Jackbr
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Western 707-320 Routes?

Fri Dec 28, 2012 12:05 am

What routes were Western's 707-320s originally operated on? What configuration were they in?
 
skycub
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Fri Dec 28, 2012 12:19 am

Quoting Jackbr (Thread starter):


What routes were Western's 707-320s originally operated on? What configuration were they in?

Someone feel free to correct me if I am wrong... but I am assuming that Western's 707-347s were their 707-320 aircraft.

From the great "Western Air Lines" book by George Cearley, Jr:

"Western purchased five Boeing 707-347C's which were delivered during summer 1968. They initially served on routes between Los Angeles-Mexico City, along the Pacific Coast, and on nonstop flights between Los Angeles and San Francisco and Minneapolis. In 1969 they were placed on the routes serving Hawaii."
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N62NA
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Fri Dec 28, 2012 12:39 am

There's lots of great info here on the DepartedFlights website:

http://www.departedflights.com/LAX74p1.html
 
n471wn
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Fri Dec 28, 2012 12:44 am

They used them extensively on the MSP-LAX routes
 
doulasc
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Fri Dec 28, 2012 2:55 am

didn't Western fly their 707-300C on their MIA-LAX route along with some DC-10s?
 
milesrich
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Fri Dec 28, 2012 3:41 am

They were also used on LAX-SEA flights in 1976 era. Only time I ever flew on them.
 
AY104
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Fri Dec 28, 2012 3:53 am

I remember just after I started working for Western in 1975, and took a flight from LAX - SFO, which was operated by the 707. It was all Economy configuration. I don't think the 707's ever had F-Class.
If I remember correctly, around the same time, the 707 and 720B was used on the HNL route, especially from SAN. And I believe all Economy class as well. The 720B used on the mainland and to Mexico had F and Y classes, though.
I think the only aircraft on the LAX-MIA was the DC10.
I know this is off topic, but for quite a few years the 737s were all Economy as well.
Wish I could find a timetable from those years. My memory is getting pretty bad.

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Carl
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n901wa
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Fri Dec 28, 2012 3:54 am

WAL Flew the 707-347C on the HNL-LAX, and HNL-SEA route. I think one went HNL-LAX-MSP and back. I did fly it a few times as a kid, and remember boarding from the back door. HTH
 
Q
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Fri Dec 28, 2012 4:25 am

What B3F aircraft code is?

http://www.departedflights.com/LAX74p1.html

Q
 
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longhauler
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Fri Dec 28, 2012 4:34 am

Quoting Q (Reply 8):
What B3F aircraft code is?

B707-300 with Fan Jet engines, (B707-300B or B707-300C)
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bohica
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Fri Dec 28, 2012 6:14 am

WA also flew the 707 in a mixed configuration before it was retired. I believe the routing was ANC-SEA-SFO-LAX. I flew the SFO-LAX leg on that flight one time. I still remember having to go down a set of stairs to the ramp and then around the plane to board via stairs in the back. The passenger cabin was all Y and there was approximately 70 seats IIRC.

The all pax versions had approximately 20 F seats. Rows 1-2 had 2 seats each on the left side and row 1 faced backwards creating club seating. Rows 3-6 had 4 seats each. The Hawaii equipped 720's were reconfigured in all Y.
 
Type-Rated
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Fri Dec 28, 2012 7:33 am

Quoting n471wn (Reply 3):
They used them extensively on the MSP-LAX routes

Whenever we passed through MSP in the early 70s there always seemed to be a WA 707 around.
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WALmsp
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Fri Dec 28, 2012 4:37 pm

Quoting doulasc (Reply 4):
Quoting AY104 (Reply 6):
I think the only aircraft on the LAX-MIA was the DC10.

WA started with the 10s, but eventually moved to the 7s


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Viscount724
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Sat Dec 29, 2012 3:49 am

Quoting longhauler (Reply 9):
Quoting Q (Reply 8):
What B3F aircraft code is?

B707-300 with Fan Jet engines, (B707-300B or B707-300C)

Just to nitpick, the correct generic codes for 707 variants are 120/220/320/420 (not 100/200/300/400). You won't find a single reference to "707-100" or "707-300" etc. in the Boeing website.
 
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longhauler
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Sat Dec 29, 2012 4:42 am

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 13):
Just to nitpick, the correct generic codes for 707 variants are 120/220/320/420 (not 100/200/300/400).

Interesting, I didn't know that ... but always wondered why Boeing never used 20 as a Customer Code. (As I always say, its a bad day you don't learn something).
Just because I stopped arguing, doesn't mean I think you are right. It just means I gave up!
 
Viscount724
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Sat Dec 29, 2012 5:36 am

Quoting longhauler (Reply 14):
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 13):
Just to nitpick, the correct generic codes for 707 variants are 120/220/320/420 (not 100/200/300/400).

