panamair
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Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Thu Nov 15, 2012 4:50 pm

In today's press release touting the completion of the Delta 747-400 fleet upgrades (flat-beds, nose-to-tail AVOD, etc), I caught this little bit from Glenn Hauenstein:

"....The 747 is an iconic aircraft and with this nose-to-tail modification complete, it will serve as the crown jewel of our fleet taking our customers everywhere they want to go – from Australia, Asia, the Middle East and back again....."

http://news.delta.com/index.php?s=43&item=1775

As many of you probably know, DL currently sends its 744s to Asia (NRT, NGO, MNL) and the Middle East (TLV) only.

All schedules still show the 77L operating LAX-SYD into the forseeable future though.
 
spiritair97
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Thu Nov 15, 2012 4:59 pm

Quoting panamair (Thread starter):

My guess is that it was just either added in there for dramatic effect or foreshadowing od times to come.
 
FlyASAGuy2005
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Thu Nov 15, 2012 5:07 pm

Wouldn't surprise me to see it on LAX-SYD for S13. Don't forget, the 777s are up for PSVs as well. Not the 77Ls that do LAX-SYD but those will be affected too, schedule wise, because of the checks. Not saying that's the reason but another point to think about.

Who knows. Maybe it was a mistake in the sense that he was just motoring off sexy destinations but I doubt it. A man like Glen in his capacity at DL doesn't make those sort of slips. Kind of like when RA outright said they will be trying SEA-LHR. That one was surprising.

[Edited 2012-11-15 09:12:09]
What gets measured gets done.
 
PIEAvantiP180
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Thu Nov 15, 2012 5:30 pm

I believe this is finally the confirmation of the long running rumor that LAX-SYD will go 747-400. Does anybody know how this route is performing for them and will an up gauge from 777 to 747 be way to many seats on the route for them? The 747 only has 5J and 6Y+ seats more then the 777 in DL configuration but has 92 regular Y seats more, I hope they don't have to dump fares to much in order to fill 103 extra seats per flight.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Thu Nov 15, 2012 6:35 pm

Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 3):
I believe this is finally the confirmation of the long running rumor that LAX-SYD will go 747-400.

The quote is vague in context and doesn't say anything specific. It very well could mean they are planning to put the 744 on it in the future, but it also could just an inclusive list of international regions.

As of today, the future schedule all the way out is still loaded as a 77L. Confirmation would be when they actually load a 744 in the schedule.
 
PIEAvantiP180
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Thu Nov 15, 2012 7:18 pm

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 4):

You are absolutely correct. It's more of my wishful thinking. I'm planning another trip down under next year to visit family and would like to fly the 747, flew the 77L last year. I just wish they would re-time the LAX to TPA flight back to 10am as it would provide the perfect connection timing for the SYD return flight to LAX.
 
LAXintl
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Thu Nov 15, 2012 7:33 pm

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 2):
Wouldn't surprise me to see it on LAX-SYD for S13.

The only problem is that is not the peak demand time for Australia.

Peak travel period is the northern winter especially December - February, so using a 744 would be not very logical during S13.

Also shifting to a 744 would kill the thriving southbound cargo business DL manages on the route using the 777.


p.s. - Below are the DL load factors at SYD for last 12-months.

Sep11 - 75.7%
Oct11 - 81.8%
Nov11 - 75.8%
Dec11 - 82.2%
Jan12 - 88.3%
Feb12 - 81.7%
Mar12 - 67.9%
Apr12 - 74.6%
May12 - 70.4%
Jun12 - 75.3%
Jul12 - 81.2%
Aug12 - 70.0%

[Edited 2012-11-15 12:23:50]
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B4REAL
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:49 pm

Note that DL (well, NW at the time) removed the fuel tanks in the rear horizontal stabilizers of the 744 fleet, slightly reducing their range. Not sure if this will impact their ability to do this type of route.
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AA737-823
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Thu Nov 15, 2012 9:20 pm

Quoting panamair (Thread starter):
As many of you probably know, DL currently sends its 744s to Asia (NRT, NGO, MNL) and the Middle East (TLV) only.

How can it be, that DL has 16 747's and only sends them to four foreign cities!?!?!?
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Thu Nov 15, 2012 9:27 pm

DTW-NRT
JFK-NRT
ATL-NRT
HNL-NRT
SEA-NRT (Summer 2013)

DTW-NGO

JFK-TLV

NGO-MNL
NRT-MNL

There is excess slack in the fleet, and even more so since mods have been underway.

