FlyASAGuy2005
Topic Author
Posts: 3965
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:55 am

Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:14 am

I was just watching a news reel (actually an internal promo) featuring RA and Brad Tilden on the "big" DL/AS announcement.

Anyway, one interesting comment that Richard made was "Going east we have, with our alliance partners, non-stop service to Paris, Amsterdam; and we hope in the near future to add London..."

What do you make of this?

[Edited 2012-10-11 21:23:12]

[Edited 2012-10-11 21:33:42]
What gets measured gets done.
 
User avatar
pu
Posts: 1359
Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:08 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:25 am

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Thread starter):
What do you make of this?

I make of it Delta is advancing their market in new and arguably innovative ways while UA, AA and US are spending resources (and losing YEARS in time) peeocupied with their own problems and the s-l-o-w bankruptcy process.

Hitting at London now is smart while AA teters in chaos and from a market weak for AA anyway. London remains the big prize in Europe and Delta is slowly, slowly, making inroads. BA will keep their large Indian customer base transiting Heathrow for America, but now Delta captures a wonderful market in SEA going to Europe. LAX-LHR on the radar?

Pu

[Edited 2012-10-11 21:28:35]
 
roseflyer
Posts: 9606
Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2004 9:34 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:46 am

Northwest tried but did not do that well with poor times. I do think a DL 763 should work based on O/D. AS already codeshares with BA so DL is looking for local traffic.
If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
 
User avatar
pu
Posts: 1359
Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:08 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:55 am

Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 2):
AS already codeshares with BA

Amazing.
If I was unkind I might say AS is the whore of the industry, selling themselves to all comers. But they are sitting pretty and IMO can consider only WN as posessing management in their league.

Pu
 
FlyASAGuy2005
Topic Author
Posts: 3965
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:55 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:58 am

Quoting pu (Reply 3):
Amazing.
If I was unkind I might say AS is the whore of the industry, selling themselves to all comers. But they are sitting pretty and IMO can consider only WN as posessing management in their league.

Pu

Well, it's been said before that AS is a codeshare whore...

It's a good thing though. That's how they do what they do so well. And why I think they will remain an independent entity.
What gets measured gets done.
 
User avatar
pu
Posts: 1359
Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2011 1:08 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 5:24 am

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 4):
And why I think they will remain an independent entity.

I was going to open the door to this subtopic, but I don't much value the regular and baseless gossip about who will buy AS and didn't want to steer the thread towards fantasy and speculation. But we'd have to say Delta is now (or will be soon) the closest of all Alaska's girlfriends, agree?
.
...and given that most of us marry the closest of all our suitors, this seems a case study in how to organise a trial marriage.

Hostile takeovers don't seem to be work in the airline industry, so it becomes a question of:
a. how well this endeavor works out for both parties, and
b. If Alaska's boardmembers, like all men, have a price they cannot refuse

...but disaster comes fast to those who overpay...


Pu
 
User avatar
EA CO AS
Posts: 13503
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 8:54 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 5:58 am

Quoting pu (Reply 5):
we'd have to say Delta is now (or will be soon) the closest of all Alaska's girlfriends, agree?
.

Disagree. Both codeshare to the same degree with AS (literally, the codeshare enplanements and markets served are nearly the same size for DL and AA) and AS has stated they wish to strengthen their alliance with AA; it's just become more difficult due to their bankruptcy disrupting normal operations there.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
Yukon880
Posts: 156
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2011 7:26 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 6:25 am

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 6):
...and AS has stated they wish to strengthen their alliance with AA; it's just become more difficult due to their bankruptcy disrupting normal operations there.

How convenient for DL though, no?
Pratt & Whitney, In thrust we trust!
 
FlyASAGuy2005
Topic Author
Posts: 3965
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:55 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 6:48 am

Quoting Yukon880 (Reply 7):
How convenient for DL though, no?

