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SFOA380
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SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:08 pm

This appears in the article about the big SQ order and deserves its own thread...

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stori...pore_business/view/1233225/1/.html
 
Tdan
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:11 pm

This was inevitable. SQ could never figure out how to make these routes work in a high fuel environment and notorious A345 fuel hogs. Sad to see them go from a spotters perspective.
We will ride this thunderbird, silver shadows on the earth, a thousand leagues away our land of birth... -Captain Bruce
 
SonomaFlyer
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:11 pm

The link does not work  
 
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SFOA380
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:15 pm

Sorry--don't know what happened--this one should work

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stori...pore_business/view/1233225/1/.html
 
planemannyc
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:16 pm

 
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STT757
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:18 pm

It's a shame, will they retain EWR services and run it through a Star hub as before (EWR-FRA-SIN).
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
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Stitch
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:23 pm

Quoting Tdan (Reply 1):
SQ could never figure out how to make these routes work in a high fuel environment and notorious A345 fuel hogs.

They made it work for longer than TG did.  

Honestly, I'm not sure the 777-200LR would have saved this route (or TG's). While flight-planning projections I have seen show the 777-200LR burned about 20% less fuel on the mission (at the same payload weight), those projections also showed that the savings worked out to about $20,000 per trip / $15,000,000 per year with a fuel price of $1.95/USG. The current spot price is now $3.19 so while the savings would now be close to $32,000 per trip, the 777-200LR's fuel bill would be higher today then the A340-500's was at the time the original projections were run.

If SQ was filling all 100 seats on the A340-500, then the route still would have been profitable. But clearly they were not, and the route was losing money. So applying the same loads to the 777-200LR would still have generated a loss, just not quite as large, but I believe large enough to warrant closing the service.
 
SonomaFlyer
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:23 pm

Thanks for that SFO. It looks like given the fleet orders by SQ, the only aircraft which could service these routes in the future would be the 359 (which I would assume they ordered). No other a/c in their fleet could operate these routes without significant penalties.

Interesting times ahead. I wonder how this affects the rumor that SQ is negotiating to be the launch customer for the 787-10?
 
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Stitch
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:25 pm

Quoting sonomaflyer (Reply 7):
It looks like given the fleet orders by SQ, the only aircraft which could service these routes in the future would be the 359 (which I would assume they ordered). No other a/c in their fleet could operate these routes without significant penalties.

Well they could add the 777-200LR, but see above.

The 777-8XLR could also be a future option. Not sure how a hypothetical 251t MTOW "787-8LR" would work out...
 
SonomaFlyer
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:32 pm

I don't see a 251t 788 being produced within the foreseeable future. As the 788 program matures, they will trim weight and improve engine efficiency. Perhaps this route could work with an all J class 788 going forward but SQ won't have 787's in their fleet. They are trending Airbus. The lack of a 787 order for SQ tells me they will eventually phase out their 77W's in favor or an Airbus replacement.
 
LondonCity
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:36 pm

It looks as though the news of the ending of these ultra long-haul flights was buried within the new aircraft order announcement.

There is some further analysis in Business Traveller. I chuckled when I read what AF's ex-CEO Pierre-Henri Gourgeon thought of the A340-500s when he described them as "flying fuel tankers with few people on board."

http://www.businesstraveller.com/new...non-stop-flying-to-los-angeles-and
 
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jfklganyc
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:37 pm

Wow!

I was always shocked this was at EWR instead of JFK...but either way the equation (ULH, fewer seats, high fuel) does not make this flight work.

Quite the blow to EWR. I dare say they should ax EWR altogether...how many money losers NYC-FRA do they need? They already run the route from JFK and it is being downgraded from 380 to 777
 
qf002
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:41 pm

This is the sort of route that could have worked 15 years ago. It's just not viable to run these sorts of very long flights any more unless they are connecting really major hubs where the traffic is virtually guaranteed to come.

I am a little disappointed I'll never get a chance to do the flight though, as I doubt we'll see it return until something really major shakes up aviation (ie a completely new concept aircraft).
 
