Rafabozzolla
Topic Author
Posts: 968
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2000 1:27 pm

Varig's Expansion

Thu Oct 19, 2000 10:51 am

After a period of rapid expansion in the 90’s, Varig has. in the last two years, made several changes to its long-haul routes. In the wake of the Asian crisis the first victim was its longest flight GRU to HKG. It had stops in JNB and BKK but in 1998 was axed and became a flight between Brazil and South Africa only.

Last year due to the crisis in Brazil Varig stopped serving ATL and IAD and the flight from Rio to New York became a continuation of the daily GRU-JFK service. Other services suspended were JNB in South Africa, and in Europe Porto, Amsterdam and Zurich. This was not truly a reduction, but rather a change in strategy. Varig boosted frequencies to the remaining destinations and every county to which it flies long haul are served at least on a daily basis (except for Denmark served 3x a week from London).

Last July Varig showed its first sings of expansion, opening flights to Munich (the fight is proving successful for the original 3x a week 767 service will be upgraded to MD11 soon, one more frequency will be added and Lufthansa will start flying from MUC to GRU next summer), and doubling frequencies to LAX. In terms of alliances Varig has now code share services with LH, UA, NH, SK, SA and Lan Chile and is soon to start code share with Air Canada once services between Toronto and São Paulo are taken over from Canadian.

Now that services to main destinations seem to be well established, and considering that VASP no longer flies internationally, wouldn’t it be time for Varig to try some new services to destinations that, at least from a layman’s point of view, seem underserved? A few suggestions:

- In Japan Varig should change its second destination from Nagoya to Osaka. Vasp had the authority but might have lost it by now.
- Auckland and Sydney seem very logical. There is a substantial traffic between Brazil and these two countries. Brazilians often go to Buenos Aires or even Los Angeles to get to Australia. Besides it would have the feed from Star partners Ansett and Air NZ.
- Instead of flying to LAX twice a day, one of the services should be changed to SFO to allow better connections with United’s flights.
- In Europe VASP made many mistakes but had successful flights to BCN and Zurich. Varig should definitely assume these two important markets.

What do you think?
 
The777Man
Posts: 5918
Joined: Sun Jul 04, 1999 4:54 am

RE: Varig's Expansion

Thu Oct 19, 2000 11:08 am

I think that BCN could certainly work. I think they should be daily to MUC before any other expansion in Europe. The MUC flight seems to be doing extremely well. I would also like to see them go back to JNB before SFO or SYD/AKL. The later flight from GRU to LAX connects very well with UA and NZ flights to MEL, SYD and AKL. KIX makes sense but there's more flights from LAX to KIX than to NGO. Varig has traffid rights on the US-Japan sector. We'll see what happens. Interesting topic. The777Man
Boeing 777s flown: UA, TG, KE, BA, CX, NH, JD, JL, CZ, SQ, EK, NG, CO, AF, SV, KU, DL, AA, MH, OZ, CA, MS, SU, LY, RG, PE, AZ, KL, VN, PK, EY, NZ, AM, BR, AC, DT, UU, OS, AI, 9W, KQ, QR, VA, JJ, ET, TK, PR, BG, T5, CI, MU and LX.. Further to fly.. LH 777
 
northwest 777
Posts: 216
Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2000 2:48 am

RE: Varig's Expansion

Thu Oct 19, 2000 12:24 pm

Is Varig supposed to be receiving 777s? I thought i might have heard something about it but I can't remember. If they are going to get them will it be for expansion or strictly as replacement aircraft. Also, where do they serve in Europe and with what aircraft? Where do they have to stop in order to make these flights. Thanks!
 
Rafabozzolla
Topic Author
Posts: 968
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2000 1:27 pm

RE: Varig's Expansion

Thu Oct 19, 2000 1:17 pm

The 777s are to be used first on the Japanese routes (GRU-LAX-NRT and GRU-LAX-NGO) and at least for the time being will be used to increase capacity as today these flights are operated by MD11s.
The network? Here it goes

North America
New York, Miami, Los Angeles, Mexico City and Cancun plus Chicago in code share with United.

Europe
Lisbon, Madrid, Paris, London, Copenhagen, Frankfurt, Munich, Milan and Rome.

Asia
Nagoya and Tokyo

South America
Caracas, Bogota, Lima, Santa Cruz de La Sierra, La Paz, Asuncion, Montevideo, Buenos Aires, Cordoba, Rosario and Santiago de Chile.