I mean really, looking at the press release video, AS's presence seemed sort of out of place if nothing more than DL trying to stick it to American.
What gets measured gets done.
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 3285
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2004 7:30 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 6:55 am

Slots on the lhr end?
 
jfk777
Posts: 5868
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 12:07 pm

Quoting pu (Reply 1):
Hitting at London now is smart while AA teters in chaos and from a market weak for AA anyway. London remains the big prize in Europe and Delta is slowly, slowly, making inroads. BA will keep their large Indian customer base transiting Heathrow for America, but now Delta captures a wonderful market in SEA going to Europe. LAX-LHR on the radar?

While Seattle to LHR would be a good route for DL to start since BA owns it alone, Pan AM used to fly it daily with a 747. DL is an anchor arline offering flights over both Oceans at SEA which has never happened before.

LAX to LHR is another matter for DL since four airline from the UK & USA fly it with up 7 flights daily. ANZ also flies it daily as part of Auckland to LHR. Delta would be better using an additional LHR slot for another JFK or Atlanta flight.
 
User avatar
EA CO AS
Posts: 13503
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 8:54 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 12:19 pm

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 8):
AS's presence seemed sort of out of place if nothing more than DL trying to stick it to American.

No, it's more about getting DOT approval by saying, "Lookee here, we've got ourselves a strong local partner in SEA who will also funnel traffic to/from our flights all over the PNW and West Coast."
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
delta2ual
Posts: 558
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 11:18 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 1:29 pm

Don't AS Board Room members have access to all DL Skyclubs? I don't think they have the same access to AA Admirals Lounge. That must be a big selling point for AS FF's with club membership, IMO.
From the world's largest airline-to the world's largest airline. Delta2ual
 
neveragain
Posts: 466
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:59 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:01 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 10):
While Seattle to LHR would be a good route for DL to start since BA owns it alone, Pan AM used to fly it daily with a 747.

Always a good rationale for opening a new route! Perhaps in their statistical analyses, the Delta network planners use a dummy variable, 0=Was served by Pan Am; 1=Was not served by Pan Am. Maybe they also have a variable for number of TATL 757 flights operated by UA.
 
User avatar
mayor
Posts: 6188
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:58 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:17 pm

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 11):
No, it's more about getting DOT approval by saying, "Lookee here, we've got ourselves a strong local partner in SEA who will also funnel traffic to/from our flights all over the PNW and West Coast."

Except that the DOT has said, in the original SEA-HND route case, that merely having a codeshare, with no control over the flights and schedules of the partner, is not a reason to award the route. Wouldn't that also apply to SEA-LHR?
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
LAXintl
Posts: 20183
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:23 pm

A SEA-LHR would not require any DOT approvals. Its an open-skies market. Simply need the appropriate slot at the other end.

For comments about LAX-LHR, Delta essentially already has flown this route recently. Air France tried it part of the JV back in 2008-9.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
User avatar
mayor
Posts: 6188
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:58 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:28 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 15):
A SEA-LHR would not require any DOT approvals. Its an open-skies market. Simply need the appropriate slot at the other end.

Oops.....forgot about that.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 15326
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:49 pm

What has changed since the last time they flew SEALHR that would fill up the plane this time?
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 4460
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:03 pm

Because it was so successful for NW the last time around?

Quoting pu (Reply 1):
from a market weak for AA anyway.

LHR is not a weak market for AA.
It is what it is...
 
bobnwa
Posts: 4473
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2000 12:10 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:05 pm

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 17):

Favorable slot times in at LHR will help fill up the plane this time
 
hatbutton
Posts: 275
Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 11:39 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:05 pm

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 4):
Well, it's been said before that AS is a codeshare whore...

I get the reference, because AS chooses to hang with anyone no matter what alliance they are in. But if you are a codeshare whore for the total number of codeshares you have then AS is no less so than any airline in a major alliance. AS has 15 airline partners whereas there are 28 in Star and 18 in Skyteam.
 
deltal1011man
Posts: 4721
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 9:17 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:11 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 15):

For comments about LAX-LHR, Delta essentially already has flown this route recently. Air France tried it part of the JV back in 2008-9.

and if it were to be done again it would benefit from the smaller aircraft Delta used. IMO the AF 777 on LAX-LHR was....a terrible idea.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 17):

hopefully better slot times and a smaller aircraft.
New airliners.net web site sucks.
 
steex
Posts: 1331
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:45 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:15 pm

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 17):
What has changed since the last time they flew SEALHR that would fill up the plane this time?