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:48 pm

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 11):
They already run the route from JFK and it is being downgraded from 380 to 777

When the decision was made, EWR was not a star alliance powerhouse. Now it is. LH really should ramp up operations there too, but we know like LHR, ppl outside the US automatically think "go to JFK". That is of course changing and I could see at some point UAL moving the PS shuttle across.... if they did that, they could combine some flights and send widebody aircraft at a few peak times, shuttling them inbetween hubs before they go off intercontinentally at each end, which would give them an advantage over the competition. particularly on the red eye. Even though UAL and singapore are hardly the best of friends, it does give Singapore's loyal star flyers a better connection option, at taps into the massive UAL frequent flyer base in the area much better. I could see a strong business case for SIA sending the smaller 777 to JFK to maintain a presence, and sending the A380 to EWR to maintain volume, get CASM right down, and fill it from UAL's huge connection possibilities. IE - premium class traffic largely headed to NYC, and fill up half of the back with locals and the other half from the UAL network.
 
Newark727
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 2:50 pm

Aww man, I always liked spotting the A340-500, it was like a giant DC-8 Super Seventy. Still, I can't say I'm altogether surprised, it seems like that sort of route+business plan only works for certain city pairs under certain conditions.
 
ORDJOE
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:04 pm

Too bad, I always heard it was filled with, and SQ does not really discount those J seats or give them out as awards, but still even with all the wall street types filling it is still is not enough. This is a blow ULH for sure, so what is the I guess ATL-JNB is now the longest once this ends
 
G500
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:15 pm

I'm hoping SQ will eventually add a second A380 flight SIN-NRT-LAX to make up for the non-stop cancellation

we'll see what happens
 
AirbusA6
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:19 pm

A shame, hopefully the A345s will find a new home, probably as a gorgeous private jet!
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usairways85
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:28 pm

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 11):
Quite the blow to EWR. I dare say they should ax EWR altogether...how many money losers NYC-FRA do they need? They already run the route from JFK and it is being downgraded from 380 to 777

That is likely because LH already serves FRA-JFK/EWR quite well. SQ upping it from a 744 to a A380 was probably way to much capacity.
 
vincewy
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:33 pm

Quoting g500 (Reply 16):
I'm hoping SQ will eventually add a second A380 flight SIN-NRT-LAX to make up for the non-stop cancellation

SQ had in the past LAX-TPE-SIN (night) and LAX-NRT-SIN (day), both dailies. If SQ ever wants to resume redeye from LAX, it should fly through HND, PVG, ICN, or HKG instead. I doubt getting 5th freedom rights from those hubs will be easy.

NH is already flying LAX-HND redeye.
 
avek00
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:36 pm

Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 13):
When the decision was made, EWR was not a star alliance powerhouse. Now it is. LH really should ramp up operations there too, but we know like LHR, ppl outside the US automatically think "go to JFK". That is of course changing and I could see at some point UAL moving the PS shuttle across.... if they did that, they could combine some flights and send widebody aircraft at a few peak times, shuttling them inbetween hubs before they go off intercontinentally at each end, which would give them an advantage over the competition. particularly on the red eye. Even though UAL and singapore are hardly the best of friends, it does give Singapore's loyal star flyers a better connection option, at taps into the massive UAL frequent flyer base in the area much better. I could see a strong business case for SIA sending the smaller 777 to JFK to maintain a presence, and sending the A380 to EWR to maintain volume, get CASM right down, and fill it from UAL's huge connection possibilities. IE - premium class traffic largely headed to NYC, and fill up half of the back with locals and the other half from the UAL network.

1. Newark is not equipped to handle the A380.

2. SQ will almost certainly continue to prioritize connecting traffic over JFK, just as most international carriers that serve both EWR and JFK do.

3. SQ sees the new United (and the new Delta) as major competitve threats to its North American services. The USA carriers have retooled themselves on costs, are leveraging fleet flexibility to unprecedented levels, and have increased premium cabin product quality to levels that are acceptable to business travelers. There's little desire on either side of the Pacific for SQ and UA to work more closely together than the Star Alliance requires.
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Lufthansa
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:41 pm

Quoting AirbusA6 (Reply 17):

A shame, hopefully the A345s will find a new home, probably as a gorgeous private jet!

since it looks like most of the fleet will be dumped, across the globe (i think thai's are parked at don muang?) I wonder if a good role for these aircraft lies with the military, who aren't so concerned about fuel burn?