Interesting, I didn't know that ... but always wondered why Boeing never used 20 as a Customer Code. (As I always say, its a bad day you don't learn something).

"20" was reserved for Boeing. I should also have added that the generic 720 code was 720-020.
 
Aeri28
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Sat Dec 29, 2012 8:49 am

I have ab solutely no idea what I flew, whether it was 707 or 720. Have no idea, but, since one of my parents worked for WAL from late 60s well up past the merger with Delta, we always (98% of the time) flew first class being non revs. This included SFO or OAK to HNL, LAX to MEX, SFO to Juneau and Anchorage (all in the late 60s to early 70s) among other routes. I never remembered an aircraft without First (just from a childs recollection, at least to key Hawaii and Mexico routes. - I may be wrong). The last 707 flight I took was from SFO-LAX-SFO in 1976 as we were moving from the Bay area to Los Angeles and went for the day to scope out LA with my parents.

I m pretty sure those aircraft were on their way out by the late 70s. I don't think they were ever used on the LAX to MIA-FLL flights. I took that one in 1979 pretty much when it first started and I took it as to be my first DC 10 fight.
 
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Sat Dec 29, 2012 8:57 am

Quoting Aeri28 (Reply 16):
I don't think they were ever used on the LAX to MIA-FLL flights. I took that one in 1979 pretty much when it first started and I took it as to be my first DC 10 fight.

WA operated some odd tag routes when flying back east, LAX-MIA-FLL/NAS, SLC-IAD-DCA, SLC-BOS-LGA. I thought the MIA flight was always a DC-10, but there is a picture of a 707 posted earlier in this thread, don't know if that was a regular thing for a while, or just a substitution.
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timz
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Sat Dec 29, 2012 6:34 pm

In Airport Activity Stats the WA 707s (and 720Bs) aren't rare at MIA, but the 707s appeared 50+ times in the late 1970s, which suggests they were subs. Anybody found a timetable showing WA 707/720Bs to MIA?
 
JFKPurser
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Sat Dec 29, 2012 6:43 pm

I flew SAN-LAX on a WA707-347C in 1980. It was inbound from HNL. I recall that it did have a FC section as I was seated just one or two rows aft of the FC divider. I recall the seats being bright purple and fuchsia, and the cabin was fitted with the first-generation Boeing widebody look interior with enclosed overhead bins.
 
Bobloblaw
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Sat Dec 29, 2012 7:07 pm

It looks from departed flights that WA 720s and 707s to Hawaii only served meals in F class with nothing in Y. Is that true?
 
Viscount724
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Sat Dec 29, 2012 11:21 pm

Quoting bobloblaw (Reply 20):
It looks from departed flights that WA 720s and 707s to Hawaii only served meals in F class with nothing in Y. Is that true?

If memory correct, carriers to Hawaii then had 2 categories of Y class service, standard Y (with meal service) and what most carriers referred to as "Thrift Class" (usually with code K) at a lower fare with no meal service.
 
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n901wa
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Sat Dec 29, 2012 11:59 pm

When my pops worked at Western, we flew back home to HNL at least 3 times a year ( 707-347C, 720B, and the DC-10 ), and we always sat in back, usally the smoking section, back of the airplane. Where people use to sit on the armrest and smoke after the meal service. ( Just lucky to get a seat back then, with first come first serviced was the non rev way. ) We always had a meal service in Coach. I remember a Coconut crust Chk, Steak, and I think a Breaded Mahi Mahi was the choices. Never got to drink the Champagne punch from the Volcano   did win a Captains halfway sweepstakes once or twice ( still got the plates and Champagne bottle ).
 
Aeri28
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Sun Dec 30, 2012 5:32 am

Do you think these 707 sightings in MIA and HNL in the late 70s had anything to do with the DC10 groundings after the AA crash in 1979?

When did Western get the MIA route? It ust seems odd, as I thought the advertised DC10 nonstop coast to coast service , but at the end of the 70s, the 707s would seem to be a downgrade of sorts. I mean, at that period, if you did coast to coast, you weren't flying a single aisle plane and a 707 to Hawaii in the late 70s would have been strange vis a vvis the competition.

Anybody know when WAL retired the 707s/720s? By the late 70s, I was flying regularly from LAX where we lived to grandparents in Sacramento and it seems to me WA fleet consisted mostly of 727s, 737s and the DC10. As I said earlier, I remember my last 707 flight being in 1976 and definitely remember what a treat it was to be on it, but also remembering it seems that they were on their way out.. Maybe I'm wrong??
 