One aircraft has been doing a significant amount of military charters over the past month, and will be utilized on some domestic flying (DTW-LAX, ATL-LAX) over the Thanksgiving holiday weekend.
 
modesto2
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Thu Nov 15, 2012 10:32 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 6):
p.s. - Below are the DL load factors at SYD for last 12-months.

Just out of curiosity, where do you get those numbers? Some of them are kinda accurate and some of them are not accurate (when compared with company data).
 
777STL
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:31 pm

DL may very well upgauge to the 744, but that vague, flowery statement is hardly indicative of that.

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 2):
A man like Glen in his capacity at DL doesn't make those sort of slips.

I highly doubt a man like Glen, in charge of one of the largest airlines in the world, has the time to review every bit of marketing drivel that comes out of a company the size of DL.

Quoting AA737-823 (Reply 8):
How can it be, that DL has 16 747's and only sends them to four foreign cities!?!?!?

And how many different cities does DL serve NRT from alone? Six? Seven?

Hell, AA has 47 sum odd 777s and serves a relative handful of cities with those as well.

LHR, NRT, Shanghai, Beijing, Madrid, Seoul, Sao Paulo, Rio, and?
PHX based
 
tullamarine
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:47 pm

There has been considerable specualtion that VA and DL are working to shuffle their fleets around a bit so that MEL-LAX can become daily. Currently it is only 3 times weekly using VA 77Ws which are load restricted westbound. A DL 77L would be better suited to the route and releasing the DL 77L currently doing SYD-LAX would achieve this.
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NWADTWE16
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:06 am

Love this thread and hoping to see the beautiful 744's flying to more cities now that the mods are done. Hope someone can keep us looped about what new pairs are on the horizon
 
FlyASAGuy2005
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:47 am

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 6):
Peak travel period is the northern winter especially December - February, so using a 744 would be not very logical during S13.

Didn't know that. Thanks.

Quoting 777STL (Reply 11):
I highly doubt a man like Glen, in charge of one of the largest airlines in the world, has the time to review every bit of marketing drivel that comes out of a company the size of DL.

Okay...

In other news, SEA-HND was approved.
What gets measured gets done.
 
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mayor
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 12:57 am

I think many on here are guilty of overthinking what Glen's statement meant. He mentioned the "fleet" and, in turn mentioned that it (the fleet) could carry customers to Africa, the Middle East and Asia. He was referring to the FLEET.
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jporterfi
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 3:47 am

If LAX-SYD is upguaged to a 744, does this mean that the ATL-LAX leg that brings the 77L to LAX from ATL will also switch to a 744? Or would that leg possibly be downgauged to a 763 (assuming DL doesn't regularly have high load factors on that flight due to the extra capacity compared to a 763) since DL wouldn't need that 77L in LAX anymore?
 
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mayor
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 3:59 am

Quoting mayor (Reply 15):
I think many on here are guilty of overthinking what Glen's statement meant. He mentioned the "fleet" and, in turn mentioned that it (the fleet) could carry customers to Africa, the Middle East and Asia. He was referring to the FLEET.

Case in point:

Quoting jporterfi (Reply 16):
If LAX-SYD is upguaged to a 744, does this mean that the ATL-LAX leg that brings the 77L to LAX from ATL will also switch to a 744? Or would that leg possibly be downgauged to a 763 (assuming DL doesn't regularly have high load factors on that flight due to the extra capacity compared to a 763) since DL wouldn't need that 77L in LAX anymore?
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 4:03 am

Quoting mayor (Reply 15):
He was referring to the FLEET.

Thats how I interpret the quote at first glance.

Quoting jporterfi (Reply 16):
If LAX-SYD is upguaged to a 744, does this mean that the ATL-LAX leg that brings the 77L to LAX from ATL will also switch to a 744? Or would that leg possibly be downgauged to a 763 (assuming DL doesn't regularly have high load factors on that flight due to the extra capacity compared to a 763) since DL wouldn't need that 77L in LAX anymore?

It depends.... There are a few ways they could route aircraft (in theory)

NRT-LAX & NRT-SYD are both flown with 77L
NRT-HND is flown with an A332

If LAX-SYD was flown with a 744 they would need to connect the aircraft back to the rest of the network - either ATL, DTW, or NRT.
 
Transpac787
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 4:15 am

Quoting B4REAL (Reply 7):

Note that DL (well, NW at the time) removed the fuel tanks in the rear horizontal stabilizers of the 744 fleet, slightly reducing their range. Not sure if this will impact their ability to do this type of route.

Absolutely incorrect.

