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enilria
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CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 2:06 pm

It will be interesting to see if this means that service to ATL ends for these cities because if it continues and the code share is not active, the Atlanta service will be empty.

"Our April 2013 schedule, to be published next week, will reflect four more AirTran city conversions at Charlotte, North Carolina; Flint, Michigan; Portland, Maine; and Rochester, New York."
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/southw...ports-third-quarter-104500398.html
 
Flytravel
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 2:18 pm

I assume CLT, PWM and ROC will have the BWI service transition to WN. And, FNT might gain BWI service. So remaining also is CAK which I assume might gain BWI service, linking BWI to all WN markets within 500 miles that are not driveable within 4 hours. On the edge of that range is Pittsburgh that is 4.5 hours, and Norfolk that is also 4.5 hours, where I wonder if WN will transition to more ATL service over BWI service for those markets.
 
AWACSooner
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 2:49 pm

DAY is still without WN BWI service
 
Cubsrule
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 2:56 pm

Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
It will be interesting to see if this means that service to ATL ends for these cities because if it continues and the code share is not active, the Atlanta service will be empty.

From the publicly-available data, it does not seem that CLT-ATL is a great performer, and the lack of connections on the ATL end will just worsen the picture. A combination of BNA/TPA/MDW/BWI or some such would cover most of the connections available over ATL, thoguh.
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RL757PVD
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 3:13 pm

For PWM I can see something like:

4x BWI
1x MCO

Maybe drop 1 BWI for 2 MDW if they are lucky

ROC I can see:

4x BWI
2x MDW
1x MCO
1x TPA

Perhaps loss of ATL in leu of better BWI/MDW
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 3:14 pm

Quoting AWACSooner (Reply 2):
DAY is still without WN BWI service

I wonder if the premium seating is why DAY is still FL...There is a lot of business traffic between DAY and BWI.
 
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enilria
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 3:19 pm

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 3):
Quoting enilria (Thread starter):
It will be interesting to see if this means that service to ATL ends for these cities because if it continues and the code share is not active, the Atlanta service will be empty.

From the publicly-available data, it does not seem that CLT-ATL is a great performer, and the lack of connections on the ATL end will just worsen the picture. A combination of BNA/TPA/MDW/BWI or some such would cover most of the connections available over ATL, thoguh.

I don't doubt it goes away, but BNA will be crappy. Maybe HOU?

What does FNT get? MDW? I don't think that would work. BWI/Florida offers no West.
 
Cubsrule
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 3:27 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 6):
but BNA will be crappy.

Why? BNA-RDU does fine.

Quoting enilria (Reply 6):
What does FNT get? MDW? I don't think that would work. BWI/Florida offers no West.

Much like ORF-BWI, FNT-MDW isn't that long as the crow flies but it's not a fun drive because there's a body of water in the middle, so it might be all right.
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 3:29 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 6):
What does FNT get? MDW? I don't think that would work. BWI/Florida offers no West.

How about FNT-BNA? There's at least likely to be some local O&D traffic related to the auto industry.
 
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 5:04 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 6):
What does FNT get? MDW? I don't think that would work. BWI/Florida offers no West.

That would be my guess - FNT will likely keep ATL and get something like 2x MDW.

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 7):

Much like ORF-BWI, FNT-MDW isn't that long as the crow flies but it's not a fun drive because there's a body of water in the middle, so it might be all right.

FNT will almost certainly get MDW. Yes, for some O&D but also for the connecting options it opens up to the network.

Quoting AVLAirlineFreq (Reply 8):
How about FNT-BNA? There's at least likely to be some local O&D traffic related to the auto industry.

No, not really for FNT. FNT itself is a GM plant town, a shell of what it once was. That being said the automotive related air traffic is going into DTW.

FNT is a draw is for the northern suburbs, and the Mid-Michigan area, including a lot of traffic from the MBS and LAN catchment areas because of the lower fares.
Due to the location of Chrysler's HQ FNT is a viable option, but not really so for Ford, GM or Toyota and most suppliers which are closer to DTW. However Chrysler does not have many ties to the Nashville area.

WN is not going to start BNA-FNT.
 
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enilria
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 5:44 pm

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 7):
Quoting enilria (Reply 6):
but BNA will be crappy.

Why? BNA-RDU does fine.

