doulasc
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Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 2:25 am

Here is a good topic. Around 1958 TWA ran by Howard Hughes was thinking about buying Northeast Airlines.
Also Northeast and Northwest were talking a merger-who would survive?
Western and Continental-new compmany Continental Western
Pan Am and TWA-would either name survive or a new airline created.
A lot of mergers did not happen because the CAB would not approve them.
Anyone want to add anything else?
 
deltairlines
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 2:27 am

United-US Airways in 2000, with the DCA ops were going to be spun off into a new airline (that had an AMR investment) called DC Air.
 
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Polot
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 2:33 am

I don't know if it counts, but there is also US Airways' attempted hostile takeover of Delta while the latter airline was in bankruptcy.
 
BA0197
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 2:39 am

BA and AA initially wanted to merge operations however were rejected by the European and American courts. They eventually established their JBA after multiple attempts at satisfying the regulators.

BA and KL, failed after it was thought that BA was not giving KL enough credit for their operation.

BA and Swiss?
 
Beechtobus
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 2:42 am

I was excited about Frontiers and Western Pacific's merger before it fell through. I believe there was once upon a time talk of Frontier 1 merging with UAL before the former went belly up.
 
Viscount724
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 2:46 am

Quoting BA0197 (Reply 3):

BA and Swiss?

There were no merger plans, just an alliance.
 
BA0197
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 2:48 am

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 5):

If I just may say that would have been a formidable alliance. Very powerful. If I may, what happened. Did BA decide to go with oneworld or did Swiss back out?
 
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Polot
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 2:50 am

Quoting BA0197 (Reply 6):
If I just may say that would have been a formidable alliance. Very powerful. If I may, what happened. Did BA decide to go with oneworld or did Swiss back out?

LH bought Swiss, so there went the relationship. Swiss was also getting close to AA and I think many expected them to join Oneworld eventually.
 
Viscount724
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:02 am

Quoting doulasc (Thread starter):
Also Northeast and Northwest were talking a merger-

Northwest and National also agreed to merge in 1970 (with NW the surviving carrier) but the CAB wouldn't agree that National's recently-awarded MIA-LAX route could be included without further hearings etc., and NW backed out of the merger.

Long thread on similar subject a year ago.
Announced Airline Mergers That Never Happened (by 727LOVER Aug 7 2011 in Civil Aviation)
 
SCQ83
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:24 am

In 2006/07, before BA/IB merged into IAG, Lufthansa showed public interest on taking over Iberia.

As for Spanair, the word in the street was that Qatar Airways was to take a stake in the company (à la Etihad with Air Berlin) and save it... but that never happened and they went bankrupt almost 1 year ago.
 
rwy04lga
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:33 am

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 8):
Also Northeast and Northwest were talking a merger-

Northwest and National also agreed to merge in 1970

All are now part of Delta Air Lines.
Just accept that some days, you're the pigeon, and other days the statue
 
vv701
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:36 am

FR is currently making its second attempt to buy EI. Its first attempt was rejected by the competition authorities.

As a result of that first attempt FR already owns 29.4 percent of EI's equity. However the Irish government also owns 25.4 per cent of the airline.

A big sticking point in any multinational purchase are the international bilateral air service agreements that usually specify that services be limited to operations of one or sometimes more airlines from the countries signing the agreement. This is why AF and KL retain their individual identities and are legally still French and Dutch. Similarly the IAG partners, BA and IB and the members of the Lufthansa Group like LX, OS and LH itself retain their individual nationalities and identities.

Although the trend towards new Open Skies Agreements suggests things may be changing, it only needs one significant country, such as the Russian Federation, to insist on maintaining traditional bilateral agreements to ensure that multi-national mergers do not result in the identity of the merged airlines disappearing.
 
bohica
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:44 am

Quoting deltairlines (Reply 1):
United-US Airways in 2000

Part of the deal also involved merging PSA, and Piedmont into ACA.
 