They could potentially make a very good tanker. They can uplift lots, have lots of range, could be used as a troop transporter as well as a tanker. It's been called by some as a ridicule a 'flying fuel tanker'... so if that's what its good at why not put it to use for that very purpose? Sure its full range will never be needed in this role, but it has the potential to lift lots of very heavy cargo, or refuel lots of jets by uploading vast quantities of fuel, the rest of the A340 program will ensure a steady flow of parts and support (much easier than say, a VC-10 for instance) and they probably can be bought relatively cheaply. The A330 military version allows for a full PAX interior, so make it attractive to governments around the role by saying duel purpose... and fit the front of the cabin with a very nice first class. Therefore when its not needed for air force duties, it can be called on to fly VIP's over long distances (im thinking the British PM for example who politically won't be allowed to buy a dedicated plane for some stupid reason) and of course transport troops. The global fleet of them is relatively small and all the equipment developed for the A330 MRTT probably could easily be applied. And if it isn't politically correct in the west, well, the chinese could probably take 30 of them without too many issues.
 
LAXintl
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:49 pm

These flights have been struggling for a while.

Remember SQ announced it would reintroduce Y+ last March on the A345.
SQ Reintroducing Y Class On A345 US Nonstops... (by hodja Mar 28 2012 in Civil Aviation)

Also for several years now they have been playing with frequency going less then daily for various periods.


Anyhow for fun here is their 2011 load factors on the routes:

EWR
Jan - 77
Feb - 63
Mar - 80
Apr - 61
May - 83
Jun - 78
Jul - 72
Aug - 59
Sep - 76
Oct - 72
Nov - 60
Dec - 60
Average = 70.1%

LAX
Jan - 76
Feb - 74
Mar - 70
Apr - 73
May - 86
Jun - 82
Jul - 77
Aug - 69
Sep - 80
Oct - 81
Nov - 77
Dec - 69
Average = 76.2%

Quoting vincewy (Reply 19):
SQ had in the past LAX-TPE-SIN (night) and LAX-NRT-SIN (day), both dailies. If SQ ever wants to resume redeye from LAX, it should fly through HND, PVG, ICN, or HKG instead. I doubt getting 5th freedom rights from those hubs will be easy.

For LAX, I am sure SQ will resurect its 3rd flight (which would now become the 2nd one).
SQ already holds rights to operate via a host of stops including TPE, ICN, HKG, KIX, etc..
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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Stitch
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:52 pm

Quoting AirbusA6 (Reply 17):
A shame, hopefully the A345s will find a new home, probably as a gorgeous private jet!

Airbus agreed to take them in as trade on the A350+A380 deal. I expect they'll be broken up and sold as OEM spares as the planes are worth far more in pieces than complete.
 
olympic472
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 3:59 pm

Quoting avek00 (Reply 20):
3. SQ sees the new United (and the new Delta) as major competitve threats to its North American services. The USA carriers have retooled themselves on costs, are leveraging fleet flexibility to unprecedented levels, and have increased premium cabin product quality to levels that are acceptable to business travelers. There's little desire on either side of the Pacific for SQ and UA to work more closely together than the Star Alliance requires.

Insightful and well stated.
The "non-cooperation" from scheduling to lounge makes me think that they are in different Alliances.

Reading the posts here and previous posts, there are so many that believed in the SQ KoolAid. This is hardly a surprise if they have flown this sector and understand the numbers.

As previously suggested, they will make good tankers and troop carriers for the RSAF. Despite the fact that they are traded back to Airbus as part of the 380 and 350 deal.

[Edited 2012-10-24 09:05:47]
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Stitch
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:02 pm

Quoting olympic472 (Reply 24):
The "non-cooperation" from scheduling to lounge makes me think that they are in different Alliances.

SQ has always struck me as an airline that considered Star more an alliance of convenience than as an actual strategic alliance.
 
kaitak
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:02 pm

Sad to see, purely from an enthusiasts' perspective; one less airline to fly A345s on and five fewer of the most beautiful aircraft flying today.

 

Not that surprising from an economics perspective.
 
migair54
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:15 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 22):

Actually the load factor of 76% is not bad, but if they can´t manage to make money with that load factor is better to reroute the flight and try to make more money somewhere else. I´m sure they will add a second LAX flight soon, they can´t reduce the high yield seat so drastically, a load factor of 76% using a plane with almost 100 seats is easy to calculate so the pax are there, now they only need to keep them flying with them using 1 stop.
We are talking about a huge number of business class pax, 30 days a month with 76 pax a day is 2.280 pax to LAX a month and 30 day with 70 pax a day is 2.100 pax a month to NYC.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 23):
Airbus agreed to take them in as trade on the A350+A380 deal. I expect they'll be broken up and sold as OEM spares as the planes are worth far more in pieces than complete.

