MS861
Posts: 35
Joined: Sun Jul 30, 2000 5:27 pm

KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Fri Oct 20, 2000 8:17 pm

Can anyone please tell me what they think of KLM, and how they rate amongst other airlines?? They ranked 4 out of 5 stars on http://www.airlinequality.com and I thought this was impressive considering Emirates and SIA were anked 5 stars. There is not much at all on their website that says about inflight service, route network, and not very good fleet details. What are their f/a 's like? Would you fly them? What can you tell me?
Thanks,

MS861
 
gkirk
Posts: 23347
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2000 3:29 am

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Fri Oct 20, 2000 8:27 pm

Well, Ive flown KLM uk from Glasgow to Amsterdam if thats any help? They were good, good service, the seats were fairly comfortable as well. From this experience i definitely would fly KLM.

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bibeb
Posts: 26
Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2000 8:33 pm

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Fri Oct 20, 2000 8:45 pm

Please note that KLM use to be one of Europe's best, but they lost that reputation completely. Their aircraft doesn't have PTV, their service is just not that good compared to others (no First class, no sleeper seats) and their staff is not that helpfull as other (asian/american) crews. Booking KLM and flying NW on a cramped DC-10 is something other (especially in the middle of the 5 middle seats) that Dutch people don't like. They fly 747-300 which are converted 747-200, so KLM needs fleet renewal within a few years as well. Furthermore, apart from the excellent alliance with NW, they cannot succeed in getting other airlines involved.
 
gkirk
Posts: 23347
Joined: Thu Jun 15, 2000 3:29 am

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Fri Oct 20, 2000 8:49 pm

If i had to choose between flying KLM or British Airways however, i would choose BA as at least if you are flying to the US you are guaranteed a fairly comfortable a/c. However I would choose KLM over a number of other carriers.
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
SilverWing
Posts: 91
Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2000 7:53 pm

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Fri Oct 20, 2000 10:58 pm

I´ve flown KLM a few times from AMS to Beijing. They used to operate 743s on this route but changed to 744 a few months ago. But on this aircraft the seat pitch is even smaller than on the 743 (or at least to me it seemed so). Service is ok but nothing special. Like Bibeb mentioned, no PTVs and the food is the usual airline stuff. However, once I was upgraded from Economy to Business Class on the way back from Beijing which was very nice. I heard that they do this quite often when Business isn´t fully booked. But I think you have to be quite lucky to be one of the chosen few. I think I would give them 3 stars.
 
lima
Posts: 1090
Joined: Sun May 30, 1999 11:37 am

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Sat Oct 21, 2000 1:30 am

I tried them four years ago and since then try to fly them whenever is possible. I flown intraeuropean and longhaul (South America). They are very good to me, especially in terms of punctuality, connections at Schiphol and the friendliness of its cabin personnel. Cabin staff to me contribute to the good flying experience with KLM, but is not surprising because the Dutch people is in general that nice so they are true ambassadors to their country.
 
caribb
Posts: 1504
Joined: Mon Nov 08, 1999 6:33 am

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Sat Oct 21, 2000 2:00 am

I use KLM to regularly fly Montreal-Amsterdam-Montreal. I have also flown them from Schiphol to Venice.. In general they are good. Food is average to good depending on the flight. The F/As are very professional and accomodating but I found Air France's better. Service is good too but again I find Air France better on this level. Interior colours of the aircraft are quiet Dutch blues.. nice but nothing to write home about. The MD-11s are nice jets and seating space is adequate but not as good as Air Canada. The 747-300s are also nice, nicer than the MD-11s in my opinion. Air Canada's A340s and Air France's 747-400s were nicer planes overall. Schiphol is the ace in the hole.. it is a great airport, the best I have ever used. In general though I'd have to rank them pretty high. They are not necessarily the best at anything but they do everything very well... kinda like a Honda  
 
jrebel
Posts: 169
Joined: Sun Aug 27, 2000 5:14 am

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Sat Oct 21, 2000 5:02 am

I have been flying KLM regularly for almost 41 years. My first flight was WAW-AMS on a Viscount in December 1959, at the age of three weeks. For some reason my recollection of that event is somewhat hazy! Within three months I had made six flights.

In most respects I would say that KLM can be described as average at best. The one exception is on board service. Over the years I have found that KLM's flight attendants consistently provide friendly and efficient service.

johan rebel

 
dutchjet
Posts: 7714
Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:13 am

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Sat Oct 21, 2000 5:38 am

As our national carrier, I am sorry to say that KLM has lost its edge in recent years. Locally, we think that the airline has been so busy looking for partners and alliances that it has had little time to think about its own service and reputation. In economy, KLM is very average; they are in the process of introducing an upgraded business class that I have not yet tried. KLM is safe and reliable, but as far as comfort and service on board, I personally think that the US carriers do a better job at the moment. Shame.
 
patroni
Posts: 1372
Joined: Sat Aug 14, 1999 7:49 am

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Sat Oct 21, 2000 7:23 am

Before I got Nonrev rights I used to fly KLM very often during the past 7 years and made around 100 flights on them so far. Yes, it's true that the longhaul fleet could offer something more in Economy class like PTV's or even these "ears" at the seats so that your head doesn't fall in the gap between the seat and the window when you're sleeping. Other airlines are definitely leading the way in longhaul Eco.

