blr380
Topic Author
Posts: 54
Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2009 12:33 am

New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Wed Nov 07, 2012 5:18 pm

Elite Airways, based in Portland, ME is interested in starting new services from New England towns to Florida.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/lifest...-11e2-aaa5-ac786110c486_story.html

It is nice to see a new carrier to restart FL service from PWM...but not sure what their business strategy is.
Please share your thoughts and any further info you may have on this new venture.

Edited:
Just found another link that reports a regional service in the Northeast:
http://www.mainebiz.biz/apps/pbcs.dl...e?AID=/20121107/NEWS0101/121109965

On another note, sad to see Twin Cities discontinuing PWM (the first international flight before AC jumped in).

[Edited 2012-11-07 09:23:51]
 
WA707atMSP
Posts: 1471
Joined: Sun Oct 08, 2006 8:16 pm

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Wed Nov 07, 2012 5:22 pm

This airline sounds like a cross between Independence Air's fleet and Skybus' strategy of flying to out of the way airports.

This doesn't seem like the sort of strategy that will ensure longevity in the airline industry.
Seaholm Maples are #1!
 
CMHSRQ
Posts: 822
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 1:49 am

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Wed Nov 07, 2012 5:37 pm

2 plus hour flights on 50 seat RJ's. Someone needs to go to airline economics 101. This will never get off the ground.
The voice of moderation
 
ScottB
Posts: 5413
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2000 1:25 am

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Wed Nov 07, 2012 6:37 pm

Quoting cmhsrq (Reply 2):
2 plus hour flights on 50 seat RJ's. Someone needs to go to airline economics 101. This will never get off the ground.

Not just that, but in a market like PWM-MLB. I suppose the idea would be to market it as Palm Beach/Orlando, but it won't be cost-competitive.
 
GentFromAlaska
Posts: 2666
Joined: Sun Feb 20, 2005 2:21 pm

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Wed Nov 07, 2012 7:28 pm

Quoting WA707atMSP (Reply 1):
This doesn't seem like the sort of strategy that will ensure longevity in the airline industry.
Quoting cmhsrq (Reply 2):
2 plus hour flights on 50 seat RJ's.

Possibly if it was marketed as S&S or snowbird and seafood service. The abundance and assortment of seafood including Maine lobster and several varieties of fish available near PWM. Two months ago I flew with 48 pounds of seafood I purchased near PWM from http://www.harborfish.com
Man can be taken from Alaska. Alaska can never be taken from the man.
 
pwm2txlhopper
Posts: 1140
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2004 10:40 am

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Wed Nov 07, 2012 7:43 pm

I just read about this in the local Portland paper and came on here to see if anybody else picked up on this?

I first heard about this airline when they opened their home office in downtown Portland a year or two ago. At the time, they expressed interest in flying international/domestic schedule flights and charters. Possibly in business class configuration. They were supposedly going to operate 757's and 767''s and were even proposing International flights to Europe with the possibility of flights originating/stopping in PWM for customs/refueling!

On their website, they still have their corporate office listed here in downtown Portland. I haven't heard anymore about them since their initial proposal though. I just assumed it was just another upstart that never really got off the ground ?

Elite Corporate Website

http://cyaviation.com/


Quoting blr380 (Thread starter):
t is nice to see a new carrier to restart FL service from PWM...but not sure what their business strategy is.
Please share your thoughts and any further info you may have on this new venture.

I'm no expert in running an airline, but I can't see anything but failure for an upstart airline flying 50 seat RJ's on 1,000+ mile routes between small tourist markets at discount fares! Especially with high fuel prices.. Reminds me of Independence Air! But even they weren't flying routes that far.

Quoting blr380 (Thread starter):
On another note, sad to see Twin Cities discontinuing PWM (the first international flight before AC jumped in).

Not really. Before AC and Twin Cities, there was Starlink Air to Nova Scotia. That was just a few years ago before Twin Cities took over.

In 2000, there was AC (the first time) with service to YUL.