Presumably, if Delta actually goes through with it, the schedule will be improved. The original schedule was as follows:

NW 105 LHR 18:30 SEA 20:55
NW 106 SEA 22:20 LHR 16:15+1

This left almost no time for connection onto AS by the time NW 105 arrived from LHR and passengers went through customs. Additionally, the eastbound flight was considerably later than most people desired, not getting into London until late afternoon. The poor times and connectivity left the route to sink or swim as primarily an O&D route against a strong incumbent who offered superior AS connectivity (not to mention beyond-LHR connections) with a better schedule, a pretty tough task.

By comparison, here is BA's schedule on the route:

BA 49 LHR 15:10 SEA 16:40
BA 48 SEA 18:55 LHR 12:00+1

Obviously, much more sensible. The BA 49 arrival allows ample time to connect to most AS evening flights, and the BA 48 schedule still essentially allows a full work day in Seattle while arriving into London 4+ hours sooner. A better schedule for Delta won't solve the fact that BA is entrenched and offers beyond-LHR connectivity, but it at least would give them a much better shot.
 
eva777sea
Posts: 313
Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2006 9:16 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 4:29 pm

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 18):

Because it was so successful for NW the last time around?

One thing to note is that back when NW tried it BA was running 13x to 14x weekly frequency year round going as high as 14x744 weekly during the summer. Ever since the great recession they have been running 7x744 weekly. Capacity on the route is down, and as noted above, NW used a horrible schedule. I think DL at least has a shot of making it work with a 763. Capacity on the route would still be down vs 4 or 5 years ago.
 
davescj
Posts: 1105
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2007 1:46 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 5:26 pm

Quoting delta2ual (Reply 12):
Don't AS Board Room members have access to all DL Skyclubs? I don't think they have the same access to AA Admirals Lounge. That must be a big selling point for AS FF's with club membership, IMO.

AS Board Room members get the DL SC when flying on a DL flight.

Dave
Can I have a mojito on this flight?
 
skipness1E
Posts: 3400
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:18 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 6:51 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 15):
Delta essentially already has flown this route recently. Air France tried it part of the JV back in 2008-9.

Not really, Air France had zero market presence from the UK end, something Delta would not be saddled with.
 
burnsie28
Posts: 5042
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2004 1:49 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 7:03 pm

Quoting EVA777SEA (Reply 23):
NW used a horrible schedule.

It's not like they had a choice.
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 3285
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2004 7:30 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 7:19 pm

Quoting Deltal1011man (Reply 21):
and if it were to be done again it would benefit from the smaller aircraft Delta used. IMO the AF 777 on LAX-LHR was....a terrible idea.

Per seat costs will just be higher if they use a smaller plane and there is certainly lots of demand on the route. What would Delta use the A330? It would still bomb the planes were literally almost empty up front every flight they flew. It was a joint venture by both Delta and Air France sold on delta.com listed on every same search engine and site it was to most people a Delta flight already. Delta will not be going back to that market it has been tested and failed miserably so recently. It really was a disaster route no chance of building into the market or anything
 
neveragain
Posts: 466
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:59 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 7:22 pm

Quoting bobnwa (Reply 19):
Favorable slot times in at LHR will help fill up the plane this time
Quoting burnsie28 (Reply 26):
It's not like they had a choice.

"Past performance is no guarantee of future results."
 
burnsie28
Posts: 5042
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2004 1:49 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 8:35 pm

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 27):
What would Delta use the A330?

LHR is all flat bed, so either a 764 (which is typical for LHR) or a modded 763
 
deltal1011man
Posts: 4721
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 9:17 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 9:01 pm

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 27):
Per seat costs will just be higher if they use a smaller plane and there is certainly lots of demand on the route.

*sigh* If what you say is true then Delta would start nearly every new route with a 777/333 or 744.

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 27):
What would Delta use the A330?