That would make a lot of sense, we all know that an A345 has no value as full plane except for some VIP and still difficult to sell.


What if SQ get the 5 B777LR that AI is trying to sell, could they make it work in this routes??

Quoting olympic472 (Reply 24):
As previously suggested, they will make good tankers and troop carriers for the RSAF.

I think Airbus idea for this issue is offer the A330 MRTT and not the 340 to develop a new version, specially with so few A345 in service.
 
mogandoCI
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:31 pm

Quoting avek00 (Reply 20):
3. SQ sees the new United (and the new Delta) as major competitve threats to its North American services. The USA carriers have retooled themselves on costs, are leveraging fleet flexibility to unprecedented levels, and have increased premium cabin product quality to levels that are acceptable to business travelers. There's little desire on either side of the Pacific for SQ and UA to work more closely together than the Star Alliance requires.

But then again, how many Star carriers are SQ actually working closely with anyway ? The fact that SQ is doing fine even on their 5th freedom segments is a testament to the strength of the SQ brand.

EWR-SIN shutting down is more economic reality than problems at SQ. If 100 all J seats at 90+% load factor (and no cheapo TOD upgrades) can't get it to work, no carrier on earth could. Maybe a 787-9LR could finally make it profitable and sustainable.
 
MadameConcorde
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:40 pm

I think I am going to break with my First to Fly habit this time. I'd really like the idea of being "last to fly" the world's longest route on that final EWR-SIN Singapore Airlines A345 flight.

Seems that it's going to be Q4 of 2013?

I can just imagine 18 straight hours partying in the sky. I am a taker!
They better plan on having loads of Dom Pérignon on board!

           
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Stitch
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:43 pm

Quoting migair54 (Reply 28):
What if SQ get the 5 B777LR that AI is trying to sell, could they make it work in this routes??

If SQ is actually averaging a 76-80% load factor, than the 20% fuel savings of the 777-200LR over the A340-500 might very well have kept the route viable. However, you'd have to factor in the capital costs of buying the 777-200LR, which would eat into the fuel savings.
 
PHX787
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 5:00 pm

Quoting Tdan (Reply 1):
This was inevitable. SQ could never figure out how to make these routes work in a high fuel environment and notorious A345 fuel hogs. Sad to see them go from a spotters perspective.

I wonder if the 787/A350 could do such a route with such a seating layout.

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 30):
I think I am going to break with my First to Fly habit this time. I'd really like the idea of being "last to fly" the world's longest route on that final EWR-SIN Singapore Airlines A345 flight.

I hope you post a trip report  
Quoting kaitak (Reply 26):
Not that surprising from an economics perspective.

Exactly. Sad but true.
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IrishAyes
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 5:09 pm

Well, this will create some bragging rights for any DFW or SYD-based fans. Now, QF 7 will officially become the world's longest route (although it still remains the #1 route for the world's longest flight in economy).
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LAXintl
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 5:12 pm

Quoting migair54 (Reply 28):
Actually the load factor of 76% is not bad, but if they can´t manage to make money with that load factor is better to reroute the flight and try to make more money somewhere else.

These are not normal flights.

We are talking about ULH flights where the block times are at 18:30 and 17:45 respectively.

Currently I doubt even close to 100% LF would be profitable on such segments on a uber high CASM A345.

Also remember back when the routes first launched in 2004, crude oil averaged $37.66 per barrel. 2011 it was $93.02 !

I suspect SQ has hung on to these flights for prestige purposes for quite some time....
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
N62NA
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 5:55 pm

Quoting STT757 (Reply 5):
It's a shame, will they retain EWR services and run it through a Star hub as before (EWR-FRA-SIN).

I suspect they'll drop EWR and just stick with the "international gateway/prestige" NYC area airport, JFK.

Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 13):
I could see a strong business case for SIA sending the smaller 777 to JFK to maintain a presence, and sending the A380 to EWR to maintain volume, get CASM right down, and fill it from UAL's huge connection possibilities.

