vectismanpaul
Topic Author
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BA Gatwick News Thread

Sat Nov 03, 2012 10:48 am

I was just wondering if anyone had any more news about BA route developments for Summer 2013 at London Gatwick.
I am aware that Manchester is stopping and Amsterdam is reduced from 26 to 22. I also know that Barcelona and Alicante are being introduced 3 times daily each. A reliable source on here last week indicated that 2 new short haul routes would be announced very soon. Any ideas what they might be? I also heard a rumour that there could be a couple of long haul 'tag ons' too.
I don't want the thread to become a debate about pros and cons of having a base at Gatwick but just to concentrate on BA Gatwick News including aircraft, routes etc....
Hopefully the thread will become informative!!
I look forward to reading your inputs.
V.
 
jet72uk
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Sat Nov 03, 2012 11:50 am

The two short haul route announcements have been delayed but they will happen. Not heard of any long haul apart from CMB.
 
rutankrd
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Sat Nov 03, 2012 11:53 am

http://www.thebasource.com

Useful enthusiast site for ALL things BA related

Just bookmark it
 
AIR MALTA
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Sat Nov 03, 2012 12:58 pm

Quoting jet72uk (Reply 1):
The two short haul route announcements have been delayed but they will happen.

Is there any chance one of them would be Malta. KM has reduced their flights to LGW so may be BA could take over some of them.

Generally speaking, BA is a bit weaker than LH, AF or KL for European flights due to constraints in LHR or LGW. I think they should share codes with the likes of KM, JU or JP if they do not serve their respective countries. It would add more feed to BA's longhaul and shorthaul flights.
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timboflier215
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Sat Nov 03, 2012 1:02 pm

Quoting AIR MALTA (Reply 3):

With easyJet flying from LGW to Malta, I think it unlikely BA would see enough yield to justify the route. Happy to be proved wrong though.
 
kaitak
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Sat Nov 03, 2012 3:03 pm

Heard a rumour that some of BA Cityflyer's Embraer 190s might go to LGW, ultimately replacing the 734s and thus removing BA mainline from shorthaul at Gatwick.
 
capri
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Sat Nov 03, 2012 3:15 pm

It's more likely will be CMN in summer, they have suspended it by now from LHR, but it will come back as there is also a demand in the summer for TNG also, so keep watching for these 2 routes
 
santos
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Sat Nov 03, 2012 4:02 pm

Quoting capri (Reply 6):
It's more likely will be CMN in summer, they have suspended it by now from LHR, but it will come back as there is also a demand in the summer for TNG also, so keep watching for these 2 routes

Air Arabia Morocco started this 2 routes only last week, so probably not on BA priority list, as CMN wasn't a good performer for BD.
 
timboflier215
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Sat Nov 03, 2012 4:18 pm

As an aside, how big was LGW for BA at it's height? How many a/c based, how many routes etc?
 
vectismanpaul
Topic Author
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Sat Nov 03, 2012 4:21 pm

Kaitak wrote:

'Heard a rumour that some of BA Cityflyer's Embraer 190s might go to LGW, ultimately replacing the 734s and thus removing BA mainline from shorthaul at Gatwick.'
In my opinion unlikely owing to BA agreement with BALPA re use of aircraft with less than 100 seats out of LGW or LHR. This does not mean, I believe, that BA Mainline cannot order/operate EMB 195s but would need to do so with more than 100 seats. Flybe operates theirs with 118 seats. However I have been informed that Gatwick handling charges are more favourable for aircraft with 150 plus seats. (interesting that easyjet A319s have a 156 capacity)
However some routes would suit a 114 to 118 seater (Maybe Manchester route may have survived with this capacity aircraft). However in Summer months demand is high on some routes in both Club and Economy cabins. Also some routes such as Paphos would need the A319/A320 or the 737.

V.
 
jet72uk
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Sat Nov 03, 2012 9:33 pm

Not MLA unfortunately.
 