It's had two carriers before and it didn't last. It's just not a market that will respond well to fare stimulation. Neither is a very sexy destination to interest travelers.

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 7):
FNT-MDW isn't that long as the crow flies but it's not a fun drive because there's a body of water in the middle, so it might be all right.

Well, the water isn't exactly in the middle. It's not that far out of the way. It's not like MKE.

Quoting AVLAirlineFreq (Reply 8):
How about FNT-BNA? There's at least likely to be some local O&D traffic related to the auto industry.

Nope.

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 9):
That would be my guess - FNT will likely keep ATL and get something like 2x MDW.

If it keeps ATL and the code share isn't ready during the booking window (it won't be) it'll be awful. Listening to the conference call Kelly explicitly said that as part of the cutover, ATL would be losing some existing destinations. They didn't say FNT/CLT explicitly, but I think that was implied. Perhaps FNT will get BWI/MDW and Florida. I think as a duplicate of their other area airport it makes little sense.
 
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 5:57 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 10):
It's just not a market that will respond well to fare stimulation.

Why, then, is the BNA-RDU local market 80 percent larger than the BNA-CLT local market? For comparison, MEM-CLT is actually larger than MEM-RDU with similar fare levels.
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knope2001
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 6:05 pm

Of course this is speculative, but I suspect none of those four cities will be connected to Atlanta by Southwest in the new world. (PWM doesn't have ATL service now.)

Charlottle carries almost nothing but connecting feed in ATL -- just a handful or two of locals per flight.

Rochester and Flint have more local traffic to/from ATL, but the AirTran flights to the ATL hub rely heavily on connecting flows beyond Atlanta.

All three of those cities can have their connecting flows served by "better" Southwest hubs...and by "better" I mean that they are either stronger for local traffic, or closer, or both.

Perhaps a better way to look at it is this. If AirTran didn't serve Charlottle, Flint, Portland and Rochester at all, and Southwest decided to come in, what cities in their combined (post-merger WN+FL) network would rank highest for service? If Southwest was to announce Greensboro, Lansing, Burlington and Syracuse were starting this summer, would ATL be high on the list of likely markets? Probably not.

The transition of ATL from a big connecting comlpex to focus primarily on local traffic fits these changes. If you look at the nonstop routes dropped (and not replaced by Southwest) in the past 2 years or so, most of them are somewhat smaller local markets from ATL...BMI, FNT, CHS, MDT, MLI, PHF, BKG, CLT, ROC, SRQ. Historically they relied heavily on connecting feed. Outside of a few...Pensacola, Wichita, Akron, perhaps Raleigh and Dayton...most of the remaining FL or WN markets at Atlanta are large enough local markets to justify nonstops without heavy reliance on connections. And some of those may survive based on special circumstances (like DAY picking up enough metro Cincinnati traffic, or PNS not having a better option to connect to the northern tier of destinations.)
 
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 6:11 pm

Quoting DTW.SCE" class="quote" target="_blank">PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 9):
Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 7):

Much like ORF-BWI, FNT-MDW isn't that long as the crow flies but it's not a fun drive because there's a body of water in the middle, so it might be all right.

FNT will almost certainly get MDW. Yes, for some O&D but also for the connecting options it opens up to the network.

Unfortunately, I think this would cause AA to drop FNT-ORD, so in effect, FNT would be getting WN, but losing AA.

Quoting DTW.SCE" class="quote" target="_blank">PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 9):
FNT is a draw is for the northern suburbs, and the Mid-Michigan area, including a lot of traffic from the MBS and LAN catchment areas because of the lower fares.
Due to the location of Chrysler's HQ FNT is a viable option, but not really so for Ford, GM or Toyota

FNT is an option for GM employees who work in Pontiac and / or live north of Pontiac / Auburn Hills. Even for Birmingham / Bloomfield Hills, the home to gate time is about the same to go to FNT as it is to go to DTW, because although it takes a little longer to drive to FNT, once you get to FNT, it's much quicker to go from your car to the gate because FNT is a more compact airport than DTW.

However, most of the GM / Chrysler / Nissan traffic is locked into Delta because of corporate contracts and / or a preference for flying on DL in order to earn Sky Miles. I don't think WN will be able to take much of this traffic away.
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 6:18 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 10):
Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 7):
FNT-MDW isn't that long as the crow flies but it's not a fun drive because there's a body of water in the middle, so it might be all right.