PacificF27
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Sun Dec 30, 2012 8:45 pm

The 4 engine jets with all coach were 720Bs-- called "Fan Jet Commuters". They were in service between LAX and SFO, LAX and LAS and SFO and LAS. June 1966 schedule.
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timz
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Sun Dec 30, 2012 9:27 pm

In 1978-79 WA had two nonstops a day LAX-MIA; looks like the redeye was always a DC-10 but the morning flight was a 707 or 720B one or two days a week.
 
Viscount724
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Mon Dec 31, 2012 12:00 am

Quoting Aeri28 (Reply 23):
When did Western get the MIA route?

They were awarded MIA-LAX in March 1976.
http://news.google.com/newspapers?id...0airlines%20miami&pg=918%2C2552473

They must have launched servie fairly quickly as it appears on their July 1976 route map.
http://www.departedflights.com/WA070176.html
 
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WALmsp
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Mon Dec 31, 2012 3:01 am

Quoting Aeri28 (Reply 23):
Anybody know when WAL retired the 707s/720s?

They 707s were retired in the summer of 1980. The last of the 720s retired a year earlier.

http://www.geocities.com/~aeromoe/fleets/western.html
In memory of my Dad, Robert "Bob" Fenrich, WAL 1964-1979, MSP ONT LAX
 
kparke777
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Mon Dec 31, 2012 4:23 am

Worked at WAL for 7+ years during late 70's-mid 80's. Flew 707 #N403WA LAX>SAN>DEN during June 79. Also LAX> MIA>Nassau in March of 81 on DC10 #N904WA with return on #N906WA. Also 720 #N365WA MIA>LAX during Feb 79. It seemed like I was always on #363 or #365 when I was on the 720. That bird was quite a plane and a rocket for it's time especially on the short LAX to SFO, LAS and SAN routes from LAX. Even had 1 abort on a 720 HNL>LAX. Went back to the gate, changed the tire and away we went. Great memories!
 
Viscount724
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Mon Dec 31, 2012 5:07 am

Quoting kparke777 (Reply 28):
Worked at WAL for 7 years during late 70's-mid 80's. Flew 707 #N403WA LAX>SAN>DEN during June 79.

Four of Western's 5 707s at SAN below. They were registered N1501W through N1505W. Western's internal fleet numbers were 401 through 405. N1503W was #403. N403WA wasn't the registration.

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And the 5th 707 (N1503W) at SEA.

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Western ordered 10 707-347Cs but the last 5 were cancelled at a late stage and were sold to the Royal Canadian Air Force. Those aircraft below.


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WesternA318
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Thu Jan 03, 2013 4:31 am

I wonder if SLC ever saw these on a semi-regular basis?
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Wingtips56
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Thu Jan 03, 2013 7:55 am

I remember WA did briefly operate a 720 from SMF via SJC to HNL in 1979 or 1980. I don't know how it did, but suspect the run ended when the aircraft were retired, as the market then probably wouldn't have supported replacement with a DC-10. (Now HA runs a daily 763 SMF-HNL, and AH ran daily 73G and later 73H [leased] SMF-OGG, which is now run with AS 738.) The 707/720 were gone by the time I worked for WA in 1983 (during my furlough from AirCal).

I do have a question for WA alumni during the 707/720 years:

In 1977 or '78, I flew WA SFO-SEA with my college band (UC Davis, Go Ags!) on a combi aircraft. I didn't realize it right away, and thought it was odd that we Coach passengers had to go down the jet bridge stairs, across the ramp an up air stairs to the back door, while it appeared First Class got the Jetway. Further class segregation was noted by a solid wall separating the rear cabin, and then the emergency card didn't even show us a forward exit path. How rude! OK, I felt really dumb when I finally realized it was a combi aircraft, but I didn't know such things existed then. I was much more astute with the return flight on the same type.

So here is the question: could it have been a 720/72M? The window shade on board had "Boeing 720" embossed in the pull tab. I think the emergency card said 720, but I can't swear to it. Airliners shows only a 707-combi in pictures, and I couldn't find any reference anywhere else to the fleet including 72Ms. Was that a cross-type replacement part, and we really were on the 707-combi or was it indeed a 720-combi?
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines
 
kparke777
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Thu Jan 03, 2013 9:25 am

Quoting Wingtips56 (Reply 31):



I do not believe it was a 720. It would have been equipment that was actually referred to as a B70M (707). The window shades did seem to cross fleet as I recall (been almost 30 years).
 
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n901wa
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RE: Western 707-320 Routes?

Thu Jan 03, 2013 11:32 am

The Window Shade Handle fit the 707/720/727 window shades. I still have 1 of each in my rollaway ( they were in my Dads Rollaway )   After a while the newer handles came without a airplane type on a smooth handle.
One of my Old Leads in HNL started in SMF, and he use to tell me about the HNL flight and how they would ship Lichi to SMF and the mainland guys would sweep them up and throw them away, because they didn't know they were fruit. He explained to them it was good, and they thought he was full of it.