In africa it codeshares with SAA on the São Paulo-Johannesburg route.
 
The777Man
Posts: 5918
Joined: Sun Jul 04, 1999 4:54 am

RE: Varig's Expansion

Thu Oct 19, 2000 10:00 pm

I also think Varig shoukd increase frequencies to both MXP and FCO. I think they could fly daily to both cities which I don't think they do now. The777Man
Boeing 777s flown: UA, TG, KE, BA, CX, NH, JD, JL, CZ, SQ, EK, NG, CO, AF, SV, KU, DL, AA, MH, OZ, CA, MS, SU, LY, RG, PE, AZ, KL, VN, PK, EY, NZ, AM, BR, AC, DT, UU, OS, AI, 9W, KQ, QR, VA, JJ, ET, TK, PR, BG, T5, CI, MU and LX.. Further to fly.. LH 777
 
The777Man
Posts: 5918
Joined: Sun Jul 04, 1999 4:54 am

RE: Varig's Expansion

Thu Oct 19, 2000 10:04 pm

Rafabozzolla, is it confirmed that Varig will use the 777s to LAX and Japan first? I know that was the last route with 743s and the GRU-LAX nightflights are always full. I'm very much looking foreward to seeing Varig 777s here at LAX!!!!! The777Man
Boeing 777s flown: UA, TG, KE, BA, CX, NH, JD, JL, CZ, SQ, EK, NG, CO, AF, SV, KU, DL, AA, MH, OZ, CA, MS, SU, LY, RG, PE, AZ, KL, VN, PK, EY, NZ, AM, BR, AC, DT, UU, OS, AI, 9W, KQ, QR, VA, JJ, ET, TK, PR, BG, T5, CI, MU and LX.. Further to fly.. LH 777
 
Rafabozzolla
Topic Author
Posts: 968
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2000 1:27 pm

RE: Varig's Expansion

Thu Oct 19, 2000 11:30 pm

No one at Varig told me that, but at the time of order that's what was published by both Varig and Boeing.
 
planenutz
Posts: 1156
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 1999 5:50 am

RE: Varig's Expansion

Fri Oct 20, 2000 1:06 am

Didn't VARIG fly to SFO at one time? I remember seeing a billboard in San Francisco advertising there service sometime in 1992-93. I also remember them having a large city ticket office off of Union Square in San Francisco up until 1995 or so. The flight may have been an extension of their service to LAX.
Not all who wander are lost....
 
Guest

RE: Varig's Expansion

Fri Oct 20, 2000 1:41 am

Hi,
Having been born in Brazil, I have a strong interest in the airline, and have a few questions:

Why did RG fly to HKG-was it mainly a business route?
Same for JNB-was this a business route or tourism?

I have seen a photo of an RG 744! When did they operate this, was it theirs or leased, for how long and why?

Thanks, sorry about the questions!
 
Guest

RE: Varig's Expansion

Fri Oct 20, 2000 1:44 am

I've found a photo on the database; read the caption, it's quite interesting.


Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Rajesh Changela


 
Rafabozzolla
Topic Author
Posts: 968
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2000 1:27 pm

RE: Varig's Expansion

Fri Oct 20, 2000 5:06 am

Dear Capt. Picard and Planenutz,

I'll try to answer your questions. but I am not sure about all the responses.

I think Varig never flew into SFO, but I am pretty sure that VASP did it for a while as an exetention of its LAX service. Nowadays RG code shares with United on the LAX-SFO route.

I am not an employee so I can not tell you why Varig started operations to HKG. I can only assume a few things. I've heard that it was a good cargo route, and maybe RG's management was expecting a boom in business traffic, but this was cut short due to the asian crisis.

The JNB route was manly a tourist route. For many years Varig had exclusive rights as Brazil's flag carrier, even though it has allways been a private company. In "exchange" for this privilege, during the 70's and 80's Varig developed a route network in Africa (Luanda, Maputo, Lagos, Abdjan, Dakkar and of course Johannesbug) that never realy made money, but was considered strategical on the eyes of the Military government then in power. As soon as democracy was restored these routes were dropped and only JNB was kept.

As for the 747-400s they were operated in the mid 90's togheter with some 747-300s, but were later replaced by smaller aircraft in tune with the new strategy of increasing frequencies to key destinations.
 
Guest

RE: Varig's Expansion

Fri Oct 20, 2000 7:53 am

Thanks for the info.
 