The 747-451's at DL routinely fly with fuel in the stab, almost every 13+ hour flight they do.
 
spiritair97
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 5:37 am

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 18):

"NRT-LAX & NRT-SYD are both flown with 77L
NRT-HND is flown with an a332"

LOL I assume you meant LAX-SYD and LAX-HND? Don't mean to nitpick, but just to avoid confusion.
 
LAXintl
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 6:52 am

Quoting modesto2 (Reply 10):
Just out of curiosity, where do you get those numbers? Some of them are kinda accurate and some of them are not accurate (when compared with company data).

DOT T-100s and Australia Dept of Infrastructure & Transport.

Loads would be based on round trip and also I believe include things like non-revs.
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qf002
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 7:15 am

Awesome as it would be, I'm not confident it's going to happen. I'm sure there are all sorts of internal discussions where SYD and the 744 gets brought up, but an airline with load figures in the 80's at peak season shouldn't be adding capacity to such a congested route.

Quoting modesto2 (Reply 10):
Just out of curiosity, where do you get those numbers?

The excel spreadsheet at this page, I imagine.

These are the figures that the government requires the airlines to give them, so it's safe to assume that they are pretty accurate.

Quoting PSUDTWSCE (Reply 18):
If LAX-SYD was flown with a 744 they would need to connect the aircraft back to the rest of the network - either ATL, DTW, or NRT.

The existing SYD-LAX continue onto ATL with the same aircraft -- I imagine they would do the same thing with a 744.
 
YULWinterSkies
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 4:11 pm

Quoting 777STL (Reply 11):
And how many different cities does DL serve NRT from alone? Six? Seven?

Quoting DTW.SCE" class="quote" target="_blank">PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 9):

DTW-NRT
JFK-NRT
ATL-NRT
HNL-NRT
SEA-NRT (Summer 2013)

Add MSP, LAX, SFO and PDX to these 5 cities above. MSP used to be served by a 744, now by a 77L. LAX is 77L currently, SFO and PDX is 767.
If including US territories, DL also has multiple dailies to GUM and SPN out of NRT (and a few other major Asian airports).

NRT is a hub, so US mainland-NRT is a hub-to-hub routing for the most part, and hub to point for SFO, PDX (and HNL, a hub-to-point route mainly targeted at Asian vacationers who go say aloha to the Hawaiian islands.)

Makes for 8 cities on the mainland, 9 in the 50 states, and 11 including Western Pacific territories, plus whichever other city I may have forgotten about. Yes NRT is a massive hub for DL.

Add to that a large number of Asian destinations served from NRT, but DL has no 5th freedom rights on these routes, they can only carry passengers connecting to/from a flight to one of these 11 US cities.
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VC10er
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 5:07 pm

I find it very interesting that Delta promotes the 747 so much in advertising etc. Before the merger Delta was never committed to being a 747 airline. Now that they have 16 it seems to be a source of pride for them...conversely, United has always been a heavy user of 747's and while today they are down to just 23 of them, they are often the source of grief for United. Funny that! (and refitted with a great First class cabin in the nose, it's one of United's better rides- not the back sadly)
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brilondon
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 5:20 pm

Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 3):
I believe this is finally the confirmation of the long running rumor that LAX-SYD will go 747-400. Does anybody know how this route is performing for them and will an up gauge from 777 to 747 be way to many seats on the route for them? The 747 only has 5J and 6Y+ seats more then the 777 in DL configuration but has 92 regular Y seats more, I hope they don't have to dump fares to much in order to fill 103 extra seats per flight.

They won't be utilizing the 744 on the LAX-SYD in the foreseeable future. I deffinatly hope not, I much prefer the 77L in business than the 744, unless I can get seat 1A.
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davescj
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 5:22 pm

Quoting VC10er (Reply 24):
Before the merger Delta was never committed to being a 747 airline. Now that they have 16 it seems to be a source of pride for them...

I think this has to do with the icon nature of the 747 in general. I do not see DL ordering either the 748 or A380. As the 744s age out of the fleet, I would expect DL to make the 777 the "icon" aircraft of the fleet.

Dave
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PIEAvantiP180
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 5:35 pm

Quoting brilondon (Reply 25):
I much prefer the 77L in business than the 744, unless I can get seat 1A.

The 77L and 747 in DL fleet have almost the exact same J seat. Is it that you prefer the inward facing J seats on the 777 compared to the outward facing seats on the 747?
 
panamair
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 5:39 pm

Quoting brilondon (Reply 25):
I much prefer the 77L in business than the 744, unless I can get seat 1A.