AIR MALTA
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Sun Nov 04, 2012 12:21 pm

Quoting jet72uk (Reply 10):
Not MLA unfortunately.

So you know what the destinations are... any hint? old GB airways destinations?
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AIR MALTA
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:46 pm

Excellent news. BA was always remoured to start those 2 destinations from LGW.

I however feel that there is room for more new routes out of LGW especially considering BA is closing MAN, reduing AMS and some other routes. These 2 new routes will only take a 734 from 13:00 onwards. I think the cancellation of MAN and AMS reduction might have freed up one entire 734.
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ba319-131
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Tue Nov 06, 2012 1:16 pm

Quoting vectismanpaul (Reply 9):
'Heard a rumour that some of BA Cityflyer's Embraer 190s might go to LGW, ultimately replacing the 734s and thus removing BA mainline from shorthaul at Gatwick.'

- With no additional 190's on order, I don't think this holds much water, these machines are needed @ LCY.
111,732,3,4,5,7,8,BBJ,741,742,743,744,752,762,763,764,772,77L,773,77W,L15,D10,30,40,AB3,AB6,A312.313,319,320,321,332,333
 
capri
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Tue Nov 06, 2012 1:27 pm

it's good for the crew reducing their daily sectors
 
richardw
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:26 pm

My guess for the morning rotation is PMI and MAH.
 
AIR MALTA
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:34 pm

Quoting capri (Reply 15):
My guess for the morning rotation is PMI and MAH.

PMI was previously served from LGW and discontinued....
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ba319-131
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:35 pm

Quoting richardw (Reply 16):
My guess for the morning rotation is PMI

- They used to operate to PMI x LGW before, used the service myself, full on all flights.
111,732,3,4,5,7,8,BBJ,741,742,743,744,752,762,763,764,772,77L,773,77W,L15,D10,30,40,AB3,AB6,A312.313,319,320,321,332,333
 
richardw
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:41 pm

Quoting AIR MALTA (Reply 17):
PMI was previously served from LGW and discontinued....

Same as BCN, GOA and NCE then!
 
AIR MALTA
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:47 pm

Quoting richardw (Reply 19):

Got me there, lol! You're right then... PMI and MAH could be a possibility...
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acelanzarote
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:57 pm

See BA are starting LGW-ACE every Thursday from next April...so presume LPA/TFS also likely?
The ACE flight is showing a 737 when doing a booking.
Hope it works out...nice.
Keith
from the Island with sun and great photo's.. Why not visit Lanzarote
 
AIR MALTA
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Tue Nov 06, 2012 4:40 pm

ACE is every Thursday and Sunday while TPS gets the service the other days.

Thinking about other Spanish routes, I was wondering why BA isn't using Vueling as a partner where Vueling would operate routes to Gatwick from let's say VLC, PMI, SVQ, MAH, BIO, etc with BA sharing codes on those services. It might be a smart move to put pressure on U2 at LGW.
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seansasLCY
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Tue Nov 06, 2012 5:06 pm

Just to clarify as my post was deleted. BA are launching Lanzarote (twice weekly) and Tenerife South (5 Weekly).
 
jet72uk
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Tue Nov 06, 2012 5:23 pm

There you go. Not overly exciting but new routes none the less.
 
AIR MALTA
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 9:28 am

Quoting jet72uk (Reply 23):
There you go. Not overly exciting but new routes none the less.

What is for strange is that BA does not make big announcement about its shorthaul routes... The routes are already on sale but we did not hear anything from them.
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seansasLCY
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 12:16 pm

Apparently San Juan has been dropped. BA cite they are optimising their network.
 
GSTBA
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 12:45 pm

Quoting AIR MALTA (Reply 24):
What is for strange is that BA does not make big announcement about its shorthaul routes... The routes are already on sale but we did not hear anything from them.

Big announcements about routes, aircraft orders etc are usually made as part of the quarterly financial results.

