lostsound
Topic Author
Posts: 453
Joined: Mon May 21, 2012 1:43 pm

Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 4:24 pm

Quote:
Introducing Air Canada’s new leisure airline with stylishly affordable service to holiday spots in Europe and the Caribbean. Benefit from Air Canada’s extensive network for smooth connections to flights departing daily from Toronto and Montreal. Service begins July 1, 2013. It’s time to go more. Where will your next holiday take you?
http://www.aircanada.com/en/about/rouge.html

The website has all the information on routes, etc...
Livery is nothing special, but it's pretty eye drawing Imo.

I'm Curious to see how the cabin will be outfitted.

[Edited 2012-12-18 08:28:00]
 
etops1
Posts: 828
Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2005 12:26 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 4:30 pm

Yeah um , Why do they think its a good idea to do this ?
 
finnishway
Posts: 440
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2012 5:17 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 4:33 pm

Quoting etops1 (Reply 1):
Why do they think its a good idea to do this ?

It is a trend nowadays.
 
FlyKev
Crew
Posts: 1295
Joined: Mon Jan 16, 2006 5:34 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 4:34 pm

Wow, sounds just like Air Transat to me - then again as this is most likely their intentions.

Any word on what the cabins are going to look like? Will be curious if they can beat the new TS cabin product wise.

Kev.
The white zone is for immediate loading and unloading of passengers only
 
User avatar
yowza
Posts: 4275
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 7:01 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 4:43 pm

That's a pretty smart looking livery and YYZ-EDI is a godsend for me. Whether this is great idea however... I'm not so sure.

YOWza
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 15251
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 4:54 pm

I was thinking it should be called Drapeau Rouge (Red Flag)--I wasn't far off! At least they have the same person running it that came up with its predecessor Tango; but I'm sure it's *totally* different this time!

" In 2001, while working as an independent consultant, Ben led the team that launched Tango, Air Canada's pioneering strategy in a separately branded operation and in 2002 he joined Air Canada full time as Managing Director of Tango."

What could go wrong.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
crosswinds21
Posts: 163
Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2009 10:46 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 4:57 pm

Ok, while I am by no means an expert in LCCs, I do see some things here that make me question the viability of this venture. It seems that this "Rogue" is not at all separate from Air Canada itself and thus not really a true LCC. There are items such as:

-Booking on the AC website with AC flight numbers (operated by Rogue)
-Ability to connect to/from other AC flights in YYZ/YUL
-Ability to accrue miles
-AC Lounge access under certain conditions
-Complimentary meals on flights to Europe
-And so on...

So basically, I don't understand how this is really an LCC and I don't see how this model is different from the failed LCC spinoffs such as Song and TED. (Yes, I understand that the actual flights will be operated by a separate group with different wages, etc., but that in itself does not guarantee a successful airline.) I am also guessing that the managament/opearations/strategy/planning/etc. will also be done by AC and not by Rogue? If this is the case, then how is this venture going to succeed?

Again, like I said, I'm not at all an expert in this field and I'm just stating some of my observations. So if I'm wrong in any of this, I'd love to understand how.

Thanks...
 
sw733
Posts: 5302
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 6:19 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:01 pm

Quoting yowza (Reply 4):
That's a pretty smart looking livery and YYZ-EDI is a godsend for me. Whether this is great idea however... I'm not so sure.

It definitely makes sense to me...in the summer.
 
skipness1E
Posts: 3378
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:18 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:05 pm

The livery is like the Air Canada of old.
What about DUB? Was that not expected to be included?

Wonder why they went for EDI over GLA? YYZ has never managed more than once weekly with Worldways then Air Transat, indeed it was recently dropped. Good news though.
 
VCy
Posts: 323
Joined: Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:01 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:05 pm

the livery looks gorgeous!  
I'd expect more leisure destinations to Europe tho, like BCN, FCO, MXP, NCE  
 
YXD172
Posts: 340
Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2008 3:38 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:18 pm

Quoting crosswinds21 (Reply 6):

-Booking on the AC website with AC flight numbers (operated by Rogue)
-Ability to connect to/from other AC flights in YYZ/YUL
-Ability to accrue miles
-AC Lounge access under certain conditions
-Complimentary meals on flights to Europe
-And so on...