During 1991-93 circa, Northwest Airlink flew PWM-YQB several days per week.
 
kcrwflyer
Posts: 2525
Joined: Tue May 18, 2004 11:57 am

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Wed Nov 07, 2012 8:11 pm

Why cant anyone with an airline idea ever have a good one that passes the common sense test? 50 seat jets on 2 hour flights to Florida? C'mon man..
 
flyPBA
Posts: 124
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 2:10 am

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Wed Nov 07, 2012 8:43 pm

actually (or also) ... http://www.eliteairways.net
 
blr380
Topic Author
Posts: 54
Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2009 12:33 am

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Wed Nov 07, 2012 8:46 pm

Quoting ScottB (Reply 3):

I think the RJ's are meant for local/regional flights within New England/New York. Longer routes are supposedly on A-319 or similar (yet to be confirmed)

Quoting cmhsrq (Reply 2):

The demand exists - not sure about the yields. B6 and FL flew MCO-PWM route and the loads were great (once again, I am not sure about the yields). Two airlines (with A320/737) was probably too much to handle this market. MLB is a completely different ball game with no connections on either ends. It should be a matter of time WN connects MCO with PWM.
 
User avatar
viasa
Posts: 1424
Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2005 10:29 pm

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Wed Nov 07, 2012 9:23 pm

The first aircraft is a 19 year old former Comair CRJ100: http://www.ch-aviation.ch/portal/new...scheduled-operations#disqus_thread
 
zippyjet
Posts: 5077
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2001 3:32 pm

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Thu Nov 08, 2012 2:53 am

Best of luck to them. I take it they are going into the saturated MCO area market. How about MIA? Sure there landing fees are expensive but, the pickings are ripe for competition against the juggernaut bankrupt air I mean AA. I wish we stayed and expanded in MIA. Seems like everyone is thowing their eggs in the crowded baskets of FLL and MCO.
I'm Zippyjet & I approve of this message!
 
PlanesNTrains
Posts: 5347
Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:19 pm

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Thu Nov 08, 2012 6:04 am

I wonder how a streamlined P2P regional on dirt cheap CRJ's might fair with slightly lower fuel.

JetDirect

Interesting thought, but perhaps not worth the risk.

-Dave
-Dave
 
lat41
Posts: 457
Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 12:23 pm

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Thu Nov 08, 2012 1:10 pm

While all this may be going on, we still have PeoplExpress yet to get out of the starting gate. That carrier was supposed to be up and running already. I would think that any startup would have flights full to the gunnels every day and not with $79 gimmick fares to make it.
 
thrufru
Posts: 117
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2009 3:48 pm

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Thu Nov 08, 2012 2:22 pm

Well, the economics of operating RJ's have changed just a little bit. The acquisition costs are at rock bottom prices with monthly leases in the low 5 figures. It's a little like The economics behind having an old car. You might pay a little more for maintenance and your fuel economy isn't nearly as good, but you don't have a car payment.

Now with that, and the ancillary costs, I still think its a heck of a stretch to get this off the ground and have it operate successfully for any length of time.
 
bohica
Posts: 2298
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2004 3:21 pm

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Thu Nov 08, 2012 4:23 pm

Quoting pwm2txlhopper (Reply 5):
Reminds me of Independence Air! But even they weren't flying routes that far.

At least Independence Air had a hub so all the RJ's fed off each other as well as the A319's. This outfit only has a point-to-point service between PWM and MLB. This is great if you live in PWM or MLB and you need to fly to the other location. Otherwise you're SOL.

The great circle mapper distance PWM-MLB is 1216 miles. However, I doubt that the CRJ is overwater equipped. Therefore the flight path needs to hug the coastline which make the flight even longer. Also at that distance the CRJ is going to be weight restricted and I would be surprised if you could carry more than 40 passengers per flight.



Quoting kcrwflyer (Reply 6):
Why cant anyone with an airline idea ever have a good one that passes the common sense test? 50 seat jets on 2 hour flights to Florida? C'mon man..

3 hours on a PWM-MLB flight is optimistic. The block time would be closer to 3 1/2 hours.
 
Rbgso
Posts: 288
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 11:15 pm

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Thu Nov 08, 2012 4:50 pm

Quoting bohica (Reply 14):
3 hours on a PWM-MLB flight is optimistic. The block time would be closer to 3 1/2 hours.

Anything over 45 minutes in a CRJ200 is absolute torture.
 
Goldenshield
Posts: 5005
Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2001 3:45 pm

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Thu Nov 08, 2012 5:28 pm

Quoting bohica (Reply 14):
Therefore the flight path needs to hug the coastline which make the flight even longer. Also at that distance the CRJ is going to be weight restricted and I would be surprised if you could carry more than 40 passengers per flight.