Q3 results are due on Friday so expect any further announcements then
 
AIR MALTA
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Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2001 6:45 am

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:10 pm

Quoting GSTBA (Reply 26):
Big announcements about routes, aircraft orders etc are usually made as part of the quarterly financial results.

Q3 results are due on Friday so expect any further announcements then

Good, looking forward to that... I think the whole short haul operation at LGW should be rethought. BA should consider offering some BoB ontop of its actual catering offering. On some short routes, sandwiches or full english breakfasts should be available for sale ontop of the actual crisps or croissant (except for the Scottish routes). I would gladely buy a full English Breakfast on top of my croissant on a flight from Gatwick to Tunis if that was possible.
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GSTBA
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:41 pm

BA have already announced a number of changes to LGW's S13 shorthaul operation. Only some of these changes are shown in this post. So I thought I would post a list of the changes that have been made so far The comparisons below are to BA's S12 operation.

Shorthaul

Alicante - NEW for the S13 season. Flights will operate 17 x Weekly until the end of June then will increase to 3 x daily

Arrecife - NEW 2 x weekly service for S13

Amsterdam - Overall frequency reduced from 26 to 22 x weekly

Barcelona - NEW 3 x daily service for S13

Bologna - Route transfered to LHR. Operated up to 3 x daily S12

Edinburgh - Overall frequency reduced from 4 x daily to 26 x weekly.

Faro - Increases from daily to 8 x weekly

Glasgow - Overall frequency reduced from 27 to 25 x weekly

Jersey - Overall frequency reduced from 35 to 34 x weekly

Manchester - Route cancelled from start of S13. Flights operated 3 x daily during S12

Marrakech - Overall frequency increased 3 x weekly to daily compared to S13.

Marseille - Route transfered to LHR. Operated up to 3 x daily S12

Naples - Will reduce from 3 to 2 x daily.

Pristina - Route will not operate S13. Flights operated up to 4 x weekly S12.

Rome - Will increase from 10 x weekly to 2 x daily

Salzburg - Operational days in S13. 4 x weekly S12 frequency maintained

Tenerife - NEW 5 x weekly service for S13

Thessaloniki - Operational days in S13. 4 x weekly S12 frequency maintained

Tirana - Overall frequency reduced from 5 to 4 x weekly. Route will also operational day changes.

Tunis - Operational day changes. 5 x weekly frequency maintained for S13.

Further S13 operational changes are likely in the weeks and months to come

Fleet Deployment

At present all S13 flights are showing as being operated by 737-400 aircraft. A update to the LGW fleet deployment for S13 is expected in the weeks ahead. BA are expected to temporarily transfer 4 or possibly even 5 Airbus aircraft to LGW for S13 season.
 
Candid76
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 2:02 pm

Just booked a round trip to Gatwick from MAN for the end of November, a route I've used quite often. Who knows when I may fly into LGW again, or even BA again as LHR is of little use to me. Pity really
 
GSTBA
Posts: 386
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 2:12 pm

Quoting AIR MALTA (Reply 27):
I think the whole short haul operation at LGW should be rethought. BA should consider offering some BoB ontop of its actual catering offering. On some short routes, sandwiches or full english breakfasts should be available for sale ontop of the actual crisps or croissant (except for the Scottish routes). I would gladely buy a full English Breakfast on top of my croissant on a flight from Gatwick to Tunis if that was possible.

BA conducts a survey of pax at the end of each flight. BA at the end of each flight sends a email to 10 randomly selcted pax to ask them to complete the survey. Last summer this survey was carried out on all LGW short haul flights. The survey found last summer that over 90% were either satisfied or extremely satisfied with the current domestic and Euro Traveller cabin service offering. This result dropped to 70% for CE. BA are unlikely to change the ET or domestic product at LGW based on these results.

BA have tried a BOB service in the past. This was on BA Connect. BA found that they lost more money than they made and found it difficult to predict pax demand for sandwiches and hot meals. I think that as a alternative BA should give pax the option of being able to order and pay for a hot meal on line for pax traveling in ET and on domestic services. This option also means that there would be no wastage.
 