While some of these are definitely not your typical LCC style, I have a feeling that the new LCC is mainly geared at lowering staffing costs and flying higher density aircraft. Using AC's existing site makes sense, and meals to Europe are needed unless they want to reduce service below TS / WG. The other factors allow them to offer three tiers of fares, and I'm sure that the extra revenue from Lattitude will more than offset the extra costs if they can sell the higher priced tickets.

That said, I'm not too sure how I feel about 29" pitch on the A319s! I avoided 5G flights for that reason, and with WS and TS offering more legroom (and better service in TS's case)... Even WG offers complimentary food (and wine!) on their Caribbean flights, so I guess it all comes down to price.
Radial engines don't leak oil, they are just marking their territory!
 
northstardc4m
Posts: 2724
Joined: Fri Apr 28, 2000 11:23 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:20 pm

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 8):
Wonder why they went for EDI over GLA? YYZ has never managed more than once weekly with Worldways then Air Transat, indeed it was recently dropped. Good news though.

I would guess they are offering it in conjunction with a group tour or something.

I'll hold my breath on the livery till i see it in person, looks good though.
Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
 
mpsrent
Posts: 112
Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2006 3:49 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:22 pm

I was hoping for YYZ to MAN as such a large, central and popular British destination for Canadians could use more flight options. In any case I can understand why they selected EDI to avoid strong competition with TS while DUB and GLA are well serviced by TS.
 
SPQR
Posts: 102
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 3:03 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:24 pm

gah what a horrible name, works OK in French I guess, but in English who would want to fly an airline named after make-up?
 
kaitak
Posts: 8942
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 1999 5:49 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:24 pm

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 8):
The livery is like the Air Canada of old.
What about DUB? Was that not expected to be included?

I was wondering that myself; still, probably a good thing, because it means that mainline AC is staying on the DUB route. I have a horrible feeling that they might go 8 abreast on these 767s and that's not a comfortable prospect for anyone, complimentary meals or not.
 
saloman
Posts: 108
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2011 5:31 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:32 pm

Another question is how they will treat Star Gold pax from other airlines. They only mention AC top tier on that webpage getting lounge access, so it'll be interesting to see how harmonized it actually will be with mainline. that would certainly be an easy way to curb costs, but I'm unclear as to what their obligations would actually be vis-a-vis ACs Star membership.
 
blink182
Posts: 5273
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 1999 3:09 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:39 pm

Quoting spqr (Reply 13):
gah what a horrible name, works OK in French I guess, but in English who would want to fly an airline named after make-up?

All AC needs to do is buy the rights to this gem of a commercial from the 1990s and voila!
Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...
 
BlueShamu330s
Posts: 2565
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2001 3:11 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:45 pm

Quoting kaitak (Reply 14):
I have a horrible feeling that they might go 8 abreast on these 767s and that's not a comfortable prospect for anyone, complimentary meals or not.

Seat map shows 2-3-2, whilst the Executive rows 1-3 are marked as "Cabin details coming soon."

http://www.aircanada.com/shared/en/c.../fleet/pop_fleetb767-300rouge.html

Rgds

[Edited 2012-12-18 09:54:20]
So I drive a 4x4. So what?! Tax the a$$ off me for it...oh, you already have... :-(
 
northstardc4m
Posts: 2724
Joined: Fri Apr 28, 2000 11:23 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:03 pm

Quoting kaitak (Reply 14):
I have a horrible feeling that they might go 8 abreast on these 767s and that's not a comfortable prospect for anyone, complimentary meals or not.

I don't think they can with the current exit configuration, they would need to have the A-A-I-A 4 door config to support that seating density.