Well, the water isn't exactly in the middle. It's not that far out of the way. It's not like MKE.

True, but the traffic on the south side of Chicago and in Northwest Indiana is horrendous, in large part because everyone going from cities east / northeast of Chicago to Chicago or cities west / northwest of Chicago has to go around the south end of Lake Michigan.
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 6:30 pm

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 4):
For PWM I can see something like:

4x BWI
1x MCO

As a WAG goes I have a hunch you may see a BOS-PWM. flight. Excluding traffic it's about a 1.5 hour drive.

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 4):
ROC I can see:

4x BWI
2x MDW
1x MCO
1x TPA

You have to keep in mind BUF another WN city is nearby.
Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
 
southwest737500
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 6:45 pm

CLT-MDW
CLT-DEN
CLT-STL

This is great news, well worth the wait

[Edited 2012-10-18 11:49:37]
Next flight: TUL-ATL-CLT CRJ900 and MD88
 
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 6:47 pm

Quoting WA707atMSP (Reply 13):
FNT is an option for GM employees who work in Pontiac and / or live north of Pontiac / Auburn Hills. Even for Birmingham / Bloomfield Hills, the home to gate time is about the same to go to FNT as it is to go to DTW, because although it takes a little longer to drive to FNT, once you get to FNT, it's much quicker to go from your car to the gate because FNT is a more compact airport than DTW.

However, FNT generally is not as desirable when it means a connection versus a nonstop out of DTW.

Quoting enilria (Reply 10):
Perhaps FNT will get BWI/MDW and Florida. I think as a duplicate of their other area airport it makes little sense.

FNT is disproportionately a leisure / low fare airport. I'm not sure of how BWI would be more desirable than ATL service. FNT does not have a lot of ties to the Balt/Wash area. FNT does to a lot of Florida / Sun destinations, which would continue to be better served over ATL.

Quoting WA707atMSP (Reply 14):
True, but the traffic on the south side of Chicago and in Northwest Indiana is horrendous, in large part because everyone going from cities east / northeast of Chicago to Chicago or cities west / northwest of Chicago has to go around the south end of Lake Michigan.

FNT-MDW yes would get some O&D but its opening up the network to points west, not really so much the nonstop service. Driving to Chicago from Southeastern Michigan stinks.
 
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enilria
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 6:54 pm

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 11):
Quoting enilria (Reply 10):
It's just not a market that will respond well to fare stimulation.

Why, then, is the BNA-RDU local market 80 percent larger than the BNA-CLT local market? For comparison, MEM-CLT is actually larger than MEM-RDU with similar fare levels.

Well, one huge difference is that US is flying CLT how many times per day? ...and isn't WN the only carrier flying RDU-BNA? The point is that it would be too much service for a market like BNA-CLT. Doesn't mean they won't do it, but I wouldn't choose it.

Quoting knope2001 (Reply 12):

Of course this is speculative, but I suspect none of those four cities will be connected to Atlanta by Southwest in the new world. (PWM doesn't have ATL service now.)

I thought that was strongly implied in the conference call.

Quoting WA707atMSP (Reply 13):
Unfortunately, I think this would cause AA to drop FNT-ORD, so in effect, FNT would be getting WN, but losing AA.

Perhaps

Quoting southwest737500 (Reply 16):
CLT-MDW
CLT-DEN
CLT-STL

I'd be shocked if there is no Florida non-stop.

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 17):
FNT is disproportionately a leisure / low fare airport. I'm not sure of how BWI would be more desirable than ATL service.

I just don't see them flying FNT-ATL on the WN code with no code share. I'm hearing they picked these cities for cutover because they do not require code share which tells me that none will have ATL service as Knope2001 also suggested.
 
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 6:55 pm

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 15):

I don't see BOS-PWM happening in the near future. American Eagle tried it for a while before the airlines started boosting flights out of PWM (Almost 400,000 more passengers using PWM in the past decade), which is remarkable. Also, note that Amtrak serves multiple daily routes along with Concord buses that go to BOS.
As stated in the other thread, the airport is intensely seeking MCO route (snow birds) as there is a huge demand. I feel BWI, MDW and MCO will be the most reasonable additions to the WN network.
 
Cubsrule
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:11 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 18):
he point is that it would be too much service for a market like BNA-CLT. Doesn't mean they won't do it, but I wouldn't choose it.