Viscount724
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:51 am

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 10):
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 8):
Also Northeast and Northwest were talking a merger-

Northwest and National also agreed to merge in 1970

All are now part of Delta Air Lines.

I would say that part of National is now incorporated in DL. Pan Am acquired National but DL didn't acquire all of Pan Am.
 
UA787DEN
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:57 am

TWA to just about everyone in the 1980s and 1990s.

Northwest had a lot of close proposed.mergers and half mergers/half alliances throughout the years (KLM)
 
spartanmjf
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:03 am

Was there not talk of a PA / NW merger in the late 1980's?
"Nuts to the man in 21D!"
 
COSPN
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:06 am

Northwest and Continental in 1992
 
sparky35805
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:12 am

Eastern-American in 1962 with American the surviving carrier.CAB denied the plans in 1963.
Sparky
 
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Polot
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:40 am

Quoting COSPN (Reply 16):
Northwest and Continental in 1992

There was also Delta and Continental in the mid 90s. It was because of that takeover attempt that NW eventually got their golden share as they helped CO fight off DL.
 
rampart
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:42 am

Wasn't both Pan Am and Texas International bidding for National, one reason Pan Am paid too much for National?
If TI had acquired NA...
CO and EA might have been left alone...
and...

-Rampart
 
CapEd388
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:43 am

1980s - Braniff and Eastern.
388 346 77W 787
 
CIDFlyer
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:47 am

I dont think it was ever announced, but there were talks at one time about AirTran/TWA, and TWA/US. at the time US/UA was announced NW/AA were in talks about merging too. I still think US/TW would have been a good combo, combined with HP. Definitely would have given US coverage in the midwest via STL.
 
dcann40
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:58 am

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 10):
Also Northeast and Northwest were talking a merger-

Northwest and National also agreed to merge in 1970

All are now part of Delta Air Lines.

National isn't. National was taken over by Pan Am. Delta never acquired Pan Am.
 
UA787DEN
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:59 am

Quoting CIDFlyer (Reply 21):

The TWA mess plus the US-HP mess probably would have caused angry pilots to crash helicopters in the headquarters of the striking Executives In Dubai  

TWA was actively looking to merge throughout the 90s. No one wanted to. Most other carriers were doing better.at the time, and NO ONE wanted to be a part of the TWA mess. There were just so many issues.
 
rampart
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:00 am

Quoting CIDFlyer (Reply 21):

I dont think it was ever announced, but there were talks at one time about AirTran/TWA, and TWA/US. at the time US/UA was announced NW/AA were in talks about merging too. I still think US/TW would have been a good combo, combined with HP. Definitely would have given US coverage in the midwest via STL.

I recall it being an HP+TW proposal, before US was in the picture, I could be wrong. I agree, it might have been a good combo.

-Rampart
 
HermansCVR580
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:00 am

Don't know which year but American wanted Republic.
The right decision at the wrong time, is still a wrong decision. "Hal Carr"
 
doulasc
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:01 am

I would think that American Airlines and Braniff would have been a good merger in the 1970s. It would open up South America for AA.
 
UA787DEN
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:10 am

Quoting doulasc (Reply 26):

Braniff never really made money, and was an interesting carrier, to say the least. As far as airlines to acquire, Braniff would have been higher on the list mainly because it added to the DFW presence and removed a competitor.

Quoting UA787DEN (Reply 23):

I forgot to mention the 747s flying LHR-HNL-LAS, flown by computer while all the pilots were in Dubai crashing copters into the HQ of the striking executives. And Karabu selling half the seats.
 
LOWS
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:35 am

Well, wasn't there US+UA in 2007?
 
Wingtips56
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:42 am

Quoting Polot (Reply 7):

Quoting BA0197 (Reply 6):
If I just may say that would have been a formidable alliance. Very powerful. If I may, what happened. Did BA decide to go with oneworld or did Swiss back out?

LH bought Swiss, so there went the relationship. Swiss was also getting close to AA and I think many expected them to join Oneworld eventually.

