aio86
Posts: 910
Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2000 12:16 pm

Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Wed Oct 18, 2000 10:21 am

Ok, here's my question...
American's big hub and base is at Dallas-Ft. Worth although I know that they have a lot more European flights from Chicago and more Latin American flights from Miami but I think that Dallas should still be important to them. So why do they fly their great 777s to London-Gatwick? Why not heathrow? Send Miami or some other destination to Gatwick, Heathrow's slots are too valuable. How about a smaller market like Boston or (as previously mentioned) Miami. Is it because the only other airline to Dallas from London is on BA and that flight is to LGW and it is the only airport that there is no competition with the Heathrow route. Wow did I just answer my own question or am I totally wrong and stupid?
Thanks,
Aaron
 
User avatar
RayChuang
Posts: 8024
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2000 7:43 am

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Wed Oct 18, 2000 10:25 am

The reason is due to the Bermuda II agreement on trans-Atlantic operations.

I believe the only airlines that can fly from London-Heathrow (LHR) to the USA are UA, DL, BA and VS. If they ever build Terminal 5 at LHR I think we may see both AA and CO get landing slots at LHR.
 
aio86
Posts: 910
Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2000 12:16 pm

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Wed Oct 18, 2000 10:30 am

Sorry umm, no American is one of the four airlines included in that. Delta does not have permission to fly to Heathrow. American flies there from LAX, SFO (I think), Chicago, New York JFK, New York Newark, Miami, Boston and Washington DC Dulles. Dallas is the only place they don't fly from the US to Heathrow.
-Aaron
 
Mitchell Gant
Posts: 233
Joined: Sun Aug 20, 2000 12:38 am

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Wed Oct 18, 2000 10:32 am

The Bermuda II treaty does not allow service from Heathrow to DFW. DFW can only be served from LGW, this goes for as well as IAH, BWI, MCO, etc.
 
FLY777UAL
Posts: 4830
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 3:49 am

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Wed Oct 18, 2000 10:32 am

Actually, the only airlines allowed to operate from the United States to London Heathrow are BA, AA, UA, and VS. AA aquired their landing rights through TWA in '91, as did UA from Pan Am.

Bermuda II also provides for only a certain number of cities which can have non-stop Heathrow service, of which the cities of Dallas/Ft. Worth were not included (I'll try to find a complete list). That is why DFW (and PHX, DEN, CLT, etc.) cannot have non-stop LHR flights.

F L Y 7 7 7 U A L
 
blink182
Posts: 5280
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 1999 3:09 am

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Wed Oct 18, 2000 11:23 am

AA also flies from RDU-LGW, and I think two or more other cities have flights to LGW by AA since they have 7(or 6) flights a day to LGW and DFW and RDU combined are 3 flights.
blink182
Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...
 
modesto2
Posts: 2681
Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2000 3:44 am

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Wed Oct 18, 2000 11:46 am

American doesn't fly internationally out of SFO.
 
Guest

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Wed Oct 18, 2000 12:25 pm

As stated earlier, AA, BA, VS, and UA are the "Heathrow Four."

Only 8 cities are allowed service to Heathrow (non-stop or otherwise) per Bermuda II: New York, Boston, Miami, Chicago, LA, SF, Washington, and Seattle.

All others have to serve Gatwick or Stansted
 
aio86
Posts: 910
Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2000 12:16 pm

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Wed Oct 18, 2000 12:45 pm

Whoa, so does that mean that United is going to be starting their first service to Gatwick soon? They're starting Denver-London service, I asummed to heathrow but I guess I was wrong, as usual. Thanks for responding, if there's anything else important please mention it.
-Aaron
 
B747-437B
Posts: 8777
Joined: Thu May 30, 2002 6:54 am

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Wed Oct 18, 2000 12:50 pm

Actually, the ELEVEN airports allowed non-stop service to LHR under Bermuda II are :

BOS
JFK
EWR
MIA
PHL
SEA
DTW
SEA
LAX
SFO
ORD
"The A340-300 may boast a long range, but the A340 is underpowered" -- Robert Milton, CEO - Air Canada
 
imkeww
Posts: 676
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2001 1:48 am

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Wed Oct 18, 2000 12:52 pm

AA does not fly IAD-LHR. UA fly that route 3x daily, 4x in the summer.

-keww
 
mls515
Posts: 2954
Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2000 5:56 am

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Wed Oct 18, 2000 12:55 pm

B747-437B,

You have SEA listed twice. What is the other mystery airport?
 
fjnovak1
Posts: 574
Joined: Wed Apr 05, 2000 2:23 am

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Wed Oct 18, 2000 1:14 pm

It is DEN, I think
Go Blue!!
 
aa61hvy
Posts: 13021
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 1999 9:21 am

Blink182/RDU/LGW

Thu Oct 19, 2000 9:15 am

I figure i should add this to blinks post...AA's RDU-LGW originates im DFW,with a 767-200...not sure the load though on that route
Go big or go home
 
sn330
Posts: 606
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 7:01 pm

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Thu Oct 19, 2000 10:53 am

I don't think the missing city would be Denver. Why would BA serve it from LGW if it could from LHR. Also, DFW and IAH are much larger airports with much larger populations than DEN, as well as having continuous nonstop London services since the 70's when BCAL started to fly them. Trust me, Denver IS DEFINITELY NOT one of cities allowed by the Bermuda II agreement; IAH or DFW would have higher priority on getting on that exclusive list. There might not even be a missing city; there might be really 10, and SEA twice is a misprint.
 
Mitchell Gant
Posts: 233
Joined: Sun Aug 20, 2000 12:38 am

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Thu Oct 19, 2000 11:12 am

The missing city is Washington Dulles IAD.
 
jderden777
Posts: 1677
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2000 9:56 am

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Thu Oct 19, 2000 11:17 am

this is kinda off topic, but why are there so many international airlines at IAH (i.e. AF, KLM) rather than DFW. yes, houston may be a larger city than Dallas, but is houston bigger than dallas and fort worth combined??? I would think that DFW would have more int'l traffic. anyone else agree?? blink182 do you have any comments on this???

jderden777
"my soul is in the sky" - shakespeare
 
Guest

RE: Why Are AA's DFW Flights To Lgw?

Thu Oct 19, 2000 11:21 am

I would guess Houston gets more because of the Oil industry, NASA, and it's a major shipping port.

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