We'll never see an A380 at EWR and SQ will always favor JFK over EWR.
 
ipodguy7
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 7:20 pm

Quoting IrishAyes (Reply 33):
Well, this will create some bragging rights for any DFW or SYD-based fans. Now, QF 7 will officially become the world's longest route (although it still remains the #1 route for the world's longest flight in economy).

Can anyone else confirm this officially? I'm really hoping so, I just flew SYD-DFW in August.
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jfklganyc
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 7:56 pm

Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 13):
ppl outside the US automatically think "go to JFK". That is of course changing

Actually, it's not.

While the 90s was very much about secondary hubs as gateways, the 2000s to today has seen a return to hubs with large O and D: JFK, MIA, LAX, SFO, EWR to support the flights themselves.

In the case of EWR vs JFK, EWR had a glory period from the early to late 90s when CO was establishing a huge hub and international airlines were flocking there. JFK at this time was a mess with old terminals, no rail transport, clogged roadways, and 3 bankrupt airlines as anchor tenants: PA, TW, and EA.

From the opening of T1 (mid 90s) til today, JFK has seen a reemergence not only as the leading gateway to the US, but also as the busiest airport in the region by far.

That, combined with a very dominant hub in EWR by CO now UA, has forced everyone other than CO and UA to retrench there and retool elsewhere. Read the threads: many foreign carriers that served both EWR and JFK through a dual airport strategy are returning to soley serving JFK.

Airlines like AA and the old UA (both of which ran international out of EWR) scaled back at EWR.

EWR is safe as a gateway courtesy of the huge UA hub and lots of O and D...but don't look for a lot of tails besides UA in the near future
 
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STT757
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 8:36 pm

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 38):
Airlines like AA and the old UA (both of which ran international out of EWR) scaled back at EWR.



That's more indicative of their own poor performance and not the airport's, case in point would be UA while dropping international flying from EWR in the early '00s also simultaneously dropped JFK International flying. DL on the other hand is growing their EWR International flying, next year DL will be flying EWR-AMS and EWR-CDG.
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mogandoCI
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 8:55 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 22):
Anyhow for fun here is their 2011 load factors on the routes:

EWR
Jan - 77
Feb - 63
Mar - 80
Apr - 61
May - 83
Jun - 78
Jul - 72
Aug - 59
Sep - 76
Oct - 72
Nov - 60
Dec - 60
Average = 70.1%

LAX
Jan - 76
Feb - 74
Mar - 70
Apr - 73
May - 86
Jun - 82
Jul - 77
Aug - 69
Sep - 80
Oct - 81
Nov - 77
Dec - 69
Average = 76.2%

With load factors like these, it's stupid not to release some award seats to Star partners. It's much much lower rev per head than actual paid J, but sure beats flying an empty seat for 19 hours. Heck, I'm totally willing to redeem this flight for 120K miles plus $1000 of fuel surcharge.
 
FlyPNS1
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 9:46 pm

Quoting STT757 (Reply 39):
DL on the other hand is growing their EWR International flying, next year DL will be flying EWR-AMS and EWR-CDG.

But that's not really growth, it's just DL replacing AF/KLM flights because DL flights are effectively AF/KLM flights given the joint venture.
 
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STT757
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 9:52 pm

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 41):
But that's not really growth, it's just DL replacing AF/KLM flights because DL flights are effectively AF/KLM flights given the joint venture



It's a new airline on a route. Also AF leaving EWR, and ORD, is indicative of AF's ills and not the airport's otherwise DL would not be picking up the route. Which is my point.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 3270
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2004 7:30 am

RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:01 pm

Its the economy and more businesses letting fewer and fewer people fly premium classes
 
caljn
Posts: 146
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 9:37 pm

RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Thu Oct 25, 2012 1:53 am

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 38):
From the opening of T1 (mid 90s) til today, JFK has seen a reemergence not only as the leading gateway to the US, but also as the busiest airport in the region by far.

You failed to mention Jet Blue and their contribution to JFK's increase in traffic.

If it is the leading gateway it is a pity that international travelers first impression of the US is JFK. Anyone who uses the terms JFK and "prestige" in a sentence hasn't flown thru that third world facility of late, even after the "upgrades".
 