763

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 27):
Delta will not be going back to that market it has been tested and failed miserably so recently. It really was a disaster route no chance of building into the market or anything

Well Good news is if say the wont they likely will. You clearly have NO idea whats going on with Delta in LA. You have also said they wouldn't start SFO/PHX/LAS/SMF/SAN and that they would all quickly fail.

Quoting slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 27):
It was a joint venture by both Delta and Air France sold on delta.com listed on every same search engine and site it was to most people a Delta flight already.

not really. It was a very early JV route. DL/AF didn't have near the close relationship they have now.
New airliners.net web site sucks.
 
rwsea
Posts: 2423
Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2005 2:23 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 9:10 pm

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 17):
What has changed since the last time they flew SEALHR that would fill up the plane this time?

- better slot times, with connecting options on both ends
- BA has cut capacity on the SEA route
- DL now has a much larger international presence in SEA (NW only operated to NRT and AMS)
- DL is running a smaller plane (NW flew the 332)
- The flat-bed product is more on par with what BA offers, compared to NW's A332
- The economy in the US is improving again
 
BoeingGuy
Posts: 3949
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:01 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:09 pm

Quoting rwsea (Reply 31):
BA has cut capacity on the SEA route

BA has used a 744 or occasionaly a 777 on the route. How have the cut capacity to SEA?

If DL could get the LHR slots, would they start both SEA and SLC? They already do their other hubs/focus cities to LHR (except for MEM and CVG) so I could see these two if they wanted to expand LHR service.

What about DL starting PDX-LHR, or would they first do PDX-CDG if they wanted a second PDX to Europe flight?
 
User avatar
mayor
Posts: 6188
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:58 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:19 pm

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 32):

If DL could get the LHR slots, would they start both SEA and SLC?

I doubt it........I heard a rumor when last in SLC that DL is thinking of dropping the SLC-CDG flight and making SLC a strictly domestic hub.


About the same time that AA got BNA-LHR and RDU-LHR, DL was hoping to get a London route out of SLC, but it wasn't to be.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
steex
Posts: 1331
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:45 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:55 pm

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 32):
BA has used a 744 or occasionaly a 777 on the route. How have the cut capacity to SEA?

See:
Quoting EVA777SEA (Reply 23):
One thing to note is that back when NW tried it BA was running 13x to 14x weekly frequency year round going as high as 14x744 weekly during the summer. Ever since the great recession they have been running 7x744 weekly.
 
jfk777
Posts: 5868
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Fri Oct 12, 2012 11:50 pm

Quoting neveragain (Reply 13):
Always a good rationale for opening a new route! Perhaps in their statistical analyses, the Delta network planners use a dummy variable, 0=Was served by Pan Am; 1=Was not served by Pan Am. Maybe they also have a variable for number of TATL 757 flights operated by UA.

I didn't say PA made money on the route, but people in Seattle did get a 747 with daily nonstops to LHR at a time when European flights from SEA were limited, remember SAS at SEA.
 
BoeingGuy
Posts: 3949
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:01 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 12:28 am

Quoting mayor (Reply 33):
I doubt it........I heard a rumor when last in SLC that DL is thinking of dropping the SLC-CDG flight and making SLC a strictly domestic hub.

Really? I thought the SLC-CDG flight did very well. That's what others on A.net have indicated.
 
questions
Posts: 1149
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2011 4:51 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 12:33 am

767s... 330s... all this talk... on which routes is DL using its 777s?
 
delta2ual
Posts: 558
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 11:18 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 12:43 am

Quoting davescj (Reply 24):
AS Board Room members get the DL SC when flying on a DL flight.

Or on an AS flight:

"Delta Sky Club

Board Room members must have a valid ticket for same day travel on Alaska Airlines or Delta Air Lines."

Taken from AS website:
http://www.alaskaair.com/content/gif...boardroom-locations-and-hours.aspx
From the world's largest airline-to the world's largest airline. Delta2ual
 
Sancho99504
Posts: 262
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2005 2:44 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 12:49 am

Quoting questions (Reply 37):

Sin, syd, dxb, Los, jnb, nrt,
kill 'em all and let God sort 'em out-USMC
 
dlramp4life
Posts: 996
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2011 6:23 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 12:51 am

Quoting questions (Reply 37):
767s... 330s... all this talk... on which routes is DL using its 777s?