AC are in the A-III-III-A 2 overwing hatch config:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Nino Buda
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Daniel MacFarlane

CP Had some leased 763s in the A-A-I-A config, but i believe they were all returned to lessors after the merger (they were all -3Y0s), and i can't find anyone operating 2-4-2 with anything but 4 doors.

[Edited 2012-12-18 10:10:56]
Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
 
User avatar
DeltaMD90
Posts: 8245
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:25 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:07 pm

Quoting etops1 (Reply 1):
Yeah um , Why do they think its a good idea to do this ?

You're not a real airline until you've made a "low cost" spin off and folded it after a couple years   

Not saying it WILL fail, but the track record hasn't been good for the other airlines. It's hard for an airline to lower its costs even in a different entity, IIRC, Song still had higher costs as a spin off than B6 or WN.

Good luck to them. If anything, I hope they learn something from it if they fail at it. Song was considered a failure by many, but if you look at DL today, they are basically half-Song half-Delta... they incorporated a lot from Song even if the brand disappeared

Edit: I live the livery except the "rouge" on it looks pretty tacky

[Edited 2012-12-18 10:09:13]
Ironically I have never flown a Delta MD-90 :)
 
skipness1E
Posts: 3378
Joined: Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:18 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:08 pm

So is DUB staying with Air Canda mainline?
 
polaris
Posts: 1128
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2000 7:03 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:12 pm

Good name...good look...should stand out in the skies and at airports. Wonder if the call sign will be aircanada or rouge or aircanada rouge.

The rouge/red of the leisure division contrasts nicely with the silver sky colour of the mainline...red - fun; blue - business.

Venice, Edinburgh - not expected as first destinations but this is the leisure division, after all. Athens, not surprised. This is also a cruise destination so fits in perfectly with Air Canada Vacations.
 
GIANCAVIA
Posts: 906
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2010 11:45 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:16 pm

Stupid idea to start up this company but kudos on the scheme I think it is a lot nicer then the horrible toothpaste livery.
 
polaris
Posts: 1128
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2000 7:03 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:16 pm

Dublin stays with mainline. Year-round service is expected. Code-share with Aer Lingus is coming as announced in media release earlier this year.

[Edited 2012-12-18 10:29:07]
 
SXDFC
Posts: 1660
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 6:07 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:27 pm

I wish AC would use this for their regular color scheme.. Substitute the Red for the blue that they currently use, that would be one good looking plane..

Best of luck to this new airline, how many years will this one last?
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
polaris
Posts: 1128
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2000 7:03 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:37 pm

The first two 767s moving to rouge are C-GHPE fin no. 691 and C-GHPN fin no. 692.
 
voodoo
Posts: 1959
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2001 12:14 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:37 pm

I hereby nickname the airline AC Rogue.



Oh I see Crosswinds21 (Reply 6) has done so already. Whether intentionally or not, doesn't matter!


[Edited 2012-12-18 10:44:07]
` Yeaah! Baade 152! Trabi of the Sky! '
 
northstardc4m
Posts: 2724
Joined: Fri Apr 28, 2000 11:23 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:44 pm

Quoting polaris (Reply 25):
The first two 767s moving to rouge are C-GHPE fin no. 691 and C-GHPN fin no. 692.

Both ex-Hawaiian and recent additions to AC...
Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
 
Bobloblaw
Posts: 1680
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:15 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:45 pm

Id like to see Rouge, junked and AC adopt the entire scheme though.

Why are these markets important to AC? AC is a business airline, why are they trying to compete for low yield crap? AC gets in trouble when they try to chase the marginal passenger. My guess is they are scared of Air Transat and WestJet becoming too big overall. This is entirely a defensive move.
 
aamd11
Posts: 863
Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2001 11:54 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:17 pm

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 19):
You're not a real airline until you've made a "low cost" spin off and folded it after a couple years   

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Aaron Mandolesi
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ron Peel



  
 
kcrwflyer
Posts: 2534
Joined: Tue May 18, 2004 11:57 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:21 pm

This has not worked out for any airline yet, and failed twice for AC. What is different about this? How do you offer lower fares if your costs are the same?
 
by738
Posts: 2422
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2000 7:59 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:31 pm

I suspect we'll be revisiting this thread in 2 years time in a Jazz/ Tango style.... rolls eyes, with marginal routes dropped quickly
 
lostsound
Topic Author
Posts: 453
Joined: Mon May 21, 2012 1:43 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:36 pm

Air Canada's though process:

"Hey you know what we haven't done in a while?...."

