dwcontroller
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Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 5:49 pm

Bad week for JAL...in Boston. Separate incident from the fire yesterday, looks to be a different B787. Alert 2 for a fuel leak from left wing on a departing aircraft. Returning to gate.

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/01/0...s-jet-leaks-fuel-at-logan-airport/

[Edited 2013-01-08 09:49:40]
Best phrase to hear at the airport - "All standbys have been cleared and may board at this time"
 
HNL2BOS
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 5:58 pm

Man, I hope the electrical incident isn't anything major. I'm supposed to fly on this flight in April.

Im guessing this one might be some ground crew error?
 
atlflyer
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:08 pm

Another problem with the 787!
 
stlgph
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:14 pm

from my news wires -

airport crews cleaning up fuel
plane towed back to the gate.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
BoeingVista
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:17 pm

Another 787 incident seriously? She is going to get a reputation as a hanger queen.
BV
 
dwcontroller
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:23 pm

JAL007 was on Taxiway November holding short RWY 22L.
Best phrase to hear at the airport - "All standbys have been cleared and may board at this time"
 
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KarelXWB
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:24 pm

Quoting hnl2bos (Reply 1):
Im guessing this one might be some ground crew error?

Perhaps. ANA had a (fuel / oil ??) leak some months ago but I'm not sure if that is the same problem.
Close, but no cigar http://vine.co/v/OjqeYWWpVWK
 
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Revelation
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:37 pm

Seems the DreamLiner is turning into a DreamLemon, sigh...
Inspiration, move me brightly! Light the song with sense and color.
Hold away despair, more than this I will not ask.
Faced with mysteries dark and vast, statements just seem vain at last.
Some rise, some fall, some climb, to get to Terrapin!
 
BoeingVista
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:41 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 6):
Perhaps. ANA had a (fuel / oil ??) leak some months ago but I'm not sure if that is the same problem.

There was an AD regarding fuel leaks but I believe that all of the operators should have carried out the mandated checks by now.
BV
 
HNL2BOS
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:44 pm

Quoting Revelation (Reply 7):
Quoting BoeingVista (Reply 4):

A bit over the top?
 
BoeingGuy
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:46 pm

Quoting Atlflyer (Reply 2):
Another problem with the 787!

Thanks for the astute observation.  
 
SCQ83
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:46 pm

So are they now 2 JAL B787 in BOS? Will they bring a 3rd one? :S
 
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Revelation
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:48 pm

Quoting hnl2bos (Reply 9):

A bit over the top?

I hope so.

From the online sources:

Boeing shares were down 3.2 percent at $73.63 in afternoon trading. The stock fell 2 percent on Monday.

Seems like a good time to buy, says I.

[Edited 2013-01-08 10:53:20]
Inspiration, move me brightly! Light the song with sense and color.
Hold away despair, more than this I will not ask.
Faced with mysteries dark and vast, statements just seem vain at last.
Some rise, some fall, some climb, to get to Terrapin!
 
KC135Hydraulics
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:59 pm

I really should invest in Boeing shares. They will eventually recover from this, and this will be forgotten.

The honor is found in the ends, not the means!
MSgt, USAF
KC-135R / C-17A Pneudraulic Systems Mechanic Supervisor
 
FlyingAY
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:27 pm

I wonder what has been the dispatch reliability for the first 500 787 flights and how does that compare to the dispatch reliability of first 777 or A380 flights. Was the situation really this bad with those airframes too?
 
AADC10
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:35 pm

Quoting Revelation (Reply 12):
Boeing shares were down 3.2 percent at $73.63 in afternoon trading. The stock fell 2 percent on Monday.

Seems like a good time to buy, says I.

Not necessarily. While the drop may be partially attributable to the 787 news, a majority of Boeing profit is from military contracts. What is more likely is that there is a concern about fourth quarter earnings.
 
Aither
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:37 pm

Oil & Fire. Lucky enough it happened on 2 different aircraft.
Probably this event would not have been noticed without the electrical issue yesterday.
Never trust the obvious
 
dwcontroller
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:41 pm

Update : 40 Gal of fuel leaked. Aircraft towed back to gate. Aircraft should depart later today. Hopefully this is a non-story by days end.

*towed back

[Edited 2013-01-08 12:16:53]
Best phrase to hear at the airport - "All standbys have been cleared and may board at this time"
 
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Stitch
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:43 pm

Quoting FlyingAY (Reply 14):
While the drop may be partially attributable to the 787 news, a majority of Boeing profit is from military contracts.