Swiss was a member-elect of oneworld. I was working with AA and my oneworld colleagues in 1995-96 on the coordinated Ticketing Manual. LX was getting the drafts as we went along, but we were surprised with their sudden withdrawal right as we finished. Shortly thereafter, they linked up with LH. We had been waiting for LX to supply their info on pre-paids, refunds, net tickets, Invol Reroute, etc. for inclusion in the final oneworld manual.
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines
 
UA787DEN
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:08 am

Quoting LOWS (Reply 28):

US-UA mergers have popped up over the years. I believe UA was looking at options, and Star Alliance partner that would strengthen the East US popped up. But US was still not finished merging with HP (and to this day not everything os sorted out.) Not a great time for UA to merge with US, and UA was still talking with CO a lot.

CO had been the target of hostile takeover bids from DL ans NW in 1996. CO also explored a Western merger right after deregulation.

Pan Am tried to merge with EA, TWA, and AA throughout the 1950s to 70s. They presented a NW takeover bid in 1989.

US explored an AA or UA merger in 2008, and UA again in 2010, any many were surprised when UA and US didn't merge, UA choosing CO instead
 
BDL757
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:25 am

I've also heard from some people (some of them high up the food chain) at work that before DL and NW merged that DL and UA were to merge but at that time UA had 'too much baggage' so DL backed off. I don't really remember seeing/hearing anything between DL/UA announced so it could all be hearsay.
 
Independence76
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 8:38 am

Back in the 1993, Swissair, Scandinavian (SAS), KLM, and Austrian announced a merger agreement called "Alcazar."

It progressed until the Swiss court rejected it entirely. It was one of the major events which pushed for the failed expansion plan in Swissair.
 
johnclipper
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 8:44 am

There was talk of TW and PI before US entered the picture...
"Flown every aircraft since the Wright Flyer" (guys, if you take this literally, then you need to get a life...)
 
9lflyguy
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 9:40 am

More of an acquisition but Southwest and Frontier recently before Airtran.


Then before our demise Colgan and Mesaba were going to be folded into one.
319 320 321 722 732 733 734 735 737 738 739 752 753 763 772 CR2 CR7 CR9 DHA D8B D8C D95 145 170 175 190 M82 M88 M90 S340
 
Phen
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 11:05 am

Quoting VV701 (Reply 11):
R is currently making its second attempt to buy EI. Its first attempt was rejected by the competition authorities.

Not entirely accurate; FR has just had it's third attempt to take over EI effectively quashed by the Irish Government who has clearly stated that it will not sell it's stake in the airline to FR.
 
Fuling
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 12:02 pm

Didn't Air New Zealand try to buy out Ansett Australia just before Ansett was grounded?
 
VHHYI
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 12:47 pm

Quoting Fuling (Reply 36):
Didn't Air New Zealand try to buy out Ansett Australia just before Ansett was grounded?

They owned Ansett (having acquired half from TNT in the mid-90s and the rest from News Corp later on)!, except for Ansett International which was 51% owned by Australian interests to allow it to operate, the exact same structure Virgin Australia is operating under today.

When they realized they paid too much for it, they tried getting SQ to inject cash in various manners (stonewalled by foreign ownership limits on NZ), then in a last ditch effort before collapse they offered to QF for $1.

edit: What you might be thinking of is Air NZ/Ansett trying to buy Virgin Blue for $250m, rejected by SRB himself at a press conference.

[Edited 2013-01-06 04:49:48]
This Porsche is like an Airbus;an Engineering marvel, but without passion - Jeremy Clarkson
 
okay
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 12:52 pm

AY and SK, since the dawn of time. Never happened, never will.

okAY
 
skywaymanaz
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 1:21 pm

At one point Air Florida was trying to acquire Western but Air Florida went under instead.
 
jfk777
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 1:40 pm

Quoting spartanmjf (Reply 15):
Was there not talk of a PA / NW merger in the late 1980's?