Any new WN route from CLT is going to have "too much service," no?
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enilria
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:22 pm

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 20):
Any new WN route from CLT is going to have "too much service," no?

Yes and no. There are a lot of markets that can be stimulated and are high fare. DEN/LAS/MDW/some Florida are all markets that could probably support LCC service. Maybe HOU. I guess I'm talking more about ability to stimulate demand relative to capacity. I just don't think BNA-CLT can be grown that much and has plenty of service. Those other markets I mentioned can be grown more.
 
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:25 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 21):
I just don't think BNA-CLT can be grown that much and has plenty of service.

But you'd agree, wouldn't you, that BNA-CLT can be grown to BNA-RDU levels?

Quoting enilria (Reply 21):
Those other markets I mentioned can be grown more.

Probably so, but yields won't be as good. WN's average fare on BNA-RDU is $0.38/mile. Try getting that to Chicago or Florida, let alone Denver or Las Vegas.
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tjwgrr
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:26 pm

I'm very surprised GRR didn't make this list. So will GRR be the last non WN converted domestic FL station with flights only to BWI (not including FL's Florida routes) with no flights to ATL from GRR?

Hope this isn't a bad omen. We really need to retain a network LCC.
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:32 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 18):

I just don't see them flying FNT-ATL on the WN code with no code share. I'm hearing they picked these cities for cutover because they do not require code share which tells me that none will have ATL service as Knope2001 also suggested.

Oh, I missed that point. Interesting if they do end up dropping ATL.
 
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:42 pm

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 15):
You have to keep in mind BUF another WN city is nearby

BUF is not exactly "nearby" both BUF and ROC serve their own respective markets amd there is no reason whatsoever that ROC can not support 4x BWI 2x MDW 1x TPA and 1x MCO, which is essentially the same air tran schedule but ATL shifted to MDW, and add a BWI.

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 15):
As a WAG goes I have a hunch you may see a BOS-PWM. flight. Excluding traffic it's about a 1.5 hour drive

Not a chance, if BOS was BWI sized then maybe, but BOS only offers a handful of destinations to the WN routemap and is only 15-20 flights per day.
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airliner371
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 8:03 pm

Quoting southwest737500 (Reply 16):
This is great news, well worth the wait

I thought I would say congratulations to you. I was waiting for you to comment.

Quoting enilria (Reply 18):
I'd be shocked if there is no Florida non-stop.

SWA recently ended AirTrans CLT-MCO. Doubt we will see florida service.

Quoting enilria (Reply 18):
I thought that was strongly implied in the conference call.

I wouldn't say strongly if at all.
 
usflyguy
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 8:09 pm

FNT-ATL would only connect to MCO on WN as MCO is the only Florida station served from ATL on WN.
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KingAir200
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 8:31 pm

Quoting tjwgrr (Reply 23):
Hope this isn't a bad omen. We really need to retain a network LCC.

Well I'm sure the KCDA will come up with some ridiculous deal to attract WN. Then, of course, they'll turn around and complain that DL and UA don't offer 744 service...
 
PWMRamper
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 9:16 pm

Glad to see PWM transitioning! Too bad it's right as I'm leaving the airport...

I think MDW is a must. UA has zero competition to Chicago, and WN could clean up there.

BWI will stick, and I think we'll see one MCO flight.

BOS is interesting...I doubt it happens, but if anyone could pull it off, it'd be WN.
 
airliner371
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 9:19 pm

With this their are now just 14 AirTran cities with no SWA service.
 
GentFromAlaska
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 9:21 pm

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 25):
BUF is not exactly "nearby" both BUF and ROC serve their own respective markets

With 55 statute miles separating the two airports ROC & BUF meets the nearby criteria. That's less than a lot of peoples daily commute. What does ROC bring to the table? other than its a little closer to Niagara Falls.