For 2011, Boeing IDS brought in $3.1 billion in profits with an average margin of 9.9%. Boeing Commercial brought in $3.5 billion and margins were at 9.7%

For the first three quarters of 2012, IDS was $2.3 billion / 9.5% while BCA was $3.5 billion / 9.9%.

So the (simple) majority of profits right now are from Boeing Commercial.
 
asctty
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:47 pm

Quoting dwcontroller (Reply 17):

Unfortunately it may end up being a non-story in minor fuel spill terms, but in Boeing 787 safety terms it just adds to the list. Perhaps if Boeing had met it's original delivery target, the percentage of incidents may not be as significant?
Just a thought  
 
BoeingGuy
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:51 pm

Quoting Aither (Reply 16):
Oil & Fire. Lucky enough it happened on 2 different aircraft.

The fire was inside an electronics bay. The fuel was from the left wing outside the airplane probably 50-100 feet away. Not even close to the sensationalism you are implying.
 
Lofty
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 8:01 pm

How many passengers where on today's flight re booked from yesterdays flight? The passengers must be thinking this B787 is not very good and I want a different aircraft or JAL clearly can't look after their aircraft and which other airline are you going to book me on. Remember its not what we or the people in the industry think it is what the customer thinks.
 
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KarelXWB
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 8:04 pm

For who wants to know: the plane with the fuel leak is JA824J.
Close, but no cigar http://vine.co/v/OjqeYWWpVWK
 
idlewildchild
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 9:15 pm

Quoting AADC10 (Reply 15):
Not necessarily. While the drop may be partially attributable to the 787 news, a majority of Boeing profit is from military contracts. What is more likely is that there is a concern about fourth quarter earnings.

The bigger threat to Boeing is the impending major downsizing of the US military. Between sequestation and a general need for far less military might than the USA currently has, it's likely Boeing is going to take a hit from the US government coffers more than need to worry about the commercial aviation side of the equation.

Quoting Lofty (Reply 22):
How many passengers where on today's flight re booked from yesterdays flight? The passengers must be thinking this B787 is not very good and I want a different aircraft or JAL clearly can't look after their aircraft and which other airline are you going to book me on. Remember its not what we or the people in the industry think it is what the customer thinks.

Not to be icky but that's why I wrote the other day (prior to JL/BOS incident) I'm giving the 787 a year to get the kinks out before I book one. Too many new things and between the United pilot who told me the SA)">UA birds were all grounded on 12/27 with chronic fuel leaks and issues and the fire in Boston, I'm passing for awhile.

Fortunately my next trip is on SA/A346 JFK-JNB come February and Boeing 737s inside South Africa!
 
SWALUV
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 9:18 pm

Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 23):
JA824J

Does anyone know when the aircraft was delivered?
 
xaapb
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 9:22 pm

On it's way to Narita:

http://es.flightaware.com/live/flight/JAL7

Greetings
Jorge Meneses
 
motif1
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 9:28 pm

Quoting idlewildchild (Reply 24):
The bigger threat to Boeing is the impending major downsizing of the US military. Between sequestation and a general need for far less military might than the USA currently has, it's likely Boeing is going to take a hit from the US government coffers more than need to worry about the commercial aviation side of the equation.

Don't you worry about Boeing! Japan and India are about to spent huge money modernizing their armies in the near future. I hope that would make it less urgent for the US to wage wars since the military complex would be busy fulfilling foreign orders.

Regarding the 787s in questions: isn't the fuel leak due to maintenance error? I don't know about the electrical fire. Could be a problem with the design.
Not only is this incomprehensible but the ink is ugly and the paper is from the wrong kind of tree
 
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GSPFlyer
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 9:29 pm

Looks like the flight is on its way to NRT, about 4 hours late. Hopefully Boeing gets these issues sorted out.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/JAL7
 
Viscount724
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 9:49 pm

Quoting SWALUV (Reply 25):
Quoting KarelXWB (Reply 23):
JA824J

Does anyone know when the aircraft was delivered?

September 25, 2012.
 
n471wn
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 10:04 pm

Quoting idlewildchild (Reply 24):
Not to be icky but that's why I wrote the other day (prior to JL/BOS incident) I'm giving the 787 a year to get the kinks out before I book one. Too many new things and between the United pilot who told me the SA)">UA birds were all grounded on 12/27 with chronic fuel leaks and issues and the fire in Boston, I'm passing for awhile.

I must say this is not the kind of response I would expect from a seasoned traveler and an a.netter.....
 