[Edited 2012-12-18 11:36:45]
 
User avatar
Aquila3
Posts: 496
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 3:18 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:40 pm

Love that livery!

I hope they will soon fly MXP or VIE in the winter.
I might get a round-trip the other way to see some great NHL game!
chi vola vale chi vale vola chi non vola è un vile
 
catII
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:02 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:52 pm

Tango was never meant to be "low cost", as in overall lower operating costs. It was a different brand within a brand and was actually quite successful. It's now implemented on mainline fares, Tango basically means lowest fare. It allowed Air Canada to separate it's mainline brand (higher service) without alienating its mainline pax. When it integrated these fares within the mainline fare, they were able to sell the same brand (concept) within mainline. You pay less, you get less is the "low cost" meaning on these fares. This also helped AC introduce it's a-la-carte fare options by adding on items such as food, bags, etc. Tango was also a longer haul, sun destination airline. The name comes from 'tan and go', as you would when you head to Mexico or the Caribbean.

Zip was different, the FA's were non-unionized, the pilots were part of mainline (as Rouge will be, albeit on a lower pay scale). Zip wasn't meant to fly out east, it was started with the same aircraft as WestJet (737-200) to compete with it on the same routes out west. This airline was discount, no frills, low cost. It was started while AC was in CCAA and was eventually absorbed by AC after they excited bankruptcy protection (CCAA).

There is a method to the madness, I suppose. Whether this is a long term thing, we shall see. But I definitely understand why they're doing this. This is going to allow them to compete with the likes of Transat, WestJet and Sunwing. Mainline is losing too many routes from the stiff competition these companies are providing. This at least allows them to compete on a lower cost structure and it does effectively differentiate mainline flying from the leisure division. I think you're going to see a fairly significant transformation of mainline with a different business class on the newer aircraft, premium economy etc. They will no longer have to mix the two concepts of leisure and business into one airline. This allows them to tailor to one or the other. There is now a push from the uppers internally to obtain "4 star" airline status on mainline and I think they know what needs to be done for that to happen. That doesn't include low yield routes to leisure oriented destinations.
 
BE77
Posts: 360
Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 2:15 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:13 pm

Quoting crosswinds21 (Reply 6):
operated by Rogue

I'll give you full credit, even if there was an assist from spell check  
Quoting spqr (Reply 13):
but in English who would want to fly an airline named after make-up?

See Crosswinds21 reply 6 for the English translation

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 19):
You're not a real airline until you've made a "low cost" spin off and folded it after a couple years

Yah, but do you need to do it over and over? AC already owns a couple versions of this T Shirt.

Quoting bobloblaw (Reply 28):
AC is a business airline, why are they trying to compete for low yield crap?

As Elite for about the 10th time, I agree. I also fly WS a lot, but for international that doesn't work so well, and on the trunk domestic routes the extra frequency sure makes my work travel a lot less painful.
Tower, Affirmitive, gear is down and welded
 
User avatar
redzeppelin
Posts: 893
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:30 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:41 pm

Quoting Kcrwflyer (Reply 30):
This has not worked out for any airline yet

We've certainly seen it play out poorly in North America, with the likes of Tango, Ted and Song. But what about elsewhere? Is Germanwings working out well for LH? Jetstar/QF? Scoot/SQ? Too soon to tell?
 
tayser
Posts: 397
Joined: Sat Mar 29, 2008 10:49 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:09 pm

Quoting crosswinds21 (Reply 6):
-Booking on the AC website with AC flight numbers (operated by Rogue)
-Ability to connect to/from other AC flights in YYZ/YUL
-Ability to accrue miles
-AC Lounge access under certain conditions
-Complimentary meals on flights to Europe
-And so on...