WN serves the BUF market well from both BWI and MDW. I just can't see a repeat at ROC. I think a ATL or a BNA non-stop on WN is more realistic.
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rocANDtpa
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 10:49 pm

Great news for ROC. ROC took a hit in capacity in the fall and winter schedules. DL cut a flight to ATL and to DTW. UA cut two flights to ORD and one to EWR. US cut a previously added flight to CLT. So this is much needed good news for ROC! My predictions for a schedule is:

BWI 3 or 4 daily
MDW 2 daily
MCO 1 or 2 daily
TPA 1 daily
LAS or DEN 1 daily

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 31):

ROC and BUF are two separate markets. ROC has a metro of over a million people. I think ROC and BUF will both support WN service but with less capacity than BUF because ROC is a smaller market. WN adding service to ROC is a win win for ROC because there will no longer be a need to drive to BUF.
 
southwest737500
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:34 pm

For CLT

3X BWI
3X MDW
2X DEN
maybe 1X LAS
2 or 3 BNA
Maybe 1 or 2 HOU or STL
Next flight: TUL-ATL-CLT CRJ900 and MD88
 
airliner371
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:38 pm

Quoting southwest737500 (Reply 33):
For CLT

3X BWI
3X MDW
2X DEN
maybe 1X LAS
2 or 3 BNA
Maybe 1 or 2 HOU or STL

I think that is pretty fair. I think you should be saying 2 or 3 STL and maybe 1 or 2 HOU or BNA though. What we do know is SWA has requested a total of 2 gates in CLT so CLT might start small but it won't stay that small. (I don't mean 50 flights but 15-25 is likely WHEN ALL IS SAID AND DONE)

[Edited 2012-10-18 16:40:16]
 
KarlB737
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 12:07 am

Quoting enilria (Reply 6):
What does FNT get? MDW?
Quoting AVLAirlineFreq (Reply 8):
How about FNT-BNA?
Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 9):
FNT will almost certainly get MDW.

In light of all this discussion I received an EMail from Southwest suggesting I go look at their updated route map. How does what you see on their route map linked below when pointing at FNT fit in this discussion. I suspect that many of the cities noted as destinations by a direct line are not indicating a non-stop out of FNT but rather just destinations from FNT via ATL. Is that your interpretation?

Southwest Airlines - Route Map

http://www.southwest.com/flight/routemap_dyn.html
 
airliner371
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 12:22 am

Quoting KarlB737 (Reply 35):
I suspect that many of the cities noted as destinations by a direct line are not indicating a non-stop out of FNT but rather just destinations from FNT via ATL. Is that your interpretation?

Anytime you hover over an FL city it shows non-stop and connecting cities AirTran serves from the destination.
 
ouboy79
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 1:05 am

Quoting KarlB737 (Reply 35):
In light of all this discussion I received an EMail from Southwest suggesting I go look at their updated route map. How does what you see on their route map linked below when pointing at FNT fit in this discussion. I suspect that many of the cities noted as destinations by a direct line are not indicating a non-stop out of FNT but rather just destinations from FNT via ATL. Is that your interpretation?

It probably won't be updated until Monday morning after the flights are loaded and officially announced.
 
USAirALB
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 2:00 am

As for CLT, I highly doubt we will see Florida service...LCCs have tried CLT-Florida and none of them could make it work. FL has done MCO and B6 has done FLL. US matched fares on their nonstops at similar times. The only other airline that has been able to get Florida to work from CLT is AA.

From CLT, I see:

STL, BWI, MDW, HOU, and possibly DEN. I think they may keep ATL, but who knows. I just don't see WN flying CLT-PHX/LAS.
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MSPNWA
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 4:25 am

CLT is great news for me. I think April will be just in time next year for a trip there.
 
zippyjet
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 4:45 am

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 4):

I'd also throw FLL into that mix.
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GentFromAlaska
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 1:56 pm

Quoting PWMRamper (Reply 29):
BOS is interesting...I doubt it happens, but if anyone could pull it off, it'd be WN.

PWM needs to promote the vast amount of seafood available in PWM to WN such as the Harbor Fish Market and other on or near the custom wharf. By the way which is a short drive to PWM.

Although I think BOS-PWM would be niche market for WN at least seasonally. For a sect of the population PWM 1.5 to 2 hour drive and proximity to BOS might defeat the purpose. By the time a passenger drives to BOS parks, passes through security, waits and boards and flies they, most likely could have drove it in that same amount of time. For the kiss and fly (drop-offs) and the tourism side not so much.
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PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 2:55 pm

Quoting GentFromAlaska (Reply 41):
Although I think BOS-PWM would be niche market for WN at least seasonally. For a sect of the population PWM 1.5 to 2 hour drive and proximity to BOS might defeat the purpose. By the time a passenger drives to BOS parks, passes through security, waits and boards and flies they, most likely could have drove it in that same amount of time. For the kiss and fly (drop-offs) and the tourism side not so much

Does not help there is limited WN connectivity at BOS, they would be better off connecting over a different WN city like BWI that has far more access to the network.
 