AIR MALTA
Posts: 1733
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2001 6:45 am

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 2:52 pm

Quoting GSTBA (Reply 30):
I think that as a alternative BA should give pax the option of being able to order and pay for a hot meal on line for pax traveling in ET and on domestic services. This option also means that there would be no wastage.

This could also be a nice idea... Sort of buying a meal upgrade when you book your flight. I am sure the full English Breakfast would work well for routes under 3 hours (except Scottish routes). Other options for Lunch or Dinner should be introduced as well as having the option to buy a bottle of champagne for birthdays or honeymoons. Ultimately, BA needs to do something to increase revenues otherwise,LGw shorthaul could be thing of the past in a few years time.
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APYu
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 7:23 pm

Quoting GSTBA (Reply 30):

If the BA Survey showed such a high level of satisfaction then why are they now increasing the on board offering by offering complimentary wraps and half wraps and then like on the European sectors? I doubt they are doing it as a good will gesture.
We'd like to welcome in particular our Executive Club members and those joining us from our Oneworld alliance partners.
 
AIR MALTA
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 7:32 pm

Quoting APYu (Reply 32):
If the BA Survey showed such a high level of satisfaction then why are they now increasing the on board offering by offering complimentary wraps and half wraps and then like on the European sectors? I doubt they are doing it as a good will gesture.

What is the new catering offering on BA shourthaul now?
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GSTBA
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 8:21 pm

Quoting AIR MALTA (Reply 31):
Ultimately, BA needs to do something to increase revenues otherwise,LGw shorthaul could be thing of the past in a few years time.

I have to disagree if anything the short haul operation will be bigger in a few years time.

The LGW managing director and her team have over the last 18 months have been working hard on a program of measures designed to reduce LGW's cost base and make the operation viable. The 1st of October saw the implementation of the final part of the cost reduction program with all ramp and ground handling being transfered to the handling agent Swissport.

Have heard this week that the BA board are now expected to approve a order for new aircraft to replace the LGW 737 fleet early in the new year if not before.
 
baw217
Posts: 69
Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2007 8:52 am

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 8:22 pm

Quoting AIR MALTA (Reply 33):
What is the new catering offering on BA shourthaul now?

Have a look here: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/briti...ing-guide-winter-2012-13-beta.html

Improvement in Euro Traveller and slight amendments to Club Europe. Catering is still done by Do&Co with DHL doing the logistics.
 
anstar
Posts: 2868
Joined: Sun Nov 23, 2003 3:49 am

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 8:23 pm

Quoting seansasLCY (Reply 25):
Apparently San Juan has been dropped. BA cite they are optimising their network.
Quoting GSTBA (Reply 34):
Have heard this week that the BA board are now expected to approve a order for new aircraft to replace the LGW 737 fleet early in the new year if not before.

Hopefully they do as gthe BA aircraft are far infrerior the the mian competitior at LGW (Easyjet).
 
cslusarc
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Joined: Wed May 04, 2005 2:29 pm

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 9:15 pm

I'd like to see BA move over some narrow-body 734s to the EC operating certificate and base them at ORY while further developing ORY as a OneWorld focus city.
--cslusarc from YWG
 
bluesky73
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 11:36 pm

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Wed Nov 07, 2012 10:44 pm

Scrapping MAN and then all the flights back to the Spanish and Canary Islands is reminds me of them heading back to British Airtours days, is this a slight shift back to these popular destinations?
 
AIR MALTA
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Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2001 6:45 am

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:36 am

Quoting GSTBA (Reply 34):
Have heard this week that the BA board are now expected to approve a order for new aircraft to replace the LGW 737 fleet early in the new year if not before.

I hope this happen but the most probable is for BA to order more Airbuses deliver them at LHR and move the older ones to LGW. That way, operating costs for LGW will always be lower.