MMM
Posts: 29
Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2007 3:29 am

RE: Varig's Expansion

Fri Oct 20, 2000 8:35 am

Rafa,

I think that some time last year I heard that Varig was going to resume the JNB flight. And, I agree with you and beleive it's time for an expansion...
Just following your ideas:

1) The GRU-JNB-BKK-HKG could turn into GRU-JNB-SIN and maybe codeshare with partner SQ.

2) Qantas and Aerolineas fly "free"of competition the EZE-AKL-SYD route and it's more than time to put some pressure on them . A great deal of the traffic, as you well pointed out, is made by Brazilians that HAVE  () to go down to EZE to connect with the Oceania flights. What about if NZ/RG started a SYD-AKL route to GRU or GIG via SCL ?! ... that would definetly put some pressure on.

ANother point to add to this is that StarAlliance has no coverage in the southern hemisphere. A flight linking SouthAmerica with Oceania and SouthAmerica with Africa is definetly needed. Now, if you are on StarAlliance RTW fare you have to go via Europe/USA to get to those places,... makes no sense !

Mauricio
 
Neo
Posts: 730
Joined: Sat Jan 06, 2001 8:21 am

RE: Varig's Expansion

Fri Oct 20, 2000 9:47 am

Mauricio

You definetly have a point there. I also agree that a flight linking Brazil and Oceania would work. I thought that RG would open this new route, with the up coming traffic for the Olympic Games,,,, like it did, in Atlanta!!!

I agree with Rafabozzolla in his suggestions for new flights. Although i think that RG is focusing more in stabilishing a solid network!!! what do you think???

I also have a question? What do you think about TAM's expansion, i think we can't let that pass.....

Valeu...
Neo
 
dellatorre
Posts: 864
Joined: Sat May 13, 2000 2:50 pm

RE: Varig's Expansion

Fri Oct 20, 2000 11:08 am

The expansion of RG´s network is a key for surviving in the south hemisphere market. Some opitions:

+ GRU-YYZ
+ GRU-ZRH
+ GRU-BOS
+ GRU-AKL-SYD

 
LatinPlane
Posts: 2471
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

African Routes

Fri Oct 20, 2000 11:12 am

Hi,

Wow, that was very interesting. I had not idea that Varig flew the African routes for political reasons. I have an old Varig brochure from the early 90's or late 80's that has all those African destinations on the map. I always wondered why Varig flew there.

I thought that Luanda was flown mainly because of Brazil and Angola's Portugese heritage. Since both countries speak Portugese and both are directly accross the ocean, I thought that there was some sort of trade that stimulated scheduled flights between both countries. There is also many born African's of pure Portugese decent that left Angola and the other countries to Brazil after civil unrest developed in these countries.

Can you tell me if TAAG Angola still flies into Rio de Janeiro. For an airline that comes from a country that has been torn up by a revolution they are doing pretty well flying those big 747-300's. Also, how long would the flight duration from Rio to Luanda be if anyone knows?

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Jose Luiz Junior


TAAG - ANGOLA AIRLINES


Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Jörg-Dieter Zmich


VARIG's DC-10 at Johannesburg during the African route heydays.



Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
MMM
Posts: 29
Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2007 3:29 am

SAmerica - Africa - SEAsia

Fri Oct 20, 2000 2:23 pm

latinplane,..

I wonder if TAAG still flies to Rio too ... can anybody help !?!

Regarding flying times,... RIO-Luanda wouldn't be more that 7 hours. I flew a couple of times GRU-JNB and that is about 8.5h.. depending on the winds.

Also ,... I remembered somthing now. Before the Asian crisis in 97 , Singapore Air was planning to star a South American route. ... things cooled down, but I think now would be the time. The only airline linking SE Asia with SAmerica now via SAfrica is Malaysian Air, with their KUL-JNB-CPT-EZE flight !


Mauricio

 
dia77
Posts: 658
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2000 3:49 am

RE: SAmerica - Africa - SEAsia

Fri Oct 20, 2000 2:28 pm

I find this photo of an Iraqi Airways 747 in Rio to be really intriguing. Does anyone know what the motivation behind this service was? Thanks.


Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Daniel R Carneiro

 
Guest

RE: Varig's Expansion

Fri Oct 20, 2000 4:01 pm

Just on a sidenote, more trade exists between Angola and Brazil than between Angola and Portugal if I am to believe my Geography lecturer.
 