Jetstar brand flights:
- Can be booked through QF mainline site (go to qantas.com.au and look at MEL-ADL or MEL-SYD options - you'll see the myriad of QF flights and JQ flights in the same search result)
- Can connect to/from other QF flights via interline in any large Australian port (go to qantas.com.au and do a dummy booking for MEL-KUL - you'll see JQ/JQ, QF/JQ, QF/MH, JQ/MH options via SIN)
- Can accrue QF FF points: http://www.jetstar.com/au/en/planning-and-booking/fares/fare-types
- Can get you access to QF lounges: http://www.jetstar.com/au/en/planning-and-booking/fares/fare-types
- Can get complimentary food/drinks (if you pay the appropriate fare level): http://www.jetstar.com/au/en/planning-and-booking/fares/fare-types
 
Viscount724
Posts: 18971
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:19 pm

Quoting crosswinds21 (Reply 6):
It seems that this "Rogue" is not at all separate from Air Canada
Quoting crosswinds21 (Reply 6):
-Booking on the AC website with AC flight numbers (operated by Rogue)
Quoting crosswinds21 (Reply 6):
am also guessing that the managament/opearations/strategy/planning/etc. will also be done by AC and not by Rogue?

The name is "Rouge" ("red" in French), not "Rogue".

Quoting spqr (Reply 13):
but in English who would want to fly an airline named after make-up?

Most English-speaking Canadians have studied enough French to know that "rouge" means "red", a colour long associated with AC.
 
User avatar
yyz717
Posts: 15689
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2001 12:26 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:32 pm

Sharp livery.


Quoting spqr (Reply 13):
gah what a horrible name, works OK in French I guess, but in English who would want to fly an airline named after make-up?

Agree. Horrible name. Awkward in English. Translates into AC "Lipstick" which is non-sensical. It WILL be called AC Rogue when the renowned AC customer service problems occur.

I find it odd they would choose a French name to cater to an overwhelming English-speaking market -- but then AC mgmt has always been out of touch with the marketplace.

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 20):
So is DUB staying with Air Canda mainline?
AC Rogue will grow over time and add more 763's. Then (likely) DUB, BCN, FCO and MAD will migrate over in time.

Quoting Kcrwflyer (Reply 30):
This has not worked out for any airline yet, and failed twice for AC. What is different about this? How do you offer lower fares if your costs are the same?

Higher density seating and hence lower unit costs. In theory.

Quoting catII (Reply 34):
There is a method to the madness, I suppose.

I see the madness, but not (yet) the method.

[Edited 2012-12-18 13:39:13]
I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
luv2fly
Posts: 11056
Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 2:57 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:49 pm

The only area that I ever see this concept work is the South Pacific / Asia! And why you ask, as they run those as totally separate from the parent compnay. I don't see this lasting, Tango or Wizz part 2 or should I say Duex!
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
GIANCAVIA
Posts: 906
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2010 11:45 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:51 pm

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 38):
Most English-speaking Canadians have studied enough French to know that "rouge" means "red", a colour long associated with AC.

Red will certainly be more fitting then Black when it comes to doing the books.
 
BeyondBristol
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2009 11:13 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:05 pm

I maybe missing the obvious here but I can't see anything that says this is a LCC. Throughout the site they refer to it as a "leisure airline". I don't follow AC much so I don't know if in the concept stages it was referred to as an LCC, but this appears to be a leisure operation much like BA and VS operate from LGW/MAN where you would expect to see widebody aircraft with meal service, etc.

Am I missing something?
I'll admit it...I'm a BA & VS cheerleader.
 