Scipio
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:46 pm

Quoting n471wn (Reply 32):
I must say this is not the kind of response I would expect from a seasoned traveler and an a.netter.....

I think it is a very rational response, in particular from a seasoned traveler and a.netter.

My doctor once told me that, as a principle, he doesn't prescribe medications that have been on the market for less than five years. It is a prudent principle: let others find out what the unknown risks are.

The aircraft enthusiast in me wants to fly on the latest and the newest airplane. The rational side of my brain says that my doctor is right, and it is better to hold back and let others find out whether newer really means better...

The Comet and Thalidomide are good examples (in very different areas) of why newer may not necessarily mean better.

It is the individual responsibility of each of us to strike a balance between our preferences for adventure/novelty and safety. It's not up to others to make judgments about people's decisions in this regard.
 
AeroWesty
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Tue Jan 08, 2013 11:59 pm

Quoting Scipio (Reply 35):
I think it is a very rational response, in particular from a seasoned traveler and a.netter.

  

There's risk in everything. How one handles that risk is key. After the DC-10 grounding I avoided DC-10s as much as possible for a few years, but still rode them when the alternative was either unreasonably more expensive or inefficient schedule-wise. I simply kept my risk to flying on a DC-10 as low as possible. The 787 mishaps are beginning to see history repeat itself as far as my travel choices are concerned.
International Homo of Mystery
 
uta999
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:01 am

Boeing need a plan B

Here goes:

Sack the 787 management team and bring the original 777 team from the 1990s out of retirement

Put the 787 wings and engines on a shortened 777SP and bring all sub assembly back in-house.

Use everything that works on the 777 again on the new model

Make all aeroplanes out of metal

Don't use batteries or any materials that are lighter

Don't use composites except where they work on the 777

The 787 is an accident waiting to happen.

Please rebrand it as the 777SP

The Triple 7 has yet to suffer a fatal accident. That is incredible and should be built on, not replaced
 
copter808
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:19 am

Quoting uta999 (Reply 37):
The Triple 7 has yet to suffer a fatal accident. That is incredible and should be built on, not replaced

Yes, it's fatal accident record is exactly the same as the 787! It just has been in service a far shorter time.
 
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kanban
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:26 am

Quoting uta999 (Reply 37):
Boeing need a plan B

can not tell if that was a joke or just a result of oxygen shortage. Who would want a plane designed and built by 70-80 year olds?..

How many planes are held or returned to the terminal for minor problems.. based on the assumption here if a plane had a problem with a piece of vendor designed and built hardware, one should fire the a/c designers/manufacturing guys but not the vendor? that would be like blaming Apple because some second tier software didn't work as advertised....
 
airmailer
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:26 am

Sounds like UA may have found something:

"UPDATE II: In another line of bad news for Boeing coming out today – a scoop from the WSJ’s Jon Ostrower and Jack Nicas:

United Airlines found improperly-installed wiring on one of its Boeing Co. 787s, as operators of the new jet inspected their fleets in the wake of the electrical fire suffered Monday on a Japan Airlines Co. Dreamliner parked at Boston airport, according to a person with knowledge of the U.S. carrier’s actions.
...

The person said United found an improperly installed bundle of wires that connect to the APU battery, a unit that JAL and fire officials said ignited the blaze on the Dreamliner at Boston’s Logan International Airport after passengers had deplaned."

Source: http://blogs.wsj.com/corporate-intel...mliner-mishap-fuel-leak-in-boston/

[Edited 2013-01-08 16:32:58]
 
roseflyer
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:38 am

There is some extreme sensationalism about grounding airplanes and abandoning the program for something as small as a 40 gallon fuel leak and associated relatively short delay.

Fuel leaks occur every day. This could be as simple as 40 gallons dumped overboard when the airplane started moving from the jettison system because the plane was fueled up near max capacity. It is only news because the media loves covering notable airplanes and airlines. A delay to cover for a small fuel spill is not evidence to ground an airplane or affect stock price in my opinion.

If this was a 777, no one would have cared.
If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
 
n471wn
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:15 am

Quoting Scipio (Reply 35):
It is the individual responsibility of each of us to strike a balance between our preferences for adventure/novelty and safety. It's not up to others to make judgments about people's decisions in this regard.

