see how it goes ...

Lufthansa had not really any choice but keeping a sizable operation in CGN. Another pulldown like it happened before around 1980 and again in the early 90s would immediately trigger an expansion of Ryanair, which - as of this year - already has a foot in the door in CGN. As much as LH wants to focus on the hubs in FRA and MUC, they cannot afford to allow the likes of Ryanair gain a strong foothold at one of the two major airports in the largest, most populous state in Germany.
 
IndianicWorld
Posts: 2823
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2001 11:32 am

RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Fri Sep 21, 2012 4:44 am

Quoting PHX Flyer (Reply 44):
Well, here's news for you: Lufthansa's headquarters has been in Frankfurt, probably for the last 20 years. You're confusing it with the registered business address, which is in Cologne, but that's otherwise meaningless.

Umm.. heres new for you though. A registered business address is a HQ, so it is not in FRA at all. Saying that is meaningless misses the point completely.

FRA is its main operational base, which is a similar case with AC (Montreal, main ops base is Toronto).
 
PHX Flyer
Posts: 541
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2001 9:52 pm

RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Fri Sep 21, 2012 5:30 am

Quoting IndianicWorld (Reply 45):
A registered business address is a HQ

According to your logic all major US carriers would have their headquarters in Wilmington, Delaware, because that's where they all have their business registered.

Headquarters is where the CEO and the top executives have their offices. As far as Lufthansa is concerned, that's at Frankfurt Airport.

[Edited 2012-09-20 22:32:34]
 
PanHAM
Posts: 8643
Joined: Fri May 06, 2005 6:44 pm

RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Fri Sep 21, 2012 5:54 am

I have to disappoint you, PHX Flyer, unlike companies based in Wilmington DE, who usually have a mail box there,

Deutsche Lufthansa AG
Von-Gablenz-Str. 2-6
500679 Koeln

has real offices and a number of staff under this adress which is the legal HQ of Lufthansa. The top management has their offices there as well, and at FRA.

The Germanwings offices are separate and the new company will be run independently.
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IndianicWorld
Posts: 2823
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2001 11:32 am

RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Fri Sep 21, 2012 6:25 am

^^ Thanks. What he said  

LH has its HQ in Koln. Simple as that.
 
PHX Flyer
Posts: 541
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2001 9:52 pm

RE: HQ Of New LH LCC To Be Located In Cologne

Fri Sep 21, 2012 12:53 pm

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 47):
I have to disappoint you, PHX Flyer, unlike companies based in Wilmington DE, who usually have a mail box there,

Deutsche Lufthansa AG
Von-Gablenz-Str. 2-6
500679 Koeln

YOu would not disappoint me, fit it were only true, alas it's not. I do not dispute that Lufthansa's legal address is in Cologne. Let's agree that we have a different view of what headquarters are. The last CEO who had an office in Cologne, was Mr. Ruhnau, who retired in 1991. The building at the above address was completely abandoned by Lufthansa years ago. It is undergoing a makeover right now, and will become the new (true) Worldwide Headquarters of Lanxxess in 2013. The CEO, the executive board and all administrative company departments reside in FRA, close to 2,000 employees total In order to keep a minimal presence in Cologne, Lufthansa keeps subdivisions of some departments at a new smaller nondescript office building across from the trade-fair center, with a total of 600 employees.

In any case, I am happy that Cologne plays a bigger role again within the LH corporate structure, even tough nothing will really change for now, except that they'll put another office container next to the already existing Germanwings.

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