I played with this:

KPWM JFK FKN CHS CRG MLB KMLB

It hugs the coast, and only goes slightly over water. It's only 1100 miles, and within the CRJ-200's range without bumping payload. The only time it would be restricted would be if an alternate is added (Assuming these guys are 121 Supplemental, then that would always be the case, but then again, there are plenty of close-by airports to use on both sides Wink otherwise, they won't be bumping anyone.

[Edited 2012-11-08 09:32:27]
Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
 
PlanesNTrains
Posts: 5347
Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:19 pm

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Thu Nov 08, 2012 5:31 pm

I got the impression after reading the two articles that perhaps CRJ's would connect regionally somewhere in the northeast, feeding a potential Florida flight. I might be mistaken.

-Dave
-Dave
 
NWADTWE16
Posts: 242
Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:12 am

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Fri Nov 09, 2012 5:05 am

Quoting lat41 (Reply 12):
While all this may be going on, we still have PeoplExpress yet to get out of the starting gate.

And on the other side of the country California Pacific Airlines?!? Wrong thread i know but you got your aircraft awhile ago now and the poor thing is just sitting there, what the **** is going on?
 
rampart
Posts: 1798
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 5:58 am

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Fri Nov 09, 2012 5:23 am

Quoting NWADTWE16 (Reply 18):
And on the other side of the country California Pacific Airlines?!? Wrong thread i know but you got your aircraft awhile ago now and the poor thing is just sitting there, what the **** is going on?

Yes, airline enthusiasts, let's bash every freakin' proposal that comes to light, because we have so much faith in the consolidation, dominance, and too-large-to-fail mentality of the alternative. Of course Spirit, Jetblue, and Southwest were startups at one point. But no matter. Bash away.
 
iowaman
Posts: 3878
Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 2:29 am

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:04 am

Quoting rampart (Reply 19):
Yes, airline enthusiasts, let's bash every freakin' proposal that comes to light, because we have so much faith in the consolidation, dominance, and too-large-to-fail mentality of the alternative. Of course Spirit, Jetblue, and Southwest were startups at one point. But no matter. Bash away.

I feel it's a valid argument - high CASM CRJ's against a mountain of other non-stop and connecting options available in a highly fare sensitive leisure market. Interesting to watch and see what happens none the less.
 
NWADTWE16
Posts: 242
Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2012 5:12 am

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:41 am

Quoting rampart (Reply 19):
Yes, airline enthusiasts, let's bash every freakin' proposal that comes to light, because we have so much faith in the consolidation, dominance, and too-large-to-fail mentality of the alternative. Of course Spirit, Jetblue, and Southwest were startups at one point. But no matter. Bash away.

Its ironic you say that to me, read any of my other posts im all about more competition and i viametly defend VX|B6|F9 every chance i get..i know their not 'fresh new starts' but my only point about California Pacific is, there doesnt seem to be anything happening months after the hooha of getting their first plane. Once you have your first bird it should be promotion, promotion, promotion to get moving..something is def wrong which is leading to silence.
 
User avatar
mariner
Posts: 18090
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2001 7:29 am

RE: New Airline To Serve Florida Markets

Fri Nov 09, 2012 6:55 am

Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 17):
I got the impression after reading the two articles that perhaps CRJ's would connect regionally somewhere in the northeast, feeding a potential Florida flight. I might be mistaken.

I got that impression, too, but then I re-read both articles and he says that will happen if there's enough demand:

"He says the service would start with 50-seat regional jets, and use bigger aircraft if there’s demand."

I'll say good luck to anyone who can actually get an airline off the ground. It's their money, or their investors.

Quoting NWADTWE16 (Reply 21):
i know their not 'fresh new starts' but my only point about California Pacific is, there doesnt seem to be anything happening months after the hooha of getting their first plane. Once you have your first bird it should be promotion, promotion, promotion to get moving..something is def wrong which is leading to silence.

Off-topic, I guess, but I take your point and we are discussing start-ups, so:

http://encinitas.patch.com/articles/...-airlines-plans-spring-launch-date

"California Pacific Airlines Plans Spring Launch Date"

mariner
aeternum nauta

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: BobPatterson, CF-CPI, DavecFlyer, dmorbust, Fiend, Gatwickmatt, Google [Bot], GSPFlyer, ikolkyo, jm079, ktrick45, Miami, Qatara340, Revelation, SANFan, swacle, Tokushima, zanl188 and 295 guests