Rafabozzolla
Topic Author
Posts: 968
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2000 1:27 pm

RE: Varig's Expansion

Fri Oct 20, 2000 10:14 pm

Iraqi's flight to Rio was basically due to the fact that a brazilian contractor won a major (realy BIG) bid to built railroads and they had to find a way to ship equipment and people all the way there.
 
lima
Posts: 1090
Joined: Sun May 30, 1999 11:37 am

RE: Amsterdam

Fri Oct 20, 2000 10:34 pm

Is there any trend within Varig to return to operate flights to Amsterdam?

I think this is an important destination in Europe and and at the moment not well served to/from South America (KLM has no competitors).
 
johnboy
Posts: 2557
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 1999 9:09 pm

RE: Varig's Expansion

Sat Oct 21, 2000 3:51 am

I'd also like to see some South American flights from SFO! Seems to be somewhat sensible, as UA has more flights to Japan, China, Korea, etc. than LAX.
 
The777Man
Posts: 5918
Joined: Sun Jul 04, 1999 4:54 am

RE: Varig's 744s

Sat Oct 21, 2000 5:39 am

Varig had three 747-400s, PP-VPG, -VPH and VPI. First delivery on 31 May91 and returned the last aircraft on 28Dec94. I think Varig could return to AMS, perhaps start with a 767-200ER. They seem to fly the 767-200ERs from regional cities in Brazil to some overeas detination. Perhaps they could start new routes with these 767-200ERs from GRU and GIG? The777Man
Boeing 777s flown: UA, TG, KE, BA, CX, NH, JD, JL, CZ, SQ, EK, NG, CO, AF, SV, KU, DL, AA, MH, OZ, CA, MS, SU, LY, RG, PE, AZ, KL, VN, PK, EY, NZ, AM, BR, AC, DT, UU, OS, AI, 9W, KQ, QR, VA, JJ, ET, TK, PR, BG, T5, CI, MU and LX.. Further to fly.. LH 777
 
Louis
Posts: 576
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2005 6:53 am

Johnboy

Sat Oct 21, 2000 5:47 am

But Los Angeles has a much, much bigger Brazillian population than San Francisco.
 
dutchjet
Posts: 7714
Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:13 am

RE: Varig's Expansion

Sat Oct 21, 2000 6:30 am

I would not look for VARIG to return to many more European cities, I think that they will focus on using LH flights (Star ALliance partner) to feed flights out of Frankfurt. AMS was a problem for Varig, and the flights in/out of AMS were a continuation of the Paris flights. The Alliances, such as Star, will lead to more hub to hub flights, with the partner airlines feeding eachother. I do think that the downfall of VASP is an opportunity for Varig, but now they must watch out for TAM, which has very ambitious expansion plans!
 
planenutz
Posts: 1156
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 1999 5:50 am

Dutcjet

Sat Oct 21, 2000 6:57 am

What are some of TAM's expansion plans?
Not all who wander are lost....
 
The777Man
Posts: 5918
Joined: Sun Jul 04, 1999 4:54 am

RE: Varig's Expansion

Sat Oct 21, 2000 10:58 am

Maybe Varig could restart IAD with a nonstop flight from GRU? This would provide great connections to other points in the US. A 767-200ER could start the route and to build tarffic. The777Man
Boeing 777s flown: UA, TG, KE, BA, CX, NH, JD, JL, CZ, SQ, EK, NG, CO, AF, SV, KU, DL, AA, MH, OZ, CA, MS, SU, LY, RG, PE, AZ, KL, VN, PK, EY, NZ, AM, BR, AC, DT, UU, OS, AI, 9W, KQ, QR, VA, JJ, ET, TK, PR, BG, T5, CI, MU and LX.. Further to fly.. LH 777
 
Rafabozzolla
Topic Author
Posts: 968
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2000 1:27 pm

RE: Varig's Expansion

Sat Oct 21, 2000 2:31 pm

TAM has daily flights to Paris and double daily to Miami. It code shares with AF and AA on these routes. A new flight to Buenos Aires has been annouced and I've read on local press that TAM is also interested in flying to Milan. That's what I konw.
 
avion
Posts: 2126
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 1:28 am

RE: Varig's Expansion

Sat Oct 21, 2000 2:38 pm

Will they come back to Zurich?

Avion
 
MMM
Posts: 29
Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2007 3:29 am

RE: Varig's Expansion

Sun Oct 22, 2000 6:56 am

Thanks for the TAM info Rafa,...


they have great service and would be nice to see them going to Milan .

However,.... they DO have to take some action and change that livery .... in my point of view it's awful !