Indeed... Don't hear anything about the 777s

So if SEA-LHR happens, what LHR or 763ER route is getting screwed or equipment swap.?
SEA Ramp, wettest place on earth
 
User avatar
mayor
Posts: 6188
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:58 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 1:07 am

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 36):

Really? I thought the SLC-CDG flight did very well. That's what others on A.net have indicated.

That's what I thought, too. However, at this point, it's still a rumor.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
User avatar
RWA380
Posts: 4475
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 1:08 am

Quoting steex (Reply 22):
Obviously, much more sensible. The BA 49 arrival allows ample time to connect to most AS evening flights, and the BA 48 schedule still essentially allows a full work day in Seattle while arriving into London 4+ hours sooner. A better schedule for Delta won't solve the fact that BA is entrenched and offers beyond-LHR connectivity, but it at least would give them a much better shot

Yes with BA has connectivity with AS in SEA and their network at LHR, DL with AS in SEA and Skyteam at LHR. Maybe their improved relationship with AS will benefit DL/AS vs BA/AS.

Quoting steex (Reply 22):
Presumably, if Delta actually goes through with it, the schedule will be improved. The original schedule was as follows:

NW 105 LHR 18:30 SEA 20:55
NW 106 SEA 22:20 LHR 16:15+1

Yes there seems to be very few AS markets one could connect to from LHR, with that old NW schedule, but great connecting opportunities on the outbound.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 32):
What about DL starting PDX-LHR, or would they first do PDX-CDG if they wanted a second PDX to Europe flight?

I have my doubts that PDX could support another daily n/s to Europe, but if DL did, I'd guess LHR would be better O/D but CDG more connecting opportunities, most of which could likely be reached via AMS however.
Next Flights: PDX-HNL-OGG-LIH-PDX On AS, WP & HA
 
deltal1011man
Posts: 4721
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 9:17 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 2:44 am

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 32):
If DL could get the LHR slots, would they start both SEA and SLC? They already do their other hubs/focus cities to LHR (except for MEM and CVG) so I could see these two if they wanted to expand LHR service.

No. SLC will see AMS before London I believe. IF Delta will start a new Western US route to LHR it will be LAX (after SEA that is)

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 32):
BA has used a 744 or occasionaly a 777 on the route. How have the cut capacity to SEA?

down from mostly 2x daily(sometimes 13x weekly) to a single flight.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 32):
What about DL starting PDX-LHR, or would they first do PDX-CDG if they wanted a second PDX to Europe flight?

Same boat as SLC but flip flop it. CDG will happen before London.

Quoting mayor (Reply 33):
I heard a rumor when last in SLC that DL is thinking of dropping the SLC-CDG flight and making SLC a strictly domestic hub.

I wouldn't count on this. I do believe SLC is still paying Delta for its CDG flights.

Quoting questions (Reply 37):

ATL-DXB
ATL-JNB
LAX-SYD
LAX-NRT
DTW-PVG
DTW-PEK
DTW-ICN
MSP-NRT
and the 777LRs are going into PSV checks this winter.

Quoting dlramp4life (Reply 40):
So if SEA-LHR happens, what LHR or 763ER route is getting screwed or equipment swap.?

why would anything get changed? 767 mods are really about to start up. Delta would have more than enough to start the route in S13 or S14.
New airliners.net web site sucks.
 
Context
Posts: 41
Joined: Wed Jul 08, 2009 1:49 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 3:33 am

Indeed, according to the Port Of Seattle BA's performance MOM for July 2012 is +3.16% and YOY +15.23% which is healthy growth for any route and may indicate room for competition as I've previously suggested. I think the question is not whether SEA can support another daily service to LHR but whether DL has more profitable places to send a long-haul A/C.

Quoting steex (Reply 22):
Additionally, the eastbound flight was considerably later than most people desired, not getting into London until late afternoon. The poor times and connectivity left the route to sink or swim as primarily an O&D route against a strong incumbent who offered superior AS connectivity (not to mention beyond-LHR connections) with a better schedule, a pretty tough task.