Pan AM was getting funds from a Private Equity shop called the Arlie Group to help fund the buyout of NW. That would have been a great merger returning PA to Asia, sadly it never happened. Funny thing is most of Delta's route system to Europe was Pan Am's.
 
ABQopsHP
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 1:58 pm

Quoting rampart (Reply 19):

Always thought the same. What would it be like now?

Quoting rampart (Reply 24):

I was working for HP during this time, and was hopeful something would happen. It was becoming obvious that HP needed to do something soon. We were too small.


Also when we went into BK back in the early 90s, there had been lots of rumours that Bill Franke,
and Crandall at AA were good golfing buddies. Crandall had been seen in PHX numerous times
and we thought maybe AA was taking a good look at HP. Even the AA employees in ELP where
I worked were hearing things. Who knows.

JD CRP
ABQ ops, Cactus 202 requesting you order 5 Green Chile Chicken stew for us to p/u on arrival. ;)
 
vv701
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:34 pm

Quoting Phen (Reply 35):
Not entirely accurate; FR has just had it's third attempt to take over EI effectively quashed by the Irish Government who has clearly stated that it will not sell it's stake in the airline to FR.

I understood the first bid dated back to 5 October 2006 by when FR had obtained a 19.2 per cent stake in EI. Subsequently by 28 November it had increased that stake to 25,2 per cent and now holds 29.4 per cent of EI's shares.

I also understood that FR notified the EC competition authorities of what I understood was its second and most recent bid on 5 July 2912 and the EC responded on 10 July that it was continuing an investigation as to the impact of the FR equity investment in EI. This was in response to an earlier appeal by EI requesting that the EC disenfranchise the voting rights attributable of the FR stock holding as if FR used its voting rights it would be anti-competitive.

If this was the third bid when was the second Ryanair bid made. I can find no reference to it.

As far as I can determine the current bid has not been "quashed" but is still on-going if in very muddy waters. Indeed as recently as the 29 December the "Irish Examiner" published an article "Minister sees the light on Ryanair Aer Lingus offer". It starts:

"It would seem that the Minister for Transport has seen the light in terms of the validity of the Ryanair offer for Aer Lingus."

If his government has already "quashed" the offer why is its Minister responsible being reported in the Irish press as having "seen the light . . . of the validity of the . . . offer"?
 
Bobloblaw
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 3:45 pm

United considered buying PI in 1987 but US got the jump and won. How different the industry would had that happened.

I am pretty certain TW and US discussed a merger in the 1980s or 90s.

Rumors floated around about American buying out OZ just before TW did.

NW buying ML(?) in 1991.
 
ozark1
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:44 pm

American and Western tried to merge as well.
 
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cosyr
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 4:48 pm

Quoting COSPN (Reply 16):
Northwest and Continental in 1992

This one happened, and it saved Continental, who was almost bought by Delta. Northwest bought a controlling share, without the intention of merging the two airlines into one. That's why NW had the Golden Share up until they merged with Delta themselves.
 
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AVLAirlineFreq
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:09 pm

In the mid-1960s, Ozark proposed merging with Central Airlines. Central later merged with the original Frontier (and of course, Ozark merged with TW in the mid-1980s.)

[Edited 2013-01-06 09:10:02]
 
Lofty
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 5:56 pm

Before BA jumped into bed with AA they tried US and UA.
 
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GSPFlyer
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:14 pm

Before DL and NW merged, didn't DL attempt to merge with US? I'm wanting to say it was in 2006.
 
flyjoe
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RE: Proposed Airline Mergers That Never Happened

Sun Jan 06, 2013 6:19 pm

In 1999, United looked at acquiring America West. I had just left working with US in DEN and was hired by HP in ABQ about that time. I remembered being a bit concerned with that news. HP had a large station because we also did ground handling for CO and F9, which likely would go away and then add in the amount of staff with UA. The numbers didn't favor a new employee.

http://articles.latimes.com/1999/jan/21/entertainment/ca-336