GCT64
Posts: 1269
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2007 6:34 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:06 pm

EDI-YYZ is good news for those of us who have a team based in Edinburgh (I do, so am always interested in new options for them) or visiting Edinburgh. Gives another non-backtracking option for business trips to the US as an alternative to EDI-EWR on UA.

I wonder if this is a result of the more aggressively competitive GIP taking over EDI from BAA?

The BBC have picked it up: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-20768453
Flown in: A30B,A306,A310,A319,A320,A321,A332,A333,A343,A346,A388,BA11,BU31,B190, B461,(..53 more types..),VC10,WESX
 
User avatar
yyz717
Posts: 15689
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2001 12:26 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:24 pm

Quoting Giancavia (Reply 41):
Red will certainly be more fitting then Black when it comes to doing the books.

Good one!  
Quoting BeyondBristol (Reply 42):
I maybe missing the obvious here but I can't see anything that says this is a LCC.

You're missing nothing. There is nothing LCC about this. AC is the highest cost carrier in North America (and the only remaining NA carrier getting government support). Rogue can MAYBE lower costs towards Air Transat, Westjet and Sunwing (AC's 3 primary competitors) through higher density seating but their costs will still be higher, and in a commodity business where lowest costs rule, Rogue will likely fail.

When you put rouge on a pig, it's still a pig.
I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
9252fly
Posts: 814
Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 7:19 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:27 pm

Quoting BeyondBristol (Reply 42):
I don't know if in the concept stages it was referred to as an LCC, but this appears to be a leisure operation

I think the intent was to operate the division with lower costs, which based on recent agreements with pilots and flights attendants, should result in that occurring. You are correct in comparing it more to a leisure operation than a LCC. To me it appears to be a strategy to remain in low-yielding markets without having the mainline operation exit a route because of it's higher costs. As an added benefit, it should allow them to reenter markets that they have discontinued, such as EDI.
 
canadiantree
Posts: 137
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 1:29 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:29 pm

I'm not a fan of the livery, it looks very much like the Air Berlin livery which I think is boring. I'm already mad that Niki changed their livery to Air Berlin's scheme...

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Air-B...d=36bc71d5f8559dbf318dc4d1914fcb6d
 
IndianicWorld
Posts: 2796
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2001 11:32 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:29 pm

Someone at AC has a fascination with coming up with new names to add to the list.

Jazz, Tango, Jetz and now Rouge... Interesting.

Livery looks good though.
 
jpyvr
Posts: 84
Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2000 10:00 am

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:35 pm

Quoting yyz717 (Reply 44):
(and the only remaining NA carrier getting government support)

Could you please specify exactly what government support AC receives (other than what other Canadian airlines might receive). Historically, AC was a Crown Corporation, but as far as I had understood, it was privatized some time ago. I'm curious what you mean by the only NA carrier getting government support. Thanks!
 
User avatar
yyz717
Posts: 15689
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2001 12:26 pm

RE: Air Canada Official Launches LCC, Rouge

Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:50 pm

Quoting jpyvr (Reply 48):
Quoting yyz717 (Reply 44):
(and the only remaining NA carrier getting government support)

Could you please specify exactly what government support AC receives
Quoting jpyvr (Reply 48):
it was privatized some time ago.

Glad to. Here's a couple:
1. The Federal Government intervened recently when AC unions were going to strike, preventing such a strike through legislation. This is a gross violation of the collective bargaining process, and deliberate favouritism towards AC mgmt by an interfering government. AC should be left to the marketplace to build or lose its fortune.
2. AC continues to operate lucrative international routes awarded to it when it was a Crown Corporation. These entrenched aurthorities represent an unfair market advantage overtly provided by a protective government, that continue to benefit AC today. AC's international route authority into all markets it operated to when it was privatized should be relinquished and put up to tender for all Cdn carriers. AC can of course bid on these routes fairly, along with WS, TS and anyone else. Then, and only then, will the Cdn industry be truly market driven, and a level playing field.

Quoting canadiantree (Reply 46):
it looks very much like the Air Berlin livery

Another financially troubled carrier....just like AC.
I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.