Longrange Business Class is fine. I didn't try ´the new WorldBusiness Class yet, but flew the old C-Class on the MD11, 747-400 and 767. Compared to BA's (old) Club World, KLM was better.

Regarding the frequent flier program, KLM is an absolute winner. In 90% of the cases I fly Economy (=when i pay myself). KLM accepts all fares for the collection of miles, so that I own a Flying Dutchman Royal Wing Card for several years and enjoy the benefits of lounge access, waiting list priority etc etc.... At BA I wouldn't have got NOTHING because they don't care for their lowyield customers, regardless how frequent they travel on them. I used to fly BA a lot, even had an Executive Club Gold Card, but suddenly they changed their policy and basically kicked me out of the program by not accepting my further Eco flights any more.... shame on them...

The absolute TOP advantage of KLM is the professionality and friendliness of their cabin and ground staff... I really can't think of any bad incident involving a KLM staff member - except in the USA where they are (mis)handled by Northworst, which unfortunately is one of the worst airlines I've ever flown - and I flew them too much :-(

Within Europe their flights are fine, uneventful and reliable. AMS Schiphol is the best airport I know. I really got to find out KLM's good quality after I had to fly now a few times with Luxair....

Best regards,

Thomas
 
A330_DTW
Posts: 357
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2000 9:29 am

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Sun Oct 22, 2000 9:45 pm

Great inflight service, but groundstaff in Amsterdam are quite rude.
Don't expect to get your luggage, either, if you check it through AMS. I've even checked in locally in AMS and didn't get my luggage on a NON-STOP flight to DTW with 2hr checkin!
 
CV990
Posts: 4224
Joined: Sat May 22, 1999 3:49 am

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Mon Oct 23, 2000 12:18 am

Hi!

For me, KLM is a big reference in civil aviation. I've been growing with them since the early 60's when I remember seeing my first DC-8-50 from KLM with KLM in one side and VIASA in the other side, they are a great airline and they have a great network. Please don't forget that Holland is a small country but with the movement and the passengers they fly I thing KLM is very good on that! I personally flew just once with them but I don't forget that flight!!! It was on 1980/09/01 from AMS to MAD on the DC-9-15 PH-DNC, that was a great flight on a great rare plane!!!


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Guest

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Mon Oct 23, 2000 2:07 am

As KLM is a very old airline, te board of shareholders is too!! They are scared to open their mouth and they listen to much to the dutch government!! This is, in combination with the rules for Amsterdam Airport, KLM can get into a lot of problems in the near future.

Anyway, this is not really an answer to your question. Cabin Staff is ok, food is better than a couple of years ago and the Flight Entertainment in Business Class is ok, economy sux! US airlines are, for what you pay, much better than European. Don't know why, just is!

Best regards, and hope you have a nice flight.....

Anton
 
jrebel
Posts: 169
Joined: Sun Aug 27, 2000 5:14 am

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Mon Oct 23, 2000 10:36 pm

New Recaro seats with wrap-around headrests will be installed in Y class on all KLM longhaul aircraft, starting this month. Starting November World Business Class will be revamped as well.

johan rebel
 
OE-LDA
Posts: 207
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2000 5:29 pm

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Mon Oct 23, 2000 10:50 pm

In my opinion, KLM is okay, not great, but reliable and on a constant level. Especially on long routes they are worth their money. And on European business class their seats are better than most airlines'.
I am totally missing basics and clueless about airline flying!
 
Guest

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Tue Oct 24, 2000 2:07 am

I have just returned from a RTW trip on NW, CX and KLM. Of the three, the service on KLM was the worst especailly the check in procedure. At best the service could be described as mediocre and it did not leave any lasting impression on me.
 
OO-VEG
Posts: 1217
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2000 5:31 pm

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Tue Oct 24, 2000 2:43 am

I think it is more a problem of Schiphol than KLM but my father had to wait for over half an hour untill his lugagge arrived at the airport. Reason.... the aircraft landed at 5.25h instead of 5.55h, so they were half an hour too early. The aircraft came out Jakarta and at their stop in Singapore it was already known that the aircraft would come in half an hour earlier like it most of the time does.
Well I think that is not a very good service although I can understand there is not much personell on the airport so early in the morning.
 
Guest

RE: KLM:Royal Dutch Airlines

Tue Oct 24, 2000 5:21 am

You know I've never flown KLM, but I've flown through AMS Schiphol which is by far one of the world's best airports. So clean, so modern, comfortable, large, airy, and friendly. Very safe too, lots of police I remember. So they have a striking advantage there. I'm a big fan of the Dutch people and society (very tolerant, friendly, warm, and gorgeous women), so if the airline is anything like that, than its got to be first rate.

This winter I'll be in Amsterdam for a week, and while low-fare is the most important element of the carrier I ultimately choose, I'd look forward to KLM. I'll probably redeem FF credit on DL, even though those batards stuck me up in AMS for about 6 hours 2 summers ago becuase of a late arrival from Kennedy. But at Schiphol it was great!