I guess I just have too much respect for mathematics and odds-----I would take my chances on any aircraft anytime and anywhere. If you think you will die in a commercial plane crash operated by a world quality airline then you should play the lottery and plan on winning
 
Scipio
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:36 am

Quoting n471wn (Reply 44):
If you think you will die in a commercial plane crash operated by a world quality airline then you should play the lottery and plan on winning

It is the individual responsibility of each of us to decide whether or not we want to play the lottery  

I don't play the lottery, and I will be hesitant to board a B-787 for some time to come. I'm at peace with the rationality (from my personal perspective) of both of these choices, and I'm at peace with the fact that you may have other preferences...

As a 20-year old, I did several parachute jumps. I'm glad I did them, but at my current age I do not want to take the risk anymore (the risk of injury worries me a lot more than the risk of dying).

This is my personal preference at the current stage of my life, and it is your individual responsibility to withhold judgment on my personal preferences with regard to the risks I am willing to take  

[Edited 2013-01-08 17:48:02]
 
AeroWesty
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:42 am

Quoting n471wn (Reply 44):
If you think you will die in a commercial plane crash operated by a world quality airline then you should play the lottery and plan on winning

That's a false comparison because the lottery doesn't have the same changing risk elements. The general risk of dying in a plane crash is something like 1:10 million. Those odds change suddenly when the electronics bay beneath you is on fire in flight, or an engine separates from the wing on takeoff.

The goal of managing risk appropriately is to avoid situations where there may be a chance of your risk numbers changing against you. Whomever underwrites your insurance policies understands that. They don't play the numbers, they manage the numbers.
International Homo of Mystery
 
airbazar
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:47 am

Quoting Lofty (Reply 22):
How many passengers where on today's flight re booked from yesterdays flight?

I wouldn't expect many at all. This flight runs with very high loads so there wouldn't have been many empty seats for yesterday's passengers. I suspect that the majority of passengers were re-routed via other cites yesterday.
 
dfambro
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:53 am

Quoting Scipio (Reply 35):
My doctor once told me that, as a principle, he doesn't prescribe medications that have been on the market for less than five years

Hmm, there are quite a few diseases with major advances in standard of care in the last 5 years. You'd voluntarily pass on them on principle? I can see an argument for not prescribing drugs outside of approved on-label uses for the first 5 years, but that would still be very conservative.

Quoting Scipio (Reply 35):
The Comet and Thalidomide

These examples are 50+ years old. Risk assessment and testing is light-years more advanced now than it was then. Both incidents triggered major improvements in design and testing in their respective fields. Nothing remotely as consequential as Thalidomide will happen again in the pharma industry.

I've flown on a JAL 787 and am looking forward to my next trip.
 
aviateur
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:00 am

Ah yes, here we go. There's no denying the 787's electrical issues are potentially troubling. However, it's both good (somewhat) and bad (mostly) that so much attention is now focused on the plane. From this point on, pretty much every malfunction involving a 787, no matter how insignificant, will be seized upon by the media.

As for other early-on problems, how about those of....

Comet
747
DC-10
A380

My take on the BOS fire is up on my home page, if anybody wants to see it.

PS
Patrick Smith is an airline pilot, air travel columnist and author
 
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CCA
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:14 am

The fact the airport manager used the word vent makes me think this wasn't a leak, just full tanks and the design doing doing what it's meant to. It's been covered on airliners several times showing aircraft venting fuel during taxi when they have full tanks. The problem is uninformed people don't know how aircraft fuel tanks are vented especially the media.
P1 in A330, A340, A346, B742, B744, B748.
 
Scipio
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:21 am

Quoting dfambro (Reply 48):
Hmm, there are quite a few diseases with major advances in standard of care in the last 5 years. You'd voluntarily pass on them on principle? I can see an argument for not prescribing drugs outside of approved on-label uses for the first 5 years, but that would still be very conservative.

Of course, this is a pragmatic rather than dogmatic principle, as illustrated by the very fact that he explained his thinking to me and left the final decision up to me (instead of not even talking about the option of newer drugs). If you're facing a life-threatening disease, and a new medicine is your only hope, of course you go for it.

The principle applied to non-life-threatening illnesses, and in cases in which there were alternatives: established older drugs versus newer drugs that promised better results. His approach was to opt for the older drugs until sufficient time had passed by (i.e., data accumulated) to fully understand the side-effects of the newer drugs. He considers five years on the market "sufficient time/data".

When it comes to diagnostic tools, he is much less conservative, and keen to use the latest available...