MaverickM11
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Thu Oct 25, 2012 2:24 am

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 22):
Anyhow for fun here is their 2011 load factors on the routes:

The load factors weren't that bad; if those are actually paid seats with no or few rewards, then they're fantastic LF for an all premium layout. EWR probably was halfway decent, especially if you take out ownership. LAX had to be dreadful; I can't imagine there are enough premium passengers willing to pay not only for J to SIN, but on top of that a hefty premium to go nonstop, and flow passengers are just not worth taking on such a ULH flight.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
ben175
Posts: 524
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Thu Oct 25, 2012 2:50 am

This is such saddening news to me as these flights are always my #1 choice when flying PER-NYC or PER-LAX. I have flown these ULH routes three times and all three are in my top 5 flights of all time. The experience of being up in the air for 18 and a half hours is just incredible. I am really, really disappointed to see these routes go.
 
N62NA
Posts: 4006
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Thu Oct 25, 2012 4:30 am

I smell a revival of the old "EWR vs JFK" topic once again!

Quoting jfklganyc (Reply 38):
EWR is safe as a gateway courtesy of the huge UA hub and lots of O and D...but don't look for a lot of tails besides UA in the near future

Correct.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 39):
That's more indicative of their own poor performance and not the airport's,

This makes no sense. An airport in the context of these comments IS the airlines that fly there.

Quoting STT757 (Reply 39):
DL on the other hand is growing their EWR International flying, next year DL will be flying EWR-AMS and EWR-CDG.

Yeah, they're going to increase their EWR international flying by 100% - DL sure is massively expanding international flying out of EWR.   

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 41):
But that's not really growth, it's just DL replacing AF/KLM flights because DL flights are effectively AF/KLM flights given the joint venture.

Correct.

Quoting caljn (Reply 44):
Anyone who uses the terms JFK and "prestige" in a sentence hasn't flown thru that third world facility of late, even after the "upgrades"

Oh come on. DL's facilities are horrible, but the other terminals are quite nice.
 
777law
Posts: 126
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2006 9:16 am

RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Thu Oct 25, 2012 6:11 am

Quoting ordjoe (Reply 15):
and SQ does not really discount those J seats or give them out as awards

That's not entirely true. Having lived in Singapore for 5 years (left in January) the SIN-EWR / SIN-LAX flights were the expat favorites - generally carrying very healthy loads of expat familes (parents and kids) back to the US. My wife, daughter and I flew the SIN-EWR route a couple times and since the tickets were SG$10,000 r/t (about US$8,000) - we always used award tickets for the flight. When we combined my miles from business travel and our Singapore credit card points we generally had enough for two round trip award tickets a year. Unless we were travelling at Christmas or New Years the award tickets were pretty easy to book.

Anyway, the cancellation of these flights are going to be a big disappointment for a lot of US expats in Singapore. These flights were by far the easiest and the best way to get to the US and back from Sing. Transiting through HKG, NRT, ICN, (on the Asia side) and LAX, ORD, SFO, etc. (on the US side) is a huge pain and adds hours to journey. It is a shame to see these go.
If its not a Boeing I ain't going
 
AirbusA6
Posts: 1494
Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:53 am

RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Thu Oct 25, 2012 8:51 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 23):
Quoting AirbusA6 (Reply 17):
A shame, hopefully the A345s will find a new home, probably as a gorgeous private jet!

Airbus agreed to take them in as trade on the A350+A380 deal. I expect they'll be broken up and sold as OEM spares as the planes are worth far more in pieces than complete.

Yes, sadly it is the parts commonality with the super popular A330 which will condemn these planes to an early death 
it's the bus to stansted (now renamed National Express a6 to ruin my username)
 
MadameConcorde
Posts: 9201
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RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Thu Oct 25, 2012 9:20 am

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 40):
I'm totally willing to redeem this flight for 120K miles plus $1000 of fuel surcharge.

Doubt you will get any award seat on any of these EWR-SIN-EWR flights. There are none available now. I doubt they will release any in the future.

Sort of like Concorde. The day they announced the end of service there was no more award seats to be found and that was for any existing Concorde flights on both BA and AF. I had to pay full fare for my last AF Concorde flight 3 weeks before the end of service while I had used various tricks in the past to get me on board.

The best chance for you to be on these SQ345 nonstop flights is by booking your seat and paying the price.

        
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
changyou
Posts: 199
Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2003 10:57 pm

RE: SQ To End LAX/EWR-SIN Nonstop Flights

Thu Oct 25, 2012 9:32 am

Just hope these flights will return someday with more fuel efficient planes...