I still feel BA should have at least one daily rotation from LGW to PAR, BRU, MAN to connect to Longhaul routes out of LGW.
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vv701
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RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Thu Nov 08, 2012 2:22 pm

BA ae cutting the add-on ANU-SJU flight (BA2157/56) from the start of the 2013 Summer Timetable.
 
skipness1E
Posts: 3381
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:18 am

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Thu Nov 08, 2012 5:20 pm

Quoting VV701 (Reply 40):
BA ae cutting the add-on ANU-SJU flight (BA2157/56) from the start of the 2013 Summer Timetable.

Are they dropping San Juan entirely then or is it being attached to another add on?
 
skipness1E
Posts: 3381
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:18 am

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Thu Nov 08, 2012 5:23 pm

Quoting AIR MALTA (Reply 39):
I still feel BA should have at least one daily rotation from LGW to PAR, BRU, MAN to connect to Longhaul routes out of LGW.

That would mean over-nighting an aircraft abroad for a single rotation per day to feed a long haul that's focussed on former British possesions and colonies for the most part. I doubt a business destination as the above is viable on a single daily feeding 100% of traffic onto long haul. That's not a viable proposition.
 
AIR MALTA
Posts: 1733
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2001 6:45 am

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Thu Nov 08, 2012 5:25 pm

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 41):
Are they dropping San Juan entirely then or is it being attached to another add on?

They are dropping it entirely!
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trintocan
Posts: 2726
Joined: Sun Apr 23, 2000 6:02 pm

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Thu Nov 08, 2012 9:57 pm

Quoting VV701 (Reply 40):

BA ae cutting the add-on ANU-SJU flight (BA2157/56) from the start of the 2013 Summer Timetable.

This is the second time that SJU has been cut by BA in around a decade and the second Caribbean destination to have been cut twice in a comparable time period (the first was MBJ, axed earlier this year). It appears that the SJU route was largely flown to serve it as a tourist destination and, more notably, to allow access to cruises departing from there. The trouble is that most Caribbean cruises used by British travellers have traditionally departed from BGI or MIA / FLL - and in particular flying into MIA (FLL not having direct UK flights) offers a lower rate of APD. SJU based cruises mostly cater to the American market. It's a pity though that SJU is going.

So BA are returning to TFS and ACE. Is there any chance of PMI coming back?

Trintocan.
Hop to it, fly for life!
 
skipness1E
Posts: 3381
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:18 am

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Thu Nov 08, 2012 11:08 pm

I understand that the APD is excessive to the Carribbean in comparison to the US, which is why SJU and MBJ were dropped by BA and PUJ and KIN were dropped by VS. This is also partly why BA are launching LGW-LAS instead.
 
richardw
Posts: 3136
Joined: Tue May 08, 2001 3:17 am

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Fri Nov 09, 2012 10:20 am

Quoting VV701 (Reply 40):
BA ae cutting the add-on ANU-SJU flight (BA2157/56)

Will BA do anything with the increased efficiency of the aircraft utilisation LGW-ANU-LGW gives?
 
AIR MALTA
Posts: 1733
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2001 6:45 am

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Fri Nov 09, 2012 3:14 pm

Quoting GSTBA (Reply 26):
Big announcements about routes, aircraft orders etc are usually made as part of the quarterly financial results.

Q3 results are due on Friday so expect any further announcements then

So far we did not hear anything except all the Iberia drama.
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LHRFlyer
Posts: 695
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2010 12:50 pm

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Fri Nov 09, 2012 3:50 pm

Will be interesting to see whether Vueling fits into this.

"IAG will seek to develop a “more aggressive” plan for operations at Gatwick, a focus for leisure flights and point-to- point services that don’t link up with long-haul operations."

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-1...0-spanish-jobs-on-profit-fall.html
 
mutu
Posts: 264
Joined: Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:04 am

RE: BA Gatwick News Thread

Fri Nov 09, 2012 4:54 pm

Quoting richardw (Reply 46):
Will BA do anything with the increased efficiency of the aircraft utilisation LGW-ANU-LGW gives?

I think it was only a once a week tag on anyway? Not really a big issue

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