MSYtristar
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 3:05 pm

BOS-PWM is way too short of a market for WN to even consider. They have been pulling out of super short hauls as of late as well. BOS-PWM is a short drive via car or bus (90 min car, about 2 hours bus), plus the Amtrak Downeaster has five daily roundtrips which take 2.5 hours. All of those options are more convenient than flying out of Logan. Really happy for PWM, it's a great place.

[Edited 2012-10-19 08:06:28]
 
wnflyguy
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 4:24 pm

I don't see with 4 cities at once coming on line with a lot build up.
I see service at :
CLT. 4 BWI, 2 MDW OR 3 BWI,2 MDW, 1 DEN.
FNT, 2 MDW, 2 BWI
PWM 3 BWI, 1 MDW
ROC, 3 BWI, 2 MDW, OR 1 MDW ,1 DEN.
wnfg  
my post are my opinion only and not those of southwest airlines and or airtran airlines.
 
drerx7
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 5:49 pm

Quoting wnflyguy (Reply 44):
CLT. 4 BWI, 2 MDW OR 3 BWI,2 MDW, 1 DEN.

I hope you mean 2 HOU instead of MDW twice?
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ouboy79
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 6:22 pm

Quoting drerx7 (Reply 45):
I hope you mean 2 HOU instead of MDW twice?

No. He said 4x BWI and 2x MDW -OR- 3x BWI, 2x MDW, and 1x DEN.
 
iowaman
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 6:30 pm

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 43):
BOS-PWM is way too short of a market for WN to even consider. They have been pulling out of super short hauls as of late as well. BOS-PWM is a short drive via car or bus (90 min car, about 2 hours bus), plus the Amtrak Downeaster has five daily roundtrips which take 2.5 hours. All of those options are more convenient than flying out of Logan. Really happy for PWM, it's a great place.

I don't see BOS-PWM happening either. It's only 95 miles by air, much shorter than anything else WN flies. If anybody should fly BOS-PWM it probably should be Cape Air.

Quoting wnflyguy (Reply 44):
I don't see with 4 cities at once coming on line with a lot build up.
I see service at :
CLT. 4 BWI, 2 MDW OR 3 BWI,2 MDW, 1 DEN.
FNT, 2 MDW, 2 BWI
PWM 3 BWI, 1 MDW
ROC, 3 BWI, 2 MDW, OR 1 MDW ,1 DEN.

Yeah I think you hit it pretty well. DSM, DAY, and CAK are previous examples of the emphasis placed on MDW and DEN from former FL stations. These "focus city" stations (MDW, DEN, BWI) are going to see quite the increase in connectivity to new destinations over the next couple years that were previously unreachable in the Southwest network. I will be surprised if RIC/MEM/ICT aren't added from MDW and/or DEN or BWI in the next year as well, followed by CUN and possibly other international FL cities. I don't know if we will see GRR connected to MDW - it is noticeably closer than FNT to MDW and a mile shorter than WN's shortest route, RSW-MCO. Maybe GRR-DEN and/or BWI would be better suited.
 
HPRamper
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 6:33 pm

Quoting USAirALB (Reply 38):
STL, BWI, MDW, HOU, and possibly DEN. I think they may keep ATL, but who knows. I just don't see WN flying CLT-PHX/LAS.

I don't either seeing as CLT will be a very small station and as such WN will want to maximize utilization by funneling everyone through closer hubs, er, megacities. I also think WN starting PHX and LAS would only invite a nuclear response from US and it's just not financially worth it for WN to do that for what would be pretty low-yielding routes. We know MDW and HOU will have no competition for obvious reasons and WN could also easily get away with a DEN and maybe a couple of BWI.
 
Mexicana757
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RE: CLT/FNT/PWM/ROC To WN In April 2013

Fri Oct 19, 2012 7:03 pm

Of the four cities converting to WN from FL I see three being connected to MDW.

MDW-CLT 2x
MDW-ROC 2x
MDW-FNT 2x

PWM will connect to MDW probably with a one stop or connection through BWI.