I think you're right that this IS a route targeted at O&D which is probably not entirely the case of the BA flight which offers OW's only non-stop to the European network. We already have a well established schedule to AMS which affords similar connections to Europe for ST as LHR does for BA and OW.

Thought I'd also add that the Port Of Seattle statistics report +4.65% YOY for total enplaned and deplaned pax. We've had a lot of new service to different european locations so it's a reasonable question if pax are simply reaching their destinations by routes other than LHR. Looks like their is modest growth in European travel generally. Thoughts?

[Edited 2012-10-12 20:46:54]
 
neveragain
Posts: 466
Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:59 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 2:03 pm

Quoting context (Reply 44):
I think you're right that this IS a route targeted at O&D which is probably not entirely the case of the BA flight which offers OW's only non-stop to the European network.

With connections on the SEA end instead of LHR, it'd be no less targeted at O&D than the BA flight. Granted, the connections that BA is able to offer are probably more profitable.

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 36):
Really? I thought the SLC-CDG flight did very well. That's what others on A.net have indicated.

Well that settles it then! I doubt people who have access to the profitability metrics would post here; all that would be posted here would be load factor information, and I think most people understand that load factor is not the best indicator of profitability. I'd honestly be surprised if it was that profitable, as the O&D base is low, and due to SLC's western location, DL is competing for connecting passengers with essentially every route from the U.S. to Paris. The only thing unique DL would be offering is a 1-stop, same-airline connection for those who don't have the option otherwise, but I doubt the market from SGU or TWF to CDG is that big. Then again, I don't have access to the information.
 
roseflyer
Posts: 9606
Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2004 9:34 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 4:14 pm

Quoting dlramp4life (Reply 40):

So if SEA-LHR happens, what LHR or 763ER route is getting screwed or equipment swap.?

DL has a lot of flexibility in the 763ER fleet. They had relatively low utilization last summer, so I don't think it is certain that any route would get cut to support the SEA-PVG and SEA-LHR additions.
If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
 
User avatar
seabosdca
Posts: 4991
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2007 8:33 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 4:29 pm

Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 46):
DL has a lot of flexibility in the 763ER fleet. They had relatively low utilization last summer, so I don't think it is certain that any route would get cut to support the SEA-PVG and SEA-LHR additions.

   Once the mods are done, they should be able to add several daily 763ER roundtrips without any trouble.
 
MSPNWA
Posts: 1812
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 2:48 am

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 5:57 pm

Quoting context (Reply 44):
I think the question is not whether SEA can support another daily service to LHR but whether DL has more profitable places to send a long-haul A/C.

I believe the question is still whether or not SEA can support another LHR flight. For example it would be the smallest U.S. metro area with competition to LHR (and the smallest to offer more than one flight daily), and overall capacity would be very high for its size. In other words, A DL flight would turn SEA-LHR from very well-served to a statistical anomaly. I can't imagine there being money to be made on SEA-LHR.
 
Prost
Posts: 1891
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 6:23 pm

RE: Delta's Richard Anderson Hinting On SEA-LHR

Sat Oct 13, 2012 6:17 pm

Quoting MSPNWA (Reply 48):
In other words, A DL flight would turn SEA-LHR from very well-served to a statistical anomaly. I can't imagine there being money to be made on SEA-LHR.

I think we can all agree that British Airways is a strong competitor, but I think that there might be room for DL on this route as well. There are a lot of Skymiles and Alaska Air mileage partner plan member in Seattle, and if DL can sweeten the pot for AS mileage plan members to choose DL va. BA, that might help.

I'm curious what effect EK SEA-DXB has had on all trans Atlantic routes out of SEA. Have they taken most of the Indian sub-continent traffic away that used to connect in LHR, FRA,AMS, and CDG?

As SEA-LHR would fall under the DL/AF/KL joint venture, I would hope KL or AF would have a desirable slot at LHR they'd let DL use for the route that would have more desirable times then when NW operated the route.

Also, SEA seems to be an anomaly to most cities its size in regards to international routes served. I can't think of another city it's size that isn't a full on hub that has its depth and breadth of international routes served, at least in the US.