The refurbished 744 Business seat is better in most ways than the 77L seat - facing towards the window, longer bed when fully reclined, center seats that allow pax to face each other, and the AVOD selection I believe is also greater than on the 777 (300+ movies, for example, versus 100+)
 
brilondon
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 8:44 pm

Quoting PIEAvantiP180 (Reply 27):

The 77L and 747 in DL fleet have almost the exact same J seat. Is it that you prefer the inward facing J seats on the 777 compared to the outward facing seats on the 747?

Yes.

Quoting panamair (Reply 28):


The refurbished 744 Business seat is better in most ways than the 77L seat - facing towards the window, longer bed when fully reclined, center seats that allow pax to face each other, and the AVOD selection I believe is also greater than on the 777 (300+ movies, for example, versus 100+)

I am confused. You said that the AVOD selection is greater on the 777 than on the 747, but you were talking about the 77L seat being not as good as the 747, so I have to choose between more movies that I don't want to watch.
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panamair
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 8:50 pm

Quoting brilondon (Reply 29):
You said that the AVOD selection is greater on the 777 than on the 747, but you were talking about the 77L seat being not as good as the 747,

I said:

Quoting panamair (Reply 28):
and the AVOD selection I believe is also greater than on the 777 (300+ movies, for example, versus 100+)

I said the AVOD selection is greater THAN on the 777...maybe you missed the "than"?
 
brilondon
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 8:58 pm

Quoting panamair (Reply 30):


Quoting brilondon (Reply 29):
You said that the AVOD selection is greater on the 777 than on the 747, but you were talking about the 77L seat being not as good as the 747,

I said:

Quoting panamair (Reply 28):
and the AVOD selection I believe is also greater than on the 777 (300+ movies, for example, versus 100+)

I said the AVOD selection is greater THAN on the 777...maybe you missed the "than"?

I apologize, I am working on a 10 hour time change today and have just awoken from only 3 hours sleep. I now see what you are talking about. I still prefer the seating in the 777.
Rush for ever; Yankees all the way!!
 
mogandoCI
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 9:21 pm

Quoting YULWinterSkies (Reply 23):
Add to that a large number of Asian destinations served from NRT, but DL has no 5th freedom rights on these routes, they can only carry passengers connecting to/from a flight to one of these 11 US cities.

Which ones don't have 5th freedom ? I'd imagine only the Japanese domestic ones ?
 
Rdh3e
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Fri Nov 16, 2012 10:23 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 6):
p.s. - Below are the DL load factors at SYD for last 12-months.

Ouch, so in otherwords: underwhelming. Especially with only 269 seats on the 77L.
 
9252fly
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sat Nov 17, 2012 3:09 am

Quoting RDH3E (Reply 33):
Ouch, so in otherwords: underwhelming.

Yeah, I too would call that underwhelming. Mind you, we don't know much about what they're generating on the cargo side to compensate. My guess is that it's likely breaking even and that in itself is a good sign.
 
cessna2
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:16 am

Quoting YULWinterSkies (Reply 23):
MSP used to be served by a 744, now by a 77L.

That will be changing. Expect to see MSP-NRT served with a 747 next year. And from a friend that works with DL. The SYD-LAX route, (not RT) consistently has a high load factor.
 
ZK-NBT
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:42 am

Quoting tullamarine (Reply 12):
There has been considerable specualtion that VA and DL are working to shuffle their fleets around a bit so that MEL-LAX can become daily. Currently it is only 3 times weekly using VA 77Ws which are load restricted westbound. A DL 77L would be better suited to the route and releasing the DL 77L currently doing SYD-LAX would achieve this.

Thats what i've heard/read in the past. With SYD-LAX going 744 for DL and the freed 77Ls going to MEL-LAX with VAs freed 77Ws going to either BNE-LAX or AUH. It seems plasible to me, particularly now that DL have upgraded the 744s.
 
deltal1011man
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sat Nov 17, 2012 6:44 am

Quoting panamair (Thread starter):

Wont happen for S13. No word yet for W13.

but Delta's goal number one is getting the 47 on ATL-GRU.

Quoting mayor (Reply 15):

Then his wording is terrible.
1) the Delta fleet hits a heck of a lot more than the three areas listed.
2) "it will serve as the crown jewel of our fleet taking our customers everywhere they want to go – from Australia, Asia, the Middle East and back again....." I really don't get how anyone gets the Delta fleet out of that. He is clearly talking about the 747(or like i said....his English is scary poor)

*note not saying it matters.....*

Quoting jporterfi (Reply 16):

LAX-NRT could go 747 and that would be the likely thing.

Quoting mayor (Reply 17):

uh....I don't get why thats a point. Its not rocket science to get a 747 to LAX for the SYD flight...