It is very much comparable to aviation. If you can get to the same destination with well established and proven aircraft such as the B747-400, B777, and A330 versus a new aircraft that offers better comfort but faces "teething problems" such as the B787, his logic argues in favor of the former option.
 
aviateur
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:23 am

Quoting CCA (Reply 50):
The fact the airport manager used the word vent makes me think this wasn't a leak, just full tanks and the design doing doing what it's meant to.

I was thinking that too, except that the overflow was obvious enough to prompt at least one pilot to report it via ATC. Forty gallons isn't terribly much, but unless there's a peculiarity about the 787 I'm not aware of, it's a lot to be venting.

Not that it ought to be a news story. This NEVER would have made the news if not for the media now being hypersensitive to anything involving a 787.
Patrick Smith is an airline pilot, air travel columnist and author
 
Wisdom
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:48 am

The B787 has had far more issues since its EIS than the A380.
If they have so many more small issues, it's only a matter of time for bigger issues to come up.

Any news on the magnitude of the damage to the JL 787 after the fire? Any damaged frames or bulkheads??
On the A330's, the batteries are located very close to the APU, hence in the very back of the cargo compartment, close to the aft bulkhead. One of the reasons is to avoid running long wires between the batteries and the APU, so I'm guessing this should also be the case on the 787?

I have always said it, those electrical window-blinders are going to be a nightmare to maintain and are going to cause AOG situations (for instance frozen on the darkest setting, night operations requiring outside visibility). I see them being replaced in the future by more traditional windows, and new trim panels that can hold mechanical blinders.
That must have been the mistake of the century.

I'm not even going to talk about carbon dust. CFRP produces carbon dust at every friction with any material (more or less).
Carbon dust particles are very small and have sharp edges, which result in them embedding themselves into smooth surfaces. I don't want to think about how carbon dust can affect the proper operation of an aircraft. Carbon dust is so small that it would easily flow through your typical filter.

I'm also very skeptical about the prolonged aircraft life of CFRP. It's been on military aircraft for a long time, but what military aircraft has seen nearly the same cycles as a typical airliner? It's been on civil airliners but mostly on non-load-bearing and on parts that weren't affected by repetitious pressurisation cycles.

What to say about the all-electric concept? As if there weren't enough electrical issues already, now you want to run heavy A/C systems that keep an entire aircraft pressurized, through wires. What if you have a complete black-out at FL370 in the middle of the Pacific, caused by for instance a fire at whatever point these wires meet, cross or come anywhere near eachother? Fly the rest of the journey at FL100 and run out of fuel?

I know that bleed ducts would be able to bear with a small electrical fire, and if they were to leak, you either lose one side or they leak inside the fuselage, keeping the aircraft pressurised...

[Edited 2013-01-08 18:51:36]
 
sxf24
Posts: 601
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:11 am

Quoting Wisdom (Reply 54):
Any news on the magnitude of the damage to the JL 787 after the fire? Any damaged frames or bulkheads??

I have heard - unofficially - that the damage is minimal and would have been even less if the firefighters hadn't used axes.

Quoting Wisdom (Reply 54):
I have always said it, those electrical window-blinders are going to be a nightmare to maintain and are going to cause AOG situations (for instance frozen on the darkest setting, night operations requiring outside visibility). I see them being replaced in the future by more traditional windows, and new trim panels that can hold mechanical blinders.

The window shade components can be snapped in and out and replaced in minutes. Traditional shades require a removal of seats and sidewalls for replacement or repair, which can take several hours.
 
F9Animal
Posts: 3652
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 5:11 am

Thank god the fire on this bird happened on the ground! Had it been at 35, 000 feet over the Pacific.... Not too concerned about the fuel issue. These fires are very alarming! The airplane is becoming a laughing stock anymore. I dont think Boeing Execs can downplay this anymore. The customers are growing very impatient.

[Edited 2013-01-08 21:37:12]
I Am A Different Animal!!
 
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jetmech
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RE: Japan Airlines Fuel Leak Boston

Wed Jan 09, 2013 8:23 am

Quoting Wisdom (Reply 54):
It's been on civil airliners but mostly on non-load-bearing and on parts that weren't affected by repetitious pressurisation cycles.

CFRP may not have been used for the fuselage of a commercial widebody prior to the 787, but it is used widely used on a number of in service commercial types as primary structure, namely, as the material for the horizontal and vertical stabilisers of the B777, A380, A330/A340 and A320. The A380 centre wing box is also made from CFRP.

Fatigue and cyclic loads and the accomodation of such are just as important for these structural elements as they are for the fuselage

Regards, JetMech
JetMech split the back of his pants. He can feel the wind in his hair :shock: .