Quoting qf002 (Reply 22):
I imagine they would do the same thing with a 744.

not likely.
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LAXintl
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sat Nov 17, 2012 8:35 am

Quoting 9252fly (Reply 34):
Mind you, we don't know much about what they're generating on the cargo side to compensate.

Cargo is public info also.

Without digging up the numbers month by month, DL does so so also.

For example for the year of 2011 they averaged about 9.3tons per flight LAX-SYD and 3.7tons on return

As comparison United did much worse from the US with mere couple tons per flight (the 744 is weight restricted) but managed almost 13 tons on the SYD to US return leg.
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B4REAL
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sat Nov 17, 2012 1:21 pm

Quoting Transpac787 (Reply 19):
The 747-451's at DL routinely fly with fuel in the stab, almost every 13+ hour flight they do.

Thanks for the clarification - I can't quite find the original post, but someone on this forum "sounded legit" in telling me that before. It also made sense to me as I don't think DL has the 744 on any route > 7,000 miles.
B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
 
mplsjefe
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sat Nov 17, 2012 6:00 pm

Quoting cessna2 (Reply 35):


Quoting YULWinterSkies (Reply 23):
MSP used to be served by a 744, now by a 77L.

That will be changing. Expect to see MSP-NRT served with a 747 next year. And from a friend that works with DL. The SYD-LAX route, (not RT) consistently has a high load factor.

Getting our 744 service back would be great! Fingers crossed. The 77L is nice, but nothing beats the 744!
 
Transpac787
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:28 am

Quoting B4REAL (Reply 40):
Thanks for the clarification - I can't quite find the original post, but someone on this forum "sounded legit" in telling me that before. It also made sense to me as I don't think DL has the 744 on any route > 7,000 miles.

No problemo.

There was a brief period in the early 2000's where NW did, indeed, fly without fuel in the stab of any 744's but this was due to AD compliance and fuel tank inspections (think TWA 800). Once the AD's were resolved, they've been able to fly with fuel in the stabs ever since.

As for flying distances in excess of 7000 miles, the 744 has operated DTW-PVG (7137mi) on and off since SOC. Really just depends on the particular schedule.
 
FI642
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sun Nov 18, 2012 4:49 am

NW did operate "best flight" between LAX and SYD with dry tails. While the additional range was minimal, there were often restrictions. Several of my non-rev friends didn't get on what they thought were okay flights. My friends at DL say they are more comfortable with the 777 on the route right now.
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Transpac787
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:41 am

Quoting FI642 (Reply 43):
While the additional range was minimal, there were often restrictions.

The stab tank holds over 22,000# of gas. Not exactly "minimal".
 
FI642
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sun Nov 18, 2012 10:27 am

The additional range is 350 miles. Given the overall range, it really isn't much.
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tymnbalewne
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sun Nov 18, 2012 10:15 pm

Quoting Transpac787 (Reply 43):
The stab tank holds over 22,000# of gas. Not exactly "minimal".

In my estimation it's very minimal. An additional 4.5% or so?

From Boeing.com:
The 747-400 carries 3,300 gallons (12,490 L) of fuel in the horizontal (tail) stabilizer, allowing it to fly an additional 350 nautical miles.

Source:http://www.boeing.com/commercial/747family/pf/pf_facts.html
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Transpac787
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sun Nov 18, 2012 10:48 pm

Quoting FI642 (Reply 44):
The additional range is 350 miles. Given the overall range, it really isn't much.

Considering that stab fuel can frequently mean the difference between being able to get the plane somewhere nonstop with a destination alternate or short releasing it, it makes all the difference.

Not everything is quite so simplistic as straight range figures.
 
FI642
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sun Nov 18, 2012 11:23 pm

Having done weight and balance on the -400, sometimes tail fuel is not always able to be calculated into the equation. Depending on the load and payload distribution there are times it cannot be used. Range figure are always best case scenarios. In my experience, better to stop for fuel if need be, than suffer a fuel emergency.
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tymnbalewne
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Sun Nov 18, 2012 11:48 pm

Are there any routes (pax or cargo) where the 744 is the appropriate aircraft and the addition of the 350nm means the difference between non-stop and one-stop?
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FI642
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RE: Is Delta Sending The 744 To SYD?

Mon Nov 19, 2012 12:08 am

Negligible additional range way my initial point. Oddly enough, I never sent a 744BCF to ANC, always to the sandbox.

Quoting tymnbalewne (Reply 50):

I too am unaware of any routes that require this. I have sent a message to both someone at DL and UA to see if there are any routes that do. Lets see if they get back to me.
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